GUILTY OH - Two women & child killed, 13yo abducted, Apple Valley, 10 Nov 2010 #1

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darlin gal said:
It is unclear when anyone last saw or heard from Sprang. Her Jeep was found inside the garage at her home on Magers Road, just around the corner from Herrmann’s house.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...for-lead-as-search-for-4-goes-on.html?sid=101
Click to expand...

Thank you for this. I was under the impression that Sprang's vehicle was left in Tina's garage (details have been sketchy, at best.)

This article makes me wonder if something took place at Sprang's house; she tried to leave in the vehicle (hence why evidence was found in it - again.. sketchy detail) and she couldn't make it out in the car so she ran to Tina's house. Could also explain the "questionable amount of blood" found in Tina's house. I wonder where it was found; front door, back door?

Now, after reading the article, I am really concerned for the welfare of Sprang's youngest child. I believe she has three, one fully grown, one around fully grown and one being the age range of Tina's. [This information is from the "Bring The Manyard Children Home" - Facebook.]

What really spooks me at this point, seems like Lisa's car was moved/used for a reason.

Really urkes me that police didn't enter the house that night but, I do understand that at this point that a "crime" had not occurred.
 
nervous_nellie said:
im also curious if tina calling/texting about feeding the dog is something she always did? if it wasnt then maybe that set off gb's radar and he may have decided to swing by the house and happened to find them moving out of the house???
Click to expand...

My feelings on the text have been mixed, like the "flow" of information in this case.
I had a feeling that she didn't ever send this text, not herself... but someone else (messing with the time frame.)
I felt like maybe it was sent because the ex-bf was supposed to come over after work and feed the animals. Not sure, this is all my speculation. The only reason why I could think that was done was to throw the time frame, or because something was going on in the house at that point and no extra visitors were wanted (or the assumption that one would show up, like the ex.)

But, after reading where Sprangs' car was found, I was thinking... maybe that text was a warning shot to the ex-bf. Seems like a really random, early time to text someone. [Which, I am reiterating here, I am super concerned for the welfare of Sprang's youngest child now.] I do realize that the ex pulls night shifts, so he was more perceptible to getting it and responding. For Lisa to be up at 4:40 AM is really early in the morning (but, is MSM still reporting she sent it at 4:40 AM still?), especially if she works in the afternoon, but maybe she takes mid-day naps like I do?

Wonder if the ex replied her text? Wonder where his ping hit?
 
Here is my thinking at this time:
I am unsure if Stephanie was helping Tina pick out an apartment or if they had plans to move in together. Different versions online.

Wed:
Ex bf, Greg Borders states he last saw the family
at 4am.
They talked briefly around 5am.
He also says he received at text message from
Tina around 11am.
Kids are in school.
Tina plans to look for a new rental.
Stephanie comes over to help her pick out the new place.
(unknown time she arrives)

Kids arrive home from school around 4:30pm.
Tina is a no show for her job at Dairy Queen that evening.
Tina's boss at DQ calls police to do a welfare check about Tina.
Police come to home. Pickup parked outside house. Lights on.
No one answers.
Later that evening, police drop by again. Pickup there. Lights on
No one answers.

Thurs:
Kids are not in school.
Tina is a no show at work
Her boss goes to Tina's house.
She looks in the windows and sees a mess, beer cans.
She goes into the house and
sees two blood stains.
She calls police.
Police are in the house by 5pm.
No pickup parked at the house.
... Ex bf: GB says at noon, his mother called, asking if he
knew where Tina was..

Thurs. night:
Pickup found near Gambier.
Lockdown at a college campus around 11pm.
The pickup is empty.
Stephanie's car is parked inside Tina's garage.
 
sherbetjello said:
My feelings on the text have been mixed, like the "flow" of information in this case.
I had a feeling that she didn't ever send this text, not herself... but someone else (messing with the time frame.)
I felt like maybe it was sent because the ex-bf was supposed to come over after work and feed the animals. Not sure, this is all my speculation. The only reason why I could think that was done was to throw the time frame, or because something was going on in the house at that point and no extra visitors were wanted (or the assumption that one would show up, like the ex.)

But, after reading where Sprangs' car was found, I was thinking... maybe that text was a warning shot to the ex-bf. Seems like a really random, early time to text someone. [Which, I am reiterating here, I am super concerned for the welfare of Sprang's youngest child now.] I do realize that the ex pulls night shifts, so he was more perceptible to getting it and responding. For Lisa to be up at 4:40 AM is really early in the morning (but, is MSM still reporting she sent it at 4:40 AM still?), especially if she works in the afternoon, but maybe she takes mid-day naps like I do?

Wonder if the ex replied her text? Wonder where his ping hit?
Click to expand...


i read that latest dispatch article (will go get linky) .... but i didnt see anything that said anything about sprangs youngest child - other than he is 9yrs old ... is he accounted for?

eta link : http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...for-lead-as-search-for-4-goes-on.html?sid=101
 
nervous_nellie said:
i read that latest dispatch article (will go get linky) .... but i didnt see anything that said anything about sprangs youngest child - other than he is 9yrs old ... is he accounted for?

eta link : http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...for-lead-as-search-for-4-goes-on.html?sid=101
Click to expand...

Again, the flow of information from MSM has been sketchy to me - at best. I had no idea Sprang had children till around 21-hours ago when someone posted on the Facebook page that she had three.

I am RELIEVED that they have all been accounted for.
 
dreamweaver said:
Here is my thinking at this time:
I am unsure if Stephanie was helping Tina pick out an apartment or if they had plans to move in together. Different versions online.

Wed:
Ex bf, Greg Borders states he last saw the family
at 4am.
They talked briefly around 5am.
He also says he received at text message from
Tina around 11am.
Kids are in school.
Tina plans to look for a new rental.
Stephanie comes over to help her pick out the new place.
(unknown time she arrives)

Kids arrive home from school around 4:30pm.
Tina is a no show for her job at Dairy Queen that evening.
Tina's boss at DQ calls police to do a welfare check about Tina.
Police come to home. Pickup parked outside house. Lights on.
No one answers.
Later that evening, police drop by again. Pickup there. Lights on
No one answers.

Thurs:
Kids are not in school.
Tina is a no show at work
Her boss goes to Tina's house.
She looks in the windows and sees a mess, beer cans.
She goes into the house and
sees two blood stains.
She calls police.
Police are in the house by 5pm.
No pickup parked at the house.
... Ex bf: GB says at noon, his mother called, asking if he
knew where Tina was..

Thurs. night:
Pickup found near Gambier.
Lockdown at a college campus around 11pm.
The pickup is empty.
Stephanie's car is parked inside Tina's garage.
Click to expand...

I am so bad with Google docs, word doc, any doc (including getting shots at the doc.) Would it be possible for someone to start a timeline for the information held so far? Maybe bring that over to a new thread when/if it is started?

Thanks for doing this one, Dreamweaver. It's the best timeline I have seen so far.
 
Wondergirl said:
Jumping in here, trying to catch up, not sure if these 2 things have been discussed. These are just questions I have.

1. Is there a possible relationship between the two missing women?

2. Is there any connection to the College where the truck was left?

Hoping for the very best for these 4 missing people.
Click to expand...

My very first thought, actually (not so sure anymore). I do think it should be looked at from every angle.

krista said:
Two thoughts:

1. I think it's very possible that Steph was helping Tina move out while her bf was out of town. I think it's possible that she wanted to go to a shelter, a safe house, or even to steph's house. Perhaps the apartment talk was just talk.....or maybe it was just an 'idea' until that day, when there was a clear way out without any drama or drunken anger.
I think there's a possibility that they used a rental van/truck to move larger items. That would explain three things.....why the family is gone without a vehicle missing....why someone came back for the vehicle the following day....and why it didn't look like a home where a woman and children would live (per LE).
2. I believe that EITHER this bf came home and caught the women and children moving stuff out and became enraged....OR that they left of their own free will to escape a violent situation and are now in hiding....which, for me, would help explain the dog missing as well. I believe the former is more likely due to the fact that the women have made no contact with their families and because they haven't contacted LE (to our knowledge). MOO.


***Belimom*** Congrats! I appreciate your posts and just had my own 1000th~
Click to expand...

(Thank you, and congratulations...)

krista said:
These aren't infant children. IF the bf or even a stranger attacked this family, it seems that SOMEONE in this foursome...or even the dog...would fight back or runaway. Yet there's no struggle in the home. No sign of an attack...just 'an unusual amount of blood'.
Further, we've seen thousands of cases of rage, violence, anger, etc. When do we see cases of such misplaced anger such as this?? I've seen VERY FEW cases where even the family friend is missing.....even the dog. I guess...what I'm saying is that it would be HIGHLY unusual for the boyfriend to overnight become a homicidal maniac who is so angry at his girlfriend that he kills not only her but also her friend and her children....and the dog. I wonder if only one person is deceased....and the other left to protect herself from prosecution...or from losing her children. Sorry....I hate to even suggest that Tina would kill her friend and scare everyone else she knows with fear and worry....but I'm just trying to think outside the box.
Click to expand...

Entire families do go missing - Jamisons, McStays, Springfield 3 (with a friend), etc. (And also the Connecticut home invasion of the Petit family that's in the news right now - where an entire family of four with two not-so-young children were at the mercy of their attackers for something like 17 hours). BUT, to play devil's advocate here - why would the children not fight if someone had been attacked in their home?

- They were at gunpoint/knifepoint/tied up/scared
- OR the attacker was attacking for a reason (self-defense?)
- OR the attacker was someone they were very close to and was an authority figure in their lives (read between the lines here - again, just brainstorming)
 
belimom said:
My very first thought, actually (not so sure anymore). I do think it should be looked at from every angle.



(Thank you, and congratulations...)



Entire families do go missing - Jamisons, McStays, Springfield 3 (with a friend), etc. BUT, to play devil's advocate here - why would the children not fight if someone had been attacked in their home?

- They were at gunpoint/knifepoint/tied up/scared
- OR the attacker was attacking for a reason (self-defense?)
- OR the attacker was someone they were very close to and was an authority figure in their lives (read between the lines here - again, just brainstorming)
Click to expand...

and there is the Szczepankiks family, missing 12/14/09, Omaha, NE
 
STEADFAST said:
...(snipped)...

According to the father of the children, "The kids have told me when he gets drunk, he gets somewhat violent. He throws beer bottles at the pickup truck if their mom tries to leave. He broke the garage door. I mean, you know, he gets real vulgar, you know, belligerent when he's drunk."
http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/state/4-reported-missing-forces-lockdown-at-ohio-college

Domestic violence often escalates over time. I think it's really significant that at this time Tina was in the process of moving on.
Click to expand...

Leila said:
I agree with the scenario you've outlined. When we first heard of this case, I didn't have any suspicious regarding a likely perp, but I do now.
Click to expand...

Hard to ignore all of this, combined with his leaving work early and spending the night elsewhere. Also, see below:

krista said:
Very true, Steadfast....but he has a solid alibi if his friend vouches for his whereabouts in another city.
I wonder who his friend is....and if HIS whereabouts can be proven.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101112/ap_on_re_us/us_ohio_family_missing
"Borders said he finished his shift at 4 p.m. Wednesday and spent the night with a friend. He said he was playing golf on Thursday when his mother called and said Herrmann apparently was missing.
He said he didn't think much of it until he returned to the house in Howard after 5:30 p.m. and found authorities there.
He gave officers permission to search the house and didn't go inside himself. He said a deputy took a few steps into the home and said he saw a considerable mess inside.
"I think something bad happened, something happened inside the house," Borders said. "It's not like Tina or me to leave the house unsecured."
It wasn't clear if the house was unlocked when authorities arrived."

This is the media's wording....so take it with a grain of salt....but if YOUR roommate/ former fiancee, and her two children are missing from YOUR home, would you really wait outside? I can't presume to know his personality or what happened at that moment, but even if I hated my roommate I would be in there trying to see what happened, trying to help out any way I could. moo.
Click to expand...

Didn't think much of it? His GF is missing along with her kids. I think most people would think quite a bit about it...

Didn't go inside? If it were my home, I think I'd be the first one running in to see if I noticed anything amiss that maybe only someone who lived there would notice, etc. Seems odd to me - like maybe he couldn't stand to look at the scene of the crime... again.

"Unsecured?" Sounds too much like a LE term. Most folks would say 'unlocked' or 'open'. I don't really see him saying, "Honey, be sure to secure the house when you leave."

Again, all of this is MOO. I don't want to point the finger at any innocent person or any victim, but SOMEONE is the perp. I think it's likely one of the missing adults, the BF, or someone else close to the family is responsible.
 
belimom said:
Hard to ignore all of this, combined with his leaving work early and spending the night elsewhere. Also, see below:



Didn't think much of it? His GF is missing along with her kids. I think most people would think quite a bit about it...

Didn't go inside? If it were my home, I think I'd be the first one running in to see if I noticed anything amiss that maybe only someone who lived there would notice, etc. Seems odd to me - like maybe he couldn't stand to look at the scene of the crime... again.

"Unsecured?" Sounds too much like a LE term. Most folks would say 'unlocked' or 'open'. I don't really see him saying, "Honey, be sure to secure the house when you leave."

Again, all of this is MOO. I don't want to point the finger at any innocent person or any victim, but SOMEONE is the perp. I think it's likely one of the missing adults, the BF, or someone else close to the family is responsible.
Click to expand...

I agree. And his mom supposedly called him around noon that day to ask if he knew where Tina was...
And I would think his mom would add more to the conversation, such as,
Tina's boss is calling around, she didn't come to work last night.
So, it could not have been a surprise to him that things had gone wrong
when he got back to the house around 5:30pm.
And where is his concern about the kids.

And 'unsecured'... no one says that.
It would be, ' we always leave the back door unlocked..' kind of thing.
I doubt that he would be let into the house, as it was a crime scene.

And wouldn't other people call him during the day? Maybe the school?
Maybe Tina's boss from DQ?
Maybe other friends or neighbors?

I am sure LE has his cell phone records and have interviewed his friend where he spent the night and where he played golf.

I have no idea if he is guilty or not, but there are reports that he is violent at times; that he was losing a home they bought in 2007; his relationship with Tina of six years was over;
(i think it is 6 yrs..?)
.....
JMO
 
darlin gal said:
image-missing-women-280.jpg

Stephanie (left) and Tina (right)
Click to expand...

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Pray-...74173612594279&id=547206268&fbid=451163646268

A more recent pic of Tina and the kids.
 
Why this is so baffling:

Abductor is in the house most of Wed. afternoon.
If he was there to rob, why not do so and leave?

If he was there to sexually assault the women, then
why not leave afterward?

No, he/she stays there and waits for the kids to come home
from school.
And then, he/she either transports all four people and the dog
somewhere else and comes back to the house,
and does what?
does he try to clean up the scene? No.
does he try to hide evidence? No.

By Thurs. at 4pm, the house is empty and Tina's pickup is gone.
By Thurs. at 11pm, the pickup is found. Empty.

questions :
what other car was parked at the house on Wed. afternoon?
what phone calls did tina or stephanie get that day?

If this was a home invasion,
why not take whatever valuables and
tie everyone up and get out of there.

Even if, God forbid, he/she killed everyone,
why not just leave the scene, get away, establish an
alibi.

If no one was killed inside the house, why take everyone?
Just tie them up and get going.

Two people involved as abductors?

It feels personal, but not a deep rage, otherwise they
would all be found inside the house.

JMO
 
I am pretty confident they will be able to pull some information from the truck drop off with surveillance video, if they haven't already (and if the picture I am uploading is the correct location.)

You have a USPS on one corner, practically.
You have a Peoples Bank on the south side.
You have a Hotel/Inn of some sort facing west.
A fire department facing north.
Nothing facing East, however the bank probably has outside cameras on the parking lot.
I would assume that the college has some sort of video, for safety reasons (however, it looks like a really small school.)

Here is the picture:

S0eQP.png
 
has anyone come across any dob info on any of these people? i would like to submit it to our forensic astrologers....
 
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