UID Victim: Toddler's Mother, Peaches, found Hempstead Lake State Park June 1997 #4

[hafom8840]

Not sure if anyone has noticed this also, but on GilgoNews website Peaches has been removed from the victims page, although her daughter (the toddler) is still listed. Not sure why that would be, but must somehow be related to the recent lead in identifying Peaches via genetic geneaology.

BTW, there hasn’t been any official update on Gilgo investigation since May.

Is the SCPD still extremely sleazy and involved in the murders incompetent?

 

[wcasewatch]

Not sure if anyone has noticed this also, but on GilgoNews website Peaches has been removed from the victims page, although her daughter (the toddler) is still listed. Not sure why that would be, but must somehow be related to the recent lead in identifying Peaches via genetic geneaology.

BTW, there hasn’t been any official update on Gilgo investigation since May.

She was removed a while ago (she isn't showing in the May 2022 archived version). I believe it may have something to do with the fact that she was found in Nassau County.

 

[Sleuth_Noob]

She was removed a while ago (she isn't showing in the May 2022 archived version). I believe it may have something to do with the fact that she was found in Nassau County.

Oh…Well I guess that sort of makes sense. I hadn’t thought of that, and must not have noticed before…

I do hope that SCPD is making progress in this investigation though. Updating the public, even in a very general way like, “…we continue to make progress in this ongoing investigation, and will disclose new information to the public as long as it does not compromise ongoing investigation…etc.”….

Or something to that effect…

 

[wcasewatch]

Even if they do find her identity, I think it might be a while before they release it. They'll most likely spend a lot of time trying to track down her last known whereabouts and talking to people who may have seen her. The public reveal of her identity will probably only occur after they've exhausted all of those avenues.

 

[hafom8840]

I remember reading the article about what transpired. Some kids at the nearby pond smelled something and told their dad about it, and he instantly sensed the worst. Police come over, open up the container, and find peaches.
I cant even fathom how traumatizing that must be for all involved.

 

[clear sky]

Peaches would not be removed from the site because her remains were found in Nassau County.
Suffolk County has the entire case.
<modsnip - reference was removed>

 

[wcasewatch]

Peaches would not be removed from the site because her remains were found in Nassau County.
Suffolk County has the entire case.
<modsnip - reference was removed>

She was removed long before the FBI made their public appeal, so I'm guessing that her removal from the victims page was for other reasons.

Where did you read that Suffolk has the entire case? Her torso was found in Hempstead Lake State Park (Nassau) and her extremities were found near Jones Beach State Park (also Nassau).

Nassau County had the case in 2016, as they were the ones who confirmed that the two remains were linked.

 

[Ozoner]

Sorry to hear that the Gilgo Beach murders are still unsolved.

No one has ever been prosecuted. John Bittrolff is a very good suspect, but none of the remains were found soon enough for there to be much chance of finding the perps DNA. With a couple of them it might not be impossible.

One thing that prosecutors have to worry about is reasonable doubt. There was a corrupt police chief, James Burke, involved in the investigation. That fact alone could give some people reasonable doubt.

I think that the only reason O. J. Simpson was acquitted was the presence of a racist cop, Mark Fuhrman, who had bragged about a willingness to plant evidence. Burke's personal history could create a similar situation if Bittrolff were to go on trial for the Gilgo Beach killings.

I do think that Bittrolff and the LISK are one and the same, but proving that will be a challenge.

 

[hafom8840]

No one has ever been prosecuted. John Bittrolff is a very good suspect, but none of the remains were found soon enough for there to be much chance of finding the perps DNA. With a couple of them it might not be impossible.

One thing that prosecutors have to worry about is reasonable doubt. There was a corrupt police chief, James Burke, involved in the investigation. That fact alone could give some people reasonable doubt.

I think that the only reason O. J. Simpson was acquitted was the presence of a racist cop, Mark Fuhrman, who had bragged about a willingness to plant evidence. Burke's personal history could create a similar situation if Bittrolff were to go on trial for the Gilgo Beach killings.

I do think that Bittrolff and the LISK are one and the same, but proving that will be a challenge.

I doubt Bittrollf did all of them, but assuming he didn't do all of them, he probably knows the other person(s) who did do it.

 

[Sleuth_Noob]

No one has ever been prosecuted. John Bittrolff is a very good suspect, but none of the remains were found soon enough for there to be much chance of finding the perps DNA. With a couple of them it might not be impossible.

One thing that prosecutors have to worry about is reasonable doubt. There was a corrupt police chief, James Burke, involved in the investigation. That fact alone could give some people reasonable doubt.

I think that the only reason O. J. Simpson was acquitted was the presence of a racist cop, Mark Fuhrman, who had bragged about a willingness to plant evidence. Burke's personal history could create a similar situation if Bittrolff were to go on trial for the Gilgo Beach killings.

I do think that Bittrolff and the LISK are one and the same, but proving that will be a challenge.

LE should have a pretty good idea whether or not LISK and Bitrolff are one in the same. And while we don’t know what DNA, if any, still exists, LE does know (hopefully).

Regardless, at this point in the investigation—12 years later—ANYTHING that can be utilized to move investigation forward should be utilized,<modsnip - psychic discussion is not allowed>

 

[bonniejeanne17]

No one has ever been prosecuted. John Bittrolff is a very good suspect, but none of the remains were found soon enough for there to be much chance of finding the perps DNA. With a couple of them it might not be impossible.

One thing that prosecutors have to worry about is reasonable doubt. There was a corrupt police chief, James Burke, involved in the investigation. That fact alone could give some people reasonable doubt.

I think that the only reason O. J. Simpson was acquitted was the presence of a racist cop, Mark Fuhrman, who had bragged about a willingness to plant evidence. Burke's personal history could create a similar situation if Bittrolff were to go on trial for the Gilgo Beach killings.

I do think that Bittrolff and the LISK are one and the same, but proving that will be a challenge.

Thank you for that information. I had stopped following the LISK murders about nine years ago, and had never heard of the arrest and prosecution of Bittrolff.
Was his brother, who shared the same DNA, exonerated?

 

[Ozoner]

Thank you for that information. I had stopped following the LISK murders about nine years ago, and had never heard of the arrest and prosecution of Bittrolff.
Was his brother, who shared the same DNA, exonerated?

His brother was never a suspect in any of the killings so far as I know. John Bittrolff was convicted of killing two prostitutes in 1993 and 1994, which was before organized serial killers started being careful not to leave DNA. There is no question that those women were killed by John, not his brother.

So far as I know, no offender DNA was found on any of the LISK victims. Most of the victims' bodies had been exposed to the elements for years before they were found. Peaches and the container she was in might be the best bet for finding the DNA of the LISK, in my opinion. Improvements in the collection of DNA could eventually pay dividends.

 

[wcasewatch]

His brother was never a suspect in any of the killings so far as I know. John Bittrolff was convicted of killing two prostitutes in 1993 and 1994, which was before organized serial killers started being careful not to leave DNA. There is no question that those women were killed by John, not his brother.

So far as I know, no offender DNA was found on any of the LISK victims. Most of the victims' bodies had been exposed to the elements for years before they were found. Peaches and the container she was in might be the best bet for finding the DNA of the LISK, in my opinion. Improvements in the collection of DNA could eventually pay dividends.

They might have Touch DNA, which is a relatively new field. However, it can lead to false positives if there has been any contamination.

I agree that Bittrolff is by far the most likely of the known suspects. It seems as though both LISK and Bittrolff liked to create a "scene" with their victims (Peaches and Taylor) - a behavior that has only been identified in less than 2% of killers. It's also hard to overlook the fact that he lived close to where Mack and Taylor were found.

Unfortunately, it seems unlikely that LISK will ever be charged with all of the murders. My guess is that they'll find their strongest case and charge him with that. If that happens, they'll probably release circumstantial evidence about his ties to the others just to convince the public that it's him.

 

[hafom8840]

They might have Touch DNA, which is a relatively new field. However, it can lead to false positives if there has been any contamination.

I agree that Bittrolff is by far the most likely of the known suspects. It seems as though both LISK and Bittrolff liked to create a "scene" with their victims (Peaches and Taylor) - a behavior that has only been identified in less than 2% of killers. It's also hard to overlook the fact that he lived close to where Mack and Taylor were found.

Unfortunately, it seems unlikely that LISK will ever be charged with all of the murders. My guess is that they'll find their strongest case and charge him with that. If that happens, they'll probably release circumstantial evidence about his ties to the others just to convince the public that it's him.

John seems to be the most likely suspect in the mid 90s-early 2000s murders. I say it's less likely he did the mid 2000s-early 2010s murders but something tells me he knows who did it if it wasn't him.

 

[Ozoner]

John seems to be the most likely suspect in the mid 90s-early 2000s murders. I say it's less likely he did the mid 2000s-early 2010s murders but something tells me he knows who did it if it wasn't him.

I think he did all of them but just changed his dumping ground. I wouldn't even be surprised if there's a third dumping ground on Long Island that hasn't been discovered.

 

[wcasewatch]

I somehow doubt it's more than one person. The FBI believes it's an individual, as there is no precedent of two serial killers dumping their victims' remains in the same manner at the exact same site.

Interestingly, Bittrolff's first child was born just two months after the first LISK victim was found. Perhaps his progression to dismembering came about because he reasoned that he needed to put more effort into concealing his victims' identities. "I'm going to be a father soon, so I need to make sure I don't get caught."

 

[Ozoner]

Interestingly, Bittrolff's first child was born just two months after the first LISK victim was found. Perhaps his progression to dismembering came about because he reasoned that he needed to put more effort into concealing his victims' identities. "I'm going to be a father soon, so I need to make sure I don't get caught."

I don't think that genuine care for another, including one's own child, ever enters the mind of a psychopath. Becoming a father would have created an additional demand on his time, however, and might have reduced the frequency of his killing.

The two victims that he was convicted of murdering were found on November 2, 1993, and January 30, 1994, respectively. He is also the prime suspect in the murder of Sandra Costilla, who was found on November 30, 1993. We don't know the exact dates that those women were murdered, but any way you slice it, it doesn't sound like Johnny Boy had much of a cooling off period in between kills.

We've seen in other cases that getting into a relationship or getting married can reduce a serial killer's killing frequency, so I wouldn't necessarily expect Bittrolff to have kept that pace up for the roughly twenty years that he was active, but I would not be at all surprised if has killed more women that just the three mentioned above and the women attributed to the LISK.

I don't believe that Shannan Gilbert was a LISK victim, but the search for her shined a light on the LISK's stomping ground and might have caused him to go dormant, so there might not be any post-2011 victims. If there are any, the LISK might have disposed of them far from the old dump sites.

There is also a big gap in the LISK timeline. Jessica Taylor's remains were found on July 26, 2003, five days after she disappeared, and the Maureen Brainard Barnes disappeared on July 9, 2007. There was no known LISK activity during that four-year stretch. What was Bittrolff up to during that time period? Was he using an unknown dumping ground that has not yet been discovered?

 

[wcasewatch]

I don't think that genuine care for another, including one's own child, ever enters the mind of a psychopath. Becoming a father would have created an additional demand on his time, however, and might have reduced the frequency of his killing.

The two victims that he was convicted of murdering were found on November 2, 1993, and January 30, 1994, respectively. He is also the prime suspect in the murder of Sandra Costilla, who was found on November 30, 1993. We don't know the exact dates that those women were murdered, but any way you slice it, it doesn't sound like Johnny Boy had much of a cooling off period in between kills.

We've seen in other cases that getting into a relationship or getting married can reduce a serial killer's killing frequency, so I wouldn't necessarily expect Bittrolff to have kept that pace up for the roughly twenty years that he was active, but I would not be at all surprised if has killed more women that just the three mentioned above and the women attributed to the LISK.

I don't believe that Shannan Gilbert was a LISK victim, but the search for her shined a light on the LISK's stomping ground and might have caused him to go dormant, so there might not be any post-2011 victims. If there are any, the LISK might have disposed of them far from the old dump sites.

There is also a big gap in the LISK timeline. Jessica Taylor's remains were found on July 26, 2003, five days after she disappeared, and the Maureen Brainard Barnes disappeared on July 9, 2007. There was no known LISK activity during that four-year stretch. What was Bittrolff up to during that time period? Was he using an unknown dumping ground that has not yet been discovered?

It's a common misconception that sociopaths have no feelings. They can feel loyal, attached, and protective to a degree. Remember that ASPD is a spectrum. He might be a remorseless killer, and still feel like he has a family to protect.

He was living with his partner in 1993.

However, I did find some information that might explain what compelled him to act out on his fantasies.

We know that serial killers often start following "stressors", and we also know that the FBI believes LISK kills during stressful periods of his life.

Toward the end of 1993, Bittrolff had two things approaching him:

He was buying a timeshare condo with his girlfriend in Florida (the sale went through in Jan 1994).
He was also facing an assault charge stemming from a case in 1990 (he was convicted in Feb 1994).

It is possible that the circumstances surrounding these two events added enough stress to his life to compel him to act out.

Notably, pregnancy can also be a very stressful time... which might explain Fire Island Jane Doe in April 1996. At the time, his wife would have been heavily pregnant.

The murder of Peaches (1997) occurred while he was building his house in Manorville (a property that he wasn't listed on the deeds for, most likely due to mortgage reasons - financial or self-employment tax issues, or his criminal record). Overseeing the building of a house is stressful enough, never mind actually being directly involved in it.

The start of the Gilgo Four killings began shortly after he was sued by a contracting company for insurance reasons (someone fell at a site in Dec 2004).

 

[bonniejeanne17]

Thank you all for sharing your knowledge of these cases.

Do you think the Atlantic City murders of prostitutes around the same time is related? They, too, were found in a dumping ground at the shore.

 

[Kikimora11]

Thank you all for sharing your knowledge of these cases.

Do you think the Atlantic City murders of prostitutes around the same time is related? They, too, were found in a dumping ground at the shore.

Originally, back in the beginning of this whole case (circa ~2010-2012 or so), it was speculated that the two cases were very possibly related, and in fact, very likely they indeed were. However, since that time, law enforcement has ruled it out. There is no information as to how/why they ruled it out, but in my estimation, it's indicative of the very likely fact that law enforcement and/or the other investigative authorities (such as the FBI) have a lot more information on both of these cases than the public is privy to know.