IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #54

[EmmaRose]

I was wondering if there was some gentler way of expressing victims bodies being taken and left somewhere rather than the term, "dumped." It always bothers me to read "his/her body was dumped..." Just seems like a poor word choice. Anyone have any ideas of another way folks could express that?

Good Morning, Scout, and all those following this thread. I understand what you are saying, especially since family members often follow along here.
Maybe some other terms such as placed the body, left the body, abandoned the body. I also considered disposed the body, but that sounds harsh as well. I would like to hear other suggestions. 😍

 

[heli]

I have heard no mention made of Abby's phone. A question mark...????

I thought Libby's grandfather said 'their phones' in one of his videos. Maybe I'm wrong. I will go back & listen...

 

[Scout12]

Thank you. Good suggestions there...

Good Morning, Scout, and all those following this thread. I understand what you are saying, especially since family members often follow along here.
Maybe some other terms such as placed the body, left the body, abandoned the body. I also considered disposed the body, but that sounds harsh as well. I would like to hear other suggestions. 

 

[EmmaRose]

I thought Libby's grandfather said 'their phones' in one of his videos. Maybe I'm wrong. I will go back & listen...

Heli, I'm pretty sure I remember that, too, though I have no idea where I read that.

It is possible though, that Grandpa was assuming both girls had phones that afternoon. I don't remember an official statement regarding Abby's phone. Just Libby's.

 

[Lilowlet]

JMO:

I don't think RL's property was involved, and wonder if the perp parked at the cemetery. Back of the cemetery is closer to the CS (at least I think it is).

Isn't RL's property, at least the "backyard" part (his description), blocked by a gate?

Just popped in and am catching up. Imo always but I also am starting to agree with the theory of parking at cemetery, if of course BG used a car, I recently watched a vid where the guy took his car out there and walked backward from it, his vehicle was dark in color, and it didn't take too far for you to not be able to see it from a ways back. I'm sure others know or have talked about this before, but it helped me realize imo that it's be possible not to be seen with car depending on I guess where he parked and possibly car color? I'm guessing It were bright red it may make a difference. But who knows imo always.

 

[Etilema]

Random thought - sorry. I was just wondering if there was some gentler way of expressing victims bodies being taken and left somewhere rather than the term, "dumped." It always bothers me to read "his/her body was dumped..." Just seems like a poor word choice. Anyone have any ideas of another way that could be expressed?

I think it's because that is how the victim's bodies would have been treated by someone who took their lives in the first place.

But how about "abandoned"? As in, "The killer abandoned the bodies at such and such location."

 

[Madhom]

Thread #38 Post #67

finine

Registered User


My husband volunteered several years ago with a local SAR team with our German Shepherd. SAR dogs are trained to search on a specific scent and this would follow a trail to that person (if it exists), or to the end of the scent trail. Typically what happens is that an item from the missing person is placed into a ziploc bag and then the ziploc bag is opened and the dog sniffs it. If there is a scent trail from that person, the dog should be able to find and follow it. SAR dogs are not trained to identify the scent of decomposing flesh, that is what cadaver dogs do.

I'm not sure that's exactly accurate. Dogs do different types of searching. A trailing dog, I believe, is trained to hone in on one, and only one, human scent, and follow where it goes. To find That particular person. But there are also Air scent dogs, trained to find ANY human in a particular search area. Think of an urban disaster area, such as the Twin Towers, or where an earthquake has struck. You couldn't give the dog clothing of every/any person who might be trapped in rubble. They find any human trapped there, they just sniff for a human scent. The problem though is they don't differentiate between the missing person and searchers or LE that may be in that area, so that can limit effectiveness. I *think* Air Scent dogs can find bodies as long as they have not begun to decompose. There are also Tracking Dogs, but I can never keep it straight in my head how they differ from Trailing Dogs.

 

[Lilowlet]

Random thought - sorry. I was just wondering if there was some gentler way of expressing victims bodies being taken and left somewhere rather than the term, "dumped." It always bothers me to read "his/her body was dumped..." Just seems like a poor word choice. Anyone have any ideas of another way that could be expressed?

Placed* would seem appropriate or where they were left* imo always and just trying to help.

 

[Idareyato]

Just popped in and am catching up. Imo always but I also am starting to agree with the theory of parking at cemetery, if of course BG used a car, I recently watched a vid where the guy took his car out there and walked backward from it, his vehicle was dark in color, and it didn't take too far for you to not be able to see it from a ways back. I'm sure others know or have talked about this before, but it helped me realize imo that it's be possible not to be seen with car depending on I guess where he parked and possibly car color? I'm guessing It were bright red it may make a difference. But who knows imo always.

Good morning Lilowlet. Your thoughts are agreeable with mine. Maybe his motto (BG's) was also 'Today is the day' and he preplanned an exit and the girls walked into his trap. Scary but probable, and he surely did not leave the scene whistling nonchalantly---I can't imagine his feeling. Impossible for me to consider, but surely he used his utmost prowling abilities to escape unseen, don't you think?

 

[EmmaRose]

Just popped in and am catching up. Imo always but I also am starting to agree with the theory of parking at cemetery, if of course BG used a car, I recently watched a vid where the guy took his car out there and walked backward from it, his vehicle was dark in color, and it didn't take too far for you to not be able to see it from a ways back. I'm sure others know or have talked about this before, but it helped me realize imo that it's be possible not to be seen with car depending on I guess where he parked and possibly car color? I'm guessing It were bright red it may make a difference. But who knows imo always.

hi Lilolet,

Here is a link to Morning Heights Cemetary, also known as Milroy Cemetary. It is forested behind it, but I can't tell if there's any "roads" to get that far back. If it's possible to drive there, it looks like a car would blend in (not red as you pointed out, lol).

In this link is a list of names of those interred there. Thought I'd include as a reference.

https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gsr&GScid=1983408

 

[MAVLEY]

http://www.ussartf.org/dogs_search_rescue.htm

Here is a quick guide that may help with the different types of dogs used.

 

[Lilowlet]

Good Morning, Scout, and all those following this thread. I understand what you are saying, especially since family members often follow along here.
Maybe some other terms such as placed the body, left the body, abandoned the body. I also considered disposed the body, but that sounds harsh as well. I would like to hear other suggestions. 😍

Jinx, sorry I reiterated some of this, just caught up to the post. 🤔 looked up synonyms and most seem kinda harsh, I agree with these ones and others responses to this.Imo always

 

[Shiressleuth]

Random thought - sorry. I was just wondering if there was some gentler way of expressing victims bodies being taken and left somewhere rather than the term, "dumped." It always bothers me to read "his/her body was dumped..." Just seems like a poor word choice. Anyone have any ideas of another way that could be expressed?

Body was left- found- discovered-recovered -abandoned-hidden-placed
Am sure there are many more and I agree are better than the example you cite IMO.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Was it back by 03/10? I thought it was still not back yet even, right?

i don't think LE would tell us if something was back or not back. we are likely to hear nothing until the time of an arrest. the SW was on the 17th. his probation violation arrest was on the 10th.

 

[coastal]

Good Morning, Scout, and all those following this thread. I understand what you are saying, especially since family members often follow along here.
Maybe some other terms such as placed the body, left the body, abandoned the body. I also considered disposed the body, but that sounds harsh as well. I would like to hear other suggestions. ��

From Meriam-Webster's online Thesarus:

dump: to get rid of as useless or unwanted (dump the trash on the curb and go back inside)

Synonyms:
cashier, cast (off), chuck, deep-six, ditch, discard, eighty-six (or 86), exorcise (also exorcize), fling (off or away), jettison, junk, lay by, lose, pitch, reject, scrap, shed, shuck (off), slough (off) also sluff (off), throw away, throw out, toss, unload

Related Words:
abandon, abdicate, desert, forsake; dismiss, kick out; abolish, annihilate, eliminate, eradicate, expunge, exterminate, extinguish, extirpate, liquidate, remove, root (out), stamp (out), wipe out

https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/dump

Not many words accurately describe such an act. I like "left" or "abandoned" better than "dumped", but "dumped" really does imply the right...feeling? to me. MOO

 

[Burnt Toast]

It was suggested earlier that some families use the date that the body was discovered.

the sealed autopsy shows that both were "killed" on the 13th

 

[midwestseeker]

BBM I have always wondered that myself. It seems to me that two girls really into photography who, according to Mike Patty, went to the trail that day to "take pictures" would have a camera or at least a tablet (my daughters have tablets that take stunning pictures) with them to do just that.

I have often also wondered if a camera / tablet is one of the missing pieces of the puzzle (evidence) that LE has been looking for.

^^^^
This!

Was there not some talk by LE early on about a backpack or duffel to search for? Sorry, I have no link. I have often wondered if this might hold cameras. If so, a heads up to pawn shop owners would be in order. MOO

 

[Lilowlet]

hi Lilolet,

Here is a link to Morning Heights Cemetary, also known as Milroy Cemetary. It is forested behind it, but I can't tell if there's any "roads" to get that far back. If it's possible to drive there, it looks like a car would blend in (not red as you pointed out, lol).

In this link is a list of names of those interred there. Thought I'd include as a reference.

https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gsr&GScid=1983408

Thank you EmmaRose! Here's the link to the vid I watched. I'll say the vids imo It's not much other than someone parking and walking til you don't see the car.
https://youtu.be/h31qtZICEjE

 

[Shiressleuth]

YW. As you mentioned, I think it's very possible there are more pics/videos from earlier that day. I downloaded Snapchat to play around with it, and as others have mentioned, you can create a Snapchat Story, add pics/videos to your story, share if you choose, and the story is viewable for 24 hours (unlike a snap which is a pic/video only viewable for 1-10 seconds). You can also set an option to save pics/videos to Memories on Snapchat and/or to your Camera Roll. If you save to Camera Roll you can look at pic from there and see the timestamp. You can also add a timestamp to a Snapchat pic using filters. Lots of options and settings.

Regarding Abby's cell, I guess we don't know for sure, but several references were made to the girls' phones (not just Libby's).

I see that transcript is from Feb 16, however, in a news report from Monday night, Feb 13, the reporter mentions the time stamp of 2:07. So it appears they had the time stamp the first night.

Monday, Feb 13 - WLFI Report - transcribed some excerpts starting at about :35 (Ref)

• Mike Patty: …Upset, confused, obviously very distraught. Just worried, all I want to do is have the girls get home safe.
• Anna Williams: Getting scared now.
• Reporter: Abigail’s mom, Anna Williams, has spent hours worrying, just hoping to hear her little girl is ok.
• Anna Williams: It’s getting cold, been out a long time, and don’t know what time they ate last.
• Reporter: The girls haven’t answered their phones since around the time they went missing.
• Mike Patty: Missing, abducted, we don’t know for sure. Cellphone has been pinging around town here, there’s a cell phone tower, but the ping was last noted about 5 or 6 hours ago, they say the phone’s now dead.
• Reporter: The last snapchat from one of the girls was from 2:07.
• Mike Patty: I saw a text where they got delivered but they never got read.
• Anna Williams: Very scary situation right now, and I just, I just want her home.
• Reporter: Now many are on an extensive search to find them...

Cell phone references:

• Sheriff Tobe Leazenby said crews began canvassing the area and tried pinging the girls' cell phones into the evening hours but had no success in finding them. The sheriff said they believed the girls' phones were either dead or turned off. (Ref)
• Reporter: The girls haven’t answered their phones since around the time they went missing. (Ref)

Just quoting cloudajo post which references both girl's phones a couple of times for those speculating whether A had a phone or not. This seems to prove she did indeed have a phone.

 

[Lilowlet]

Good morning Lilowlet. Your thoughts are agreeable with mine. Maybe his motto (BG's) was also 'Today is the day' and he preplanned an exit and the girls walked into his trap. Scary but probable, and he surely did not leave the scene whistling nonchalantly---I can't imagine his feeling. Impossible for me to consider, but surely he used his utmost prowling abilities to escape unseen, don't you think?

Good morning to you too Idareyato! Ooo yes that is a creepy thought, but I agree with you he probably did think those words to himself ironically. Imo always And yes I do think, he seems to have some sort of ninja stealth skills to the point it blows my mind, that as far as we hear, no one saw him.Imo always