NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #12

[bluesneakers]

The saddest thing about all this is that a truly great writer could have written a book about Maura and tied it in with other strange happenings in New Hampshire and that general area over the years. There is such a great story to be told here, and Renner, who is clearly not the great talent he thinks he is, has chosen to write a book about himself.

I would love to read a book about the Connecticut River Valley killer, Brianna Maitland, Nathaniel Kibby case (AH), Maura Murray. It could be a very eerie, noir look at rugged place full of unsolved and mysterious murders and disappearances. There is such an amazing true crime book that could be written. It is really too bad someone like Renner, who calls his blog readers and potential book buyers "trolls" and who has meltdowns on redd it whenever someone dares to challenge him, has been the person to take this on. I wonder what a mature, secure, and professional writer could have crafted.

I would read that book.

 

[Caffeine]

Finding someone in the woods is such a random and unpredictable thing. Based on the two articles above...it could be a couple of years or it could be over a decade. It seems like odds and probability go out the window.

That said I still have my reservations. While its never out of the question, I don't see any gain to be had in the mind of any reasonable person. Of course suicide is still on the table and that could be a possibility but the simplest explanation to me has always been she got in a car.

If fleeing a DUI was the main concern, venturing far into the woods is not necessary when police would have initially just checked the scene and the main roads. She could have just as easily ducked behind a tree and waited.

But you never know, there doesn't seem like outside the first few years any large scale searches occurred ...

 

[Fireweed]

Finding someone in the woods is such a random and unpredictable thing. Based on the two articles above...it could be a couple of years or it could be over a decade. It seems like odds and probability go out the window.

That said I still have my reservations. While its never out of the question, I don't see any gain to be had in the mind of any reasonable person. Of course suicide is still on the table and that could be a possibility but the simplest explanation to me has always been she got in a car.

If fleeing a DUI was the main concern, venturing far into the woods is not necessary when police would have initially just checked the scene and the main roads. She could have just as easily ducked behind a tree and waited.

But you never know, there doesn't seem like outside the first few years any large scale searches occurred ...

Though I have not made a list or anything, I cannot think of a missing person's case where the body was found very far away from where the person was last seen.

If the person died from exposure, their body is going to be within just a couple of miles of where they were last seen, where their car was found, or where they "should have been".

Murder victims are within ten miles of where they were abducted.

There has been quite a few bodies of missing persons found in the past few months and it was not at all surprising where the bodies were found. I think we should all keep the case of John Glasgow in mind. He parked his car by a small state park. The state park was "searched thoroughly". There were also a few sightings of him at various hotels. His body was finally found about one mile from where his car was seven years later by accident.

 

[ZooSleuth]

The Mcstays are one case that comes to mind where the bodies were a reasonable distance from their last known whereabouts.

 

[brokerage]

It's funny to me that Mr. Renner went from "I've got major information I'm going to share with you", to a few days later saying "I'm taking a break, see ya in the spring". It's almost as though he took the criticism he must've read here to heart and decided to "punish" everyone by shutting his site down. It's too bad, because he obviously should be given credit for keeping the case relevant and talked about. But if he's really interested in achieving resolution in the case, how does he go from one extreme to the other, and simply walk away from it?

 

[Steleheart]

It was never about Maura. It was about a writer who is using her case to showcase himself and how he lost "himself" in researching her case. It is a book about himself, not Maura.

The blog is called "my search for Maura Murray" and it seems so in the beginning, but it ends with an invitation to buy a book entitled "true Crime Addict - How I lost myself in the Mysterious Disappearance of Maura Murray"

If one is interested in the author and how a "book comes together" then buy it.

If you're interested in Maura Murray then stay here.

Not to plug it but official links are required;
http://www.amazon.com/True-Crime-Addict-Mysterious-Disappearance/dp/1250089018++


all MOO

 

[xjd]

just listened to the latest podcast, glad they addressed the Renner issue. not sure i buy their explanation, but whatev.

was very interesting was Truth Seeker had to say, and as with everything about this case, his insight raises more questions: how and why does Renner believe the police are not involved in any way when those same LE threatened to arrest John Smith? maybe they are not involved as to what happened, but involved as to covering up the non-investigation. either way, warning Smith off seems very odd considering Fred later on asked him to help.

another question was about the damage to the Saturn and how it didn't look consistent with a head-on into a tree or snow bank etc. the comments on YouTube they said most of the damage was to the passenger side. could it be that the car was side-swiped or otherwise run off the road? maybe the "tandem driver" wasn't friendly or consensual, and Renner has theorized that she could have met up with someone first and then try to get away from them. Atwood was quoted as saying there were a lot of cars coming and going and was worried about the car hanging out into the road.

 

[armywife210]

just listened to the latest podcast, glad they addressed the Renner issue. not sure i buy their explanation, but whatev.

was very interesting was Truth Seeker had to say, and as with everything about this case, his insight raises more questions: how and why does Renner believe the police are not involved in any way when those same LE threatened to arrest John Smith? maybe they are not involved as to what happened, but involved as to covering up the non-investigation. either way, warning Smith off seems very odd considering Fred later on asked him to help.

another question was about the damage to the Saturn and how it didn't look consistent with a head-on into a tree or snow bank etc. the comments on YouTube they said most of the damage was to the passenger side. could it be that the car was side-swiped or otherwise run off the road? maybe the "tandem driver" wasn't friendly or consensual, and Renner has theorized that she could have met up with someone first and then try to get away from them. Atwood was quoted as saying there were a lot of cars coming and going and was worried about the car hanging out into the road.

I've always thought that car had an awful lot of damage for what was reported as the accident. And what you say could be very true. She could've been trying to get away from the guy that ended up taking her...therefor it wouldn't be some random dirtbag....just a dirtbag. It could've been someone she was supposed to meet and that meeting turned bad so she tried to get away. It could've been someone stalking her for any period of time. There are a lot of things that it could be...to me running away and living out her life isn't much of a possibility, unfortunately.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[trenchmouth]

This case is going nowhere unfortunately. Unless some major development breaks I don't see how it will ever be solved. Anyone's theory could be what happened. There's just no proof to be found after dogs followed her scent down the road. After this long, the odds are she is no longer with us.

 

[missy_g]

I wish her computer would be analyzed again if it's around to be analyzed.


Sent By Owl

 

[OldSteve]

This case is going nowhere unfortunately. Unless some major development breaks I don't see how it will ever be solved. Anyone's theory could be what happened. There's just no proof to be found after dogs followed her scent down the road. After this long, the odds are she is no longer with us.

You got that right ^
Every now and then I check in to see if anything new has been figured out... sadly, it's the same-old-same-old...

When I first became interested, I felt this was a case of her being taken shortly after leaving her car.

But, as time went on I'm not sure - now leaning more toward accidental exposure death or suicide. Considering all she put her father through before she took off, appears her doing something risky that might result in causing him more grief was not top priority.

But it's all conjecture trying to figure out what was going on inside her mind.

Considering all the investigation and investigators, I'm surprised two questions I've asked before a few times have not been answered; namely:

1) Was her car ever tested before or after it was found to see just how badly it was really running and did it backfire or produce a smokey tail.

2) Was she a night-runner who used a flashlight when running, and if so, was there one kept in her car, and if so was it there?

 

[Caffeine]

I too was curious about the idea that she may have had a flashlight. That is a very important detail to know. Personally I keep a flashlight in all my cars loaded with lithium batteries to ensure it works during an emergency .

 

[TessDeco]

Here is the thing I do not understand about your theory scoops. If Maura was going to kill herself Monday or Tuesday, then what was the point of emailing her professors? Why not just drive up there and do it? I do not know if you went to college, but I did. Indeed I have a B.A., a master's and a JD. I have studied at five different universities in three states and two countries. This is not to brag but rather to make my point abundantly clear: at all the universities and in all the places I studied I have taken two days off at a time and never let a single person at the school know. There was no search, my parents were never called, there was not a single smidgen of concern given to my absence, etc. It was not a big deal. When you are at a university, you are an adult. The "consequences" of taking off for a couple of days are at worst a drop in your grade.

Congrats on your remarkable achievements, Fireweed!

I can only speak of my own experience in a Nursing School program. A student is required to have a certain amount of clinical hours in order to sit for the licensing exams. You cannot just blow off clinical hours without a very good excuse because there just isn't enough time in a semester/quarter to make up the hours. They only allow so many "make-up" days which have to be organized with the hospital and with a nursing instructor who is already teaching full time. Clinical groups are small and you work closely with the clinical instructors. There were seven students in each clinical group at my college and a student would definitely be missed if they didn't show up. Nobody cares if a nursing student misses a lecture class. It's the clinical hours that require close communication with the clinical instructor.

FWIW I've never seen or read anything that convinces me that Maura was suicidal. We can spin what we assume to know all day long but in the end, it's still anyone's guess until Maura is found.

MHO

 

[Vox_Veritas_JT]

Found the recent two podcasts with Truth Seeker very interesting.

I'll greet Renners explosive information with a wary and cynical eye. If you take Renner at his own word only then he always seems to solve murders others cannot, he knows who took amy mihaljevic, it was only a matter of time he found out who was behind the Maura Murray case. I am of course being sarcastic but I will say its a remarkable volte face he has performed, from steadfastly believing Murray was alive some place after running off in tandem too now maintaining she is likely dead.

I lost belief in the integrity of Renner with his antagonistic approaches toward Murray's friends and family. Instead of hunting for evidence he seemed focused on finding dirt on individuals, which was at best very tenuous to the case.

I said many pages ago on these threads that the Rag in the tailpipe is the enigma which likely holds the key to what happened that night. I notice that truth seeker has said similar. Knowing who put that rag there solves the case for me. I discount Murray's explanation for reasons I have explained elsewhere here.

 

[Captain_Khan]

I said many pages ago on these threads that the Rag in the tailpipe is the enigma which likely holds the key to what happened that night. I notice that truth seeker has said similar. Knowing who put that rag there solves the case for me. I discount Murray's explanation for reasons I have explained elsewhere here.

I agree. Part of me wonders if Fred actually really was telling the truth - that is, he really did tell Maura to put the rag there to stop smoke coming out. We spend a lot of time wondering why it got there, but maybe the answer is staring us right in the face - Fred knows nothing about motor care, and gave some terrible advice.

What would that mean for Maura? No dirtbag sabotaging her car, for a start. She would have accidentally sabotaged it herself. No half-witted impromptu suicide attempt on the roadside in full view of several houses. No attempt to hide a rag potentially used to mop up alcohol - on that note, it might even mean that she wasn't driving drunk. So in that case, why the vast amount of alcohol?

That one tiny bit of evidence... if we could unlock that, the case could open in so many different directions.

 

[TessDeco]

I agree. Part of me wonders if Fred actually really was telling the truth - that is, he really did tell Maura to put the rag there to stop smoke coming out. We spend a lot of time wondering why it got there, but maybe the answer is staring us right in the face - Fred knows nothing about motor care, and gave some terrible advice.

What would that mean for Maura? No dirtbag sabotaging her car, for a start. She would have accidentally sabotaged it herself. No half-witted impromptu suicide attempt on the roadside in full view of several houses. No attempt to hide a rag potentially used to mop up alcohol - on that note, it might even mean that she wasn't driving drunk. So in that case, why the vast amount of alcohol?

That one tiny bit of evidence... if we could unlock that, the case could open in so many different directions.

I tend to believe Fred Murray. I can't think of any reason why Fred would lie about the rag in the tailpipe. But then, I don't think Fred has been as dishonest as some people seem to indicate. It's definitely strange but I'm not convinced it's a significant clue as to why Maura went missing from her car that night. Who knows?

 

[Tarik]

It's funny to me that Mr. Renner went from "I've got major information I'm going to share with you", to a few days later saying "I'm taking a break, see ya in the spring". It's almost as though he took the criticism he must've read here to heart and decided to "punish" everyone by shutting his site down. It's too bad, because he obviously should be given credit for keeping the case relevant and talked about. But if he's really interested in achieving resolution in the case, how does he go from one extreme to the other, and simply walk away from it?

It's not that hard to understand. The way I see it, Renner has tried to trick people into buying his book by jumping around like a kid in need of attention claiming that he had new bombshell information only to retract himself when he saw how frustrated people were that he was playing dumb with them and when they all realized that all along he knew he was never going to release that information. It's a tactic used by some journalists to stir up interest of the general public in their novels, albeit a very questionable tactic. I call it the "You wanna know more and get the answers to your questions? It's all in my book, buy it" tactic. Many people may think that Renner is getting some sort of personal thrill out of constantly putting people on the edge only to leave them all empty-handed. I personally think that if you have valuable information with regards to a missing person case, you should come out and say/write it. If you don't then you shouldn't say you have valuable information only to leave people empty-handed. It's very dishonest and it makes everyone feel stupid. And I get the feeling that sometimes Renner seems to think that his audience is stupid, his actions prove that. Like Fireweed a few pages ago, I too question the idea that making your customers feel stupid is a good strategy. With that being said, I still support Renner's work. I just question his work ethic and his tactics as of late.

 

[TessDeco]

It's not that hard to understand. The way I see it, Renner has tried to trick people into buying his book by jumping around like a kid in need of attention claiming that he had new bombshell information only to retract himself when he saw how frustrated people were that he was playing dumb with them and when they all realized that all along he knew he was never going to release that information. It's a tactic used by some journalists to stir up interest of the general public in their novels, albeit a very questionable tactic. I call it the "You wanna know more and get the answers to your questions? It's all in my book, buy it" tactic. Many people may think that Renner is getting some sort of personal thrill out of constantly putting people on the edge only to leave them all empty-handed. I personally think that if you have valuable information with regards to a missing person case, you should come out and say/write it. If you don't then you shouldn't say you have valuable information only to leave people empty-handed. It's very dishonest and it makes everyone feel stupid. And I get the feeling that sometimes Renner seems to think that his audience is stupid, his actions prove that. Like Fireweed a few pages ago, I too question the idea that making your customers feel stupid is a good strategy. With that being said, I still support Renner's work. I just question his work ethic and his tactics as of late.

IMO, if Renner had a compelling story to tell about Maura's disappearance, he would have published his book a long time ago. What great insight can he offer in this missing case when none of the primary people will even talk to him? All he has is a few facts and his own spin. Is that why he changed the focus of his book to be about his obsession? IDK At least now, with the podcast, we are hearing from some new people who have also researched this case for many years and can offer different perspectives. That's refreshing to me and who knows? It just may shine some new light on this case.

If there's any truth to Renner's bombshell, I want to hear it from LE, as it seems to suggest some kind of foul play. Otherwise it's just another rumor in a book by a blogger/writer with an agenda and that's not fair to Maura or her family.

All just MHO!

 

[Fireweed]

Congrats on your remarkable achievements, Fireweed!

I can only speak of my own experience in a Nursing School program. A student is required to have a certain amount of clinical hours in order to sit for the licensing exams. You cannot just blow off clinical hours without a very good excuse because there just isn't enough time in a semester/quarter to make up the hours. They only allow so many "make-up" days which have to be organized with the hospital and with a nursing instructor who is already teaching full time. Clinical groups are small and you work closely with the clinical instructors. There were seven students in each clinical group at my college and a student would definitely be missed if they didn't show up. Nobody cares if a nursing student misses a lecture class. It's the clinical hours that require close communication with the clinical instructor.

FWIW I've never seen or read anything that convinces me that Maura was suicidal. We can spin what we assume to know all day long but in the end, it's still anyone's guess until Maura is found.

MHO

Yes but that is only if you are planning on returning and continuing in the program with a passing grade.

I feel like so many people miss the point of what I am getting at. If Maura missed two days of these clinicals, there would not have been a search party called. The consequences of missing clinicals would have been purely academic in nature. Scoops is totally convinced that if Maura missed two days of school (even these you-miss-one-and-the-world-ends clinicals), that her parents and the police would have been called. That is not how things operate at a university. If Maura missed two days of clinicals then her grade would have suffered, or she would have been kicked out of the program, but FFS, she would not have been a "missing person".

If anyone still does not understand what I am saying here, then please PM me and I will try again to get my point across.

 

[JeannaT]

You got that right ^
Every now and then I check in to see if anything new has been figured out... sadly, it's the same-old-same-old...

When I first became interested, I felt this was a case of her being taken shortly after leaving her car.

But, as time went on I'm not sure - now leaning more toward accidental exposure death or suicide. Considering all she put her father through before she took off, appears her doing something risky that might result in causing him more grief was not top priority.

But it's all conjecture trying to figure out what was going on inside her mind.

Considering all the investigation and investigators, I'm surprised two questions I've asked before a few times have not been answered; namely:

1) Was her car ever tested before or after it was found to see just how badly it was really running and did it backfire or produce a smokey tail.

2) Was she a night-runner who used a flashlight when running, and if so, was there one kept in her car, and if so was it there?

Are you referring to the People article that noted that a rag (or some other item) was found stuffed in her exhaust, and under those conditions the car wouldn't have been drivable for more than a short distance? And she had just recently stopped and gotten gas? It appears someone stuck that in her exhaust pipe very shortly before her car plowed into the bank and was abandoned.