The Presence of the Ransom Note

[SunnieRN]

Cathy, thank you for sharing your experiences with us! I am so happy that you were able to look past the preacher, to God!!

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Just wanted to throw this out there, but does Burke have a black eye in that picture? Or is it just something on the picture?

I'm pretty sure it's not a mark on the picture. It looks like either a black eye or those black lines football players put under their eyes.

 

[otg]

What if they were not covering for each other, but for their other child? Would that make it more palatable? It did for me, in the fact that it was something I could understand. That along with other clues has convinced me that Burke and not his parents is somehow responsible.

Maybe ......a bit,still I find it a very bizarre choice.(garrote)
BUT BDI would explain their behaviour.Perfectly.It's the only thing that explains their behaviour&actions actually.IMO

IMO the most powerful things pointing to BDI are the parents behaviour&actions
AND
the overkill

add

AND BDI explains IMO also FW's behaviour.
He was mad with the R's not telling the truth but decided to shut up cause it was about a kid and not a cold blooded criminal parent?Maybe they promised to get help for BR (they DID send him to a shrink,we have no idea why EXACTLY,we'll never know,he didn't seem to be too upset about JB's murder,see his comments re moving on)

I have always thought BDI; it's the only thing that would've kept JR's trap shut all these years. If you read the Ramsey's own book you'll note that they are extraordinarily image-conscious people -- even a childhood mishap or fit of pique, for which he could have been acquitted, would've scarred Burke's public image for life. He'd always be the "kid who fed his sister pineapple and then bashed her on the head." They were willing to go to quite some length to preserve his Ivy League potential.

All of the subsequent behavior vis a vis Burke screams out. Also things that have always struck me -- when JR brought JonBenet up from the basement holding her at arm's length like a plank -- that wasn't the posture of a shocked father, that was the posture of someone who had quite a few hours to think about the fact that he was going to have to tote an aging cadaver around and was grossed out by it, daughter or not. And Patsy's melodramatic "Jesus, you raised Lazarus from the dead, raise my baby" was not a sentiment that rolls from the tongue in the first few minutes of shock; she clearly rehearsed that.

JMHO of course. Great posts, everyone!

Great post yourself! ITA. More and more, I see BR fitting into this crime. It fills in a lot of gaps.

I have to agree with you guys. For years I have believed that Patsy lost it and bashed JB's head, but that's not sounding so logical anymore. Especially now that LE wants to talk to Burke and he doesn't want to talk to them. If he were totally innocent and told everything he knew all those years ago, he would have no reason to keep silent now. Makes you wonder if all the therapy he got really worked. I guess he could have "blocked" out what he did to his sister and therapy would have brought that out, that could be the reason for his silence now.

I'm beginning to think that Burke may have killed JBR and Patsy and John covered it up to protect his reputation and even their own. If he threw a flashlight at JBR, it would have to be with a lot of force to create the head injury she had. What could have happened to make him so angry? I feel like if this scenario is true, then JBR must have said something to him to make him go off. What could she have said, besides the normal sibling banter, to cause him to throw some object at her head? She was only 6 so I highly doubt she was cursing him out or something. I believe the pineapple may also tie into this as maybe JBR and Burke were eating pineapple together and then they got into an argument?

I believe the entire case is predicated on four motives: sex, shame, embarrassment and tremendous overwhelming fear. First, on the part of BR in the murder or accidental death of JBR, and second, on the part of the parents in staging a cover-up.

And if you consider the scenario I just laid out, doesn’t everything else in the behavior of all the people associated with this make sense? Does it not explain why Burke’s voice can be heard on the 911 call? Does it make sense now why Burke would stay in his room all morning long not coming down to ask what all the commotion was when they were supposed to be leaving for Michigan that morning? And when he was led through the house to leave for someone else’s home, why didn’t he even ask, “What are the police and all these people doing here? Did something happen?” Does it not explain some of the bizarre things that John and Patsy did and said after their child was killed, and why they would hire attorneys almost immediately to help them avoid being questioned by police? And how about John Andrew’s answer to what should be done to the person who killed his sister? -- “He should be forgiven.”

If you at least consider this, is there anything that doesn’t make sense?

How many “experts”, and people inside the investigation who have seen more evidence than the public, have used the word “accident” when talking about this?

Michael Kane used the word publicly when talking about there being a lot of information the public was not aware of.

Early in the investigation, Dr. Henry Lee “suggested the possibility that death had been accidental, with a cover-up, and noted distinctive elements of ‘staging.’"

Also, has anyone else heard about a supposed overheard conversation between Lou Smit and John Ramsey in which Smit was supposed to have said: “John, look, it was an accident. This could be a lot easier for everybody". I read this somewhere, but never got a confirmation from any other source. Anyone ever hear of it? If true, it might explain why a good detective would sell himself out and shill for the Ramseys out of compassion/sympathy/whatever (which I never could understand).

.

 

[SunnieRN]

I'm pretty sure it's not a mark on the picture. It looks like either a black eye or those black lines football players put under their eyes.

There isn't a mark in the same place under his other eye.

Otg, I have read that statement on this forum, but I am not sure that it was linked.

 

[SunnieRN]

From Angelfire: http://www.angelfire.com/planet/check/burke.html

If Lee is thinking that JonBenet's death was an accident. He is not alone. Others have had similar thoughts. When Lou Smit was overheard talking to John Ramsey, he said, "John, look, it was an accident. This could be a lot easier for everybody". 17 What kind of accident is it when a person dies of strangulation? Is it an accident when a child kills another child? Many say yes, it is, when the killer is too young to understand the meaning of life and death, right or wrong or the consequences of their actions. Burke was 9 years eleven months old.

No link given


Same quote here without a link: http://www.justiceforchandra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=24978&sid=179b8fa10cce18e215ad0c245eca4e8c


All I could find right now, no original source.

 

[Toltec]

I was reading Steve Thomas book and was surprised to run into this:

Frank Coffman, a local writer, had told me that Pam Griffin, a friend of Patsy Ramsey's from kiddie pageant circles, claimed Patsy had told her about writing the so-called practice note for some innocent reason. I jumped at the possibility that a suspect had admitted to a third party that she had written it. It was a huge development, and I brought it up promptly.

DA investigator Lou Smit coughed, then acknowledged that he had received the same information some time earlier. "I was going to write a report on that." he said. I was appalled that he had not placed it before us immediately. It seemed to me that if something pointed against the Ramsey's, it might never reach the detectives...

Nothing came from several attempts to get Pam Griffin to repeat her statement to police, and the DA's office wasn't impressed enough to force her immediate testimony.

ITRMI paperback, page 225

 

[Agatha_C]

CathyR,

God used you as a tool, for he saw the strength in you to stand up and testify, Girl! Amen! You are an inspiration and a lesson in faith. Thank you.......

 

[SunnieRN]

I was reading Steve Thomas book and was surprised to run into this:

Frank Coffman, a local writer, had told me that Pam Griffin, a friend of Patsy Ramsey's from kiddie pageant circles, claimed Patsy had told her about writing the so-called practice note for some innocent reason. I jumped at the possibility that a suspect had admitted to a third party that she had written it. It was a huge development, and I brought it up promptly.

DA investigator Lou Smit coughed, then acknowledged that he had received the same information some time earlier. "I was going to write a report on that." he said. I was appalled that he had not placed it before us immediately. It seemed to me that if something pointed against the Ramsey's, it might never reach the detectives...

Nothing came from several attempts to get Pam Griffin to repeat her statement to police, and the DA's office wasn't impressed enough to force her immediate testimony.

ITRMI paperback, page 225

I wonder what else Smit never told?

 

[Agatha_C]

Was it the money or BR that kept Smit quiet?

 

[SunnieRN]

Was it the money or BR that kept Smit quiet?

I believe it was BR, as he had been a straight shooter before this.

 

[Agatha_C]

That would be the only reason that I too can think of..... Unless he knew he was sick and dying, and the money would help his family, some people can be bought if the price is right.

 

[madeleine]

Was it the money or BR that kept Smit quiet?

IMO neither.He listened to his heart this time and didn't follow the evidence.He was a very religious person and this was exploited by the R's.
:twocents:
I really feel he didn't lie about his views,he really believed in IDI.

 

[otg]

(edited so as not to repeat)

I can't believe sometimes that God used that idiot to help me out and make me learn one of the most important lessons a Christian learns- your relationship to God is as unique as you are, it isn't like your friends,family or anyone you have ever heard of. It is a very personal thing........ this journey. He works mysteriously and uses people you never guess he is using till you have passed the milestone he had in mind for you. The only time we can really clearly see God carrying us is when we look back and see the footprints he left behind in our hearts. Just like that famous poem says.


Your story reminded me of my own journey and the unexpected turns life has thrown at me and how I have been so blessed to be surrounded by much wiser and spiritually stronger people when I really needed it. God has blessed me in so many ways I can't even begin to say how many times he has been there. Thanks for being here too. We may not agree on everything but God has a plan for all of us and he loves us all. I try and remember that when posting in a public forum like this one. I'm glad Trish doesn't allow a lot of stuff to go on 'cause it builds respect for your fellow posters even if you don't always agree with them and it goes along with Christian values about passing judgment on folks. I don't think any of us are passing judgment on the R's or an IDI we are looking for clues to solve a murder and any and all people connected to the R's are suspect.

Wow, Cathy. What a great story; and I'm so glad you used the experience to learn, grow stronger, and be a better person in spite of others around you.

Thanks for sharing.
.

 

[otg]

From Angelfire: http://www.angelfire.com/planet/check/burke.html

If Lee is thinking that JonBenet's death was an accident. He is not alone. Others have had similar thoughts. When Lou Smit was overheard talking to John Ramsey, he said, "John, look, it was an accident. This could be a lot easier for everybody". 17 What kind of accident is it when a person dies of strangulation? Is it an accident when a child kills another child? Many say yes, it is, when the killer is too young to understand the meaning of life and death, right or wrong or the consequences of their actions. Burke was 9 years eleven months old.

No link given


Same quote here without a link: http://www.justiceforchandra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=24978&sid=179b8fa10cce18e215ad0c245eca4e8c


All I could find right now, no original source.

Interesting... The first link you found (Wow, Sunnie, you are good!) shows a footnote reference of "17", but the footnotes at the bottom only go through "15", like whoever wrote it never completed their references.

The other link you found references a now defunct Geocities site in the quote.

I never understood how someone who I thought was as smart as his reputation would have you believe he was (Smit) could be so misled by the Ramseys. In fact, he became such a minion to them, it seemed he was saying and doing ridiculous things that no one could believe. His beliefs on the stun gun and the "garrote" completely threw the investigation off track. And then the side-show he created with that hissy-fit resignation of his when they announced that a grand jury would be convened. I could go on and on, I guess, but the point is that it was hard to understand what would make him do the things he did, unless for some reason he felt he was doing "the right thing". What that reason was, I'd like to know. And if he did know exactly what happened and felt an "innocent" would be protected by his actions -- that might explain it.

Thanks, again, Sunnie.
.

 

[SunnieRN]

That would be the only reason that I too can think of..... Unless he knew he was sick and dying, and the money would help his family, some people can be bought if the price is right.

He didn't pass away until 12 years after leaving the case. I truly do not believe this was in any way related to money.

IMO neither.He listened to his heart this time and didn't follow the evidence.He was a very religious person and this was exploited by the R's.
:twocents:
I really feel he didn't lie about his views,he really believed in IDI.

I believe he knew the truth, the entire truth. I honestly can not believe that anyone other than BR is guilty. Potentially of murder, almost certainly of sexual experimentation and accidental harm.

I believe Smit KNEW this, hence the 'accident' comment. This man, I don't believe would cover for the Ramseys, if he believed they were guilty, but I have no question that he would cover for them if their other child perpetrated this horrible act!

Otg, I really wanted to find 17 and couldn't find it anywhere. Amazing how this story has been so well squelched, isn't it?

 

[Agatha_C]

I've given this a lot of thought this morning and I really think that Smit, at first let the shared religion get in the way and honestly believed the R's were innocent. Later, maybe when he realized he was wrong it was too late, so he suffered with the sin of pride. Think about it, he had retired from a long and successful career, over 200 cases solved. He is sucked back into LE and the R case. Biased by the religion he shared with these people and just as blinded by their BS. Smit begins to look for the nonexistent intruder. In his hands he hold only fragments of evidence, a window someone might have come through. A scuff on the wall that someone might have left (JR said he climbed through it himself. Maybe that print was his maybe it was BR or one of his friends, while down there playing with the train?) A suitcase, that may or may not have been under the window, as FW was said to have moved it. 1 hair, and some rather difficult DNA and fiber samples.

Now I picture it like this.. Ever break a vase and then try to glue it back together? It never works, no matter what, there are chips of glass missing, sometimes, most of the time there is a small chunk missing. After all that work of gathering pieces, carefully gluing them back together, only to find its missing a piece. All your hard work and its still trash, its never going to hold water.

I think pride got in the way after all those years and the R's were about to ruin that record..... Not dogging the man but if he was wrong about the R's, what about some of those other cases......

 

[otg]

He didn't pass away until 12 years after leaving the case. I truly do not believe this was in any way related to money.

I don't think so either -- about the money. I do believe his integrity was too great to have allowed him to do something like that for money.

I believe he knew the truth, the entire truth. I honestly can not believe that anyone other than BR is guilty. Potentially of murder, almost certainly of sexual experimentation and accidental harm.

I believe Smit KNEW this, hence the 'accident' comment. This man, I don't believe would cover for the Ramseys, if he believed they were guilty, but I have no question that he would cover for them if their other child perpetrated this horrible act!

Do you suppose, Sunnie, the Ramsey's might have "confessed" their secret to him after they connected with him at such a deeply Christian level? Perhaps they trusted him enough to confide everything that happened, and he somehow sympathized with them and decided to help them out?

Makes me wonder (if that was the case), had he seen someone being charged with the crime (say... JMK), would he have stood by and allowed an innocent person be convicted? Or maybe he might have felt that someone like JMK is such a scumwad anyway, he might have deserved punishment regardless of guilt. Who knows?

Otg, I really wanted to find 17 and couldn't find it anywhere. Amazing how this story has been so well squelched, isn't it?

Yup. And if true, it would finally explain to me Smit's actions.

:silenced: ... :silenced: ... :silenced:
​

.

 

[SunnieRN]

You know, I agree as I have hard many people, even on Websleuths, that have stated even if someone that is innocent of the crime they are in prison for, they probably deserve to be there for something they never got caught for. Personally I can't subscribe to that belief, but I can understand the feelings of those who state their beliefs.

It's possible Smit would figure Karrs butt should be in the slammer. Not sure how far he would have gone toward that end, but both he and John Douglas were hoo hawing and making a lot of comments about an IDI, and their theories being correct, upon his arrest.

One thing that makes me proud of living in America is that everyone is entitled to a fair trial by a jury of their peers. Does it always go the way it is supposed to? No. Is every person in every jail guilty of the crime they are incarcerated for, doubtful. The principal that this system is founded upon is sound. Politics and money, unfortunately sway the outcomes.

 

[tumble]

Hi everyone, I have only just joined but have been reading for a few weeks.

I hope this is not too repetitive a post. Please if it is, let me know or delete it.

I'm really hung up on the presence of the ransom note. I have been trying to understand what purpose it served, in relation to the murderer. These are the options as far as I can think:

1. Intruder - the ransom note is legitimate. Killing JB in the house was not part of the plan, but it happened. Problem - Why did they not take JB's body with them & still collect on the ransom. Why leave behind physical evidence in the form of the ransom note. Once JB was dead, the RN served no purpose other than to potentially incriminate the true murderer.

2. Intruder - the ransom note was a ruse to divert suspicion to another fictituous intruder. Problem: Why leave a ransom note pointing to an intruder, when you are one. You are placing yourself (as an outsider) into the pool of possible suspects. Why not allow LE to focus almost solely on the Ramsey's, as is highly likely if no ransom note had been left. Again, why leave behind physical evidence, when there is nothing to be gained from it.

3. Insider - the ransom note was a ruse to divert suspicion to an intruder & remove suspicion from the real murderer. Problem - Leaving of physical evidence. However did this outweigh the fact that without a RN suspicion would be immediately on members of the household.

I'm interested in anyone else's view as to the purpose of the ransom note. Particularly if anybody has any ideas on how it could benefit an intruder.

Regarding the RN and the intruder I have a hard time seeing how and when the intruder wrote the note. Both the pen and the pad could be sourced to the home.

I also found it strange for the Rs to spread the RN on the floor while reading it, that is just silly. To me that sound like they were concerned getting their fingerprints on the paper, something no parent in that situation would ever think about.

A question. Did LE ever try to lift prints of the pen?

 

[DeeDee249]

Regarding the RN and the intruder I have a hard time seeing how and when the intruder wrote the note. Both the pen and the pad could be sourced to the home.

I also found it strange for the Rs to spread the RN on the floor while reading it, that is just silly. To me that sound like they were concerned getting their fingerprints on the paper, something no parent in that situation would ever think about.

A question. Did LE ever try to lift prints of the pen?

I'd hope they did, but we haven't seen evidence of it. It is common knowledge that there is plenty of evidence we haven't seen, and that may be part of it, but I can't see them keeping something like that a secret. If the pen shows Patsy's prints, (and why wouldn't it, it is her pen) the RST would not want that public, though her prints SHOULD be there, even if she didn't write the note. Yet, if her prints are NOT there- why aren't they? It is her pen. So we have a damned if you do, damned if you don't problem. The pen is like the flashlight- if it belonged to the house, why wipe it down? Why wipe the BATTERIES down? If it belonged to an intruder, I suppose they might wipe it down, but why wipe the batteries down? An intruder wouldn't have touched them. While the Rs tried to say the flashlight wasn't theirs, no one has claimed the pen was not theirs. So whose prints are on it?
This is the same problem we see with JB's longjohns. Patsy admitted putting them on JB when they got home that night. So why isn't her DNA on them? JR carried JB up from the basement, holding her upright around the waist. Why isn't HIS DNA there?
IMO, both parents' DNA is there, but this information will not be released.