Cincinnati Zoo kills gorilla after child gets into his cage, May 28, 2016

[Jax49]

I think something the public misunderstands about zoo enclosures is they don't want it to look like a cage. Had they gotten burglar bars or a huge bulletproof glass wall, it would be clearly a cage. They want it to look like a cabana.

And it's really hard to keep people who are determined to get in, out of a cabana.

Totally understand the desire, but it seems to have swung too far away from safety.

ETA: nothing like me stating the obvious...

 

[KaaBoom]

I think something the public misunderstands about zoo enclosures is they don't want it to look like a cage. Had they gotten burglar bars or a huge bulletproof glass wall, it would be clearly a cage. They want it to look like a cabana.

And it's really hard to keep people who are determined to get in, out of a cabana.

Why would they use burglar bars or bulletproof glass? They are not trying to stop burglars or bullets. It only needs to keep kids from falling into the gorilla pit.

 

[Montjoy]

I think something the public misunderstands about zoo enclosures is they don't want it to look like a cage. Had they gotten burglar bars or a huge bulletproof glass wall, it would be clearly a cage. They want it to look like a cabana.

And it's really hard to keep people who are determined to get in, out of a cabana.

Who is the 'they'? I'll bet you that zoologists want everything to be done to protect the animals -- even if that means keeping people out, and even if it means a less aesthetic enclosure.

But why frame this as you did? It's a false dilemma, intended to oversimplify the issue. An enclosure can be safe and still not look like a cage.

 

[Montjoy]

I bet a lot of children could pull that net lose, and crawl under it just as fast as that kid got in the gorilla pit. It looks like they choose the absolute minimum solution.

Yeah, it's not hard to gue$$ what their prioritie$ are -- and I'll give you a clue: it'$ not protecting animal$.

 

[KaaBoom]

I'm not a fan of zoos, but notwithstanding: something that has escaped this discussion is that, if anything, taking one's children to the zoo should be seen as a solid sign of good parenting.

There was a time when it would have been considered great parenting, but now days it should probably be considered irresponsible parenting. Visiting zoos now should be considered a high risk activity for anyone, with the minimalistic barriers between visitors and the animals.

Something to think about. The gorilla that escaped from the Dallas Zoo and injured four people before being killed, escaped by climbing up a 16 foot wall. The Cincinnati Zoo gorilla enclosure is only 15 feet tall. Do you want to be visiting the zoo with your children when one of them decides to climb out of the enclosure?

 

[Zuri]

It was announced yesterday that the prosecutor will make a statement on Monday regarding his decision on filing charges against these parents.lease:

For the "Grace of God but go I" posters, would you also not file charges against parents in hot car deaths??? How do you feel about Ross Harris???
And there are msm links further down this page showing this father does have a criminal history, so that says something about the child's role model/family life.

Respectfully, LinusK, I am one of the "There but for the Grace of God go I" posters you refer to. I am not a perfect parent. At all. I am hyper vigilant, uber controlling (according to my kids), well educated and fairly intelligent? yet I have managed to make mistakes that could have had dire consequences. Fortunately, my children did not go into a gorilla exhibit in a zoo resulting in the death of a primate.

I can't equate Ross Harris's actions with this situation at all. It comes down to intent IMO. I don't believe for one second this mother intended for her son to go into the gorilla enclosure, nor did she intentionally ignore him.

Truthfully, if I were to reveal all the mistakes I have made as a parent over 28 years, I am afraid of the bashing I would receive and that would be devastating for me. I have already beat myself up enough. Whether this mother has self awareness or not, I can't begin to bash her or judge her harshly. I don't know of one single perfect parent, however I have tried to learn from experience what I should or shouldn't do so I don't repeat my mistakes.

Initially, I said "WhereTH was the mother?" when first reading of this incident. With more witness accounts and reporting, I realized that this could happen to anyone (hopefully not). I respect you and your position and I hope I you can respect mine. Xo

 

[sonjay]

Unbelievable. It looks like they went to Home Depot and picked up $200 worth of supplies (wood beams, rope, and netting), and slapped it together in half an hour. :facepalm:

But I guess it should be no surprise. Why should they do anything more, in a country that wants to send the mother to jail for her child climbing over a railing and some bushes and falling into a gorilla pit, and thinks that corporations have zero responsibility for anything.

Unfortunately it’s just a matter of time before it will happen again, because no changes will be made to prevent it.

Based on the exhibit's history, it might happen again in about the year 2054.

 

[sonjay]

There was a time when it would have been considered great parenting, but now days it should probably be considered irresponsible parenting. Visiting zoos now should be considered a high risk activity for anyone, with the minimalistic barriers between visitors and the animals.

Something to think about. The gorilla that escaped from the Dallas Zoo and injured four people before being killed, escaped by climbing up a 16 foot wall. The Cincinnati Zoo gorilla enclosure is only 15 feet tall. Do you want to be visiting the zoo with your children when one of them decides to climb out of the enclosure?

The world is a dangerous place. Cars & trucks zooming past on the street in front of your house. Dangerous chemicals stored in the household. Pools in backyards. Water buckets sitting around unguarded. Prescription and OTC medicines stored in bathroom cabinets. Ladders! Stairways! Hot water! Responsible parents know this and supervise their young children accordingly.

 

[Swirlz]

The zoo is at fault here, 100%. A four year old should not have been able to get into the pen, even if the parents were extremely negligent. The zoo puts animals on display to make money. They make the displays as open as possible because that's what people want, to see an animal up close. So now a baby has been harmed, and an innocent life lost because of "entertainment." If this were the only time it had happened, that would be one thing, but this happens a lot and the organizations making money off the animals sweep it under the rug.

We've decided that we have the right to display a giant creature who nearly matches us in intelligence, and completely outweighs us in strength, and not only that, but we have the right to view that animal as up close and unconstrained as possible, such that a regular FOUR YEAR OLD could enter the area and that should not be possible. It's such bizarre hubris.

 

[sonjay]

The zoo is at fault here, 100%. A four year old should not have been able to get into the pen, even if the parents were extremely negligent. The zoo puts animals on display to make money. They make the displays as open as possible because that's what people want, to see an animal up close. So now a baby has been harmed, and an innocent life lost because of "entertainment." If this were the only time it had happened, that would be one thing, but this happens a lot and the organizations making money off the animals sweep it under the rug.

We've decided that we have the right to display a giant creature who nearly matches us in intelligence, and completely outweighs us in strength, and not only that, but we have the right to view that animal as up close and unconstrained as possible, such that a regular FOUR YEAR OLD could enter the area and that should not be possible. It's such bizarre hubris.

BBM. This is the only time this has happened at this zoo.

 

[bluesneakers]

BBM. This is the only time this has happened at this zoo.

One dead gorilla is one too many.

JMO

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Respectfully, LinusK, I am one of the "There but for the Grace of God go I" posters you refer to. I am not a perfect parent. At all. I am hyper vigilant, uber controlling (according to my kids), well educated and fairly intelligent? yet I have managed to make mistakes that could have had dire consequences. Fortunately, my children did not go into a gorilla exhibit in a zoo resulting in the death of a primate.

I can't equate Ross Harris's actions with this situation at all. It comes down to intent IMO. I don't believe for one second this mother intended for her son to go into the gorilla enclosure, nor did she intentionally ignore him.

Truthfully, if I were to reveal all the mistakes I have made as a parent over 28 years, I am afraid of the bashing I would receive and that would be devastating for me. I have already beat myself up enough. Whether this mother has self awareness or not, I can't begin to bash her or judge her harshly. I don't know of one single perfect parent, however I have tried to learn from experience what I should or shouldn't do so I don't repeat my mistakes.

Initially, I said "WhereTH was the mother?" when first reading of this incident. With more witness accounts and reporting, I realized that this could happen to anyone (hopefully not). I respect you and your position and I hope I you can respect mine. Xo

This is the kind of discourse that's much appreciated on ws's. People can disagree, but do so respectfully. There's no sniping. Thank you! :loveyou: (Reading back, I hope this doesn't sound patronizing. It's not meant that way at all. I feel nauseated when I read what sounds like sniping back and forth. And I realize that not all are snipes but because there's no inflection or nonverbal cues in the written message, it's hard to tell sometimes).

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Considering the new fence, my boys would easily have climbed that when young, the 'holes' make a perfect toehold. I guess someone would more easily spot a child climbing though...

 

[JohnPaul]

The zoo is at fault here, 100%. A four year old should not have been able to get into the pen, even if the parents were extremely negligent

oh please....you can't "child proof" the entire world,

if a kid runs out onto the street and gets hit by a car, should there have been a fence there to prevent it? :thinking:

why don't we calculate how many kids have viewed this exhibit over the past 30+ years, and then compare that number to how many children have got into the exhibit? :thinking:

 

[flourish]

I'm not a fan of zoos, but notwithstanding: something that has escaped this discussion is that, if anything, taking one's children to the zoo should be seen as a solid sign of good parenting.

I'm hoping you're sincere. I've been reading all the anti zoo posts, and remembering my first family date with my now husband and stepson.
We had such a great time! We all loved really getting to see animals we've only seen on monitors with nothing but several feet of air between us. We didn't have a death wish, little guy was appropriate as were the zoo barriers.
(it was helpful that it wasn't nearly the first time he and I had met, just our first interaction in that context)

We got to watch Polar bears swimming right in front of us. The glistening of their fur is so much more amazing in person.

So perhaps I'm a very selfish human, as I enjoyed visiting the zoo. I love animals. Posters here have seen pictures of my animal companions. But I've also loved the zoo every time I went with the exception of once and that had nothing to do with animals on the other side of the barriers.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Honestly, this could have been me. I have 5 children, and my middle child doesn't know fear, and has impulse control issues. It is much better now (he will be 6 in 4 days!!) then it was when he was younger. He has taken off on me twice while camping, and yes all it took was a couple seconds me for to be distracted. Once he got out of the house in the early morning hours when I was still asleep. Thank goodness he went down toward the chicken coop, and not towards the road. I'm not a perfect mother, and "By the Grace of God go I". I still can not think of that morning that he got out of the house without feeling sick to my stomach, and it must be almost 4 years ago now...

<snipped>

I remembered your post when I heard about this local drowning case. Two young children left the house while their parents slept. One child drowned.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...6/04/dearborn-toddler-swimming-pool/85405732/

 

[jjenny]

I think something the public misunderstands about zoo enclosures is they don't want it to look like a cage. Had they gotten burglar bars or a huge bulletproof glass wall, it would be clearly a cage. They want it to look like a cabana.

And it's really hard to keep people who are determined to get in, out of a cabana.

The new barrier doesn't look much more secure than the old one. And it's not humans I am concerned about. Zoo already showed they will kill an animal if human gets into enclosure.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

This youtube video is called "9 Zoo Fails":

[video=youtube;rTx5drN7DHI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTx5drN7DHI[/video]

I was surprised to see there had been a prior "suicide by lion" attempt in India! Most of these incidents seemed to people who voluntarily entered the enclosure. To take a better picture, to retrieve a child's dropped toy, to "swim with the animals". Sheesh!

 

[human]

I heard a good program on public radio and I cannot find the reference.

The commentator talked about why are we not upset about chickens that are raised in an area where their beaks are clipped and their feet do not touch the ground. Pigs, which are smarter than dogs, live in a space in their own waste. They get lesions on their lungs from the ammonia. They cannot turn around in their space.

Interesting.

 

[KaaBoom]

The world is a dangerous place. Cars & trucks zooming past on the street in front of your house. Dangerous chemicals stored in the household. Pools in backyards. Water buckets sitting around unguarded. Prescription and OTC medicines stored in bathroom cabinets. Ladders! Stairways! Hot water! Responsible parents know this and supervise their young children accordingly.

Yet, when it happens at the zoo, everybody blames the parent. If a child gets away from a parent and runs into the street and gets hit by a truck, thats just a terrible accident, but if a child get's away from a parent and falls in the gorilla pit at the zoo, thats gross negligence on the part of the parent. We got the message, zoos are terrible dangerous places, and any responsible person would know not to take a child there. We should just have the police arrest every single person at the zoo gate, who tries to take a child into the zoo, for child endangerment.