PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #9

[BigCat]

I will admit that it could be a reason.

The problem is, those three people are facing criminal charges. If there was something criminal in RFG actions, that would be different, the motive, to see that his pension remains intact, or to prevent a law suit, would be a very strong reason. Neither a colossal lapse of judgment, stupidity, nor cowardice are criminal, even in combination.

Now, I am worried about the titling of the Mini. It was in PEF's name and the reason was given was in case RFG would be sued. It is possible certainly that he thought the decision was so poor, that it would open him to civil liability, especially if he found out that Sandusky was worse than reported and still was at it. It just seems, from the outside, that while the decision not to prosecute Sandusky was hideously stupid, it doesn't reach that level.

I read on another site that the State Police learned that McQueary was a possible witness after an anonymous email was sent to the Centre County DA, who then forwarded the email to the AG's office. I'm not certain on the date. If that is the case, then I think it's a real possibility Gricar received a similiar email at an earlier date. I hope that possibility was explored.

Was LE able to access his email account? I'm not a computer person, so I have no idea if it's technically possible to recover deleted emails.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I read on another site that the State Police learned that McQueary was a possible witness after an anonymous email was sent to the Centre County DA, who then forwarded the email to the AG's office. I'm not certain on the date. If that is the case, then I think it's a real possibility Gricar received a similiar email at an earlier date. I hope that possibility was explored.

Was LE able to access his email account? I'm not a computer person, so I have no idea if it's technically possible to recover deleted emails.

That is what happened in October or November 2010. It was well into the investigation and SPM, the DA, had been in office for 10-11 months at that point.

Yes, e-mail goes through a central computer and is stored there, a carbon copy, as it were. If there was an e-mail sent to RFG in 2005, regarding Sandusky, the police should have had it. Obviously, they would want to look to see if RFG was arranging a meeting with someone in Lewisburg, and those arrangement could have been via e-mail.

I have looked at the possibility:

http://www.centredaily.com/2012/03/12/3123385/parking-lots.html

http://www.centredaily.com/2009/04/21/2396785/murder-i-a-meeting-for-murder.html

Read more here: http://www.centredaily.com/2012/04/10/3157763/a-meeting-for-murder-20.html#storylink=cpy

http://www.centredaily.com/2012/04/10/3157763/a-meeting-for-murder-20.html

The second one was written almost two years before I'd ever heard of Jerry Sandusky, ironically, and more than a year prior to that e-mail being sent. Some of the arguments against have vanished.

The third looks at this with new evidence.

 

[JaimeSommers]

RSBM ...

http://www.centredaily.com/2009/04/21/2396785/murder-i-a-meeting-for-murder.html

Was reading this one and have a question: What kind of dogs were used in the search? Search dogs? Cadaver dogs? Both? (Just curious.)

That marsh has always bothered me. In one of the TV shows about Gricar's disappearance, they said it's impossible to search it. Then again, if it's impossible to traverse it for a search would it be difficult to traverse it to hide a body?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

RSBM ...



Was reading this one and have a question: What kind of dogs were used in the search? Search dogs? Cadaver dogs? Both? (Just curious.)

That marsh has always bothered me. In one of the TV shows about Gricar's disappearance, they said it's impossible to search it. Then again, if it's impossible to traverse it for a search would it be difficult to traverse it to hide a body?

The marsh is not impossible, but I know of no organized search of it, with a dog.

On 4/17/05, the dog was listed as a bloodhound for the parking lot. Their was an indication that it was a scent trail. The handler said that it could indicate RFG got into a car, from the way the circled when the trail was lost.

I believe a cadaver dog was used in the river search; they had the dog on the boat.

 

[MissJ]

I still don't think suicide but I'm 60% murder and 40% walk away. It changes frequently.JMO.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Current Centre County District Attorney Stacy Parks Miller (SPM) will be running unopposed for re-election. http://www.centredaily.com/2013/03/13/3536337/student-enters-contested-state.html

This is the first time that no candidate has filed in opposition since 1997. In 2001, RFG had primary opposition. In 2005, after RFG had announced his retirement, both the Republican and Democratic primaries were contested. In 2009, the Democratic primary was contested.

A write-in candidacy is possible, though SPM could seek that nomination on write-in votes as well.

I will add that this is relevant because this office is basically the lead office investigating the Gricar case.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I was looking at the Freeh Report again and noticed something.

In dealing with the 1998 incident, it says, "The prosecutor assigned to the Sandusky cased declined to be interviewed by the Special Investigative Counsel." (p. 46)

It does not say that Karen Arnold declined to be interviewed. It mentions Arnold by name on p. 43.

Could there be another prosecutor (Sloan?) that was assigned to the case and not Arnold?

 

[APIMaple]

For a long time the lap top being put in the water confused me and made me wonder why someone would do that, and commit suicide, so I ruled out suicide.

With what we know now, I'm wondering if Ray didn't sadly end his life, and attempt to wash away any evidence of his involvement in the Sandusky affair from the lap top.
I still slightly lean toward walk away, but less so these days.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I have two problems with suicide, a general one, and one to being a Sandusky related one.

First, there is no body. It is not impossible by this point that it wouldn't be found, but it is hugely likely that it would have been discovered. That is the general.

Second, RFG could have prosecuted Sandusky on the 1998 incident at any point since the summer of 1998, so long as he remained DA. He had the second victim, B. K., so the case would have been stronger than the 2012 case, in regard to Victim 6.

There is no evidence that he was even thinking in that direction; they was no file in the DA's Office on Sandusky. Politically, RFG was not going to be facing reelection after 2001, nor planning to practice law, so the prosecution would not have had a political or professional effect on RFG. Sandusky, while still popular in the early 2000's, was no longer viewed as Paterno's heir apparent by the public, so a prosecution would not have been as damaging. RFG would not have been seen as damaging PSU football.

 

[BigCat]

I have two problems with suicide, a general one, and one to being a Sandusky related one.

First, there is no body. It is not impossible by this point that it wouldn't be found, but it is hugely likely that it would have been discovered. That is the general.

Second, RFG could have prosecuted Sandusky on the 1998 incident at any point since the summer of 1998, so long as he remained DA. He had the second victim, B. K., so the case would have been stronger than the 2012 case, in regard to Victim 6.

There is no evidence that he was even thinking in that direction; they was no file in the DA's Office on Sandusky. Politically, RFG was not going to be facing reelection after 2001, nor planning to practice law, so the prosecution would not have had a political or professional effect on RFG. Sandusky, while still popular in the early 2000's, was no longer viewed as Paterno's heir apparent by the public, so a prosecution would not have been as damaging. RFG would not have been seen as damaging PSU football.

I think you have a blind spot on this point. Take that as a compliment: you have a rational and fair mind. A fan-atic, on the the other hand, is defined by his irrational, unjust perspective.

The hatred I have read on the PSU football message board for Tom Corbitt and Louie Freeh is beyond reason. I've even read posts that blame the victims, though I have to believe those are the sentiments of the radical fringe.

I'm not just basing my opinion on what I've read on PSU football boards. I know how my own community would react to a DA prosecuting someone associated with the state university's football team. It wouldn't matter that the person is no longer with the program, especially since the incident occurred on campus property while he was still on staff of the current head football coach. The perception would be that the football program is on trial. Time to circle the wagons.

JMO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I think you have a blind spot on this point. Take that as a compliment: you have a rational and fair mind. A fan-atic, on the the other hand, is defined by his irrational, unjust perspective.

The hatred I have read on the PSU football message board for Tom Corbitt and Louie Freeh is beyond reason. I've even read posts that blame the victims, though I have to believe those are the sentiments of the radical fringe.

I'm not just basing my opinion on what I've read on PSU football boards. I know how my own community would react to a DA prosecuting someone associated with the state university's football team. It wouldn't matter that the person is no longer with the program, especially since the incident occurred on campus property while he was still on staff of the current head football coach. The perception would be that the football program is on trial. Time to circle the wagons.

JMO

I've been reading some of them, and even engaging. Most of the anger is directed against the firing of Paterno. There are a few defenders of Spanier, Schultz, and Curley, but they are in the extreme minority.

Part of this is that, according to RFG, he was not planning to run after 2001, or practice law privately. There were no political constraints on him.

I will agree that there were, and would be, some "crazy football fans," in RFG's words, but the influence of football in the 1998 case diminished after 2000 and the political aspect after 2001.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

As this thread has been around for over a year and has 35 pages, I have stared a new thread:
PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #10 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I will be requesting this one be closed.