In case you missed it. Nancy Grace addresses the Burke Ramsey “break.”

[Zak]

I am watching it now, and I am fit to be tied!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

polygraphs.....arghhhhh! Don't even get me started!

My head is gonna explode all over my computer screen, i gotta shut this show off and go to bed.

Did I miss something or did I hear them say that the R's took a police polygraph? I thought they took 2 private ones. I think it's just awful that NG has a show that they can't even get the facts straight. She must be too busy nowadays to refresh her memory before doing a show. I can barely stand to watch her show anyway. If you take away all the clips they play over and over, then it probably amounts to about 20 minutes of actual discussion. The least she and her guests could do would be to get the correct details of a case. And why does NG have to be so rude and obnoxious to her lawyer commentators? Oh well, I could go on and on about the show, enough said.

 

[RiverRat]

I will have to read the transcript to verify, but the only thing that kept my blood pressure down was Nancy giving her opinion that John & Burke were not involved...but I didn't hear Patsy's name mentioned though.

Stage 4 Cancer...a husband with the means to allow her to live her final years in FantasyLand instead of in prison, a very exhausted woman that still had plenty on her to-do list for Christmas, a daughter that was still wearing pull-ups, she wasn't happy with the choices of presents...a doll that looked like her and a bike that there was no time for her to enjoy, a son with a cool Nintendo, I can all to easily picture Patsy snapping...and that's just a very small example of why my opinion changed from "Oh, those poor parents!" to where I am and have been for 13 plus years.

 

[madeleine]

Another thing that caught my attention was in the clips that were played, I noticed that the R's seem to distance themselves from JBR. I heard them say " I did not kill JonBenet" and "I loved that child", there may have been other instances but I'm not remembering them right now. For the life of me I can't understand the words that they used when talking about JBR. I mean, why would they not have just said " I did not kill my daughter" or "I loved my daughter"? It seems to me as if they were talking as if she were an object more more than their own flesh and blood. It just struck me as odd, anyone else get that strange feeling when hearing the words they used?

I just realized something else.....whenever JR talks about the killer/intruder he uses words like evil,monster,creature....sci-fi/fantasy/fairytale expressions....if the intruder is real,why use expressions that usually describe unreal characters...dunno how to explain

 

[madeleine]

NANCY GRACE

Police to Re-Question JonBenet`s Brother

Aired September 30, 2010 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.





http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1009/30/ng.01.html

 

[Tadpole12]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1009/30/ng.01.html


LARRY SCHILLER, AUTHOR, "PERFECT MURDER, PERFECT TOWN": Well, number one, you have to look at the state of where the case is now. You know, as well as everybody else, there`s no statute of limitations on murder. This is a police department that was highly embarrassed when the murder took place. They weren`t prepared for it. They didn`t have the education, the knowledge on how to handle something like this. So they`re not going to give up on it. Any bit of evidence, any rumor, anything, they`re going to try to corroborate, not by one person, two or three.

So you don`t know what has triggered the police into this recent flurry of activity. You know, there`s still some footprints that are unidentified. Some have been identified. There`s a palm print and a fingerprint still unidentified. So there`s a lot of evidence that the police are still running down.

Look at the DNA. We don`t even know really if the DNA is from the perpetrator or if it was on her pants prior to the mixture of the blood that was excreted from her body. Maybe modern technology now, advancing so quickly, has given the police another answer to a question that they didn`t have before.



Hey Madeleine.

Schiller's comments encourage speculation.
Rumours corroborated?

140 were interviewed. I wonder if people were more forthcomming?, second time round.

 

[madeleine]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1009/30/ng.01.html


LARRY SCHILLER, AUTHOR, "PERFECT MURDER, PERFECT TOWN": Well, number one, you have to look at the state of where the case is now. You know, as well as everybody else, there`s no statute of limitations on murder. This is a police department that was highly embarrassed when the murder took place. They weren`t prepared for it. They didn`t have the education, the knowledge on how to handle something like this. So they`re not going to give up on it. Any bit of evidence, any rumor, anything, they`re going to try to corroborate, not by one person, two or three.

So you don`t know what has triggered the police into this recent flurry of activity. You know, there`s still some footprints that are unidentified. Some have been identified. There`s a palm print and a fingerprint still unidentified. So there`s a lot of evidence that the police are still running down.

Look at the DNA. We don`t even know really if the DNA is from the perpetrator or if it was on her pants prior to the mixture of the blood that was excreted from her body. Maybe modern technology now, advancing so quickly, has given the police another answer to a question that they didn`t have before.


Hey Madeleine.

Schiller's comments encourage speculation.
Rumours corroborated?

140 were interviewed. I wonder if people were more forthcomming?, second time round.

I so like this maybe...would have been foolish not to run more tests on all that evidence.

 

[DeeDee249]

Is Schiller referring to that palm print on a basement door that was identified YEARS ago as belonging to Melinda R?
I had read that a partial print had been lifted from JB's corpse, but that the corner DECIDED not to put that in his report. Can you believe that? A horribly murdered little girl, and the coroner doing the autopsy CHOOSES not to report that there was a fingerprint on her, and that in his opinion she was sexually assaulted. While he did say aloud to LE who were in the room that he felt there had been digital penetration (also known as sexual abuse), it was his decision not to put it in writing. Hmmm- wonder why not?

 

[Linda7NJ]

Is Schiller referring to that palm print on a basement door that was identified YEARS ago as belonging to Melinda R?
I had read that a partial print had been lifted from JB's corpse, but that the corner DECIDED not to put that in his report. Can you believe that? A horribly murdered little girl, and the coroner doing the autopsy CHOOSES not to report that there was a fingerprint on her, and that in his opinion she was sexually assaulted. While he did say aloud to LE who were in the room that he felt there had been digital penetration (also known as sexual abuse), it was his decision not to put it in writing. Hmmm- wonder why not?

and what was that crap about the shoe print? I thought that too had long been identified.

When Nancy asked the guy if it was possible the DNA in her panties could have been cause by a factory worker...and he went on and on about laundry..and detergent...it's really a miracle my head did not explode! I had to shut it off early last night and finish this morning. I thought for sure my puter screen would be covered in "head juice" before the show ended! lol

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

and what was that crap about the shoe print? I thought that too had long been identified.

When Nancy asked the guy if it was possible the DNA in her panties could have been cause by a factory worker...and he went on and on about laundry..and detergent...it's really a miracle my head did not explode! I had to shut it off early last night and finish this morning. I thought for sure my puter screen would be covered in "head juice" before the show ended! lol

I haven't see it yet, but I gather it was another non-RDI media event?

 

[RiverRat]

and what was that crap about the shoe print? I thought that too had long been identified.

When Nancy asked the guy if it was possible the DNA in her panties could have been cause by a factory worker...and he went on and on about laundry..and detergent...it's really a miracle my head did not explode! I had to shut it off early last night and finish this morning. I thought for sure my puter screen would be covered in "head juice" before the show ended! lol

Same here...that was just toooo much when you know for a fact that the panties were never in the laundry in the first place, it was more than terrifying to hear this HUGE Lie pushed by someone that obviously is not familar with this case...:banghead:

 

[RiverRat]

I haven't see it yet, but I gather it was another non-RDI media event?

Sounds like another Bluff, IMO...

RR

 

[KoldKase]

Is Schiller referring to that palm print on a basement door that was identified YEARS ago as belonging to Melinda R?
I had read that a partial print had been lifted from JB's corpse, but that the corner DECIDED not to put that in his report. Can you believe that? A horribly murdered little girl, and the coroner doing the autopsy CHOOSES not to report that there was a fingerprint on her, and that in his opinion she was sexually assaulted. While he did say aloud to LE who were in the room that he felt there had been digital penetration (also known as sexual abuse), it was his decision not to put it in writing. Hmmm- wonder why not?

Oh lord, please don't get me started on Schiller or Meyers.... :furious:

 

[KoldKase]

I haven't see it yet, but I gather it was another non-RDI media event?

Oh, you should watch it. You'd love it. It was an IDI's wet dream.

Nothing but one completely erroneous statement after another for 30 min's. No one remembered the most basic, undisputed facts about the case, but that didn't stop them from making up their own. Lots of speculation was presented by Nancy G., who was channeling the Ramseys' every thought and feeling at one point.

While all the talking heads were solidly sympathetic with the Ramseys, declaring them DNA-innocent, Nancy fell down the credibility scale about 100 points to anyone who knows anything about the case, because she obviously didn't care if she or her guests knew what they were talking about or not.

 

[Amy Noel]

The Ramseys did not kill their daughter! We may bever know who did, which is very sad and hard to accept, but that is the truth. The case was destroyed from the start. They police and investigators were the most incompotent bunch of clowns ever. However the one piece of undisputable evidence that they do have rules out the Ramseys and points to an unknown male and that is the pubic hair found on JonBenet that was tested. Maybe one day we can hope that they will find him by this DNA, maybe he will be arrested on a unrelated charge and we will finally know! I hope that day comes soon!!! Please let this woman RIP, I wish she had lived to see On July 9, 2008, when the Boulder District Attorney's office announced that as a result of newly developed DNA sampling and testing techniques, the Ramsey family members are no longer considered suspects in the case and sent a letter to John Ramsey the same day, officially apologizing to the Ramsey family. I think if this would have come sooner she might have beaten the cancer.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Oh, you should watch it. You'd love it. It was an IDI's wet dream.

Nothing but one completely erroneous statement after another for 30 min's. No one remembered the most basic, undisputed facts about the case, but that didn't stop them from making up their own. Lots of speculation was presented by Nancy G., who was channeling the Ramseys' every thought and feeling at one point.

While all the talking heads were solidly sympathetic with the Ramseys, declaring them DNA-innocent, Nancy fell down the credibility scale about 100 points to anyone who knows anything about the case, because she obviously didn't care if she or her guests knew what they were talking about or not.

I'm sorry I missed it.

 

[claudicici]

"However the one piece of undisputable evidence that they do have rules out the Ramseys and points to an unknown male and that is the pubic hair found on JonBenet that was tested. "
I have never heard this.This is incorrect ,isn't it?

 

[txsvicki]

I just realized something else.....whenever JR talks about the killer/intruder he uses words like evil,monster,creature....sci-fi/fantasy/fairytale expressions....if the intruder is real,why use expressions that usually describe unreal characters...dunno how to explain

I can't remember their names, but the son of one of BTK's next to last or last victim called him names like that for years before he was caught, and at the victim impact statement. The only thing though, is he was furious and angry for years and sure wasn't trying to forgive. Who could forgive a monster who did that to their little girl no matter how religious they were, especially so early on after the murder.

 

[StrayKat]

I will have to read the transcript to verify, but the only thing that kept my blood pressure down was Nancy giving her opinion that John & Burke were not involved...but I didn't hear Patsy's name mentioned though.

Stage 4 Cancer...a husband with the means to allow her to live her final years in FantasyLand instead of in prison, a very exhausted woman that still had plenty on her to-do list for Christmas, a daughter that was still wearing pull-ups, she wasn't happy with the choices of presents...a doll that looked like her and a bike that there was no time for her to enjoy, a son with a cool Nintendo, I can all to easily picture Patsy snapping...and that's just a very small example of why my opinion changed from "Oh, those poor parents!" to where I am and have been for 13 plus years.

Wan't semen found? PR could not have done that...

 

[Amy Noel]

"However the one piece of undisputable evidence that they do have rules out the Ramseys and points to an unknown male and that is the pubic hair found on JonBenet that was tested. "
I have never heard this.This is incorrect ,isn't it?

Hair Evidence

Human Hair

• Hair on Blanket

1. Where Found. "a Caucasian "pubic or auxiliary" hair was found on the blanket covering JonBenet's body. (SMF P 179; PSMF P 179.) The hair does not match that of any Ramsey and has not been sourced. (SMF P 180; PSMF P 180.)" (Carnes 2003:22). According to Rocky Mountain News, "Also, some believe that the most critical piece of evidence seized in the search of the Ramseys' Boulder home may be one that doesn't show up in the 65 pages of documents that were released last week. It's a single pubic hair, found on the blanket that covered JonBenet's ravaged body, where she lay on the bare floor of a small basement room...But that hair doesn't show up on the itemized list of evidence seized at the Ramseys' Boulder home in any way that is clear or obvious."
2. No Match to Ramseys. "It does not match any member of the Ramsey family,'' said a Ramsey representative who requested anonymity. The failure to trace that hair to anyone inside or outside JonBenet's family has also been confirmed by law enforcement sources.
3. Significance. "That single hair, I don't want to understate it, is the single most significant thing I've heard," said Denver attorney Scott Robinson. "It's far more significant than all the talk about melting snow, were there footprints or weren't there, a broken window, can you get in or can't you. But that hair -- a defense lawyer can make a lot out of it. "Because," Robinson added, "if I'm the prosecutor, I have to be really worried as to how I can put together a plausible story ... that explains the existence of a pubic hair not belonging to anyone that they know of, on a blanket covering the child. That hair explains why the delay (in making an arrest), why the caution."
4. This FBI report explains how racial origin can be deduced from a hair sample.

 

[Amy Noel]

Wan't semen found? PR could not have done that...

DNA Evidence

DNA Testing Timeline

• DNA Samples Collected in 1997. All the original samples of DNA collected from family and close friends were collected in early 1997, starting in mid-January.
• New Technology 1999. In 1999, the "FBI released a new technology called Short Tandem Repeat to profile DNA. It uses 13 markers to raise the probability that a randomly selected individual would match it is one in 1 quintillion."
• 2001 Testing. "The new testing is allowed after a legal battle in Colorado's courts, and JonBenet's underwear is analyzed again resulting in between one and two markers out of 13 being defined."
• 2003 Testing. A "second blood spot on JonBenet's underwear tested resulting in between nine and 10 markers on the spot to be defined."
• Submission to CODIS. "That genetic fingerprint meets the threshold to be placed into a national database, Combined DNA Indexing System or CODIS, which holds DNA profiles of those convicted in most states of certain crimes."
• The Daily Camera news coverage of the forensic evidence is here.

Male DNA Under Fingernails

• Findings. "The coroner took nail clippings from JonBenet. Male DNA was found under JonBenet's right hand fingernail that does not match that of any Ramsey. (SMF P 174; PSMF P 174.) Defendants also assert that male DNA was found under JonBenet's left hand fingernail, which also does not match that of any Ramsey. (SMF P 173.)" (Carnes 2003:22). This is consistent with Internet poster Margoo's screen capture showing a "mix" of DNA only 3 of the 13 DNA samples submitted: #7 Bloodstains from panties; #14L, #14M Right and Left hand fingernails from JonBenet Ramsey.
• "Defensive Flesh." Internet poster Mame has asserted that Lou Smit told her there was "defensive flesh" found under JBR's fingernails (his term). Internet poster Evening2 disagrees and believes that "When Lou Smit referred to JonBenet "getting a piece of her killer", he wasn't talking about flesh, just that "his" DNA was there, that's all."

Male DNA in Underwear

Findings

• Male DNA Found. "In addition, male DNA was found in JonBenet's underwear that does not match that of any Ramsey and has not yet been sourced. (SMF PP 175, 178; PSMF PP 175, 178.)" (Carnes 2003:22).
• No Match Found to Date. "The Boulder Police Department has yet to identify the male whose DNA was found at the crime scene. (SMF P 177; PSMF P 177.)" (Carnes 2003:22).
• Saliva? According to Internet poster Margoo, Lin Wood reported in a chat session that the DNA in the underwear "probably" was saliva. Several news sources also have suggested the male DNA was from saliva, including Denver Post, People's Daily Online and Taipei Times

Who Has Been Cleared by DNA?

• 60 People Cleared. CBS News reports 60 persons have been "cleared" based on their DNA tests.
• Ramsey Family Members. The DNA does not match John Ramsey, Burke Ramsey, John Andrew Ramsey, Melinda Ramsey, Patsy Ramsey or Jeff Ramsey, the brother of John Ramsey (see Internet poster Jayelles post of 07-05-2004 02:29 PM). This is consistent with a statement by private detective Ollie Gray in a 48 Hours interview, in which he stated the DNA evidence eliminates the Ramseys. A transcript and (blurry) version of the DNA report are posted at Webbsleuths.
• Friends of Family. Internet poster Jayelles has deduced that the DNA also has cleared, Fleet White and Priscilla White
• Other Individuals. Internet poster Jayelles has deduced that the DNA also has cleared Mervin Pugh, the Ramsey's handyman.

Who Has Not Been Cleared by DNA?

• According to Internet poster [ame="http://boards.crimelibrary.com/showpost.php?p=8862732&postcount=340"]Athena[/ame], according to PMPT "McReynolds and Barnhill's DNA could not be excluded" p182 (This appears to be a paraphrased reference to paperback version of Schiller).