some 12 year old are having sex but they should not be. we let our kids grow up way to fast. yes we need sex ed because kids are doing it but we dont need sex glorified on a movie in class. as for your 15 yr old niece if i remember back that far 15 and 12 are miles apart. if this movie was show to my 15 year old i may not be happy but not near as upset as i would be at 12. if this was a movie about a man and woman having sex i would still be upset. i am busy trying to teach my child to have morals for herself but not judge others for their beliefs. as a parent i dont think this would help with a tough job. they are 12!! show them night at the museum or something for pity sake.
sub shows Brokeback Mtn to 8th graders
- Thread starter angelmom
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I would, appropriately depicted (as I think BB mostly is, and maybe a "Top Gun" type hetero sex scene) if I've determined it's right for her age and maturity and sends the right message. For me, it has nothing to do with the gender of the two people - it has to do with what it teaches. i.e. is it sex w/ violence, or w/o repercussions, a one night stand or a relationship, real caring for the other person's pleasure and so forth.
BUT - that's if I'm there, and talk w/ her about it and such. I do not think any sexual scene is appropriate in a classroom, and not w/ 8th graders. I also don't think violent movies or movies that degrade women or others should be shown.
In 9th grade, they showed Fellini's (I think Fellini) Romeo and Juliet. If you've seen it, you may or may not remember that there's a flash of Juliet's breast - oh, and that it's 14 year olds having sex. And a maid talking about penises. I remember it quite vividly, as I'm sure all of my male classmates do. Movies have an impact in a way that teacher's lectures sure don't.
This sub certainly made a deliberate choice. Why it was made I have no idea.
Marthatex
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There's plenty of hetero sex in the movie as well. It's just not an appropriate movie for school IMO.
Around here it caused a huge controversy when a high school teacher placed the book on her class reading list.
I think everyone is agreeing with you. Even 8th to 9th is quite a difference. Regardless it is still a sub making an inappropriate choice about what to show your children - if it's borderline, then it shouldn't be shown. Or at least, parents should be notified.
BBM is only borderline, IMHO, for two scenes - a very short, quickly cut sex scene and a murder/mutilation scene after the fact, not during. Those two scenes I would distract my 4 year old from (or turn off) - but I wouldn't shield her from the rest of the movie - there's no reason.
However, if I had a 12 year old, I would likely allow them to watch the entire thing, if I were present. I would, though, be very upset if they were shown it at school, due to those scenes and because I wouldn't be able to control the discussion after.
that may be true. some people think aliens come from space and stick probes up our butts. i dont think most people responding here think either of those things. it's the fact they are 12 for me. my kid is not old enough to make her own moral judgement on homosexual behavior or hetrosexual behavior. i dont want to force my feeling on it down her throat at 12. if i can hold my self back with my own kid why cant a sub with a room full of kids she dont even know?
That's right - I'd forgotten about Anne Hathaway. My 4 year old would lose her mind if she happened to glimpse "Ella Enchanted" w/ her shirt off in the back seat of a car. Do Heath and Michelle have scenes too? I think they did.
I confess I haven't read the story - but I think it was a short story.
I am much less in favor of censoring reading, but I would still be concerned about sex scenes in books. We read Philip Roth senior year, and most of the boys could hardly take it. I can't remember the book - it wasn't Tropic of Cancer, but there was a brief scene in the book.
i can agree with every thing you said. you would let your child watch it. unless proven unfit we as parents should get to decided what is right for our kids. btw you have no idea how lucky you are your 4year old will sit still for a whole adult movie. you are blessed.
detectivewannabe
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What ever happened to teaching our children? I get so sick of my elementary children coming home and saying they had "free time" and got to watch a movie. What about reading, and writing? If it's an educational movie (ie. Abraham Lincoln) then that's different but watching Nemo, and Dumbo, in my opinion, is a waste of my tax dollars.
Nova
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As a matter of fact they do, and that scene is much more graphic than the one with the guys in the tent. Funny how it slipped my mind...
Nova
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Yeah, they do. I was being gracious and ignoring that aspect because I don't think showing an R-rated movie to middle school students needs to be a "gay" issue.
Oh, no - she wouldn't sit still - that's part of the reason why I wouldn't be too concerned. Even if the messages were a problem for me, she wouldn't catch it.
My kids are well-behaved and listen well, but they are constantly on the go. It's only when they're ill that they will sit and rarely even then.
And I agree w/ parents deciding absolutely - even if those parents are deciding for reasons different than mine...
Nova
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You are right, sherri. 15 is miles from 12. My point was that I wouldn't insist my niece watch that movie even at 15 and even though she is very familiar with gay people. I meant to imply "much less at 12."
Well - that's part of it... we're much more accustomed and immune to seeing graphic hetero scenes. Even children are constantly inadvertently exposed to it.
But sex scenes in general are much less to worry about than violence. Study after study shows how much more concerned we should be about the casual violence in TV and movies. Once we allowed some TV to our 4 year old, I'm shocked at how much is there - even on Nick, CartoonNetwork and Disney.
I understand that. I'm just saying that some parents objection may not lie along the same lines.
These studies are also reported on news shows that show far worse things than an anvil falling on a rabbit's head or a mallet hitting their oversized foot.
Nova
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I agree. And I hope no one will think I am defending the idiot sub when I say the lawsuit over this is bull. I don't believe anyone's 12-year-old is irreparably impaired by watching Brokeback Mountain. Confused and embarrassed, maybe. And the sub should be fired.
But the lawsuit is just one more example of our being too eager to litigate.
i got what you meant to imply. i agree with you. when a child is old enough to ask they are usually old enough to make their own choices. my husbands cousin is gay and my child loves him. at 12 her getting a visual of what his sex life is like (or he wishes it was like) is wrong. her getting a visual of what my sex life is like would be wrong as well. i quoted you because i liked what you said about forcing her to watch. when in school kids have to do as told. they should never have put a young child in that position.
I've been trying to think of a comparable hetero movie - adultery, frustrated love, sex scenes, controversial content...
I keep thinking of Leaving Las Vegas w/ Nicholas Cage and Elizabeth Shue - the prostitute w/ a heart of gold and he's drinking himself to death. WAY too many inappropriate messages for any high school class.
Or Titanic - he's drawing her naked, and there's a steamy scene (can't remember how graphic) but probably not necessary or appropriate to show in class.
Absolutely - which is why we never watch the evening news. Too depressing and graphic.
Nova
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I think exposure to violence is a difficult issue. My gut feeling is that a constant diet of violence-without-consequence isn't good for anyone. (Whether cartoon "violence" can even be counted is debatable; doing so assumes young viewers can't distinguish between cartoon slapstick and real life violence. And a news program--if at all reputable--IS focusing on consequences.) My concern is with hours upon hours of so-called "action" shows in which nameless human beings are "blown away" casually.