OK - Terence Crutcher, 40, fatally shot by Tulsa PD officer, 16 Sept 2016

[bluesneakers]

We need to get rid of some and we need an outside agency reviewing these incidents and handing out firings, arrests, sentences. Cops investigating cops doesn't work.

And so many other things, but killing citizens, paid leave, back to work, and millions in settlement money seems to be working for the majority.

 

[popsicle]

Initial police briefings indicated Crutcher was not obeying officers' commands, but MacKenzie said Monday she didn't know what Crutcher was doing that prompted police to shoot. Two 911 calls described an SUV that had been abandoned in the middle of the road. One unidentified caller said the driver was acting strangely, adding, "I think he's smoking something."

http://www.abc15.com/news/national/man-fatally-shot-by-tulsa-police-had-no-gun

What it appears to me is he was not obeying commands... not raising his hands and walking towards the Officer. That is why the response of so many Officers and the copter. He then put his hands up but began walking back to his vehicle. Once he was back at the vehicle it appears he put his hands down... and possibly reached into the window of his vehicle. He was shot and tased at the same time. jmo

 

[Betty P]

Initial police briefings indicated Crutcher was not obeying officers' commands, but MacKenzie said Monday she didn't know what Crutcher was doing that prompted police to shoot. Two 911 calls described an SUV that had been abandoned in the middle of the road. One unidentified caller said the driver was acting strangely, adding, "I think he's smoking something."

http://www.abc15.com/news/national/man-fatally-shot-by-tulsa-police-had-no-gun

What it appears to me is he was not obeying commands... not raising his hands and walking towards the Officer. That is why the response of so many Officers and the copter. He then put his hands up but began walking back to his vehicle. Once he was back at the vehicle it appears he put his hands down... and possibly reached into the window of his vehicle. He was shot and tased at the same time. jmo

We've already seen in numerous videos of black males shot by LE that there's no "right" way for them to respond. They're immediately considered dangerous just because they're black. This guy was standing next to his stalled vehicle. He wasn't on drugs, he was driving home from attending a night class at the local community college.

He was trying to ask LE for help in moving his vehicle out of the roadway and trying to respond to their orders. He was dead from the minute his car stalled on the roadway and LE responded. There was nothing he could have done to stop them from killing him.

We need to retrain police officers to stop thinking of every black person as an enemy combatant.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

If he walked back to the vehicle, put his hands down, and reached into the window (against orders) I think it's quite possible the officers feared he was grabbing a gun.
Split second decision.
I'm not sure what happened. But I do wonder why he stopped complying.

JMO I haven't seen the video. Just going by reading.

 

[bluesneakers]

Dwyane Wade, athletes irate over death of Terence Crutcher at hands of Tulsa police

If Colin Kaepernick's national anthem protest has accomplished nothing else, it's awakened professional athletes to the power and reach of their voices to work towards social justice.

And on Tuesday, in the wake of yet another horrific shooting death at the hands of police, players were making use of those voices and their increasingly magnified platform.

Dwyane Wade —who along with Carmelo Anthony, LeBron James and Chris Paul opened the ESPYs with a passionate plea to end “racial profiling” and “the shoot to kill mentality” among law enforcement and “not seeing the value of black and brown bodies..." —took to Instagram to comment on Crutcher’s killing posting a black image with just #TERENCECRUTCHER written in white.

And Philadelphia safety Malcolm Jenkins, who spearheaded a trio of Eagles who raised their fists in protest on Monday night in Chicago, begged the nation once again to understand what should be basic: There's something wrong when an innocent man is shot by police.

"The first step to fixing a problem is admitting that there is one! Don't ignore injustice #TerenceCrutcher," he tweeted.

More at the link, including instagrams.

 

[bluesneakers]

We've already seen in numerous videos of black males shot by LE that there's no "right" way for them to respond. They're immediately considered dangerous just because they're black. This guy was standing next to his stalled vehicle. He wasn't on drugs, he was driving home from attending a night class at the local community college.

He was trying to ask LE for help in moving his vehicle out of the roadway and trying to respond to their orders. He was dead from the minute his car stalled on the roadway and LE responded. There was nothing he could have done to stop them from killing him.

We need to retrain police officers to stop thinking of every black person as an enemy combatant.

There's no right way and there's not even any consistency. Crutcher was unarmed, hadn't committed any crime, was not a suspect, was not threatening.... what else could he have done? From the minute they zeroed in on him it was over - the outcome at that point was entirely out of his hands.

Imagine having done NOTHING WRONG and being surrounded by armed police officers who want to kill you.

 

[human]

There's no right way and there's not even any consistency. Crutcher was unarmed, hadn't committed any crime, was not a suspect, was not threatening.... what else could he have done? From the minute they zeroed in on him it was over - the outcome at that point was entirely out of his hands.

Imagine having done NOTHING WRONG and being surrounded by armed police officers who want to kill you.

I have friends who are black and they are terrified for their children. I read comments of how people are sick of the race card. Yeah, I bet they are when they are white and it is not part of their everyday life. So boring to hear about it when one is white. Grrrrrrrrrr!

 

[bluesneakers]

I have friends who are black and they are terrified for their children. I read comments of how people are sick of the race card. Yeah, I bet they are when they are white and it is not part of their everyday life. So boring to hear about it when one is white. Grrrrrrrrrr!

If the race card is so powerful why didn't Terence play it when he was surrounded?

 

[sds71]

I thought he was trying to steady himself on the car after being tased.

 

[Jax49]

Press conference by attorneys for the family, showed two stills from the ground level camera, clearly showing the WINDOW WAS UP.

How did he reach into a closed window???

 

[JeannaT]

And Terence hadn't even been pulled over. His car stalled.

There's not a busted tail light or expired tag for these officers to hide behind. He was murdered, for nothing, and I don't believe for a second his life mattered to any one of the cops who stood there and watched him die.

It's hard to tell if his car "stalled". I've never seen a car "stall" in the middle of a two lane road before where you don't have time to pull over to the side. His car was parked in the middle of the road, doors open, and a man was behaving erratically is what the 911 call described. Upon arriving at the scene on the way to a different call, the officers gave the man several directions which he refused to obey, and wouldn't show his hands. There is no video of any of that - the video is from the backup that was called. It seems to me that this is clearly a case where a taser was warranted. I don't know how it happened that he was tased by one officer and shot at the same time by another - it seems the female cop didn't know he was being tased. We only have footage and video from the last 30 seconds of the incident so it's hard to know what all was going on that made the cops alarmed, but I don't think anyone has ever seen a "stalled" car in the position that car was in.

I don't mean to sound like I'm defending the female cop - it doesn't seem she is cut out for police work and she grossly overreacted. BUT, I don't think this is a case where he was by the side of the road, a hapless driver with a broken down car, and was gunned down for nothing by a brutal act of police.

 

[Betty P]

Press conference by attorneys for the family, showed two stills from the ground level camera, clearly showing the WINDOW WAS UP.

How did he reach into a closed window???

My impression from watching the helicopter video was that he was leaning against his vehicle with arms up to allow them to frisk him. Given the location of the police, they would have been able to see what he was doing and that the window was closed. It appeared he was also talking to them at the time. It will be interesting to hear the audio from any bodycams they were wearing.

 

[popsicle]

Court records show Terence Crutcher has been convicted of drug trafficking, obstructing an officer, resisting an officer and petty larceny in the past. The documents also show that Crutcher has several alcohol and vehicle-related charges, including driving with a suspended license.

http://www.kjrh.com/news/local-news...the-unarmed-man-fatally-shot-by-a-tpd-officer

He was on probation for drug trafficking at the time.

http://docapp065p.doc.state.ok.us/s...RTAL30&doc_num=556091&offender_book_id=333041

 

[bluesneakers]

It's hard to tell if his car "stalled". I've never seen a car "stall" in the middle of a two lane road before where you don't have time to pull over to the side. His car was parked in the middle of the road, doors open, and a man was behaving erratically is what the 911 call described. Upon arriving at the scene on the way to a different call, the officers gave the man several directions which he refused to obey, and wouldn't show his hands. There is no video of any of that - the video is from the backup that was called. It seems to me that this is clearly a case where a taser was warranted. I don't know how it happened that he was tased by one officer and shot at the same time by another - it seems the female cop didn't know he was being tased. We only have footage and video from the last 30 seconds of the incident so it's hard to know what all was going on that made the cops alarmed, but I don't think anyone has ever seen a "stalled" car in the position that car was in.

I don't mean to sound like I'm defending the female cop - it doesn't seem she is cut out for police work and she grossly overreacted. BUT, I don't think this is a case where he was by the side of the road, a hapless driver with a broken down car, and was gunned down for nothing by a brutal act of police.

What difference does it make? Had he broken any laws? A car stopped on the road for ANY reason isn't a capital crime as far as I know.

He wouldn't show his hands? You should watch the video - his hands are in the air and he is walking, not threatening anyone. Which commands did he disobey?

The officer who shot him is not cut out for police work and neither are any of the others who stood around and did NOTHING while a man was suffering and dying in front of them. Serving and protecting only themselves.

 

[Betty P]

It's hard to tell if his car "stalled". I've never seen a car "stall" in the middle of a two lane road before where you don't have time to pull over to the side. His car was parked in the middle of the road, doors open, and a man was behaving erratically is what the 911 call described. Upon arriving at the scene on the way to a different call, the officers gave the man several directions which he refused to obey, and wouldn't show his hands. There is no video of any of that - the video is from the backup that was called. It seems to me that this is clearly a case where a taser was warranted. I don't know how it happened that he was tased by one officer and shot at the same time by another - it seems the female cop didn't know he was being tased. We only have footage and video from the last 30 seconds of the incident so it's hard to know what all was going on that made the cops alarmed, but I don't think anyone has ever seen a "stalled" car in the position that car was in.

I don't mean to sound like I'm defending the female cop - it doesn't seem she is cut out for police work and she grossly overreacted. BUT, I don't think this is a case where he was by the side of the road, a hapless driver with a broken down car, and was gunned down for nothing by a brutal act of police.

If your vehicle suddenly stalls (engine stops) on an incline, as his did, the power steering would become inactive and it would be difficult to steer the rolling car. Power brakes also become inactive. It probably drifted over the center line as he pulled the emergency brake. Unable to start it, it would be left there.

There's nothing erratic or unusual in his behavior. The autopsy/ medical exam didn't show the presence of alcohol or drugs. He was probably walking back to the police car explaining what happened, but they weren't listening. The guys in the helicopter, on the radio, had already pegged him as a dangerous person. He was probably confused by their reaction towards him, but raised his hands and started walking back to his car. They decided to tase him instead.

There were many ways they could have de-escalated the situation, but they chose not to.

I can't figure out why the woman officer shoots him then yells "shots fired" into her radio. Perhaps she was trying to cover up and make it seem like he shot at her first.

These officers have already been caught giving false information about this incident. Right now, I don't believe anything they say.

 

[JeannaT]

What difference does it make? Had he broken any laws? A car stopped on the road for ANY reason isn't a capital crime as far as I know.

He wouldn't show his hands? You should watch the video - his hands are in the air and he is walking, not threatening anyone. Which commands did he disobey?

The officer who shot him is not cut out for police work and neither are any of the others who stood around and did NOTHING while a man was suffering and dying in front of them. Serving and protecting only themselves.

Well, I agree with you about the officer who shot him, and wonder why aid wasn't rendered by the officers on the scene except their behavior seems to indicate they were prepared for him to get back up.

There is no video of the first several minutes of the encounter, all you get to see is the last less than 30 seconds. So you don't get to see whether he was cooperative in the beginning, except a helicopter and a second police car wouldn't have been called if he was a cooperative stranded motorist.

It does matter, bluesneakers. There are cases where citizens are shot dead out of the blue for no apparent reason whatsoever, and that's not what seems to have happened here. He certainly, IMHO, deserved to be tasered.

 

[Betty P]

Court records show Terence Crutcher has been convicted of drug trafficking, obstructing an officer, resisting an officer and petty larceny in the past. The documents also show that Crutcher has several alcohol and vehicle-related charges, including driving with a suspended license.

http://www.kjrh.com/news/local-news...the-unarmed-man-fatally-shot-by-a-tpd-officer

He was on probation for drug trafficking at the time.

http://docapp065p.doc.state.ok.us/s...RTAL30&doc_num=556091&offender_book_id=333041

The second link isn't working for me.

If true, none of those things justifies killing him in cold blood for having a stalled vehicle in the roadway.

 

[Betty P]

Well, I agree with you about the officer who shot him, and wonder why aid wasn't rendered by the officers on the scene except their behavior seems to indicate they were prepared for him to get back up.

There is no video of the first several minutes of the encounter, all you get to see is the last less than 30 seconds. So you don't get to see whether he was cooperative in the beginning, except a helicopter and a second police car wouldn't have been called if he was a cooperative stranded motorist.

It does matter, bluesneakers. There are cases where citizens are shot dead out of the blue for no apparent reason whatsoever, and that's not what seems to have happened here. He certainly, IMHO, deserved to be tasered.

If there's video available from the first minutes (and there should be, as it looked like there were several LEO's already on the scene and the helicopter had been there a while), the Tulsa PD should release it. They haven't.

 

[bluesneakers]

Well, I agree with you about the officer who shot him, and wonder why aid wasn't rendered by the officers on the scene except their behavior seems to indicate they were prepared for him to get back up.

There is no video of the first several minutes of the encounter, all you get to see is the last less than 30 seconds. So you don't get to see whether he was cooperative in the beginning, except a helicopter and a second police car wouldn't have been called if he was a cooperative stranded motorist.

It does matter, bluesneakers. There are cases where citizens are shot dead out of the blue for no apparent reason whatsoever, and that's not what seems to have happened here. He certainly, IMHO, deserved to be tasered.

Why did he deserve to be tasered? He was outnumbered, unarmed and unable to escape. I can't imagine what he might have done or said at that moment that justified what the officers did to him.

The video starts with him walking slowly on the road, surrounded, with his arms in the air. Obviously cooperative and doing exactly what we are told to do. He is visible doing this from the dashcam and from the helicopter.

 

[ZooSleuth]

If your vehicle suddenly stalls (engine stops) on an incline, as his did, the power steering would become inactive and it would be difficult to steer the rolling car. Power brakes also become inactive. It probably drifted over the center line as he pulled the emergency brake. Unable to start it, it would be left there.

There's nothing erratic or unusual in his behavior. The autopsy/ medical exam didn't show the presence of alcohol or drugs. He was probably walking back to the police car explaining what happened, but they weren't listening. The guys in the helicopter, on the radio, had already pegged him as a dangerous person. He was probably confused by their reaction towards him, but raised his hands and started walking back to his car. They decided to tase him instead.

There were many ways they could have de-escalated the situation, but they chose not to.

I can't figure out why the woman officer shoots him then yells "shots fired" into her radio. Perhaps she was trying to cover up and make it seem like he shot at her first.

These officers have already been caught giving false information about this incident. Right now, I don't believe anything they say.

I can confirm what you said is possible when a vehicle stalls. When I was younger I had a Toyota that had recently received a new battery. The battery was held in place with a bungee cord. I guess whoever replaced the battery didn't put the bungee cord on correctly and one day when I was taking a turn the battery moved and the connection was lost. This caused everything on my car to turn off including power steering and I was able to sort of pull over but it was extremely difficult to steer. I could easily see somebody being confused when this happens and not being able to get their car off the road in time. If you lose power steering in an SUV (like TC's) I imagine it would be even harder to steer than my car was because of the heavier tires and overall heavier vehicle with an SUV.