Dr. Phil Interviews Burke Ramsey (9/12 & 9/13 2016)

[callyn]

I disagree all he had to do was hit her , which he openly admitted he swung the golf club at her before ( and my autistic child can easily cover up things , she is much more awkward too!!!!!

When did he admit he had swung a golf club at her before? I missed that. All I heard him say is that he hit her accidentally on the backswing. TIA

 

[observation]

It's very obvious that DP has L Wood as his attorney (like the Ramseys). He said basically the same things that Wood has said over the years. Don't bother watching it if you've followed the case any length of time.

Agreed- I could not watch all of it out of frustration. It's also in direct contrast to a few recent interviews he gave- especially on the View- which someone linked on one of these threads.


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[Boodles]

I watched it and maybe I'm dense but I didn't come away knowing which way DP's pendulum swings. He described odd affect and behaviors but he also said that anyone who has an opinion on whether BR did it or didn't do it will come away with another opinion...

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if DP Part 3 is Ramsey-friendly and supports the IDI theory. I have a nagging feeling the Burke-butchering saga we've seen so far has been carefully crafted via editing to garner exactly the reaction it's getting. (If I read one more "he's so creepy" I might vomit). I think DP will end up as supporting the Ramsey POV.

All I want to see is the raw video of the interviews, both BR (then and now) and JR.

 

[just the facts pls]

Justthefacts,

I love your tribute to Prince!

Thank you! He was a kind, gentle, and beautiful soul and the world is less without him. <3

 

[Boodles]

When did he admit he had swung a golf club at her before? I missed that. All I heard him say is that he hit her accidentally on the backswing. TIA

you heard correctly. "Not on purpose" with his backswing is what he said.

And he didn't say he went into the basement Xmas night. He went downstairs, which I interpreted as into the room where the tree/presents were. Someone earlier (not you callyn) said he admitted going to the basement. He didn't.

 

[Bitz]

Agree!

 

[PositiveLight]

If BR killed her by accident I don't think B would have spent a day in jail only psychiatric care where he belonged.
Not sure why the parents would create such an elaborate cover-up. I assume fear of family pride being tarnished forever and losing yet another child.
The case would have been solved. I doubt anyone would have put the grieving parents in jail either.

I think that is one reason to at least come to a conclusion and a final ruling. To keep other parents from pulling this crap.
Too many copycats out there now a days.
I agree he would've only been put in psych care. I think it was necessary for his own good and mental well being. Maybe if he had we would be looking at a very different BR today. One that is much more controlled and well rounded socially.
The fact that they didn't do the right thing from the beginning concerns me most. Hell if they had called 911 immediately if BR did in fact accidentally harm her, she might very well be alive today and we might not have to wonder.
There is a need to prevent this from repeating. Let parents know they have to answer to cops and society. That this behavior is not allowed. Until JBR receives justice, and it might only be in the public arena that she receives this, should any of us sit back and stay silent.
I do think the system owes JBR some type of answers and some kind of outcry.
No child should have to suffer as she did, needlessly.
I think when we stop asking questions and let things go quietly into the abyss as this case has for too long, we are only harming our own future generations.
Look at Casey Anthony. She should have never walked.

 

[violet67]

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if DP Part 3 is Ramsey-friendly and supports the IDI theory. I have a nagging feeling the Burke-butchering saga we've seen so far has been carefully crafted via editing to garner exactly the reaction it's getting. (If I read one more "he's so creepy" I might vomit). I think DP will end up as supporting the Ramsey POV.

All I want to see is the raw video of the interviews, both BR (then and now) and JR.

I think you are so right!!..These interviews were done (imo) with an agenda. I don't believe for one moment they were intended to incriminate the Ramseys. No way would Lin Woods have allowed it. Be interesting to see what direction the CBS documentaries will take.

 

[Madeleine74]

I feel like everything that happened comes into crystal clear focus if BR killed JBR that night. It just makes sense. He is and was special needs, he was jealous of his sister, he had exhibited violence toward her before. J and P covering it up, while wrong, does make sense when looking through the panicked, exhausted eyes of two parents who have already lost one child. They made a poor judgement call - but the situation was dire.
However - the one piece that does NOT fit this scenario is the garrotte. It just doesn't and never will for me. No parent, with the intelligence and resources of the R's are going to fashion a sadistic torture tool and administer it to their dead daughter's body. I just don't buy that.
It would have made more sense to tamper with a shelf and make it look like something fell on her if they wanted to make it look accidental.
The garrotte does not fit BDI, JDI, or PDI. Only IDI.

Thoughts?

My thoughts are yes, a desperate parent who doesn't know what else to do, who can't confide in anyone, and who is trying to save the rest of their family from the actions of one, would do whatever they needed to do. If a child is dead, you can't 'hurt' them beyond their being dead. Doesn't matter how wealthy the R's were--they could not disclose the truth of that night to anyone. You can come up with a hundred other better ideas of what the family could have or should have done, but that's with hindsight and 20/20 vision and not being in that situation at that time and being them. The reality is, this is what was done and it was done within the family.

Anytime it comes down to a belief "no parent could do that to their child..." that's the moment you know feelings are getting in the way. One has to put their own feelings completely aside. None of us knew the Ramsey family--we have no idea what they would or would not do, so to say they (nor any other parent) would not do something, is simply not valid.

 

[Madeleine74]

I think you are so right!!..These interviews were done (imo) with an agenda. I don't believe for one moment they were intended to incriminate the Ramseys. No way would Lin Woods have allowed it. Be interesting to see what direction the CBS documentaries will take.

Burke Ramsey is legally an adult, who has a full time well-paying job. Wood could strongly advise him to do or not do something, but in the end it's up to Burke. Lin Woods can't physically stop Burke from doing anything, including any interview he decided to do. Burke may be 'socially awkward,' but he's not an incompetent, drooling, mentally-challenged human.

 

[Niner]

Just in case this wasn't mentioned yet... still reading here.... nline:

I have to miss part 3 and I'm not pleased about it!

You didn't miss Part 3 - it's on next Monday, Sept. 19th.

 

[Toltec]

Haven't been here in years but I watched snippets of Burke's interview with dr. Phil. He said something that caught me off guard. He talks about Patsy opening the door to his bedroom saying "Oh my gosh, oh my gosh!" Then he says she entered his room looking for Jonbenet saying "Where's my baby, where's my baby!". Patsy testified that she did not enter Burke's room, she only peeked inside. Any thoughts on this?

 

[questfortrue]

I have watched Part 1 of the IDI twice and the BR interviews with Dr. Phil. I now have a few points and/or questions that I know you all can help me with. I have also looked these up and either found no info or conflicting.

1) Did anyone notice that JR was coaching his wife during the interview a week after the murder? I think it was with CNN (not sure). She was saying that you need to keep your babies safe . She paused during this due to emotional distress and JR filled in the words for her under his breath and his mouth moved with hers as she uttered the remainder of the sentence.

2) During IDI, Judith Phillips stated that Patsy was a really good mom to JR. No mention of BR. It may have been edited out...idk

3) No fingerprints on the RN except for the examiner. How the heck did either of them read the note without touching it? Even to turn to the next page?

4) It was said that JR was so anxious that Detective A. told him to search the house. I thought he was under control and very cordial

5) Has Fleet and Priscilla White's police statements ever been released? I have heard and read many items in which there are conflicting stories about the argument between them and the Ramsey's

6) The garrote - They had a boat and I am sure that JR taught BR to tie different knots on the boat, or even at home. The garrote may have been a practice one - Boy Scouts using certain knots or learning them to help out with the boat

7) Did the Ramsey's ever admit that the pen and paper for the RN came from their home? I have seen conflicting stories

8) On the IDI, handwriting expert said that as the note progressed, the writing became more fluid, I guess in regards to the letter formation. To me, it seems as if it becomes more frenetic, in that the writing sloped below the lines, etc.

9) Conflicting stories of sexual abuse of JBR. Some say chronic abuse and some say none. I am confused on that one.

Thanks all!

~RBBM~

#9 - A summary from some of the posters who've done the 'heavy lifting' on this topic: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-amp-Discussion-ONLY!&p=11733227#post11733227

 

[questfortrue]

Haven't been here in years but I watched snippets of Burke's interview with dr. Phil. He said something that caught me off guard. He talks about Patsy opening the door to his bedroom saying "Oh my gosh, oh my gosh!" Then he says she entered his room looking for Jonbenet saying "Where's my baby, where's my baby!". Patsy testified that she did not enter Burke's room, she only peeked inside. Any thoughts on this?

If she did indeed say this, and one agrees she wrote the note, it was a nice performance.

 

[TeaTime]

Cina Wong said that as far as a lengthy handwriting sample goes, one can only disguise handwriting for so long and then the natural handwriting will emerge. The RN was long enough that the natural handwriting was plentiful, despite there being an effort to disguise it in the beginning of the note, and she found 200 similarities between PR's known writing samples and those of the RN. TWO HUNDRED. Seriously, must this be discussed further? PR wrote that RN.

BR went downstairs after everyone was supposed to be asleep. Sneaky. I didn't hear that he went to the basement but even if he were still on the first floor, he was where the pineapple and iced tea glass were and he 'maybe' (his words not mine) had some pineapple that night. "Can you remember what you ate 20 years ago?" was a very coached and smarty pants response. Are we to believe that NO ONE asked him about the pineapple ever?? It was HIS baseball bat, despite PR saying it wasn't. He was awake before the 911 call and at all times thereafter until he was ushered from the house, despite all the claims that he was asleep. So many lies and secrets about BR. Ask why.

PR and JR continued to state emphatically that BR was asleep and heard, saw, knew nothing of what happened that night. You know what is missing? Them saying "I woke BR and asked him if he knew where JBR was or had he seen or heard anything and he said no." If they never asked him, how would they know? They knew because that was the story that was important to keep straight. "BR was asleep folks, he knows nothing, he is just a 60 pound weakling who could not possibly do anything wrong so go on now, nothing to see here". Ask why it was so important to distance BR from the crime without ever asking him a thing about that night?

I didn't hear the part about using a flashlight to take BR to bed or that BR used it to go downstairs and I haven't had a lot of time with 9 almost 10 year old boys but it seems weird to me that he would wander around the house alone at night with a flashlight. Most kids are scared of the boogy man or monsters in a dark house. That he wasn't tells me he was a odd duck even at 9/10.

BR's voice on the tape. BR downstairs at night. BR's BB bat. "I am not the confrontation type", "I am not the worried type" were some of his reasons for not going to find out what was happening in the house. In fact, he wasn't scared until all the people started to arrive and search the house.

I am not a psychiatrist or a psychologist but I know one man who acts like BR with all the smiling and eye darting charm. The man is a psychopath who has tried to choke 3 of his exes, at least that is what they say. Registered nurse, lots of GF's, explosive, violent incidents of rage and then the smiling, eye darting charm. Scary as hell. So scary 2 of the women have restraining orders against him. Every new GF believes the exes are the crazy ones until they end up fleeing the house in the middle of the night with nothing but the clothes on their backs. Then a new one gets charmed and the cycle begins again.

BR reminds me of him so much, the hairs on the back of my neck stood up.

 

[Madeleine74]

Patsy lied about things regarding the killing of JBR, so it stands to reason she may not have been providing accurate information about this one aspect of that morning, in addition to all the other inaccurate nuggets she tossed out to police. So you have to take what PR said with a huge grain of salt and also consider that BR's memories are those from 20 yrs ago.

 

[Dixie811]

Just in case this wasn't mentioned yet... still reading here.... nline:




You didn't miss Part 3 - it's on next Monday, Sept. 19th.

I know.. I meant I have to miss it on the 19th

ETA I live in the Stone Age and don't have DVR

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[just the facts pls]

Cina Wong said that as far as a lengthy handwriting sample goes, one can only disguise handwriting for so long and then the natural handwriting will emerge. The RN was long enough that the natural handwriting was plentiful, despite there being an effort to disguise it in the beginning of the note, and she found 200 similarities between PR's known writing samples and those of the RN. TWO HUNDRED. Seriously, must this be discussed further? PR wrote that RN.

BR went downstairs after everyone was supposed to be asleep. Sneaky. I didn't hear that he went to the basement but even if he were still on the first floor, he was where the pineapple and iced tea glass were and he 'maybe' (his words not mine) had some pineapple that night. "Can you remember what you ate 20 years ago?" was a very coached and smarty pants response. Are we to believe that NO ONE asked him about the pineapple ever?? It was HIS baseball bat, despite PR saying it wasn't. He was awake before the 911 call and at all times thereafter until he was ushered from the house, despite all the claims that he was asleep. So many lies and secrets about BR. Ask why.

PR and JR continued to state emphatically that BR was asleep and heard, saw, knew nothing of what happened that night. You know what is missing? Them saying "I woke BR and asked him if he knew where JBR was or had he seen or heard anything and he said no." If they never asked him, how would they know? They knew because that was the story that was important to keep straight. "BR was asleep folks, he knows nothing, he is just a 60 pound weakling who could not possibly do anything wrong so go on now, nothing to see here". Ask why it was so important to distance BR from the crime without ever asking him a thing about that night?

I didn't hear the part about using a flashlight to take BR to bed or that BR used it to go downstairs and I haven't had a lot of time with 9 almost 10 year old boys but it seems weird to me that he would wander around the house alone at night with a flashlight. Most kids are scared of the boogy man or monsters in a dark house. That he wasn't tells me he was a odd duck even at 9/10.

BR's voice on the tape. BR downstairs at night. BR's BB bat. "I am not the confrontation type", "I am not the worried type" were some of his reasons for not going to find out what was happening in the house. In fact, he wasn't scared until all the people started to arrive and search the house.

I am not a psychiatrist or a psychologist but I know one man who acts like BR with all the smiling and eye darting charm. The man is a psychopath who has tried to choke 3 of his exes, at least that is what they say. Registered nurse, lots of GF's, explosive, violent incidents of rage and then the smiling, eye darting charm. Scary as hell. So scary 2 of the women have restraining orders against him. Every new GF believes the exes are the crazy ones until they end up fleeing the house in the middle of the night with nothing but the clothes on their backs. Then a new one gets charmed and the cycle begins again.

BR reminds me of him so much, the hairs on the back of my neck stood up.

BBM - IMO yes because studies indicate that handwriting can be inherited and the handwriting of parents and children can be similar:

http://www.ijcer.org/index.php/ojs/article/viewFile/685/299

Mother-Son samples showed 86.69% similarity.

 

[PositiveLight]

I have watched Part 1 of the IDI twice and the BR interviews with Dr. Phil. I now have a few points and/or questions that I know you all can help me with. I have also looked these up and either found no info or conflicting.

1) Did anyone notice that JR was coaching his wife during the interview a week after the murder? I think it was with CNN (not sure). She was saying that you need to keep your babies safe . She paused during this due to emotional distress and JR filled in the words for her under his breath and his mouth moved with hers as she uttered the remainder of the sentence.

2) During IDI, Judith Phillips stated that Patsy was a really good mom to JR. No mention of BR. It may have been edited out...idk

3) No fingerprints on the RN except for the examiner. How the heck did either of them read the note without touching it? Even to turn to the next page?

4) It was said that JR was so anxious that Detective A. told him to search the house. I thought he was under control and very cordial

5) Has Fleet and Priscilla White's police statements ever been released? I have heard and read many items in which there are conflicting stories about the argument between them and the Ramsey's

6) The garrote - They had a boat and I am sure that JR taught BR to tie different knots on the boat, or even at home. The garrote may have been a practice one - Boy Scouts using certain knots or learning them to help out with the boat

7) Did the Ramsey's ever admit that the pen and paper for the RN came from their home? I have seen conflicting stories

8) On the IDI, handwriting expert said that as the note progressed, the writing became more fluid, I guess in regards to the letter formation. To me, it seems as if it becomes more frenetic, in that the writing sloped below the lines, etc.

9) Conflicting stories of sexual abuse of JBR. Some say chronic abuse and some say none. I am confused on that one.

Thanks all!

1.) I totally noticed this too! Any good lip readers out there?
Also wanted to add that this can be called imitative behavior ( just learned something new about myself here by researching this! ) and can also signal a hearing issue.
Both me and my daughter mouth words as we watch people speak. As they are speaking. It's like we know what they are saying as they speak. It's weird. But when we watch someone speak we watch their lips and mouth the same words the speaker is saying. We get on each others nerves when we do it too lol. Other times we just laugh about it.
I would be curious to know if he is actually mouthing the same words she is about to speak. Could show premeditation and coaching too.
2.) I also noticed this. Even when DP asks BR what he witnessed of his parents at the funeral, he stated that he could tell his dad loved her very much. No mention of the mother. Weird.
3.) Amen! Also I would expect if an intruder broke in, he may wear gloves?
4.) Some have theorized if JR found her body on the first search, he got anxious and started covering up after the fact. That this is when he became agitated. I also read somewhere (no links) that he started drinking after that first search. Can anyone confirm this?
5.) Not sure about the answer here. I understand that FW was more than cooperative and they were ruled out early on. That FW was trying to get them to talk to police. Maybe this is reason for falling out.
6.) I agree I said something similar myself.
knot info-
https://meritbadge.org/wiki/images/5/5d/Six-Boy-Scout-Knots.pdf
http://www.animatedknots.com/indexboating.php#ScrollPoint
7.) Supposedly, JR handed the book to the cops himself. The pen was found near pad. (no links)
8.) Yeah I was curious too. Depending who you ask. If you watch the Ramsey interviews, they said they were pretty much ruled out. JR was ruled out but PR never was. They can't prove either way. Some say she could only fake another handwriting for so long and then the writer goes back to old habits. If she has kept it short, there might not be any discussions.
9.) I've only read here and there that playing doctor was noted between JBR and BR.

 

[Bitz]

I agree that PR wrote the note. I also think it was to cover BR. I wondered about the garrote and the note because ........1) to me the note did become more fluid in the letter formation but it seemed to me as it was written, PR or whomever the author may have been, was becoming more upset as it was written. How hard it had to have been to write that note. In addition, the garrote fascinates me as to when it was made. I know this is horrible to say, but I even have considered that BR may have used it to drag JBR around after the blow to the head. How long he waited for that, idk. Just a thought