Mexico Mexico - Jenny Chen, 26, Oaxaca, 11 April 2016 #3

[KaaBoom]

BBM

I'm not sure they're equally possible either, but here is my take on your reasons.

1. I wondered in my previous post if there would be repercussions if family and friends pursued the matter after the embassy had handled things. So their silence could mean she has returned to the China she scorned. But given her criticism of China, silence could also mean they need to be silent for their own protection.

2. A mental health crisis doesn't always result in hospitalization even in the U.S. Bodies can take time to be discovered if there is suicide or other cause of death during an episode (from exposure, snake bite, fall, etc). I know of several cases that took months, and I know of one that was never are found despite the vehicle being found and indications that there was suicide. So this scenario doesn't necessarily require records or a death certificate to be possible.

3. Same as #2. Victims of foul play are sometimes not found for years or ever (see Stephanie Warner's case in my signature). I'm not sure why Jenny's parents were told she had been seen alive if she wasn't, unless it was a case of mistaken identity and her body hadn't been found, so they assumed it was Jenny. Or it was a flat-out lie to pacify them and not upset trade relations between China and Mexico (my theory).

4. I'll add the possibility of a tragic accident/incident to round out the possibilities. Getting lost, falling, snake bite, fatal illness (she had visited a hospital earlier), dehydration etc. Again, bodies can take years to find, if ever.

Given what JR has posted, if accurate, and keeping it simple, I think foul play is 90-95% likely. I divide her taking off (to China or elsewhere), being sex trafficked, having an accident and committing suicide into the remaining percentage, not necessarily evenly.

Needless to say, my hope is that she took off and is still alive and well.

2, 3, or 4, her body has got to be some place. Mexico does investigate deaths. As for #1 Her criticism of China, would have nothing to do with her friends suddenly deciding to be silent. All these people just suddenly were intimidated into silence? By who?

 

[Lilibet]

2, 3, or 4, her body has got to be some place. Mexico does investigate deaths. As for #1 Her criticism of China, would have nothing to do with her friends suddenly deciding to be silent. All these people just suddenly were intimidated into silence? By who?

Of course her body would be someplace if she's dead, but as I said, perhaps it hasn't been found yet. Plenty aren't, no matter how effective an investigation is done. The person is just as dead if the body is or isn't found.

I didn't mean that Jenny's criticism of China would cause silence. But her criticism may have caused the Chinese government to do just a pacifying investigation and back off after the embassy looked into it and accepted the LE belief she had been seen. It's possible that her family and friends pushing the issue might be strongly discouraged. They could also be embarrassed by her criticism. I'm not saying it's likely, but free speech is not always welcomed by the Chinese government and that could be intimidating to her family and friends. Just a thought, not written in stone. She may well be in China, but for me, silence isn't necessarily strong evidence that she is, although you certainly could be right. We're just throwing theories and opinions around and mine change frequently.

 

[Sjm_qc]

A quick response on the Green card/visa issue (sorry I can't quote or link at the moment):

The marriage lisence was issued in August 2013, in King county (another poster linked on p. 49 of the thread), which is where/when they were married.

I extrapolate from that that she most likely arrived in the US on a K1 visa (fiancé), which leads to a conditional 2 yr Green card via the marriage. After the 2 years are up (or actually a little before), the GC holder applies for 'removal of conditions', & generally needs to show that s/he is still married (nb: there are a couple of exceptions e.g. Divorce waiver, domestic violence waiver, to name just 2). After that, a 10 yr GC is issued.

IIRC, from earlier research/info here I believe that Jenny-Qun Dan was at the 'removal of conditions' stage, & her conditional GC validity had been extended while in that process (such an extension is usually granted for a year, can be renewed).

It would be exceedingly unlikely (I think impossible) that she could be back in the US going through the process of, or having completed, removal of conditions without her husband's knowledge.

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

A quick response on the Green card/visa issue (sorry I can't quote or link at the moment):

The marriage lisence was issued in August 2013, in King county (another poster linked on p. 49 of the thread), which is where/when they were married.

I extrapolate from that that she most likely arrived in the US on a K1 visa (fiancé), which leads to a conditional 2 yr Green card via the marriage. After the 2 years are up (or actually a little before), the GC holder applies for 'removal of conditions', & generally needs to show that s/he is still married (nb: there are a couple of exceptions e.g. Divorce waiver, domestic violence waiver, to name just 2). After that, a 10 yr GC is issued.

IIRC, from earlier research/info here I believe that Jenny-Qun Dan was at the 'removal of conditions' stage, & her conditional GC validity had been extended while in that process (such an extension is usually granted for a year, can be renewed).

It would be exceedingly unlikely (I think impossible) that she could be back in the US going through the process of, or having completed, removal of conditions without her husband's knowledge.

Thank your for posting this. I agree completely. I was going to post basically the same thing, but my teenage daughter decided we had to make a McDonald's-run before they stopped serving full breakfast menu, so here I am .

Additional info, if anyone is interested:
"Reinhard said he and his wife have been together for eight years.
...
Reinhard said he gave out his phone number to several people that day and he got a call shortly after from Chen who said, 'Hi, I’m Jenny. Would you like to go out on a date with me?'
The rest, as they say, is history. The couple married in 2012. Chen moved to the United States in 2013." (BBM)
http://nwasianweekly.com/2016/06/hu...-of-seattle-was-last-seen-in-april-in-oaxaca/

"Document Detail
Date Received: 09/30/2013 1:35:40 PM
Document Type: APPLICATION - MARRIAGE LICENSE

Party Name
REINHARD, JONATHAN GREGOR

Party Name
CHEN, QUNDAN"
http://146.129.54.93:8193/docdetail...iage&pg=&id2=S8zMiCGa!O0Zjh!dZNDEzHDM0xC8yM

[As per links posted below, even if Jenny and JR applied for her green card while still in China, she wouldn't have gotten her green card until after physically arriving in the US (presumably sometime in 2013)]:

"How to Apply to Remove the Conditions
You and your spouse must apply together to remove the conditions on your residence by filing Form I-751. You should apply during the 90 days before your second anniversary as a conditional resident. The expiration date on your green card is also the date of your second anniversary as a conditional resident. If you do not apply to remove the conditions in time, you could lose your conditional resident status and be removed from the country." (BBM)
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/af...conditions-permanent-residence-based-marriage

"Average Processing Time for All USCIS Offices:
I-751 - Petition to Remove the Conditions on Residence: 230 days (FY16)"

So say Jenny got her conditional green card three months after she and JR married in Sep., 2013, after her arrival in the US on a fiancé visa. Say she completed the removal of conditions process by Sep. 1 (but she could have as early as July), 2015. Say her application was accepted without any issue and the process took 210 days/seven months. In that scenario, Jenny would have gotten her permanent green card right around April of 2016, but then again, as early as Feb., 2016.

The timing is somewhat interesting, IMO.

https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/gr...en-card-immediate-relative-us-citizen#outside
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/green-card-processes-and-procedures/consular-processing
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/gr...een-card-immediate-relative-us-citizen#inside
"Maintaining Permanent Residence"
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/after-green-card-granted/maintaining-permanent-residence

 

[webant]

Of course her body would be someplace if she's dead, but as I said, perhaps it hasn't been found yet. Plenty aren't, no matter how effective an investigation is done. The person is just as dead if the body is or isn't found.

I didn't mean that Jenny's criticism of China would cause silence. But her criticism may have caused the Chinese government to do just a pacifying investigation and back off after the embassy looked into it and accepted the LE belief she had been seen. It's possible that her family and friends pushing the issue might be strongly discouraged. They could also be embarrassed by her criticism. I'm not saying it's likely, but free speech is not always welcomed by the Chinese government and that could be intimidating to her family and friends. Just a thought, not written in stone. She may well be in China, but for me, silence isn't necessarily strong evidence that she is, although you certainly could be right. We're just throwing theories and opinions around and mine change frequently.

There is also that in places in the Orient, when bad things befall people it is often assumed that they deserved what happened to them…that something they had done, either in this life or a previous one, had caused the bad thing to happen to them. Because of this, there is more of a willingness to except and move on, by friends and family than there would be in the North American culture. This is not universal and there are exceptions, but there is a difference in this regard between our cultures.

 

[slowpoke]

Thank your for posting this. I agree completely. I was going to post basically the same thing, but my teenage daughter decided we had to make a McDonald's-run before they stopped serving full breakfast menu, so here I am .

Additional info, if anyone is interested:
"Reinhard said he and his wife have been together for eight years.
...
Reinhard said he gave out his phone number to several people that day and he got a call shortly after from Chen who said, 'Hi, I’m Jenny. Would you like to go out on a date with me?'
The rest, as they say, is history. The couple married in 2012. Chen moved to the United States in 2013." (BBM)
http://nwasianweekly.com/2016/06/hu...-of-seattle-was-last-seen-in-april-in-oaxaca/

"Document Detail
Date Received: 09/30/2013 1:35:40 PM
Document Type: APPLICATION - MARRIAGE LICENSE

Party Name
REINHARD, JONATHAN GREGOR

Party Name
CHEN, QUNDAN"
http://146.129.54.93:8193/docdetail...iage&pg=&id2=S8zMiCGa!O0Zjh!dZNDEzHDM0xC8yM

[As per links posted below, even if Jenny and JR applied for her green card while still in China, she wouldn't have gotten her green card until after physically arriving in the US (presumably sometime in 2013)]:

"How to Apply to Remove the Conditions
You and your spouse must apply together to remove the conditions on your residence by filing Form I-751. You should apply during the 90 days before your second anniversary as a conditional resident. The expiration date on your green card is also the date of your second anniversary as a conditional resident. If you do not apply to remove the conditions in time, you could lose your conditional resident status and be removed from the country." (BBM)
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/af...conditions-permanent-residence-based-marriage

"Average Processing Time for All USCIS Offices:
I-751 - Petition to Remove the Conditions on Residence: 230 days (FY16)"

So say Jenny got her conditional green card three months after she and JR married in Sep., 2013, after her arrival in the US on a fiancé visa. Say she completed the removal of conditions process by Sep. 1 (but she could have as early as July), 2015. Say her application was accepted without any issue and the process took 210 days/seven months. In that scenario, Jenny would have gotten her permanent green card right around April of 2016, but then again, as early as Feb., 2016.

The timing is somewhat interesting, IMO.

https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/gr...en-card-immediate-relative-us-citizen#outside
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/green-card-processes-and-procedures/consular-processing
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/gr...een-card-immediate-relative-us-citizen#inside
"Maintaining Permanent Residence"
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/after-green-card-granted/maintaining-permanent-residence

Thank you for your excellent information. I am ignorant when it comes to how green cards work, so I appreciate the info and links.

I've got something to add regarding Jenny's status. I posted this somewhere in our threads, but who knows where it is, so I will re-post here. Jenny had a post where she said: "Yesterday I received a letter from US Immigration Department. They basically tell me "welcome to continue stay in US,.Your visa is going to expire in 02/26/2016, no worries, we are here now to tell you your visa is extended for another year while we processing your 10 year green card".
http://weibo.com/p/1001603919220546113863?mod=zwenzhang

So, around the time of her trip or just before, her conditional visa expired but then was automatically extended until Feb 2017 while Immigration processed her 10-year green card. So, even though she went missing before the processing of her 10-year card was completed, does she likely now have the 10-year card as of today's date?

 

[GigTu]

I'll pop in with my two cents to say she probably had to sign something to finalize it, so I'm guessing no. But I don't really know. Good question!!

 

[KaaBoom]

A quick response on the Green card/visa issue (sorry I can't quote or link at the moment):

The marriage lisence was issued in August 2013, in King county (another poster linked on p. 49 of the thread), which is where/when they were married.

I extrapolate from that that she most likely arrived in the US on a K1 visa (fiancé), which leads to a conditional 2 yr Green card via the marriage. After the 2 years are up (or actually a little before), the GC holder applies for 'removal of conditions', & generally needs to show that s/he is still married (nb: there are a couple of exceptions e.g. Divorce waiver, domestic violence waiver, to name just 2). After that, a 10 yr GC is issued.

IIRC, from earlier research/info here I believe that Jenny-Qun Dan was at the 'removal of conditions' stage, & her conditional GC validity had been extended while in that process (such an extension is usually granted for a year, can be renewed).

It would be exceedingly unlikely (I think impossible) that she could be back in the US going through the process of, or having completed, removal of conditions without her husband's knowledge.

They were married in China in 2012, one year before she came to the US. Their wedding pictures were clearly taken in China.

A romance borne of KFC

Reinhard said he and his wife have been together for eight years. They met while he lived in China and he attended an event called “English Corner” by a lake, which was a gathering place for Chinese who want to practice their English.

He said he was surrounded by a group of Chinese and he heard a small voice asking if he liked Kentucky Fried Chicken.

Reinhard said he gave out his phone number to several people that day and he got a call shortly after from Chen who said, “Hi, I’m Jenny. Would you like to go out on a date with me?”

The rest, as they say, is history. The couple married in 2012. Chen moved to the United States in 2013.

Husband of missing woman optimistic — Jenny Chen of Seattle was last seen in April in Oaxaca

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

Thank you for your excellent information. I am ignorant when it comes to how green cards work, so I appreciate the info and links.

I've got something to add regarding Jenny's status. I posted this somewhere in our threads, but who knows where it is, so I will re-post here. Jenny had a post where she said: "Yesterday I received a letter from US Immigration Department. They basically tell me "welcome to continue stay in US,.Your visa is going to expire in 02/26/2016, no worries, we are here now to tell you your visa is extended for another year while we processing your 10 year green card".
http://weibo.com/p/1001603919220546113863?mod=zwenzhang

So, around the time of her trip or just before, her conditional visa expired but then was automatically extended until Feb 2017 while Immigration processed her 10-year green card. So, even though she went missing before the processing of her 10-year card was completed, does she likely now have the 10-year card as of today's date?

RBBM.

Great find! Thank you.

Since her post says her visa -conditional green card, I assume- was going to expire on 02/26/2016, she must have gotten it around 02/26/2014 ("A conditional permanent resident receives a green card valid for 2 years."), or about five months after their U.S. marriage certificate was filed.
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/after-green-card-granted/conditional-permanent-residence

Based on that, the earliest Jenny could apply for removal of conditions would have been 11/26/2015 ("You should apply during the 90 days before your second anniversary as a conditional resident").
https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/af...conditions-permanent-residence-based-marriage

I also found your initial post on this topic on page 56 of this thread, and it says she posted the above on 12/12/15 ("... but I found some info that may help answer your question about her green card status. According to Jenny's writings on 12/12/15 ..."):
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...axaca-11-April-2016-2&p=12771834#post12771834

So it sounds like Jenny submitted her I-751, or "Petition to Remove Conditions on Residence" as soon as she was allowed, and it had been accepted by 12/11/15.

Even then, she still would have had to go in for her biometric services appointment, they might have requested additional information, or asked her to come in for an interview, all before a decision could be made.
https://www.uscis.gov/i-751

According to the article linked below:
"Jenny Chen left Seattle on March 1 for a backpacking trip and planned to spend three to four months exploring Mexico, Cuba, and New York
....
On March 1, she ventured down to Mexico." (BBM)
http://komonews.com/news/local/seat...oes-missing-during-backpacking-trip-to-mexico

And again, in FY2016, the average processing time for I-751 petitions was 230 days:
https://egov.uscis.gov/cris/ptAllFormsAverage.do

So, I think it is safe to say Jenny did not get her 10-year green card prior to leaving for Mexico. It is possible that she had already had her biometric processing done -which would have included taking her photo, signature, and index fingerprint, to be used in generating the new card-, they didn't have any problem with the rest of her application, and it was approved, but personally, I think it is extremely unlikely that the actual card would have been mailed before March 1 (the process has been in limbo since she went missing, or her card arrived in Seattle a few months after she left, IMO).
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/free-books/fiance-marriage-visa-book/chapter16-19.html

 

[DexterMorgan]

Do we have 100% proof that she didn't receive her 10 year card extension?

Because I think Jenny would have taken care of that before a 3 month excursion to 3 countries which 1 was the ny trip she was looking forward too.

Maybe JR held out from signing his portion and she left. Idk.

But I am surprised that he wouldn't mention her waiting on her 10 year extension as proof that she wouldn't have ran away and something must have happened. Jmo.

Because that's like your spouse wouldn't have ran away because they were expecting a 100k lottery payment so something must be wrong.

So again if Jenny was looking forward to her 10 year extension card than why not we have heard this from JR nor Jenny's social media posts?

 

[Hazelnutty]

Husband seems....wonky? Something doesn't feel right here.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk

 

[DexterMorgan]

So the hostess supposedly said that they offered to have a person to drive Jenny the 12- 15 hrs or so to Cancun.

But Jenny supposedly thought the ride was taking to long and didn't want to wait.

But this same hostess still walked Jenny to the crossing while sticken around after Jenny was denied by the ATm.

So did Jenny try to run off on the hostess before giving them money and they lied to jr while knowing that they accidentally did something?

 

[DexterMorgan]

]Btw. Jenny has stayed with plenty of people out there and was hitchhiking.

So why would she turn down a ride to her destination if she was about to hitchhike anyway.

Now if the hostess said that she declined because she didn't want to pay the money for the ride. Ok.

But the hostess didn't say that supposedly.

They supposedly in my eyes said that Jenny was leary of the situation and didn't want to wait


Hmmmmm

And guess what.

Jr said that sounds like his Jenny.

Wow.

Quick to believe that Jenny turned down a possible free ride even though the hostess never mentioned that they was going to possibly charge a price. Jmo


So my question is since jr knew that Jenny didn't like to spend money and wanted a free ride.

Did he atleast ask the hostess how much her friend was going to charge Jenny which may have resulted of why Jenny declined in the first place?

 

[DexterMorgan]

Also. Jr said he offered her money and begged her to catch a bus.

But jenny wasn't okay with that to make it to her destination on time?

Okay. Something is wrong.

Did Jenny run away at that point?

 

[Lilibet]

Husband seems....wonky? Something doesn't feel right here.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk

Welcome to the Twilight Zone! :abduction: :ufo:

I've seen you on other threads Hazelnutty, but I'm not sure if this is your first visit to this one. So welcome or welcome back. :alien3:

 

[GigTu]

Can anyone remind us how far the Corona driver went?

 

[Hazelnutty]

Welcome to the Twilight Zone! :abduction: :ufo:

I've seen you on other threads Hazelnutty, but I'm not sure if this is your first visit to this one. So welcome or welcome back. :alien3:

Thank you

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk

 

[Lilibet]

Can anyone remind us how far the Corona driver went?

Without consulting the incomplete GPS records, I would say it was maybe 200-300 miles, if that...in the opposite direction from Cancun. I believe at some point he went north back to "headquarters" in Veracruz. But don't hold me to this estimate.

 

[GigTu]

That's generally what I remember too. I couldn't find the posts with that info.

IF the Corona drivers were caravaning, would they both lie about where they were headed? This guy supposedly had his family with him. Would one driver cover up for the other? Why did we not get validation that they were caravaning, and not receive logs for both drivers?

Also, why would the store owner call someone from far away to come give Jenny a ride halfway across Mexico for free?

Both of those scenarios are suspicious. I wonder if Jenny gave the cement driver information of her plans during their small talk.

 

[rosesfromangels]

One would think he would give that info up vs. having to go through the stress of a poly?