Bosma Murder Trial 02.25.16 - Day 15

[6degrees]

It's amazing what people will do for a reliable pay cheque, and maybe even a little money under the table.

It's even more amazing to me how people can trade in their moral judgment when being manipulated and charmed by a sociopath. And let's remember this woman was only clocking 10hrs/month at what is likely a fairly low wage. Maybe she and her security /IT husband Charlie were paid in ways other than cold hard cash. JMO

 

[JPC]

I think it's been available to her in MSM for 3 years and yet it appears she's still remaining "loyal" to him. I get what you are saying, but IMO too many people choose to turn a blind eye to the obvious with personal friends/family members. Perhaps it's a coping mechanism?

MOO

It is strange indeed but she seems to have had a longstanding relationship with the Millard family and there has to be a connection with the Burns family as well.

 

[deugirtni]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 37s38 seconds ago
Sachak: "Your job wasn't to question why/where money was going...your job was to categorize it." She agrees. #Bosma

Nicole Martin ‏@nmartinCHCH now
Defence "If you did not know why an item was purchased you wouldn't ask why?" Williams says no. She would input data on Quickbooks @CHCHNews

Nicole Martin ‏@nmartinCHCH 21s22 seconds ago
Williams agrees that her job was to categorize the expenses not to question them. @CHCHNews #Bosma

I guess we know now who put the incinerator capital purchase into the 'garbage' operating GL account.

 

[Gibson67]

It's amazing what people will do for a reliable pay cheque, and maybe even a little money under the table.

I don't think she worked at Millard Air..she worked from home perhaps and just got receipts etc sent to her for book keeping..she said she was invoiced for her time..she was not an employee of Millard Air

 

[JPC]

I think it's been available to her in MSM for 3 years and yet it appears she's still remaining "loyal" to him. I get what you are saying, but IMO too many people choose to turn a blind eye to the obvious with personal friends/family members. Perhaps it's a coping mechanism?

MOO

BTW, I didn't realize that this hypothetical question was specific to the Bosma case and today's witness.

 

[billandrew]

I don't think she worked at Millard Air..she worked from home perhaps and just got receipts etc sent to her for book keeping..she said she was invoiced for her time..she was not an employee of Millard Air

That's right - I didn't mean to imply that she was an employee, but rather that the job for Millard Air was regular and reliable work for her (as a contractor).

 

[6degrees]

I have never actually followed a trial before.....and these tweets and differing interpretations of the reporters is frustrating at times......In Canada, will we ever get a trial transcript? So many things are open to interpretation (ie: 125K income projection)

I'm with you RN479. I've finally posted here for the first time today despite following Tim's case on WS since day one. The tweets can be tough to follow and there is definitely lots of room for interpretation. It looks like all the sleuthers here are pretty great at putting the pieces together ultimately though!

This case has impacted so many, on so many levels for the last three years. I live in Ancaster, about 5 minutes from the Bosma's and was out and about driving the country roads of the area the night he went missing. We love to go for drives at night with the roof down and it completely freaks me out that we may have inadvertently passed by them.

I left SB a letter and pink tulips from my garden at the makeshift memorial that was at the end of their driveway. I told her that every year when the pink tulips would come up in my garden that I'd be thinking of them....so horrendous.

Anyway....I'm a newbie here so go easy on me. My background isn't law enforcement or otherwise, but a nurse practitioner with a keen interest in this case above all else. :silenced:

 

[CJPRINCESS]

Well if you really put together some of her testimony....

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 8m8 minutes ago
They do contract work. She did bookkeeping for other companies. One of her clients was Millardair. Knew of Dellen Millard in 2001.

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 6m6 minutes ago
She met Dellen later than that. Jan. 2012 she started to do Millardair books. Met Dellen before that "a handful of times."

***She "knew" of DM in 2001, met him a handful of times prior to being asked to do the bookkeeping in Jan 2012. So how did she "know" him?

Williams says she was paying the company's taxes.
by Adam Carter 2:47 PM

"I would not personally pay, or write cheques for anything," Williams says. Now she says taxes were done by a chartered accountant -- which is contrary to what she said a couple of minutes ago.
by Adam Carter 2:49 PM

***So was there an accountant or not? Has she been coached by "someone"?

"When was the last time you personally saw Mr. Millard?" Moodie asks. "May 3, 2013," she responds. It was at the hangar in Waterloo.
by Adam Carter 2:51 PM

Court now hearing about the invoice for the Eliminator. Williams says it didn't stick out for her.
by Adam Carter 3:02 PM

Moodie asks to address Justice Goodman without the jury in the room. They're led out.
by Adam Carter 3:03 PM

***Did she say something different about that invoice before and was now starting to come off as more of a hostile witness who didn't want to say anything incriminating? What did the Crown need to ask the judge at that moment? And why did it end the court day and result in them spending another hour on legal arguments this morning? Did she ask DM what the incinerator was for and he told her something that, once again is being argued away? So no one is allowed to testify as to what they were told about the incinerator's purpose?

Then she comes back today after all the arguments and says...


Feb 25 2016 11:05 AM Williams says she still sees Madeleine Burns sometimes to talk business. The last time she saw Millard, she says, was Sept. 2014. He was arrested in 2013.

Feb 25 2016 11:05 AM "I think I visited him maybe six times," Williams says.

***Which contradicts what she said yesterday about May 3rd, 2013 being the last time she saw him.

Feb 25 2016 11:01 AM Williams says she "still does a little bit of work" for MillardAir and Millard properties, gathering paperwork for a chartered accountant. She's being paid hourly, doing about 10 hours a month.

So now she gathers paperwork for an actual accountant? Does she still enter it in the books? Does she still have access to the bank account balance as she claimed yesterday she had before DM was arrested?

So why wouldn't DM get a couple of personal acquaintances (we still haven't heard from her husband...yet...but I assume we will since his name was included in the phone evidence) in to the hangar for such mundane things as IT, security and bookkeeping. Especially acquaintance bookkeepers who won't ask questions about incinerators and help him get those expenses past his father? Seems to me that she's still "loyal" to him for some reason $?

It's all very suspect

MOO

Maybe the <modsnip>before it went to the real accountant?

I've done basic accounting, I know it quite well (did them for my family business) I went to collage for Corporate (same as Chartered accountant) accounting and it was tough! But from my understanding, IF I had of continued in the corporate accounting, that the accounts would be my firms in full (from busisness expeses right thru to the taxes) ....not passed from a small time...dabbled in..book keeper? Just doesn't sound right to me at all!!!

I think she's becoming more of a "hostile witness" for the crown! Too many discrepancies in her testimony!!

 

[Abitcountry]

Finances and LW:

I think, this management of MillardAir and Millard Properties stems from grandpa: The person who is wellknown to the boss and the collegues has the least insight and for the important finances and the complete accounting there is a hired company, obliged for confidentiality.
The clerk as you said earlier does what the boss wants, today this and tomorrow that, entries in the quickbook, do the stacker, brew coffee, buy paperclips. She costs only its intended low hourly wage. Afterwards the tax consultant does the real booking incl. consulting for an eightfold hourly wage but the quickbook saves him time (and MA costs).

IMHO your very thorough assessment of the situation bears repeating.

 

[Ironworker736]

Maybe the <modsnip>" before it went to the real accountant?

I've done basic accounting, I know it quite well (did them for my family business) I went to collage for Corporate (same as Chartered accountant) accounting and it was tough! But from my understanding, IF I had of continued in the corporate accounting, that the accounts would be my firms in full (from busisness expeses right thru to the taxes) ....not passed from a small time...dabbled in..book keeper? Just doesn't sound right to me at all!!!

I think she's becoming more of a "hostile witness" for the crown! Too many discrepancies in her testimony!!

Hence hiding her face from reporters, maybe? MOO

 

[Kamille]

I'm with you RN479. I've finally posted here for the first time today despite following Tim's case on WS since day one. The tweets can be tough to follow and there is definitely lots of room for interpretation. It looks like all the sleuthers here are pretty great at putting the pieces together ultimately though!

This case has impacted so many, on so many levels for the last three years. I live in Ancaster, about 5 minutes from the Bosma's and was out and about driving the country roads of the area the night he went missing. We love to go for drives at night with the roof down and it completely freaks me out that we may have inadvertently passed by them.

I left SB a letter and pink tulips from my garden at the makeshift memorial that was at the end of their driveway. I told her that every year when the pink tulips would come up in my garden that I'd be thinking of them....so horrendous.

Anyway....I'm a newbie here so go easy on me. My background isn't law enforcement or otherwise, but a nurse practitioner with a keen interest in this case above all else. :silenced:

Welcome to posting along with us 6degrees :welcome:

Thank you for sharing your personal experience with this tragedy. I have to admit your post made me tear up a little. I'm sure SB and family are forever grateful for all that you and the other locals have done to keep TB's memory alive. It never ceases to amaze me how many people are affected in one way or another by a crime such as this. I hope you still take those nice long drives and don't let this affect your enjoyment of that beautiful area. And I also hope that you continue to join in on the discussion here. The local insight from so many of you is so appreciated.

 

[Kamille]

Hence hiding her face from reporters, maybe? MOO

I don't think she's finished either is she? She was not excused that I remember. The lawyers had some more arguments which were supposed to go until 1:30pm and then all of a sudden they just sent the jury home. She was still being cross examined by the defence and the Crown does have a chance to rebut correct? :waitasec:

MOO

 

[Abitcountry]

An honest question - if you were keeping books for a business and the boss was arrested and charged with murder, would you quit the job? If you didn't quit, what would make you stay?

First uke: and then:backut of there

 

[matou]

Feb 25 2016 12:02 PM
Sachak now talking about the budget for the jeep race in Baja, Mexico. Williams says she was giving an opinion to the police as to what the entrance fee would be and what the costs related to the race would be.

Feb 25 2016 12:04 PM
Sachak says he's suggesting the entrance fee for the race was $1,800 and not $18,000, as she testified yesterday. She says she isn't certain. "You don't know the price. You're not sure of the price." Sachak says. "Yes," she responds.

***Whoops. She was pretty off on that fee.

Feb 25 2016 12:05 PM
The lawyers now have legal arguments to make without the jury. They're being sent out -- instructed to come back at 1:30 p.m.

Bookkeeping is not her forte, apparently! JMO

 

[Ironworker736]

I don't think she's finished either is she? She was not excused that I remember. The lawyers had some more arguments which were supposed to go until 1:30pm and then all of a sudden they just sent the jury home. She was still being cross examined by the defence and the Crown does have a chance to rebut correct? :waitasec:

MOO

I believe that's correct. Is court adjourned until Monday? Justice Goodman asked if everyone would consider Fridays when available.

 

[matou]

Williams' testimony seems sort of sketchy. Can't quite put my finger on it, but something is off.

Why is she visiting him 6 times in jail when she claims to only work 10 hours a month for Millardair?

 

[Ontario Mom]

Yesterday we learned...

Jason Agnew, NAPA auto parts salesperson guy who sold auto parts to SS (and spoke with him every day on the phone) also sometimes had dealings with "Charlie the IT guy"

Charlie the IT guy is Charles Dubiens - Lisa Williams' husband.

Now someone explain to me why the heck the auto parts sales guy *ever* would have had a reason to deal with Charlie the IT guy? Auto parts and IT go together as much as peanut butter and lugnuts.

So I'm the guy running the hangar. I hire Lisa to do bookeepping. I pay SS to deal with other stuff, including the NAPA guy, that he talks to on the phone EVERY day.

How the heck does Lisa's husband end up dealing with the NAPA guy?

 

[Ironworker736]

Maybe she's the one who got the letters to CN

No, DM wouldn't be able to pass anything to a visitor or have any direct contact.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I don't think she's finished either is she? She was not excused that I remember. The lawyers had some more arguments which were supposed to go until 1:30pm and then all of a sudden they just sent the jury home. She was still being cross examined by the defence and the Crown does have a chance to rebut correct? :waitasec:

MOO

Not sure if she was excused or not:

molly hayes @mollyhayes
That's it for Williams. Jury now out. Legal arguments now before lunch. They'll be back at 1:30 p.m. #Bosma

That sort of makes it sound like it, but its hard to say.

 

[matou]

If Millardair was not generating any income, how did it make $125,000/year????