The 1998 Investigation

[J. J. in Phila]

Sloane was just sentenced on the drug charges:

http://www.centredaily.com/2013/09/06/3773680/former-county-prosecutor-sloane.html

He received seven years probation and $100.00 fine. He will also lose his law license, probably for the term of probation.

 

[Saunterer]

Sloane was just sentenced on the drug charges:

http://www.centredaily.com/2013/09/06/3773680/former-county-prosecutor-sloane.html

He received seven years probation and $100.00 fine. He will also lose his law license, probably for the term of probation.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyFyAqLtHq8"]Classical - Chopin - Funeral March - YouTube[/ame]

 

[HMSHood]

I wonder what the verdict would of had been if Ray Gricar prosecuted Jerry Sandusky in 1998.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I wonder what the verdict would of had been if Ray Gricar prosecuted Jerry Sandusky in 1998.

If no one else would have come forward, I'd bet a plea deal. Probation, possibly a fine, with Sandusky being on some of the lists. Prosecution might have led DPW to review its decision.

The key would have been liability insurance. TSM insurance carrier would have never covered them with Sandusky involved in the charity, even if he plead to a minor charge. The community would have been warned.

If some of the other victims had come forward, probably 10-20 years. Sandusky would be a free man today.

 

[HMSHood]

If no one else would have come forward, I'd bet a plea deal. Probation, possibly a fine, with Sandusky being on some of the lists. Prosecution might have led DPW to review its decision.

The key would have been liability insurance. TSM insurance carrier would have never covered them with Sandusky involved in the charity, even if he plead to a minor charge. The community would have been warned.

If some of the other victims had come forward, probably 10-20 years. Sandusky would be a free man today.

I wonder that would of been in the news.

What do you mean other victims come forward 10 to 20 years. Is it 10 to 20 years before 1998?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I wonder that would of been in the news.

What do you mean other victims come forward 10 to 20 years. Is it 10 to 20 years before 1998?

It probably would have been in the news. Ever hear of the actor Jeffery Jones?

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffery_Jones"]Jeffrey Jones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

It would not have sunk into the public consciousness as much. Sandusky would have been out, which is what Paterno wanted.

If they had found some of those other victims, my guess would be 10-20 years in prison. He'd probably have been out in enough time to congratulate Paterno on his 400th win.

 

[HMSHood]

It probably would have been in the news. Ever hear of the actor Jeffery Jones?

Jeffrey Jones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It would not have sunk into the public consciousness as much. Sandusky would have been out, which is what Paterno wanted.

If they had found some of those other victims, my guess would be 10-20 years in prison. He'd probably have been out in enough time to congratulate Paterno on his 400th win.

I guess if Sandusky had been tried, there may have been no Penn State Scandal, like in 2011.

I remember Jeffrey Jones. He was in Ferris Bueller's Day Off as the creepy principal, Edward R. Rooney, who went great lengths to find him. He even went to his home. Crazy, huh? :crazy:

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I guess if Sandusky had been tried, there may have been no Penn State Scandal, like in 2011.

I remember Jeffrey Jones. He was in Ferris Bueller's Day Off as the creepy principal, Edward R. Rooney, who went great lengths to find him. He even went to his home. Crazy, huh? :crazy:

Correct with Jones.

There would have been a scandal in 1998, but it would have played out much differently. Both University of Penn and Bucknell have had staff members in child sex scandals in the past 10 years. In neither case was the scandal overly damaging to the university.

http://www.phillymag.com/articles/the-brilliant-professor-ward/

Frankly, if all that was there was B. K. and Victim 6 it might have a national story when the arrest occurred and the disposition. 2-3 days. There was no claim of rape, just inappropriate touching. Sandusky had not even written his book.

For PSU, their police would have broken the case; PSU would have been seen as cooperating and possibly the heroes of the story.

Had some of the other victims come forward, which is not certain, it would have a bigger story, but not too much bigger. And again, it wouldn't be a major drag on PSU. The NCAA might have investigated, but it is unlikely anything would have happened other than a warning or probation.

The problem was the cover-up in 2001.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

One thing I wanted to add is that had there been an arrest in May-November, 1998, it would have been overshadowed by the Monica Lewinsky Scandal. Then until February 1999, there was the impeachment trial.

Also in October 1998 to January 1999 there was the Thomas Capano murder trial in the greater Philadelphia area, with a lot of alumni in the area. The verdict actually knocked the presidential impeachment off the air.

We definitely would not be talking a PSU scandal as much.

 

[HMSHood]

One thing I wanted to add is that had there been an arrest in May-November, 1998, it would have been overshadowed by the Monica Lewinsky Scandal. Then until February 1999, there was the impeachment trial.

Also in October 1998 to January 1999 there was the Thomas Capano murder trial in the greater Philadelphia area, with a lot of alumni in the area. The verdict actually knocked the presidential impeachment off the air.

We definitely would not be talking a PSU scandal as much.

Oh yeah, the Monica Lewinsky Scandal. It was news for all of 1998 to parts of 1999. Following Clinton Impeachment Hearings, there were Kosovo War and Columbine High School Massacre. I have noticed when there some scandal, crime, etc., some thing big tends to happen. In 2001, there were shark attacks, Chandra Levy, and Danny Almonte (Little League player who was 14), than 9/11.

Interestingly, the Thomas Capano case has been compared with OJ Simpson as they were people in power. Capano was a lawyer and deputy attorney general. Clinton avoided being impeached by the Senate.

2001 was what help bring about the scandal. I wonder of any other cover ups including prior to 1998.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I think you can see how much interest there was in the Chandra Levy case after 9/11.

1998, unless and until more information comes out, was not a coverup. It was properly reported, clearly. It just was not prosecuted at the time. There isn't any hint of any prior coverup.

In terms of the timing, the arrest in 2011 came at a relatively slow news period. Even local elections were over; the presidential primaries had not begun. No major foreign stories. It also was ongoing, unfolding, which 1998 wouldn't have been.

There is a term to describe how the matter was handled; I cannot post it here. There was fault on all sides; that made matters worse. Part of the problem was, none of the people involved were prepared for it. Both the Trustees and Spanier were to blame for that.

I frankly was stunned, from the Gricar aspect of the story, when the presentment came out. If someone had told me that RFG had not prosecuted a case that turned out to be this strong, even after the grand jury investigation was announced, I would have thought it was a joke.

 

[HMSHood]

I think you can see how much interest there was in the Chandra Levy case after 9/11.

1998, unless and until more information comes out, was not a coverup. It was properly reported, clearly. It just was not prosecuted at the time. There isn't any hint of any prior coverup.

In terms of the timing, the arrest in 2011 came at a relatively slow news period. Even local elections were over; the presidential primaries had not begun. No major foreign stories. It also was ongoing, unfolding, which 1998 wouldn't have been.

There is a term to describe how the matter was handled; I cannot post it here. There was fault on all sides; that made matters worse. Part of the problem was, none of the people involved were prepared for it. Both the Trustees and Spanier were to blame for that.

I frankly was stunned, from the Gricar aspect of the story, when the presentment came out. If someone had told me that RFG had not prosecuted a case that turned out to be this strong, even after the grand jury investigation was announced, I would have thought it was a joke.

1998 was the first known report on Jerry Sandusky. He is likely been a child molester for a long time. I often wonder if any other victims had reported him before 1998. Interesting he never was prosecuted at the time by Ray Gricar. Strange turn of events for Gricar in 2005.

2011 had many big news events that year, Japanese Tsunami and Fukushima Nuclear Meltdown (worst nuclear meltdown since Chernobyl in 1986), Osama bin Laden killed by Navy SEALs, Casey Anthony's acquittal, Norway Terrorist Attack, and 10th Anniversary of 9/11.

Another big news story that got great deal of publicity was in November 2007 with the Megan Meier MySpace Suicide case in which Lori Drew, her daughter Sarah, and her assistant Ashley Grills harassed Meier over her daughter not being friends with Meier. Like Sandusky, it was first publicized in a news article in the same fashion as Sandusky was. However, in March 2011, it did not get that much attention as the uproar with Drew went into full speed after Steve Pokin wrote the article. Lori Drew and Jerry Sandusky are similar as they are highly narcissistic, immature, repressed, and target children. They share similar characteristics with Casey Anthony, Fred Phelps, Jodi Arias, and Osama bin Laden. They are probably targets of abuse in their childhood. This one brought attention to bullying.

'My Space' hoax ends with suicide of Dardenne Prairie teen
http://www.stltoday.com/suburban-jo...cle_0304c09a-ab32-5931-9bb3-210a5d5dbd58.html

Jerry Sandusky, former Penn State football staffer, subject of grand jury investigation
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/03/jerry_sandusky_former_penn_sta.html

Chandra Levy was all over the news in the Summer of 2001. There were also California Electricity Crisis (Enron was involved and later went bankrupt in December 2001) and Tropical Storm Allison. It ravaged from Houston area, New Orleans area, North Carolina, Philadelphia area, and New York area. Even by morning of September 11, 2001, the biggest news event was Michael Jackson returning to the NBA. We all know what happened later that day. :tears: :anguish:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaVYdg9BoNI"]September 11, 2001 - As It Happened - Before The Bulletins - YouTube[/ame]

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Wow! that post brought back memories.

For 2011, I was primarily looking at November/December. It was a slow news period.

If 2001 had been reported in early February, and investigation would have taken several weeks, at a minimum. Gricar had a contested primary on May 15, and I doubt that charges would have filed before that.

The wouldn't have known about the attacks, obviously, but it would obviously been overshadowed.

 

[HMSHood]

Wow! that post brought back memories.

For 2011, I was primarily looking at November/December. It was a slow news period.

If 2001 had been reported in early February, and investigation would have taken several weeks, at a minimum. Gricar had a contested primary on May 15, and I doubt that charges would have filed before that.

The wouldn't have known about the attacks, obviously, but it would obviously been overshadowed.

Late 2011 was largely quiet outside of Sandusky.

I am a history buff.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Late 2011 was largely quiet outside of Sandusky.

I am a history buff.

I could tell; everyone else remembers the Bismarck.

To me, 1998 was a time when you knew there would be ongoing stories. You basically would have had two sex scandals moving on at the same time.

There were earlier victims but no suggestion that anyone in LE or at PSU knew about them.

 

[HMSHood]

I could tell; everyone else remembers the Bismarck.

To me, 1998 was a time when you knew there would be ongoing stories. You basically would have had two sex scandals moving on at the same time.

There were earlier victims but no suggestion that anyone in LE or at PSU knew about them.

1998 had strings of school shootings from Westside Middle School and Thurston High School.

Sink The Bismarck!

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The Westside Middle School shooting was in March of 1998, so it would not have had too much effect on a hypothetical Sandusky story in June-August 1998.

Thurston High School was May 20, at a time when the investigation was ongoing, but that story would have died down by June 1.

Still, in looking at all that was going on, Sandusky would just have been one scandal in the midst of another major sex scandal.

 

[HMSHood]

The Westside Middle School shooting was in March of 1998, so it would not have had too much effect on a hypothetical Sandusky story in June-August 1998.

Thurston High School was May 20, at a time when the investigation was ongoing, but that story would have died down by June 1.

Still, in looking at all that was going on, Sandusky would just have been one scandal in the midst of another major sex scandal.

The reason I mention those school shootings is because there strings of them from Pearl High School and Heath High School. 1997-1998 had multiple school shootings and than Columbine Massacre on April 20, 1999. Columbine was big news when it happened. I am sure had Gricar prosecuted Sandusky from the 1998 incident, it probably would of been around that time.

 

[Twindad]

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2013/09/chronology_of_the_penn_state-g.html

There were other, pressing matters closer to home, at least for Shultz.
"In the late 1990s, Penn State Milton S. Hershey Medical Center and Geisinger Health System entered into a merger that ultimately was deemed a failed effort to merge two disparate cultures."

 

[BigCat]

Correct with Jones.

There would have been a scandal in 1998, but it would have played out much differently. Both University of Penn and Bucknell have had staff members in child sex scandals in the past 10 years. In neither case was the scandal overly damaging to the university.

http://www.phillymag.com/articles/the-brilliant-professor-ward/

Frankly, if all that was there was B. K. and Victim 6 it might have a national story when the arrest occurred and the disposition. 2-3 days. There was no claim of rape, just inappropriate touching. Sandusky had not even written his book.

For PSU, their police would have broken the case; PSU would have been seen as cooperating and possibly the heroes of the story.

Had some of the other victims come forward, which is not certain, it would have a bigger story, but not too much bigger. And again, it wouldn't be a major drag on PSU. The NCAA might have investigated, but it is unlikely anything would have happened other than a warning or probation.

The problem was the cover-up in 2001.

Sandusky was still the defensive coordinator in 1998. He would have been removed from that position, even before the case went to trial.

His arrest would have tarnished the reputation of Penn State football and Joe Paterno, which would have harmed football recruiting. And there is no way in hell that Penn State footaball fanatics would have consider the PSU police (or the DA) heroes for damaging the football program. Yes, you and I know that it was Sandusky who would brought shame to the program in that situation; the fans, however, would have seen it differently. Just look at the hatred they have for Mike McQueary.

And let's not forget Harmon's email to Schultz in 98: "We're going to hold off on making any crime log entry. At this point in time I can justify that decision because of the lack of clear evidence of a crime."

That's a cover-up, imo, and a possible violation of the Clery Act.

Also, the possibility of a more thorough cover-up at the PSU level in 98 was hampered by the involvement of Chambers. She initiated the DPW investigation.

As for Gricar...well, he's not here to justify his decision. All the more reason that the 98 investigation needs to be looked into.

I suspect it won't happen, unfortunately. Ironically, the only people really calling for further investigation in to how the 1998 incident was handled are the Joebots. They're convinced the cover-up will lead back to the Harrisburg branch of the Illuminati. Well, OK, if that's where the evidence take us. I doubt it, but I have an open mind. There just needs to be an investigation.

JMO