Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #6

[dotr]

Dotr, did you send this tip in? It needs to be sent in, I'M. Great catch

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Thanks, hope it is of some use- Roselvr sent it in to Fifth Estate.

 

[Bubblyone]

The Grant's truck stop is in Idaho, not Montana, but the main freeway through Boise, I-84, continues into Montana.

In order to develop any theories, we need to start with a few suppositions. So let's suppose they were traveling from somewhere in Canada more or less directly to Florida and that they stopped by a Grant's Truck Stop. (Nothing is certain: they could have gotten the match book second hand.)

The only Grant's Truck Stops that I know of are in New Mexico and Idaho. Someone mentioned one in Nebraska, but I can't find any record of one there.

If they traveled through Boise, there's a good chance they started in BC or Alberta. That would also be true if they stopped by the Grant's in NM. I suppose Vancover is an equally likely starting point. I was originally thinking travelers from Vancouver would be slightly more likely to travel through California than Idaho, but maybe they did exactly that if the Grant's they stopped at was the one in NM.

The guy from the campground didn't mention Jacques's having a French accent, so that makes me think that he came from a predominanlty English-speaking portion of Canada.

I check in here periodically. Keep thinking that one day I will find out this has been solved. In the meantime, I have a question. A few days ago, I checked in and found that another site was referenced. Do you think that today I could find the site? I believe it was a facebook page for this couple?? Anyhow, I was reading some comments that were posted by different people. One of the people posting said that her mother was the person that waited on the female when she was buying peaches at the fruit-stand. She stated that Jean/Jacque did not come in, rather he was on a motorcycle waiting outside.

Has anyone read this before? I am thinking that if they were on a motorcycle, where did the motorcycle go, where did it end up? I know they believe a van was used to transport them to the site where they were found. Did the van also house the motorcycle?

I am going to see if I can find that site again and will link it here, but wondering about this...anyone?

 

[Roselvr]

I check in here periodically. Keep thinking that one day I will find out this has been solved. In the meantime, I have a question. A few days ago, I checked in and found that another site was referenced. Do you think that today I could find the site? I believe it was a facebook page for this couple?? Anyhow, I was reading some comments that were posted by different people. One of the people posting said that her mother was the person that waited on the female when she was buying peaches at the fruit-stand. She stated that Jean/Jacque did not come in, rather he was on a motorcycle waiting outside.

Has anyone read this before? I am thinking that if they were on a motorcycle, where did the motorcycle go, where did it end up? I know they believe a van was used to transport them to the site where they were found. Did the van also house the motorcycle?

I am going to see if I can find that site again and will link it here, but wondering about this...anyone?

Was it on their FB page or in their album on a FB page? I haven't been to their FB page so am not sure if the person commented there too like they did on the album.

 

[Bubblyone]

Was it on their FB page or in their album on a FB page? I haven't been to their FB page so am not sure if the person commented there too like they did on the album.

When all else fails...go to your history to see what you searched. Here is the link:

https://www.facebook.com/WeWontForgetThem/photos/?tab=album&album_id=914148525265852&hc_location=ufi

 

[Ozoner]

Wikipedia indicates that, when the mystery couple died, there were Grant's Truck Stops in Idaho, Nebraska, and Arizona.



I think it's definitely possible Jock came from Quebec. In fact, I think it's probable. I lived there for four years, and only about half of the people had any trace of a noticeable accent when speaking English. But I do think he could have been from anywhere in Canada.

Why do you say that it's probable he came from Quebec? I haven't read every post on this topic, but I haven't seen anything pointing specifically to Quebec.

 

[carbuff]

Why do you say that it's probable he came from Quebec? I haven't read every post on this topic, but I haven't seen anything pointing specifically to Quebec.

Because a Canadian dude with the French name Jacques would likely be from the French Canadian province of Quebec?

 

[TooCurious]

When all else fails...go to your history to see what you searched. Here is the link:

https://www.facebook.com/WeWontForgetThem/photos/?tab=album&album_id=914148525265852&hc_location=ufi

I followed this link and the introduction the lead investigator is quoted as saying their DNA had no trace of European descent.....

 

[Roselvr]

I followed this link and the introduction the lead investigator is quoted as saying their DNA had no trace of European descent.....

We try to put a variety of info in each album. There are a bunch of stories that are copied from the links. .

The European descent comes from this part where Melba emailed to ask. They have not been tested for heritage.

DNA testing has proven that John and Jane Doe were NOT siblings or otherwise related by blood.
There was no indication of European descent through DNA
As far as the quote “they stepped from a VAN”* there is no idea why that is quoted in web accounts. There was no vehicle, (van or otherwise) in the area.

Lt. Robert Burnish also stated, “if your readers have, or pass on, any information, we would love to hear from you.”

Lt. Robert Burnish - Criminal Investigations - Sumter County Sheriff’s Office
1281 North Main Street
Sumter, S.C. 29153
803-436-2017
Who were these people? Who were the Sumter County Does?

http://venturegalleries.com/blog/mystery-of-the-sumter-county-does/

 

[Ozoner]

Because a Canadian dude with the French name Jacques would likely be from the French Canadian province of Quebec?

I guess it depends what you meant by probable. I agree that Quebec is a decent starting point because there are probably more Jacqueses (is that the plural of Jacques?) in Quebec than in other provinces. We don't know whether JPF was a French speaker himself, though. I wish they would do isotope testing.
I wonder if there's any sort of directory of physicians from Quebec from, say, 1960 (since the father might have been retired by '76). It would be worth looking for J.P.F.'s in case the son was named after the father.
I wonder if the girl was one of JPF's former students. If people thought they ran off together, that could explain why no one went looking for them. If he was married, they would have both been personae non gratae wherever they came from.

 

[Tear Drop]

Has anyone seen some of the theories and other info. on this website? It has some very interesting and updated information. According to the website, there has not been any testing of the UID's DNA, so i don't believe a comparison to the Mcminn's has been made yet. Definitely worth checking out.

 

[carbuff]

I guess it depends what you meant by probable. I agree that Quebec is a decent starting point because there are probably more Jacqueses (is that the plural of Jacques?) in Quebec than in other provinces. We don't know whether JPF was a French speaker himself, though. I wish they would do isotope testing.
I wonder if there's any sort of directory of physicians from Quebec from, say, 1960 (since the father might have been retired by '76). It would be worth looking for J.P.F.'s in case the son was named after the father.
I wonder if the girl was one of JPF's former students. If people thought they ran off together, that could explain why no one went looking for them. If he was married, they would have both been personae non gratae wherever they came from.

I personally wouldn't say probable or even likely, but it's a reasonable deduction. I don't believe much of that guy's statement though. I think he was trying to deflect attention from the local area--nothing to do with us, nosirree.


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[Alleykins]

Has anyone seen some of the theories and other info. on this website? It has some very interesting and updated information. According to the website, there has not been any testing of the UID's DNA, so i don't believe a comparison to the Mcminn's has been made yet. Definitely worth checking out.

DNA is listed as available for both the male and female Ups in NamUs.

 

[adian_69]

I guess it depends what you meant by probable. I agree that Quebec is a decent starting point because there are probably more Jacqueses (is that the plural of Jacques?) in Quebec than in other provinces. We don't know whether JPF was a French speaker himself, though. I wish they would do isotope testing.
I wonder if there's any sort of directory of physicians from Quebec from, say, 1960 (since the father might have been retired by '76). It would be worth looking for J.P.F.'s in case the son was named after the father.
I wonder if the girl was one of JPF's former students. If people thought they ran off together, that could explain why no one went looking for them. If he was married, they would have both been personae non gratae wherever they came from.

I'm from Eastern Canada, and there are quite a large pocket of french speakers.

In New Brunswick, they have a special language called sheque (?sp), which is a combination of french and english.

In Nova Scotia, there are quite a few french as well. We have Acadians there that are mostly located along the south shore and south of the province. There are a lot of french schools there, and growing up, we were able to do immersion classes, so even if we werent natural french speakers, many of us can speak french fluently.

Sorry for the geography lesson, maybe it can be helpful in some way.

 

[carbuff]

I'm from Eastern Canada, and there are quite a large pocket of french speakers.

In New Brunswick, they have a special language called sheque (?sp), which is a combination of french and english.

In Nova Scotia, there are quite a few french as well. We have Acadians there that are mostly located along the south shore and south of the province. There are a lot of french schools there, and growing up, we were able to do immersion classes, so even if we werent natural french speakers, many of us can speak french fluently.

Sorry for the geography lesson, maybe it can be helpful in some way.

Which reminds me, there are still pockets of native French speakers in northern New England, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin/Minnesota as well as Louisiana.

 

[adian_69]

I already checked Louisiana. Nothing there.

If this couple is from Quebec, I know it's bren mentioned, but it's possible they're part of the FLQ, which means they would have fled Canada between 1980 and 1983 when the police began cracking down. It's more than possible. The Canadian government gave 5 or 6 of the FLQ kidnappers free passage to Cuba amd didnt try to extradite them when they moved to France either. Several members were exiled in the US in earlier years as well.

I'm just thinking if the left at that time, they may not have been reported missing.

Quebec is somewhat seperate from Canada, and i'm wondering if they may have a different database for missing persons from that time. Maybe not, I didnt have time to check, but heres a link to their missing persons database in case nobody has checked it

http://www.sq.gouv.qc.ca/personnes-disparues/personnes-disparues-surete-du-quebec.jsp#pageDemandee=1

 

[Alleykins]

Which reminds me, there are still pockets of native French speakers in northern New England, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin/Minnesota as well as Louisiana.

Our schools up in the county, near the Canadian border, were bilingual French and English, until the 70s.

 

[adian_69]

Also, just so youre all aware, if you didnt know, Canada has two seperate police forces. The RCMP are national, and the police are usually for seperate cities or towns, so it's a bit confusing. I'm sure the police report the missing persons to the RCMP now, but back in the 70's I am not sure if that was the case or not, so people who can speak/read french may want to try checking the montreal police websites too.

 

[Alleykins]

Canada has a national missing persons site. It's not as comprehensive as NamUs, but I think that may be because it's relatively new? According to the disclaimer, what cases are put on there depends on the local officials, I guess. They need to do a better job putting it all in one place for simplicity, IMHO, so everyone is on the same page.
http://www.canadasmissing.ca/index-eng.htm

 

[adian_69]

Canada has a national missing persons site. It's not as comprehensive as NamUs, but I think that may be because it's relatively new? According to the disclaimer, what cases are put on there depends on the local officials, I guess. They need to do a better job putting it all in one place for simplicity, IMHO, so everyone is on the same page.
http://www.canadasmissing.ca/index-eng.htm

This is a brand new system that was introduced in 2015/2016. There are many cases that arent on there at the moment.

On top of that, because of the police/ rcmp issue not all missing persons information may be in a national database run by the RCMP.

Canada is large, so there may be some areas that have police and no RCMP or vice versa. Where I live there is neither, but the closest is the police, so we would report there. I'll do some research and try to find out how MPs were reported in the 70's.

 

[adian_69]

And yeah our system is extremely flawed. Not only do we have this database that just got posted and is missing cases, we have the RCMP vs. Police issue and also, the Canadian police don't post much information about missing people, and it is not broadcast often or readily avaliable (when I was growing up in Canada anyway).

The US system is so much more efficient. The doe network probably has more Canadian missing persons than the Canadian Missing persons website sadly.