Timeline

[LambChop]

So after the police told GZ "you don't need to do that" George said "OK" and answered several more questions by the cops. Had TM kept running he would have been home by then ... correct?

TM was on the phone with his gf. GZ was following him by car. Once TM lost sight of GZ why would he think GZ would get out of his car, in the rain, to follow TM. He wasn't doing anything wrong and at that point was probably concentrating on his conversation with his gf. It's possible TM might not have felt threatened until he saw GZ on foot still pursing him and that is why he did not run all the way home. He did tell his gf he would not run. TM also did not call 911 so it is believable that he did not think GZ would try to follow him home.

An eye witness did say she saw two figures running towards the spot where TM's body was found, yet GZ never mentions that they were running from what we know of his statements. jmo

 

[AJ Noiter]

This critical portion of the timeline for this case only spanned seven minutes and seven seconds from the beginning of the 911 call at 7:09:34 pm up to and including the gunshot at 7:16:41 pm. LE's first responder was on the scene THIRTY SECONDS later at 7:17:11 pm.
<snipped, just wanted to use your words of an indicator for a picture>

Concerned Papa: I know you're working diligently to get the exact spot of the body figured out. In one of the videos that I've linked (the one where "John" was hiding behind his door) I remembered seeing, for a brief moment, what looked to me like a body being covered by a yellow tarp in the footage. That video seems to have been removed so I scoured that source and found another video with the footage of the body/yellow tarp. You can find it at 0:48 in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zK3ZdDEfjzg .. I believe the video is being taped from the vantage of around the "[2:26]" marker on the images. Hope this helps!

Edit below:
The "[2:26]" beside the red person marker, to be specific. I don't think the angle is quite that extreme, but in that general direction.

 

[Concerned Papa]

Concerned Papa: I know you're working diligently to get the exact spot of the body figured out. In one of the videos that I've linked (the one where "John" was hiding behind his door) I remembered seeing, for a brief moment, what looked to me like a body being covered by a yellow tarp in the footage. That video seems to have been removed so I scoured that source and found another video with the footage of the body/yellow tarp. You can find it at 0:48 in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zK3ZdDEfjzg .. I believe the video is being taped from the vantage of around the "[2:26]" marker on the images. Hope this helps!

Edit below:
The "[2:26]" beside the red person marker, to be specific. I don't think the angle is quite that extreme, but in that general direction.

Thanks, I have the video. This comes up from time to time, but nothing that I know of supports that yellow tarp having a body under it. I'll be the first one to admit that it sort of looks like a head sticking out from underneath it, but dang, surely those people showed more respect to the dead than that, KWIM?

At some point maybe they'll tell us something, but I've got locations by "witnesses" from the ridiculous (like that Francis Taaffe deal I posted) all the way up to and including O'Mara and the State Investigator's comments at the Bond Hearing. I don't think I've ever seen a case where there's this much convoluted information out there.

At least it seems to be coming into a bit more clear focus with four sources being very near, and overlapping one another. I view it as extremely important in this particular case, possibly more so than any other I have ever been involved in.

In this case a very clear picture of what George Zimmerman has told LE as to the timing and his path of his movement for that night has emerged. Not one statement, not one word by anyone has ever placed him anywhere except on that sidewalk once he got out of his vehicle at [2:08]. He told LE the attack happened as he was walking back to his vehicle. I just don't see how it could be true if the body was found half a football field away as his own attorney said at the Bond Hearing.

People here don't know or understand because I've never stated as such before, but I live in Florida. I have hunted my entire life. I have been a proud member of the NRA a large part of my life. I own, at least, 25 guns for hunting purposes. When the legislature was debating the SYG law, I fully supported it then, and I fully support the concept of standing your ground against lethal aggression now.

However, as strongly as I feel about being able to stand your ground, I could never support the concept of "chasing your ground". If that boy's dead body is not shown to be somewhere near that sidewalk, I can see zero justification for the actions taken by George Zimmerman. That boy was unarmed and had committed no crime.

It could have been MY son.

OK...Papa's off his soapbox now, LOL

 

[Phoenixfla]

Thanks, I have the video. This comes up from time to time, but nothing that I know of supports that yellow tarp having a body under it. I'll be the first one to admit that it sort of looks like a head sticking out from underneath it, but dang, surely those people showed more respect to the dead than that, KWIM?

At some point maybe they'll tell us something, but I've got locations by "witnesses" from the ridiculous (like that Francis Taaffe deal I posted) all the way up to and including O'Mara and the State Investigator's comments at the Bond Hearing. I don't think I've ever seen a case where there's this much convoluted information out there.

At least it seems to be coming into a bit more clear focus with four sources being very near, and overlapping one another. I view it as extremely important in this particular case, possibly more so than any other I have ever been involved in.

In this case a very clear picture of what George Zimmerman has told LE as to the timing and his path of his movement for that night has emerged. Not one statement, not one word by anyone has ever placed him anywhere except on that sidewalk once he got out of his vehicle at [2:08]. He told LE the attack happened as he was walking back to his vehicle. I just don't see how it could be true if the body was found half a football field away as his own attorney said at the Bond Hearing.

People here don't know or understand because I've never stated as such before, but I live in Florida. I have hunted my entire life. I have been a proud member of the NRA a large part of my life. I own, at least, 25 guns for hunting purposes. When the legislature was debating the SYG law, I fully supported it then, and I fully support the concept of standing your ground against lethal aggression now.

However, as strongly as I feel about being able to stand your ground, I could never support the concept of "chasing your ground". If that boy's dead body is not shown to be somewhere near that sidewalk, I can see zero justification for the actions taken by George Zimmerman. That boy was unarmed and had committed no crime.

It could have been MY son.

OK...Papa's off his soapbox now, LOL

Don't you think GZ would have had given a pretty darn good reason at the walk-thru the next day to not have been arrested on the spot? Surely his story must have ended with the body being located where it actually was.

I think that just because we have not heard how they ended up where they did does not necessarily mean that there is not a reasonable explanation.

 

[who]

Seems this here puts it close to the T.

 

[Reader]

Seems this here puts it close to the T.

I'm not sure because of 3 reasons:

>>I read in one of the earlier articles (don't have available now) that LE roped off the entire length of that long sidewalk. Even tho I don't have proof right now, that is reasonable since there were witnesses up and down in those apartments and if the confrontation moved away from the T, LE would want to keep it closed to gather evidence (I hope). IMO

>>Also, IF that is Trayvon's body lying there, as Papa said, they sure are not showing much respect for him if they can't even cover him up completely. I had thought he was transported to the morgue fairly soon. Surely they didn't just let him lay there while they are talking to witnesses and making their notes. That's very disturbing to me....IMO

>>MOM said in the bond hearing, on tape and transcript here, that according to the AG's evidence Trayvon was found 70 yards from his home which would go with Papa's diagram.

 

[AJ Noiter]

Couldn't edit my post with the sun information, here's the moon info for the 26th.. not sure why I didn't think to post it back then, brain fart is my defense.

Waxing Crescent
19% / 0.14
Aries

 

[LambChop]

Couldn't edit my post with the sun information, here's the moon info for the 26th.. not sure why I didn't think to post it back then, brain fart is my defense.

It was raining.

 

[AJ Noiter]

It was raining.

It was more for the sake of being complete than anything. Just like the sun information, at those times of day, depending on the cloud cover, it wouldn't matter when Civil/Nautical/Astronomical twilight starts and ends.

 

[LambChop]

It was more for the sake of being complete than anything. Just like the sun information, at those times of day, depending on the cloud cover, it wouldn't matter when Civil/Nautical/Astronomical twilight starts and ends.

Didn't someone mention that there was moonlight? It was raining so there would have been no moonlight when TM was shot. jmo

 

[AJ Noiter]

Didn't someone mention that there was moonlight? It was raining so there would have been no moonlight when TM was shot. jmo

I haven't seen anything to that effect, but one witness has been recorded as saying "there was no moonlight" - the young boy.

 

[LambChop]

I haven't seen anything to that effect, but one witness has been recorded as saying "there was no moonlight" - the young boy.

LOL. No, not a witness. It was a poster. Someone suggested there was moonlight and I thought that is why you were recording it in the timeline. jmo

 

[AJ Noiter]

LOL. No, not a witness. It was a poster. Someone suggested there was moonlight and I thought that is why you were recording it in the timeline. jmo

Oh, nope. Just doing it for the sake of being complete. I was also considering posting weather data for that same reason. I've made the decision to post weather data now lol

METAR KSFB 262353Z 04006KT 7SM -RA OVC030 17/16 A3030 RMK AO2 RAB35 SLP259 P0000 60005 T01720156 10206 20172 53003

It's been a while, so I'll try my best to parse the METAR correctly:
Time: 6:53PM
Visibility: 7 miles
Clouds: Overcast @ 30,000ft, light rain
Wind: 040° (0° is North, so this would be NorthEast?) at 6 knots
Temperature: 17°C, Dew point: 16°C
Pressure: 30.30in

 

[Just K]

At least one witness stated that it was too dark to see and that ONLY ONE neighbor had a porch light on. I read, that house always had that light on at night.

Several of the 911 callers reported that it was too dark too see anything clearly. One even described Zimmerman, after the shooting, as BLACK. That is how dark it was out there.

 

[Alecto]

*** What time TM left the townhome to walk to 7-11?
(i.e. how long did it take TM to walk there)

I checked the 7-eleven.com store locator and it had the closest store by a good margin being 0.8 miles away (east). Using a human average walking speed of 3mph that's a 16 minute walk one way.

The time that TM left at is kind of unclear, originally it was said that TM went to the store during an NBA game half time but just checking the TV guide showed that to not be possible as the game hadn't even started yet.

*** Are there phone calls confirmed during the walk to 7-11?

Yes. Based on the phone records TM was on the phone virtually non stop from 4:28-7:16. To the minute, when one call ends another starts.

*** Other than the apparently overlapping GF phone calls, are there any other details between:

• 6:00<>6:30 when TM made the purchase @ 7-11, and
  
• 7:09, when GZ called to report the SP on foot in the neighborhood (near clubhouse IIRC)?

There have been snippets of a version of events by TM's girlfriend but they are very incomplete and contradictory at the moment. GZ has been reported to have been on his way to a store himself but I've never seem specific details about when or where he first saw TM.

 

[Concerned Papa]

I checked the 7-eleven.com store locator and it had the closest store by a good margin being 0.8 miles away (east). Using a human average walking speed of 3mph that's a 16 minute walk one way.

The time that TM left at is kind of unclear, originally it was said that TM went to the store during an NBA game half time but just checking the TV guide showed that to not be possible as the game hadn't even started yet.


Yes. Based on the phone records TM was on the phone virtually non stop from 4:28-7:16. To the minute, when one call ends another starts.


There have been snippets of a version of events by TM's girlfriend but they are very incomplete and contradictory at the moment. GZ has been reported to have been on his way to a store himself but I've never seem specific details about when or where he first saw TM.

BBM

Welcome to WebSleuths! I'm glad to see a new member who's familiar with time/distance calculations.

Using the same average walking speed for the 7-11 trip, how long do you figure it would take to walk 317 feet?

 

[cityslick]

BBM

Welcome to WebSleuths! I'm glad to see a new member who's familiar with time/distance calculations.

Using the same average walking speed for the 7-11 trip, how long do you figure it would take to walk 317 feet?

This was my post a few weeks ago.

If GZ spotted TM where your marker is at the 'he's running' comment and TM's ultimate destination was 379 feet from that point.

Average running speed of a human is 10mph which translates to 14.6 feet per second.

379 feet divided by 14.6 = 25.95 (seconds). Round it up to 26seconds.

 

[Concerned Papa]

This was my post a few weeks ago.

If GZ spotted TM where your marker is at the 'he's running' comment and TM's ultimate destination was 379 feet from that point.

Average running speed of a human is 10mph which translates to 14.6 feet per second.

379 feet divided by 14.6 = 25.95 (seconds). Round it up to 26seconds.

Which, as I'm reasonably sure is known, has no bearing on the question I posed in either rate of travel or relevance. What one person "might", "maybe", "if", "could've" done while running is not at all the same consideration as what another apparently said they DID, in fact, do while walking.

 

[cityslick]

Which, as I'm reasonably sure is known, has no bearing on the question I posed in either rate of travel or relevance. What one person "might", "maybe", "if", "could've" done while running is not at all the same consideration as what another apparently said they DID, in fact, do while walking.

You asked how long it would take to walk 317 feet. I gave you the math for roughly 380 feet.

The math doesn't lie.

 

[LambChop]

Which, as I'm reasonably sure is known, has no bearing on the question I posed in either rate of travel or relevance. What one person "might", "maybe", "if", "could've" done while running is not at all the same consideration as what another apparently said they DID, in fact, do while walking.

Wouldn't it seem reasonable that if GZ walked or ran all the way over to the next street (for an address) that he would have seen TM walking down the center sidewalk???? I'm beginning to think TM went onto one of the patios or into the bushes and waited until GZ returned. TM thought he had lost him for good before he decided to continue on home. That would account for some of the time, would answer the question why GZ did not see TM walking down that center path and would make sense when TM told the girlfriend he thought he had lost GZ. Once GZ hung up from LE he doubled back and found TM which is what the gf heard on her phone. That would also explain the comment by GZ, "what are you doing here". At that point GZ may have tried to approach TM and TM may have turned to run figuring this guy is nuts.

This would make the witness' statement that two people ran past her door towards where TM's body was found sound about right. GZ's statement was that TM ran towards him while he was on the cut through and we know that just did not happen. jmo