GUILTY OH - Barb Williams for child abuse, Hancock County, 2014

[JeannaT]

I showed my husband this video. He is a teacher and has been for a long time, in a very rough school district. His opinion? NO MATTER WHAT, no matter what, NO MATTER WHAT the circumstances were between this child and teacher....she should not have laid a finger on this child or said the things she did. She should be fired, and would be, in his school, even with a strong union that we both love. And the other teachers would support that firing. This is what you call a NEVER scenario. Zero tolerance.

The whole idea of "zero tolerance", in my opinion, is ruining our schools. Zero tolerance for weapons, so you go to an alternative school for a butter knife in your lunch box. Zero tolerance for hitting so if you hit back you to go to an alternative school.

Really. Zero tolerance is the hobgoblin of lazy minds and people unwilling to look at each situation with courage and make a decision. There should be zero tolerance for "zero tolerance".

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

The whole idea of "zero tolerance", in my opinion, is ruining our schools. Zero tolerance for weapons, so you go to an alternative school for a butter knife in your lunch box. Zero tolerance for hitting so if you hit back you to go to an alternative school.

Really. Zero tolerance is the hobgoblin of lazy minds and people unwilling to look at each situation with courage and make a decision. There should be zero tolerance for "zero tolerance".

Two different issues. There should be zero tolerance for abusive hideous teachers.. The butter knife is another issue entirely.. These two things can not be lumped together.

This woman should be in jail.

 

[JeannaT]

Two different issues. There should be zero tolerance for abusive hideous teachers.. The butter knife is another issue entirely.. These two things can not be lumped together.

This woman should be in jail.

Jail??? Would you jail a parent for doing the same behavior?

 

[JeannaT]

Nothing like generalizing..

Sounds to me like you have a bias against all kinds of parents. This generation of helicopter parents is that way because the world is worse. Because we now know instantly that another child is taken or abused or murdered.

I will never forget that little boy in NY,.
http://www.mommyish.com/2011/07/13/...irst-walk-home-from-school-found-dismembered/

That is why we watch over our kids with more diligence. We still raise responsible kids but are not willing to let them being snatched by a crazy murderer just looking for a chance and it has NOTHING to do with this.

This woman is an abuser. She assaulted a child for NO reason. Not that any reason would be okay but you can plainly see that she walked up to the child and assaulted him. She is a menace and should be tried for this.

There is no excuse, no reason, No way this is okay.

The world isn't worse, Scarlett. Violent crimes are down. Stranger kidnappings have been at the same approx level since the 50's.

I don't have a "bias" against all kinds of parents - but it's an interesting discussion. I could certainly be called a "helicopter".

The fact is, though, there has never been a time in our history where children were given so little opportunity to take care of themselves and learn to struggle against adversity. I'm not talking about children on the fringes of our society or where horrible abuses occur, but in the mainstream. Never have kids been so shielded from struggle in our middle class and in our parenting and public school philosophies.

 

[MyBelle]

The whole idea of "zero tolerance", in my opinion, is ruining our schools. Zero tolerance for weapons, so you go to an alternative school for a butter knife in your lunch box. Zero tolerance for hitting so if you hit back you to go to an alternative school.

Really. Zero tolerance is the hobgoblin of lazy minds and people unwilling to look at each situation with courage and make a decision. There should be zero tolerance for "zero tolerance".

The same rules apply to the teachers. There is Zero Tolerance for violence. The policy isn't a result of lazy minds, it is a result from school massacres.

Public schools are paid by taxpayers. Any parent or teacher who doesn't want to adhere to the policies is certainly free to obtain a job or an education for their child elsewhere.

JMO

 

[Cailin Rua]

These evil, defiant six year olds wandering out of their classrooms to use the wrong bathroom. Good thing he didn't "defiantly" pee his pants or the poor embattled woman might have had to break one of his limbs.

 

[JeannaT]

These evil, defiant six year olds wandering out of their classrooms to use the wrong bathroom. Good thing he didn't "defiantly" pee his pants or the poor embattled woman might have had to break one of his limbs.

He did defiantly pee his pants, many times, and no one broke his limbs. I just hope next year goes better for him, and he's able to adjust to the structure of public school.

I don't know if you were here for the Kyron Horman missing persons case, but let me tell you, posters climbed up the spine of school teachers and administrators for not knowing where Kyron was once he entered the school.

I don't know how many dealings you've had with public school, but it is REALLY a big deal if a child chronically goes missing and the teacher responsible at the time has missed that the child has wandered off and has to be found again.

 

[MyBelle]

He did defiantly pee his pants, many times, and no one broke his limbs. I just hope next year goes better for him, and he's able to adjust to the structure of public school.

I don't know if you were here for the Kyron Horman missing persons case, but let me tell you, posters climbed up the spine of school teachers and administrators for not knowing where Kyron was once he entered the school.

I don't know how many dealings you've had with public school, but it is REALLY a big deal if a child chronically goes missing and the teacher responsible at the time has missed that the child has wandered off and has to be found again.

Did you miss the part about there being a video camera? Ian didn't go missing.

JMO

 

[Cailin Rua]

The kindergartner peed in his pants "many times?" Why on earth wasn't he in a reform school?

Interesting how you can click to different forums on this site and see what happens to little kids when adults ascribe malicious intent to toileting accidents and other normal childhood behavior. ("Found deceased") It's like this thread is in it's own little bubble.

 

[Constance]

MOO

I see a lot of young parents today who are raising their children to have respect for others by demonstrating that in their parenting. Not abusing their authority is essential, IMO.

It's not a betrayal of our own parents to recognize, admit to, and attempt to change destructive patterns. I have high hopes for future generations.

If a parent's ultimate goal is to produce a submissive human being, then allowing this type of behavior on the parts of authority figures is a great way to go about it.

MOO

 

[JeannaT]

MOO

I see a lot of young parents today who are raising their children to have respect for others by demonstrating that in their parenting. Not abusing their authority is essential, IMO.

It's not a betrayal of our own parents to recognize, admit to, and attempt to change destructive patterns. I have high hopes for future generations.

If a parent's ultimate goal is to produce a submissive human being, then allowing this type of behavior on the parts of authority figures is a great way to go about it.

MOO

Constance, I certainly agree with you there. We don't want to raise a submissive generation. But what would the country look like if everyone decided they didn't have to listen to reasonable authority?

There has to be a mixture of compliance and individualism. No one wants mind numbed zombies who take whatever leadership is telling them to do, but children do need to stay in their classrooms and not wander off down the hall all the time where they have to be searched for.

There's a balance.

 

[JeannaT]

The kindergartner peed in his pants "many times?" Why on earth wasn't he in a reform school?

Interesting how you can click to different forums on this site and see what happens to little kids when adults ascribe malicious intent to toileting accidents and other normal childhood behavior. ("Found deceased") It's like this thread is in it's own little bubble.

Actually, that's one of my main mantras. About potty training murders - which, in my experience, are usually done at the hands of mother's boyfriend and the victim is a 2 year old boy. It's awful, and mothers should be made aware of that dynamic when they invite boyfriends to invade their family home.

I don't know specifically what this child was doing, but I've seen cases of kids who pee on things on purpose. Accidents happen, and no one should be disciplined for that. I sense this wasn't a case of a string of pee accidents.

 

[Cailin Rua]

I sense this teacher was angry about a prior complaint from the parents and forgot about the cameras, as opposed to making a principled stand for a more orderly country.

 

[LaLaw2000]

These evil, defiant six year olds wandering out of their classrooms to use the wrong bathroom. Good thing he didn't "defiantly" pee his pants or the poor embattled woman might have had to break one of his limbs.

Good post, Cailin Rua.

If he ever did pee his pants in her classroom it was probably because he was too scared to even ask to go to the bathroom.

Apparently he did ask to go to the bathroom this time and that monster of a woman followed him and assaulted him anyway. Who knows what would have happened to him the next time if this assault had not been brought to light? Who knows what she might have done to another student and that student didn't say anything or she wasn't caught. No way will I believe this was a sudden and isolated incident.

*Sarcasm alert*
By all means, lets defend and attempt to protect this woman from these evil little 6 year olds!

MOO

 

[JeannaT]

Good post, Cailin Rua.

If he ever did pee his pants in her classroom it was probably because he was too scared to even ask to go to the bathroom.

Apparently he did ask to go to the bathroom this time and that monster of a woman followed him and assaulted him anyway. Who knows what would have happened to him the next time if this assault had not been brought to light? Who knows what she might have done to another student and that student didn't say anything or she wasn't caught. No way will I believe this was a sudden and isolated incident.

*Sarcasm alert*
By all means, lets defend and attempt to protect this woman from these evil little 6 year olds!

MOO

According to the nonmsm article, he'd ask to go to the bathroom, wander around, return to the classroom and immediately pee.

I think since we all can't see the actual records, everyone is just kind of guessing what has happened in the past with this child and teacher.

Anyway, good discussion of possibilities since we don't know anything.

 

[Constance]

Constance, I certainly agree with you there. We don't want to raise a submissive generation. But what would the country look like if everyone decided they didn't have to listen to reasonable authority?

There has to be a mixture of compliance and individualism. No one wants mind numbed zombies who take whatever leadership is telling them to do, but children do need to stay in their classrooms and not wander off down the hall all the time where they have to be searched for.

There's a balance.

I agree, there should be a balance.

I just feel, and I daresay many would agree with me, that it is up to the adult in the situation to keep the scales balanced. Otherwise, that's a pretty heavy burden to put on a kdg aged child. IMO.

Perhaps the problem lies in our insistence upon restraining chidren at their most exploratory age instead of setting looser boundaries? Clearly, something isn't working if the adults have to resort to physical violence.

 

[JeannaT]

Yes, I agree with that too. I think most children, and especially boys, would do much better in an educational environment where they have freedom to roam around.

Maybe one avenue is to not have our school systems go ape crazy if a child is unaccounted for for 5 minutes, might be a start.

So maybe this child needs to be in an environment with much more freedom. It seems unworkable to put him in an environment where a teacher is responsible for his constant supervision and yet she's not given any tools to enforce that except constant back and forth with the parents. It didn't work.

I know in our schools if a teacher loses a child a couple times its a BIG HUGE DEAL. It makes CNN (not our school district) if a k student accidentally gets on the wrong dang bus.

 

[LaLaw2000]

I look forward to hearing that this woman has been charged with assault. I just do not see how charges would not be brought. This is a clear video of assault. There is evidence even if some eyes do not see it that way.

Lets say LE had been called to the school the moment this woman had assaulted Ian. Lets further say that the staff member who reported it made a statement to LE. If, at that point, the video was reviewed by LE an arrest would have been made on the spot. She would have been handcuffed and taken out of the school. This would be what would have happened in Louisiana. My late husband was retired LE, and I served on my parish Sheriff's Department for 10 years. This was a crime. There was evidence.

I simply cannot understand why this woman has not been arrested and charged with assault of a minor. It's high time people were shown that there are criminal consequences for assault of a minor.

MOO

 

[blue22]

I agree, there should be a balance.

I just feel, and I daresay many would agree with me, that it is up to the adult in the situation to keep the scales balanced. Otherwise, that's a pretty heavy burden to put on a kdg aged child. IMO.

Perhaps the problem lies in our insistence upon restraining chidren at their most exploratory age instead of setting looser boundaries? Clearly, something isn't working if the adults have to resort to physical violence.

They don't have to, they CHOOSE to.

 

[blue22]

Well, I hope this case stays in the news so we can find out what happens further - whether the sheriff agrees to file charges and if so, what becomes of that.

She looks like she may be old enough to retire with benefits. Maybe that's what should be allowed to happen.

I do have a bit of a concern for this generation of children, if that incident viewed on camera is considered enough to scar him permanently. This is going down a bit of a rabbit trail, I know, and not related specifically to this case where we have so few details, but are we wrapping our children in cotton wool and then expecting them to be able to cope with adversity later in life with zero experience with it? I'm gravely concerned about the number of children who commit suicide in our culture - I believe we FAR outweigh other cultures in suicide rate - and is it because our children have had absolutely no training in "getting over it"?

Maybe I'm older than most in this thread. I'm 54. When I was a kid, if you openly defied a kinder teacher and walked out of your computer class to go wander the halls and had to be tracked down when the teacher was able to make time to track you down, and this had been happening since November as well as willfull urinating accidents in the classroom, THIS scene is what you would expect. An angry teacher to snatch you up by your collar and yell in your face. And likely you'd face much, much worse at home for this.

"The greatest generation" of Americans - those who fought in WWII and then went on to create changes and improvements the likes of which no other generation has been able to accomplish - certainly raised their kids with this treatment if they were as difficult as Ian appears to be in some of the newer articles.

I'm sorry. I'm in the 'get over it' camp when kids can. This kid didn't even mention it to his parents. He's got more flexibility than his mother and dad, and in my opinion, they should rethink how to get him to stop behaving this way in school.

Right. Children definitely don't say things, because they are "over it." Children who are scared by or abused by adults choose not to speak up, because they just get over it. Give me a freaking break. :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead: