What are the consistencies in the Routier's stories?

[beesy]

I think the murderer was one person by seeing the depth of the injuries. Looks like both boys had very similar depth wounds. Both boys had two deep wounds and two shallower wounds. If I read correctly both boys had two wounds each with identical depths of 1/8 and 3/4 inches deep. The deep wounds seem to be very similar in depth also with only 1/2 inch differences. It wouldn't suprise me if the shallower ones weren't planned. I know that what seemed to be the second attack on Damon with the two wounds that were almost 2 inches deep also added two more wounds to his back. It just looks to me as if this is very controlled stabbing.

I agree, when you learn what happened when Damon was stabbed, the cuts and stab wounds make sense. He's crawling away, she's grabbing at him, stabbing, he makes it to the sofa, she pulls him back down, stabs some more, then later, stabs him again. That poor baby boy. You know how she always says that he said "Mommy"? I think he probably really did say it. Lots of times the truth is in the lies somewhere. And that voice might be something she can't get out of her head.

 

[G.I.RattlesnakeJane]

I think the murderer was one person by seeing the depth of the injuries. Looks like both boys had very similar depth wounds. Both boys had two deep wounds and two shallower wounds. If I read correctly both boys had two wounds each with identical depths of 1/8 and 3/4 inches deep. The deep wounds seem to be very similar in depth also with only 1/2 inch differences. It wouldn't suprise me if the shallower ones weren't planned. I know that what seemed to be the second attack on Damon with the two wounds that were almost 2 inches deep also added two more wounds to his back. It just looks to me as if this is very controlled stabbing.

Devon had 2 wounds, two to the chest from the front. 1 defensive wound to the buttock. They were 2" and 5" in depth.

Go to justice for darlie and the pictures in the gallery. Look in gallery5 picture8 while the pic is not to scale it shows the position of the killer. If stabbed from the front side, the knife would be held underhanded, if from the head side it would be held overhanded.

Damon had 6 wounds to his back, same gallery pic 7 . Two glanced off shoulder bones, two more are a little deeper . I surmise if right handed that the killer was positioned from the right side of Damon at a slight angle.75 degree angle or so. The autopsy report mentions the wounds having an edge on them that makes me surmise the killer was right handed.

 

[beesy]

Devon had 2 wounds, two to the chest from the front. 1 defensive wound to the buttock. They were 2" and 5" in depth.

From the reports
Devon: Stab wound #1: , max is 5" penetration, 2" in length with a sharp and blunt angle. Direction is front-to-back, left-to-right with no up or down deviation. upper left chest

Stab wound #2..2-3/4" in length, with sharp and indeterminateangle. wound is front-to-back, slightly right-to-left with no up or down deviation max depth: 2-1/2" left mid-portion chest

Incised wound#3..1-3/4" length with indeterminate angle 1/8" left forearm

Stab wound #4: 3/4 in length and has 3/4 depth, indeterminate angle, back-to-front, right-to-left and downwards. posterior left thigh
http://www.justicefordarlie.net/acrobat_files/DevonRoutier_autopsy.pdf

Damon had 6 wounds to his back, same gallery pic 7 . Two glanced off shoulder bones, two more are a little deeper . I surmise if right handed that the killer was positioned from the right side of Damon at a slight angle.75 degree angle or so. The autopsy report mentions the wounds having an edge on them that makes me surmise the killer was right handed.

Damon's report:
All 6 sharp force injuries(4 stabs, 2 incised) are obliquely angled from left superior to right inferior All have blunt left ,angle sharp right angle and smooth margins.

Stab wound #1: back-to-front, left-to-right, no up or down deviation max depth 1-3/4

Stab wound #2: back-to-front, left to right no deviation up or down, 4 -
3/8" depth

Stab wound #3: blunt angle measures 1/16 to 1/8 ", back-to-front, no deviation left, right, up or down. depth 1-7/8"

Stab wound #4: blunt angle 1/16" and there is a 1/16" squared off-red tan abrasion at the blunt angle. back-to-front, slightly left-to-right, no up or down deviation. depth 3"

Incised wound #1: blunt angle 1/16 to 1/8"

Incised wound #2: superficial incised wound trailing to the right from the right angle. blunt angle 1/16"
http://www.justicefordarlie.net/acrobat_files/DamonRoutier_autopsy.pdf

Explain where you see 2 different knives and burrs and toolmarks.

 

[beesy]

Darlie and Darin were not rich and those tests cost a huge amount of money.Darin didn't want anything tested I'm sure and Darlie if innocent would be naive enough to believe that because she was innocent she couldn't possibly be convicted

Darin sold everything he had to try and raise enough money to bail Darlie out of jail. Why do you think he didn't want anything tested? Darlie was cocky enough to think she wouldn't be convicted. She doesn't look like a criminal, she has no criminal history, no child abuse accusations. She thought she could get away with murder because of those things. She and Darin told their stories and expected them to be believed.

All a defense team gets is the lists of evidence that the prosecutions intends to use, the prosecution didn't have to provide the tape of Darlie weeping and crying to the jury as they counted on. The prosecution doesn't have to tell the defense in depth what the exact nature of the evidence is. A list of witnesses for both sides, and an attorneys best guess as to what the witness is going to testify to.

This part here is not about Darlie, it's about the system. Convicts are allowed umpteen amounts of appeals.

People who could have impeached some of the witnesses testimony were not in the court to hear the lies told, and the attorneys and even Darlie didn't know it until the transcripts came out

It is very common to not allow witnesses in the courtroom until after they have testified. It has nothing to do with being meanie heads to Darlie. Accusing people of perjury is a strong statement. Who do you think lied?

They did prepare with a defense against the self inflicted wounds with some very convincing testimony from a well respected pathologist. He even stated that if Darlie had died he would have classified her wounds as defensive

If Darlie had died, there wouldn't have been a trial. The Routier murders would have been put into the cold case files.

The defense showed how easy it was to get in and out of the window even going thru it to demonstrate

That's actually a point against Darlie. Why did the intruder cut the screen?

The jurors who have discussed the case say they based a great deal of weight on the silly string tape

That's not true. There was a juror who appeared on the Leeza show and was very adamant that while the tape shocked them, it did not make or break the case

A tape showing Darlie crying and weeping at the memorial service and being told to get it together or she was going to scare the other kids when they got there was not shown to the jury. A bunch of legal wrangling BS in our courts.

How many times have you seen tapes of people mourning shown in court? The SS party tape was shown because it was out of the norm. Have you seen this other tape?

Thise that have the large amounts of money to throw at the defense testing like OJ can even beat a rap

OJ won though. You're talking about defendants being screwed.

Accused people are actually better of if poor in a lot of cases because the state paid for defense can often get the money to test evidence. Middle class people are in trouble and had better be prepared to sell everything they own and then some and even that may not be enough as lawyers fees are very high.

Darlie had a court appointed attorney at first. They hired Mulder because they chose too, not because they HAD too.

If found innocent the state doesn't pay you back for your defense costs. It is too bad, we are sorry, but that's the cost of having a system like we have. The system can be manipulated and innocent people do get convicted and sometimes people make mistakes

You live in America. We are given the chance to do anything we want to with our lives here. We have appeals! Darlie's been sitting there for 9 years asking for appeal after appeal. She's had plenty of chances to get a new trial. This is the 3rd time I've asked you, but if Darlie had been found not guilty, would you think she had received a fair trial? I know most of us believe OJ's trial sucked. That he ripped us off. That he laughed in our faces. Would you feel that way about Darlie? If not, then ask yourself why you think the trial was so unfair?

 

[G.I.RattlesnakeJane]

and the rest of the family to obtain independant council. Darin, I'll sell everything I own to get her the best defense possible -as long as I'm not involved.
We can't control what these court appointed attorneys do like we can our own, whose interests were best served by this legal move ask yourself that.

If they didn't have 100 grand to throw at the defense and living expenses during the trial they couldn't afford to hire an independant lawyer. If they had 100 grand Darlie wouldn't be in this mess according to the motives set forth.

If Darlie had died would Darin have had 100 grand to throw at his defense?

Could he have made a profit anyway?

We all know who really lost here the boys, but who gained, or failed to gain what they expected. I don't think freedom from the responsibility of the boys was it either.

 

[txsvicki]

Didn't Darin's mother mortgage her home somewhere there on 19th street to help raise money for the defense?

 

[beesy]

and the rest of the family to obtain independant council. Darin, I'll sell everything I own to get her the best defense possible -as long as I'm not involved

No, Darin was worried about bailing her out. He thought he could her get her out by the next day. He wanted her home.There is no evidence pointing to Darin. Every time I've ever seen an interview with Darin, he says Darlie is innocent and get her out! Why is Darin the big meanie to you now?

We can't control what these court appointed attorneys do like we can our own, whose interests were best served by this legal move ask yourself that

Ok, whose interests were best served? Now they are the bad guys. In your other post the system sucks because only poor people can get "free" attornies.

If they didn't have 100 grand to throw at the defense and living expenses during the trial they couldn't afford to hire an independant lawyer. If they had 100 grand Darlie wouldn't be in this mess according to the motives set forth.

Well, they did hire an independant lawyer.They received some donations. Darin sold everything, so for them to have not been "in this mess" Darlie wouldn't have had any of her pretty things. Now all of the money is donated.

If Darlie had died would Darin have had 100 grand to throw at his defense

Darin didn't try to kill Darlie. So he wouldn't have needed any money anyway. LE would have come to the same conclusion that Darlie did it and tried to hurt herself enough to make it look like she was attacked, but oopsy, she slipped.

 

[beesy]

Didn't Darin's mother mortgage her home somewhere there on 19th street to help raise money for the defense?

Yes, I think so

 

[Goody]

No, Darin was worried about bailing her out. He thought he could her get her out by the next day. He wanted her home.There is no evidence pointing to Darin. Every time I've ever seen an interview with Darin, he says Darlie is innocent and get her out! Why is Darin the big meanie to you now?
Ok, whose interests were best served? Now they are the bad guys. In your other post the system sucks because only poor people can get "free" attornies.
Well, they did hire an independant lawyer.They received some donations. Darin sold everything, so for them to have not been "in this mess" Darlie wouldn't have had any of her pretty things. Now all of the money is donated.
Darin didn't try to kill Darlie. So he wouldn't have needed any money anyway. LE would have come to the same conclusion that Darlie did it and tried to hurt herself enough to make it look like she was attacked, but oopsy, she slipped.

The public defenders Darlie had were the best lawyers for her defense. They came with a budget for testing. Mulder didn't. People think that the talents of the lawyer wins and loses cases, but most of the time it is the evidence that makes the biggest difference. A great lawyer can't win if he isn't allowed to use the tools he normally works with. I think that is what happened here. Limited budget, limited defense, bad time frame (for the trial). All factors that restrained Mulder from his usual performance. Any good lawyer could have presented a better defense with enough time to prepare, a sufficient budget for testing to dispute the state's theories, and some fingerpointing at Darin. Would there have been a win for Darlie? Not necessarily (doubtful actually) but I think she would have been better represented. That doesn't mean that Mulder did anything wrong. The deck was just stacked against him, probably not something he is used to happening to him.

 

[G.I.RattlesnakeJane]

Just so we are all the same page here, G.I. Jane, which one of Darlie's stories are we going off here? In the 16 versions thread it was the burglar killer. You seemed to have wandered off into the Darin killer. Or are we on the rapist killer? It's sooooo confusing!

Just looking at all the angles here not just one. Trying to figure out which scenario is most likely to have occurred and if possible try and reinact the 3 most likely.

 

[G.I.RattlesnakeJane]

No, Darin was worried about bailing her out. He thought he could her get her out by the next day. He wanted her home.There is no evidence pointing to Darin. Every time I've ever seen an interview with Darin, he says Darlie is innocent and get her out! Why is Darin the big meanie to you now?

I have to look at all angles and realistically speaking he was there and that's what makes him a suspect. No evidence against him- conflicting stories about his where-abouts when police arrive. Inconsistent stories at the hospital that Darlie angrily corrects him on. This has been previously posted. Washing his face and hands before going to the hospital. Smells kinda like a rat here.
Hssssss, the rattlesnake in me in on alert here.


OK, whose interests were best served? Now they are the bad guys. In your other post the system sucks because only poor people can get "free" attorneys.
I didn't create this system and it does suck-somewhat. Justice is not always served in the courtrooms of America, plea deals, technicalities, tort laws too. The middle American would be wiped out financially speaking, if wrongly accused of a serious crime.Juries aren't always swayed by the truth sometimes the emotionally charged charismatic lawyer, not the truth, wins.


Well, they did hire an independant lawyer.They received some donations. Darin sold everything, so for them to have not been "in this mess" Darlie wouldn't have had any of her pretty things. Now all of the money is donated.

He had to, Darlie didn't die. He had to support her or look guilty himself.
He can't control the court appointed attorneys they would have automatically made him a suspect. He was there,
Why does he not accept that she did it now? He hired a lawyer that guaranteed him he would not be made a suspect in Darlie's defense. That is why the Routier family mortgaged their home, to defend both Darin and Darlie. The way things went down Darlie had to have known previously that if caught she would lose everything. Would such a narcissistic personality as she has been described do this and risk it all?


Darin didn't try to kill Darlie. So he wouldn't have needed any money anyway. LE would have come to the same conclusion that Darlie did it and tried to hurt herself enough to make it look like she was attacked, but oopsy, she slipped.

I have to look objectively at all the suspects and Darin does look somewhat fishy to me. He was in this financial mess with Darlie too. He liked Jags, boats and toys as well. He is pushed hard by Darlie to achieve.

 

[deanws]

I have to look objectively at all the suspects and Darin does look somewhat fishy to me. He was in this financial mess with Darlie too. He liked Jags, boats and toys as well. He is pushed hard by Darlie to achieve.

He is guilty...but so is she. They did it together IMO.:furious:

 

[Goody]

I have to look objectively at all the suspects and Darin does look somewhat fishy to me. He was in this financial mess with Darlie too. He liked Jags, boats and toys as well. He is pushed hard by Darlie to achieve.

The only thing Darin had to fear is what Darlie would say about his actions that night. If he had been the least of the two in a plot or actual attack, he could have turned evidence against her and gotten a lighter sentence than she. Maybe in the beginning he felt he had to support her to maintain his own innocence, but that would have worn off years ago. If he were truly innocent, he'd have turned on her by now. Those were his kids, the fruits of his loin. No man would support a woman who killed his kids that way unless he was guilty, too. And no woman would waste her youth away in prison to protect a man who had killed or was responsible for the brutal deaths of her kids. If Darlie were truly innocent, she would have spilled her guts long ago. Instead of feigning this amnesia BS, she would be busting her butt in as many sessions as it took to force the memories out into the open. The results would be plastered all over the news to get her message out. Instead she wants us to believe that she is some hapless victim bound to die for a crime she didn't commit, but everything she presents defies any and all logic. It is equivalent to me painting the fence black and trying to convince you that it is white. Or even worse that it isn't even really there. If I could, I would reach thru this screen and shake the fire out of her!!! I'd scream in her face, "The truth, Darlie! The truth!"

 

[beesy]

I have to look at all angles and realistically speaking he was there and that's what makes him a suspect. No evidence against him- conflicting stories about his where-abouts when police arrive. Inconsistent stories at the hospital that Darlie angrily corrects him on. This has been previously posted. Washing his face and hands before going to the hospital. Smells kinda like a rat here.
Hssssss, the rattlesnake in me in on alert here

I believe Darin was involved, very involved. He did not do this whole thing though, he didn't even start it. She did. She corrected him because he said something wrong, off the script. How would she know what he heard unless they discussed what to say? I do not think she'd ever cover for him. Her butt is in prison, why would she? She's already brought this insurance scam BS up in an appeal. There is no way she'd let him walk free unless she was guilty too, which she is.

He had to, Darlie didn't die. He had to support her or look guilty himself.He can't control the court appointed attorneys they would have automatically made him a suspect. He was there,
Why does he not accept that she did it now? He hired a lawyer that guaranteed him he would not be made a suspect in Darlie's defense. That is why the Routier family mortgaged their home, to defend both Darin and Darlie. The way things went down Darlie had to have known previously that if caught she would lose everything. Would such a narcissistic personality as she has been described do this and risk it all?

Are you saying that Darin did all of this himself, killed the boys, attacked Darlie, then "staged the scene" all the while hiding from Darlie or either forcing her go along with him? If that's true, the second she was away from him, she would have let everyone know she had been held hostage or whatever it would be called, by him.
I think both of them have narcissitic personality disorder. I don't know why she decided to kill those boys, but she did. Lose it all? She didn't think she would lose it all. She still doesn't. She thought she was gaining something.
One of the symptoms of narcissism is dressing provcatively and acting inappropriately I don't think we have to even discuss if Darlie dressed slutty or not. And even you said she slept around. Lynch says she seemed to be flirting with him and that she stood up, showed him her tattoo and pulled her shorts and panties down a bit to show her belly button ring. Now is that the way to behave when being questioned about your sons' murders and vicious attack on you? And don't say thats just Darlie because that's my point. If that is just Darlie then that means she has one of the symptoms of narcissism.

 

[Goody]

[/b]
One of the symptoms of narcissism is dressing provcatively and acting inappropriately I don't think we have to even discuss if Darlie dressed slutty or not. And even you said she slept around. Lynch says she seemed to be flirting with him and that she stood up, showed him her tattoo and pulled her shorts and panties down a bit to show her belly button ring. Now is that the way to behave when being questioned about your sons' murders and vicious attack on you? And don't say thats just Darlie because that's my point. If that is just Darlie then that means she has one of the symptoms of narcissism.

When did she sleep around? She was only 18 or 19 when she married Darin, I think. Hardly enough time to be labeled promiscuous. Are you saying she was promiscuous in high school?

 

[beesy]

When did she sleep around? She was only 18 or 19 when she married Darin, I think. Hardly enough time to be labeled promiscuous. Are you saying she was promiscuous in high school?

I am going on what Jane has said. She has said those things and since she knows her, I reckon they're true.

 

[Goody]

I have to look objectively at all the suspects and Darin does look somewhat fishy to me. He was in this financial mess with Darlie too. He liked Jags, boats and toys as well. He is pushed hard by Darlie to achieve.

Hey, Jane, did you say that Darlie slept around before she married Darin? In Texas or Pennsylvania or both?

 

[deanws]

Hey, Jane, did you say that Darlie slept around before she married Darin? In Texas or Pennsylvania or both?

Please...unless Jane was the other person in bed with Darlie, I am sure she doesn't know exactly what Darlie did or who she did it with.:twocents:

 

[beesy]

Hey, Jane, did you say that Darlie slept around before she married Darin? In Texas or Pennsylvania or both?

GIJANE:

I don't think those boys got the best efforts of the investigators. I don't think the DA cared much at all if Darlie was guilty or innocent just could he make a case and win it. Darlie made it easy for him she was just trashy enough, overdone and over the top. I told you I knew her and obviously well, Darlie was always like that though and no amount of gentle or polite advice to tone it down was ever taken.She didn't percieve it that way she saw it as trying to be the best she could be. She bought into that Barbie Doll image early on. She was also a Texan and well ladies, we have been known to be overly made up and the home of the BIG hairdo

From this, I got that Jane was saying Darlie didn't stay home on Friday nights, if you know what I mean. But maybe I misunderstood.

 

[beesy]

When did she sleep around? She was only 18 or 19 when she married Darin, I think. Hardly enough time to be labeled promiscuous. Are you saying she was promiscuous in high school?

That's plenty of time Goody. You sweet little naive thing. Maybe I misunderstood Jane, but believe me, Darlie had lots of time, lots of it before she got married