Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #1

[CARIIS]

The killing machine:


BUK launcher takes five minutes to warm up and 12 minutes to reload

Missile was likely detonated within 65ft (20 metres) of the MH17 target

d 8-12 seconds to reach its target.

95% accuracy

several models of Buk Missile Systems

developed in the Soviet Union in the 1970s

BUK - which means 'beech tree' in Russian

They can cut an aircraft in half, set it on fire or provide large pieces of shrapnel that shred it apart.’

13.8-inch (35cm) ‘seeker’ on the missile

has 20 mile range

nside the missile is a variety of different warheads



This is why I think they messed up - this is the third compnent of the system which the idiots did not have (aquisition radar vs self contained radar--the aquistion radar is in a third vehicle OR directly connected to a control tower):

‘If you are linked in to a national or standing air traffic system you’ll know what aircraft are flying around you.Purgin said he was not aware of whether rebel forces owned BUK missile launchers, but even if they did, there had no fighters capable of operating it.

Justin Bronk, with the Royal United Services Institute.......'However, I also highly suspect that the separatists did not intend to shoot down an airliner, but probably thought they were targeting a Ukrainian transport at high altitude.'

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Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...laysian-flight-95-accuracy.html#ixzz37v2guqA6
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Off task: MAL airlines will refund anyone who is scared to fly with them for the next 5 days per CNN

Per CNN they took 38 bodies somewhere - but noone knows where.....

OYe............today in sunlight they are finding luggage neatly piled up the site is totally messed up there moving stuff - and lets remember they have no motivation to cooperate



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[Summerfun]

Two dogs and 9 birds, all live at boarding, are now listed.

http://m.kmbc.com/2-dogs-among-casualties-of-mh17-crash/27038590

I see the dogs were casualties. That means dead.

 

[Lyra500]

The speeches without any fact were done very quickly.
And yes get there as fast as you can and take hold of the situation.
So there you will get real facts.
What is taking so long?

The crash site is under the control of armed separatist rebels who are restricting the access of international investigators. They can't take hold of the situation or get the real facts if men with guns are preventing them from doing so.

 

[Intermezzo]

I was listening to a reporter on BBC Radio 5 talking about being at the scene - similar albeit more graphic comments about the bodies. Earlier in the discussion someone said how awful it was people taking photos, but they could turn out to be invaluable for identification if bodies are already decomposing. The reporter said something about some of the people "guarding" being drunk. :facepalm:

Who are the people that are guarding the crash site?
The pro russian rebels? they control the area.

 

[Summerfun]

The crash site is under the control of armed separatist rebels who are restricting the access of international investigators. They can't take hold of the situation or get the real facts if men with guns are preventing them from doing so.

The americans have no guns. Really?

 

[newone]

Two dogs and 9 birds, all live at boarding, are now listed.

http://m.kmbc.com/2-dogs-among-casualties-of-mh17-crash/27038590

too ironic for me: meaning there was no mention of such manifest in MH 370 -- this is too much
this is ''overreach" it's too much if you know what I mean compared to MH370 - kind of overkill or oversharing
politically motivated: they didn't share as much so quickly with MH370 -- there's another agenda happening here

 

[Intermezzo]

I do. 2 still had bodies in their homes. Bless them.

Really?
Did they bodies land close to their home?
Bless them indeed!

 

[SnoopyDawgDawg]

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/ukraine-russia-helping-destroy-crash-evidence-24631209

Snip:

Ukraine Says Russia Helping Destroy Crash Evidence

"The integrity of the site has been compromised, and there are indications that vital evidence has not been preserved in place," Malaysian Transport Minister Liow Tiong Lai said at a news conference in Kuala Lumpur.

 

[Lyra500]

The americans have no guns. Really?

Just to clarify - are you suggesting the US makes an armed incursion to take over the area (or possibly even that they are remiss for not having done so already)?

 

[jamiect]

The americans have no guns. Really?

Why would the US send military personnel into the Ukraine?.

 

[marlywings]

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

..............John Lennon

 

[Intermezzo]

Ok, ok. Are you saying that anyone older than me must be older than dirt? :snooty: I am not amused. :snooty:

Unfortunately, other countries would be silly not to take advantage of the political gains to be made here. I said earlier in this thread that this may turn out to be Putin's worst mistake. I don't think he wanted to down a civilian airliner, I do believe he gave the order to fire on another Ukrainian aircraft. Mistaken identity caused this. However, countries of the world have to start calling Putin out on his funding the rebels and supplying them with serious weaponry.

This is the perfect thing to use to call Putin out. With all due respect to the families of the victims, this may be a very good thing for the rest of the world. We may be able to stop Putin now before he actually managed to go to war with Ukraine. It seems his ordering the rebels to fire on a second Ukrainian plane this week was the beginning of starting a situation that would eventually have to lead to war.

This plane crash exposes Putin's grip on the rebels. It exposes his arming the rebels with serious weaponry and his effort to start a war with Ukraine. The almost 300 lives lost may end up saving thousands more in the long run. I hope so. I hope their deaths mean more to history than tragedy. JMO

Great Post!
And to add..Who has trained them to use these military weapons?

 

[Lyra500]

The blast force from the missile that slammed into a Malaysian plane over Ukraine, combined with the plane’s dramatic deceleration, probably instantly rendered everyone on board unconscious or dead.

research found that trauma in a mid-air explosion occurs from three sources, the force of the blast, the massive deceleration when a plane going 500 miles an hour stops in mid-air, and the impact of the fall. Additionally, the loss of cabin pressure can cause hypoxia within seconds at 33,000 feet, leading to loss of consciousness.

none of the 230 passengers in the 1996 crash survived, most of their bodies were subsequently recovered. Though the crash occurred offshore, the analysis found none of the passengers had sea water in their lungs, suggesting none were breathing when they entered the water.

It’s literally an explosive decompression and would have caused a lot of g-force pushing people back in their seats,” he said. While it would have taken the plane minutes to fall from 33,000 feet, hypoxia would have rendered anyone who survived the initial blast unconscious within 30 seconds, Waldock said.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-18/malaysian-flight-passengers-probably-died-instantly.html

As always seems to be the way with these things, there are experts with differing opinions.

The guy on BBC News 24 is saying that some people could have survived the missile strike and still been alive depending on which part of the aircraft they were in - I think the fact that there are so many intact bodies could support that. As mentioned before, even if the hypoxia at 33,000ft rendered them unconscious up there, they did not remain in that atmosphere, they fell towards earth. So sadly some of them if not killed by the blast, may have regained consciousness as they fell.

This might explain the couple who appeared to be hugging each other and the child with an expression of fear. Truly dreadful.

 

[marlywings]

Closing this thread shortly. If you'd all like to move on up to thread #2 thanks everyone...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...H17-crashes-in-Ukraine-295-aboard-7-17-2014-2