GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #2

[ThinkHard]

This is why I have felt from the beginning that if she didn't die at the hands of one of her IG friends who perceived their relationship differently and didn't want her to go, then my guess is she was victimized by a scam. But I don't think by someone she just met on the street, I think it was by someone she had been speaking to online.

 

[ThinkHard]

Do they stone people to death for adultry in Turkey?

No. You do not have a very accurate view of turkey.

 

[ThinkHard]

Could these be the same guys who offered to be her tour guides?

Could very well be. Though if we consider the manner of death, at least to me it seems more personal then just being about money.

I think someone she was "buddies" with there had very personal feelings for her.

 

[tresptip]

No. You do not have a very accurate view of turkey.

Quit judging my views!:furious:
I never said I believed in it, I only asked if they do it!

 

[KivaSupporter]

Since January 21, when Sierra did not return home, her two sons have been in seclusion away from school, television and any other exposure to what may have happened to their mom.

The formal autopsy report will not be released for a week, but former FBI Agent William Daly believes there will be an arrest.


http://www.myfoxny.com/story/20972864/sarai-sierra-murder-investigation

 

[bet2173]

Do they stone people to death for adultry in Turkey?

Thanks God, no!

 

[ToutCa]

Do they stone people to death for adultry in Turkey?

Adultery was "officially" illegal (but of course, still often practiced) in Turkey until 1996. It was taken off the books as a crime because women were being punished for it at a far greater proportion than men.

Periodically, since then, conservative governments have tried to get adultery once again declared a crime. This has failed, mostly due to arguments that doing so would jeopardize Turkey's ongoing attempts to join the EU.

As background:

-- Turkey has been a secular and democratic nation-state since the 1920s.
-- Stoning anyone for any reason is illegal. "Honor killings" have been known to take place from time to time in rural areas (I stress, these are ILLEGAL).
-- 77% of Turks in a 2011 survey said they were against stoning adulterers:
LINK

If you want to learn more about what modern Turkey is like, I heartily recommend the amazing novels of Nobel Prize winner Orhan Pamuk or the beautiful films of Nuri Bilge Ceylan. I'm sure ThinkHard, lavy, and Yashim have more recommendations.

 

[bet2173]

Is this the first time a person is murdered with relation to Instagram? I'm not sure but I think I've read in the newspaper about another murder related to traveling for Instagram. Does any one remember? Or was it about facebook?

 

[belimom]

Since January 21, when Sierra did not return home, her two sons have been in seclusion away from school, television and any other exposure to what may have happened to their mom.

The formal autopsy report will not be released for a week, but former FBI Agent William Daly believes there will be an arrest.


http://www.myfoxny.com/story/20972864/sarai-sierra-murder-investigation

I also read that they won't be told until their father can return home and tell them in person.

 

[ThinkHard]

Quit judging my views!:furious:
I never said I believed in it, I only asked if they do it!

I'm sorry for hurting your feelings. I'm just getting really sick of hearing about how ignorant so many Americans are about Turkey...I guess I'm a little defensive.

 

[ThinkHard]

Adultery was "officially" illegal (but of course, still often practiced) in Turkey until 1996. It was taken off the books as a crime because women were being punished for it at a far greater proportion than men.

Periodically, since then, conservative governments have tried to get adultery once again declared a crime. This has failed, mostly due to arguments that doing so would jeopardize Turkey's ongoing attempts to join the EU.

As background:

-- Turkey has been a secular and democratic nation-state since the 1920s.
-- Stoning anyone for any reason is illegal. "Honor killings" have been known to take place from time to time in rural areas (I stress, these are ILLEGAL).
-- 77% of Turks in a 2011 survey said they were against stoning adulterers:
LINK

If you want to learn more about what modern Turkey is like, I heartily recommend the amazing novels of Nobel Prize winner Orhan Pamuk or the beautiful films of Nuri Bilge Ceylan. I'm sure ThinkHard, lavy, and Yashim have more recommendations.

Elif Şafak is my favorite Turkish author!

 

[looking4answers]

The New York Post is a tabloid specializing in sensationalizing just about everything. If Taylan once got a ticket for jaywalking they'd call him a "criminal element" and everyone in Amsterdam is probably a drugged out whoremonger because pot and prostitution are legal in Amsterdam. The Post is one step above the National Enquirer.

I tend to agree, and it makes me sick that Jeane Macintoshs article about Sarai is pretty biased in her own beliefs. Yes of course the LE are looking at all angles, but there are NO facts of this, except for maybe meeting sketchy people whom themseleves might have had ties to anything. Who cares? Someone I worked with his bro owns two "waste management" cos in NNJ, and showed me around his bros town to where all the mafia heads lived. Also one night said hey my bros good friends son is coming out with us for drinks, dont ask him about it, but his dad is the oldest living hit man in the NJ mob. Also one of my exs is/was(?) dating a Capo (general under a Don/head of a mafia family) in the Bronx/NY mob.

WHO CARES WHO YOU BUMP INTO. I have bumped into my share of people. Even my cuz worked for the highest levels of intel in DEA, then after 9/11 worked for the other 3 lettered Gov't Org that I should not mention, to help find and off terrorists. WHO CARES WHO YOU KNOW OR MEET. It does NOT say anything about YOU.

I really do not like the NY posts reporting, very sad and unprofessional to put up such ridiculous sensationalism.

 

[ThinkHard]

I also read that they won't be told until their father can return home and tell them in person.

Yes I've read that. I know it doesn't have anything to do with the case. But I do have expertise in the area of children and psychology, and withholding that information has serious potential to cause further emotional damage for those two boys. They are bound to feel very betrayed by their loved ones.

 

[ToutCa]

:what:

showed me around his bros town to where all the mafia heads lived. Also one night said hey my bros good friends son is coming out with us for drinks, dont ask him about it, but his dad is the oldest living hit man in the NJ mob. Also one of my exs is/was(?) dating a Capo (general under a Don/head of a mafia family) in the Bronx/NY mob.

I would respond to this, but I'd rather not end up "sleeping with the fishes"!

 

[looking4answers]

Amsterdam might be known for legalized pot and prostition....but it's not exactly like everyone is a "drugged out whoremonger"

Can we please stop with generalization about places people have never been too. Pretty please?

He definitely did not mean that, that is the point he was trying to make, that you cannot make generalizations. Btw I am half Dutch, and I do not take offense to it. We need to cut down on the amount of drug tourism that comes to Holland, the locals have even thought of changing the laws so only Dutch people can smoke. I think they should do this, because they couldn't care less about pot the way foreigners do, to them they are just open and that is why. Btw, a good book on the Ducth and their impact on America and how it became the country it is today with freedoms for all..etc is called "The Island at the Center of the World". It is on the Dutch history of Manhattan, but it is eyeopening on how the Dutch and their beliefs in freedoms for everyone formed not just NYC but even the founding fathers and their forming of the constitution.

 

[bet2173]

I know a lot of you will be angry with me for stating this and I'm not saying this for judging anyone or anything, but the donation request of the family, I don't know exactly why but intuitionally bothered me a little. First, SS's brother said it was for the funeral then the next day he posted another memorial picture and said the money will go to the kids.

 

[ToutCa]

I know a lot of you will be angry with me for stating this and I'm not saying this for judging anyone or anything, but the donation request of the family, I don't know exactly why but intuitionally bothered me a little. First, SS's brother said it was for the funeral then the next day he posted another memorial picture and said the money will go to the kids.

I guess it's all in the perception.

In America, this looks like they are being honest and upfront. They raised enough money for the funeral, so now it's a memorial fund for the kids.

In Turkey, to some, it may look shady and like they are profiteering.

To me, personally, I don't really care, what those kids are going to need moving forward money cannot buy.

 

[looking4answers]

I've been wanting to say something about this for days.

Why, unlike male victims, do we tend to submit women victims to a kind of all-or-nothing, black-or-white "*advertiser censored*/madonna" standard? The stories are almost all either "SS was a drug-running hard-partier who abandoned her family" OR "SS was a perfect mother and a saint who never drank, danced or had an untoward thought".

This is unrealistic. SS was a beautiful, complex, conflicted human being like any of us. I believe she should be remembered as such, regardless of the particulars of whatever happened to her.

We don't know what she was up to with the men she met on her travels, and we don't know what her primary relationship status was either. Maybe everything was great and they were deeply and exclusively committed to one another. Maybe they had an open relationship. Maybe her husband had cheated on her and she was dealing with that. None of us know.

We can't walk in her shoes because we don't know where she was in her emotional life. We may never know. We must, though, respect her journey, and whatever the truth was of her actions on her voyage through the world, accept her in all her complex contradictions as one of us.

That is my plea.

Exactly, simple yet true. I don't think the news should sensationalize either way, this is my biggest problem with many of the news pieces, plus it is their responsibility to report on vetted "facts" not speculation. We can speculate here, because this is a forum for doing so, not the "news".

 

[tresptip]

I tend to agree, and it makes me sick that Jeane Macintoshs article about Sarai is pretty biased in her own beliefs. Yes of course the LE are looking at all angles, but there are NO facts of this, except for maybe meeting sketchy people whom themseleves might have had ties to anything. Who cares? Someone I worked with his bro owns two "waste management" cos in NNJ, and showed me around his bros town to where all the mafia heads lived. Also one night said hey my bros good friends son is coming out with us for drinks, dont ask him about it, but his dad is the oldest living hit man in the NJ mob. Also one of my exs is/was(?) dating a Capo (general under a Don/head of a mafia family) in the Bronx/NY mob.

WHO CARES WHO YOU BUMP INTO. I have bumped into my share of people. Even my cuz worked for the highest levels of intel in DEA, then after 9/11 worked for the other 3 lettered Gov't Org that I should not mention, to help find and off terrorists. WHO CARES WHO YOU KNOW OR MEET. It does NOT say anything about YOU.

I really do not like the NY posts reporting, very sad and unprofessional to put up such ridiculous sensationalism.

The first time I accidentally bumped into someone like that, I moved the very next day and went into hiding for a long time!Those people are not safe to know.

 

[ThinkHard]

I'm quite hungry for new information. I really want to know what the gmail accounts will tell LE.

What do we know as FACTS right now?