Incompetence or something else?

[BBB167893]

It's not a matter of ego, it's more to preserve my sanity.

I know how that is!

It's not about finding justice but proving RDI. You never will nor will you ever accept any evidence leading to IDI.

That's not worth a response.

Call it a Victory! for RDI, you've won, I'm beaten. You can have a smilie party to celebrate.

I don't feel like celebrating one bit.

 

[SunnieRN]

I totally agree! Also- JR making that comment "we knew people would be suspicious" when LK asked about the date IS suspicious to me. The fact that he said that has to mean he KNEW people would feel her death occurred not that long after they returned home that night. So JR saying he "chose" that date so people would remember what happened to JB on Christmas night is pretty lame. And Mayer (in an inexplicable decision) chose to put the time JR found her rather than a TOD. Probably because he FAILED to perform the procedures to determine it, though the stage of rigor she was in as well as the location of the pineapple in her digestive tract would have been sufficient for him to do so. Had he been put on the witness stand, I hope that (his failure to perform those tests) would have been something he would have be asked about. But with the DA so loathe to ask the Rs anything (instead wishing the info would be "volunteered") you can't be certain ANY proper questioning would take place, especially with a DA who hadn't taken a case to trial in YEARS.

DeeDee, I honestly think that JR saying he 'chose' the 25th isn't lame, it's more an admission of guilt. He KNEW JonBenet died on Christmas. I truly believe it was Patsy who was in the dark about a LOT of things. There was a reason she could be so adamant about her innocence. She didn't kill JonBenet, she just helped disguise the truth.

 

[DeeDee249]

DeeDee, I honestly think that JR saying he 'chose' the 25th isn't lame, it's more an admission of guilt. He KNEW JonBenet died on Christmas. I truly believe it was Patsy who was in the dark about a LOT of things. There was a reason she could be so adamant about her innocence. She didn't kill JonBenet, she just helped disguise the truth.

Actually, that wasn't my quote. I don't know how it ended up with my name, but I know sometimes the quote function doesn't work the way it ahould.

 

[UKGuy]

I am not sure anymore that this case wasn't solved due to incompetence.

...

So why wasn't this case solved?
Incompetence?
Money&connections?
or
All of the above?

I just can't believe how unlucky JB was..........

madeleine,
IMO there was a conspiracy allegedly funded by Ramsey largesse.

Incompetence is normally cited by politicians when they run out of excuses e.g. consider Enron, Savings and Loans, Fanny Mae, or the AGI bailout. Why did they occur officially it was incompetence due to the complexity of the financial instruments being traded. That is the head honcho's were dumb, but they still trousered the bonus payments!

If it were not a homicide investigation and something less serious then incompetence might apply. Removal of possible crime-scene evidence by Patsy's sister, since we do not know where the primary crime-scene location was, was not incompetent, it simply should not have been allowed.

Conclusion: cover up!


.

 

[BoldBear]

I don't know if this is anything to add, but I often wonder how much sympathy for a grieving family has played in the investigation. There is Smit. But with all the crap going on between BPD and the DA, I wonder if someone didn't have a grasp on what really happened. It's an ethical 'what if' I have. You know that a death happened in a horrible cascade of events, all centering around an accident. Then you have the question if solving the mystery could do more harm. The right thing is to always convict the murderer, to pull that person or persons off the street. But with little evidence, your career and reputation on the line and more people being hurt than helped, would silence be the choice? It's unlikely with Kolar's book. I just wonder if someone from LE hasn't figured it out and has decided to hold their tongue for whatever reason.

 

[Annapurna]

BoldBear,
Sympathy helped the R's out significantly. I am instantly reminded of how Pam Paugh was allowed to "retrieve clothes for the funeral"....more like clean the house out. It's not like they couldn't afford other clothes.

Some cops felt bad for them so they let that happen. Someone higher up was either blinded by sympathy or money and ordered that raid to be allowed.

I suspect there are a few people in LE that know more than they would ever say while JR is still alive and litigating.

 

[DeeDee249]

BoldBear,
Sympathy helped the R's out significantly. I am instantly reminded of how Pam Paugh was allowed to "retrieve clothes for the funeral"....more like clean the house out. It's not like they couldn't afford other clothes.

Some cops felt bad for them so they let that happen. Someone higher up was either blinded by sympathy or money and ordered that raid to be allowed.

I suspect there are a few people in LE that know more than they would ever say while JR is still alive and litigating.

I totally agree. Many people are unaware that a local clothing store gave the family clothing for the funeral (including Patsy's ridiculous "Jacquie Kennedy veil". The only clothes they needed from the house was pageant dresses and a tiara for JB. (beyond the pale- Patsy tried to make her look just like that MyTwinn doll Patsy custom ordered). Police even gave Aunt P a police jacket to wear (so as not to attract attention, they claimed). This is illegal. And they knew it. They also knew it was wrong to allow anyone inside the house (still a crime scene even if it had been "returned" to the family) especially to remove items. People reported seeing the police outside- not accompanying her as she went though the house and you can bet they did not search what she got. I have read some reports that say she filled 3 squad cars.

 

[questfortrue]

BoldBear,
Sympathy helped the R's out significantly. I am instantly reminded of how Pam Paugh was allowed to "retrieve clothes for the funeral"....more like clean the house out. It's not like they couldn't afford other clothes.

Some cops felt bad for them so they let that happen. Someone higher up was either blinded by sympathy or money and ordered that raid to be allowed.

I suspect there are a few people in LE that know more than they would ever say while JR is still alive and litigating.

Prepare for more of the same song of victimization this year, the 20th anniversary of her death. From the beginning the Rs claimed to be a target and victim of the evil Intruder. Then they became a victim of the BPD’s ‘persecution.’ Now, thanks to MSM being totally asleep at the wheel, it’s all been proven by (a true sleight of hand regards) the DNA. This evokes another reason for more sympathy. Folks who don’t know the case will have tremendous sympathy. Perhaps some will even admire JR for his transition from ‘grief to grace.’

According to Charlie Brennan of the DC, “While there is no sign that Boulder police have the case under active investigation, ample media attention around the sad anniversary likely will serve as a reminder that even in a new year, the past is ever with us.” I’d say he has it right. The past is still with Boulder. And it still haunts those of us who know she lost her life to someone she loved and then was betrayed by lies, lies which were even thrown over the family of her best friend.

 

[BoldBear]

It's been a long time since I wrote that note. I was on the fence when I wrote it, but learned enough and thought enough to finally decide. My hypothetical is that Lou Smit had this figured-out within 2 days. He was a very smart and spiritual man. He was, however, at the end of his career and didn't need the final feather in his cap. He sympathized with the family. The basement entry was a smokescreen, a slight of hand, to distract from what really happened. His arguments with Steve Thomas were part of a game of distraction. I had this idea when I read Steve Thomas' book. It made the arguments between the two of them rather amusing.

This is all speculation on my part. It's only like thinking out loud. It's somewhere below 'opinion' and more into 'what if'.

 

[BBB167893]

Prepare for more of the same song of victimization this year, the 20th anniversary of her death. From the beginning the Rs claimed to be a target and victim of the evil Intruder. Then they became a victim of the BPD’s ‘persecution.’ Now, thanks to MSM being totally asleep at the wheel, it’s all been proven by (a true sleight of hand regards) the DNA. This evokes another reason for more sympathy. Folks who don’t know the case will have tremendous sympathy. Perhaps some will even admire JR for his transition from ‘grief to grace.’

According to Charlie Brennan of the DC, “While there is no sign that Boulder police have the case under active investigation, ample media attention around the sad anniversary likely will serve as a reminder that even in a new year, the past is ever with us.” I’d say he has it right. The past is still with Boulder. And it still haunts those of us who know she lost her life to someone she loved and then was betrayed by lies, lies which were even thrown over the family of her best friend.

Every story needs a good villain, right? The hero is only as good as the villain is bad. The Ramseys' story has two, as you say: first the "real killer," then the big, bad cops.

Reading over this thread, I'm reminded of ol Trip. I used to wonder if Alex Hunter and his merry band of morons were afraid Trip would spill any secrets to Mike Bynum, until I realized that Trip is such a blithering idiot that it was probably a secret to him where he *advertiser censored**in' lived!

 

[Meara]

…….Reading over this thread, I'm reminded of ol Trip. I used to wonder if Alex Hunter and his merry band of morons were afraid Trip would spill any secrets to Mike Bynum, until I realized that Trip is such a blithering idiot that it was probably a secret to him where he *advertiser censored**in' lived!

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[Foreign Faction]

I don't think incompetence had anything to do with solving the mystery. I think the BPD solved it and presented it to the grand jury, who decided to indict the Ramseys.
The Ramseys had enough money and influence to sway the process, simple as that.

 

[BBB167893]

I don't think incompetence had anything to do with solving the mystery. I think the BPD solved it and presented it to the grand jury, who decided to indict the Ramseys.
The Ramseys had enough money and influence to sway the process, simple as that.

Hi, Foreign Faction. Welcome to Websleuths.

I'm curious. In what way do you think they swayed it?

 

[AndHence]

Separating the parents and interviewing them immediately would have gone a long way towards solving this crime. Instead the Ramseys were given four months to prepare statements and assess the evidence the police had against them. The police also never properly interviewed Burke on the day of the crime.

 

[Foreign Faction]

Hi, Foreign Faction. Welcome to Websleuths.

I'm curious. In what way do you think they swayed it?

Hi SuperDave, and thank you for the welcome.
I believe by "lawyering up" immediately, contaminating the crime scene, using their influence in the community (it seems sometimes to me as if the BPD was sort of intimidated by JR), they definitely swayed (in the long run) the decision of Hunter not to pursue the indictment.
I feel that the GJ may have implicated (if only implicitly) that Burke was the main catalyst of the event, and that it seemed fruitless to try to prosecute the Ramseys.

Ultimately, I feel that financial issues had a big impact in the furthering of this case, having already spent millions of dollars....

 

[Foreign Faction]

Separating the parents and interviewing them immediately would have gone a long way towards solving this crime. Instead the Ramseys were given four months to prepare statements and assess the evidence the police had against them. The police also never properly interviewed Burke on the day of the crime.

Precisely! Burke was shuffled away and out of the range of any police interviewing, shipped off to Fleet White's house IIRC.

As a strong proponent of the BDI theory, I feel this was integral to the solving of the case. However, when I say "Burke Did It," what I mean is that I believe he hit JBR on the head initially, and both parents were involved (to what degree, I am uncertain though) in the cover-up and staging.

 

[AndHence]

Does anyone have that goodreads link someone posted that gives a detail list of all the things Kolar pointed out in his book that point away from an intruder being responsible? I tried googling to no avail. Thanks in advance!

 

[singularity]

Does anyone have that goodreads link someone posted that gives a detail list of all the things Kolar pointed out in his book that point away from an intruder being responsible? I tried googling to no avail. Thanks in advance!

I don't know of any websites/lists giving cliffs notes on Kolar's book but my favorite part of the book, mainly because I had also had issues with the same thing, is when Kolar goes over the "basement sequence" and points out how if any intruder was involved it means the intruder still had to be in the house when all the Ramsey friends, cops, victim advocates,etc. were also in the house.

 

[Tadpole12]

Does anyone have that goodreads link someone posted that gives a detail list of all the things Kolar pointed out in his book that point away from an intruder being responsible? I tried googling to no avail. Thanks in advance!

Heyya AndHence

Maybe a thread at FFJ might assist.
http://www.forumsforjustice.org/for...gn-Faction-Who-Really-Kidnapped-JonBenet-quot

 

[BBB167893]

Hi SuperDave, and thank you for the welcome.
I believe by "lawyering up" immediately, contaminating the crime scene, using their influence in the community (it seems sometimes to me as if the BPD was sort of intimidated by JR), they definitely swayed (in the long run) the decision of Hunter not to pursue the indictment.
I feel that the GJ may have implicated (if only implicitly) that Burke was the main catalyst of the event, and that it seemed fruitless to try to prosecute the Ramseys.

Ultimately, I feel that financial issues had a big impact in the furthering of this case, having already spent millions of dollars....

You may well be right, as far as you go. The BPD took time to get going, and the DA never got off the launching pad. Meanwhile, the Ramseys and their lawyers went to work immediately, hiring experts, sabotaging potential witnesses (one that we know of) and so forth.