Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #30

[MollyDDD]

Fingerprints are standard. Not palm prints.

Perhaps the Prosecution could pick up some partial prints from his drinking cup, food tray, books or magazines he might handle.

 

[Charlot123]

Would you videotape yourself saying mean things to your husband for the world to see?

When I take photis or videos, I edit them. I want them to look good and capture the fun moments or beauty.

If I take a picture of the interior of my house, I edit out something I may not realize was there such as some crumbs or a dead insect.

I think most people try to present the best.

Their videos are something else.

Someone said, she lacked self-awareness. Maybe she did not understand how it sounded?

She was not the most thoughtful person. When she told about him courting her when she was ill, she said "I took him to my colonoscopy". Of course we know that we always are asked to bring someone for minor procedures needing anesthesia, so, no biggie, he was not there during the procedure. But to me the whole phrase sounded weird, it has nothing to do with education or anything else to understand that you should not get into such details.

So all I'd say, she was not too wise, and it constantly spilled out on her SM. If they argued, she might have said something that vexed him.

Between these two, I can imagine how things got wrong, I can even imagine someone snapping. The children, however, are beyond snapping, because I don't buy his version.

 

[PommyMommy]

OHHHHHHHHH....the State is trying to take away the defense's future ability to question whether these are really their defendants prints or not?

That is what it sounds like to me. @gitana1 ?

 

[ray9898]

How is it unconstitutional for the defendant in a murder by strangulation trial, to be asked for his palm prints?

It is a unconstitutional search and seizure if it is not based on probable cause.

The defenses entire rebuttal was based on the premise that the prosecution did not provide circumstances that amounted to probable cause because their statement of "numerous items of evidence have been collected and are in the process of being sent to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for testing" is vague.

The implication is they want specific reasons why the evidence from their client is required.

 

[gitana1]

The humiliation factor to me bc it is displayed on a public forum in a taunting way. SW has a SM history of ridicule IMO on her posts. Whether it is towards CW or the girls. Example the water gun post,

No. She doesn't have a SM history of ridicule. It is your opinion that those videos evidence ridicule. Many of us disagree. I don't think she was ridiculing Bella in the water gun video. I think she was rough housing with her. And the kid enjoyed it for the most part.

I don't see her ridiculing anyone in any of the videos except possibly in the checkers videos, IF it wasn't usual for her and her husband to banter and tease each other in a competitive manner (which MANY spouses do), and/or her husband wasn't playing along with it and felt uncomfortable.

All of these cherry-picked videos to me are simply examples of differences in how people parent or how people's marriages work. Some people don't act the same way and/or they wouldn't publicly post videos containing such moments. Some people feel there are examples or rudeness or taking it too far. Some don't think any of it is a big deal.

None of it indicates she's mentally ill or abusive.

Perhaps some of it may be an indication of some tension between them. Or maybe CW did feel belittled and that caused a simmering anger.

But IMO that's about the only thing these videos may indicate.

 

[Layla123]

Obviously, no one 'needs' to post a picture to SM. But pix of your toddlers getting their first haircuts, first timeouts, first missing front teeth, are all 'traditional' pictures. IMO, it is like a rite of passage.

I have a cute picture of my son at 3, sitting calmly in the timeout chair. And then my daughter at 3, sitting with her arms crossed, and yelling at us, from the chair, saying she was glad she was sitting there because she liked it, lol...

I didn't take those pictures to 'taunt' my children. I took them because they are cute and I was proud of them.

It is like a rite of passage for a child to grow to the age where they are starting to be accountable and responsible for grabbing a toy from their sibling or running into the street when they knew it was not safe. There is nothing wrong with being told to sit down for 2 minutes and think about what just happened. And then to apologize and get a big hug.

It really bothers me that some here are trying to make it out to be cruel or unusual punishment for a mom to give a 3 yr old a timeout.

I have a video of my 3 year old grandson crying and screaming, “You’re a bad, bad, Grandma,” because I bought his much older cousin a complicated LEGO set for his birthday, but I didn’t buy one for him (it wasn’t his birthday). It is hysterical. I showed him when he grew older, and he laughed and laughed.

 

[gitana1]

It is a unconstitutional search and seizure if it is not based on probable cause.

The defenses entire rebuttal was based on the premise that the prosecution did not provide circumstances that amounted to probable cause because their statement of "numerous items of evidence have been collected and are in the process of being sent to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for testing" is vague.

The implication is they want specific reasons why the evidence from their client is required.

Yes. Probable cause is required. Three people were killed. This is a murder case. CW says they were strangled.

There's your probable cause.

They're doing their job but it's just gatekeeping. They know they're not going to win the motion.

Nothing more needs to be shown to establish probable cause.

 

[gitana1]

I have a video of my 3 year old grandson crying and screaming, “You’re a bad, bad, Grandma,” because I bought his much older cousin a complicated LEGO set for his birthday, but I didn’t buy one for him (it wasn’t his birthday). It is hysterical. I showed him when he grew older, and he laughed and laughed.

You psychopath!! Lol.

 

[MollyDDD]

I don't think we know, but it's an interesting thought. I also wonder whether the GPS (assuming there was one in his truck) will reveal whether he was speeding home or not. They should be able to calculate the distance covered using the two points and come up with travel time/speed, right? I am definitely not the most knowledgeable of GPS, lol.
MOO

If his truck is a company owned vehicle, it may have a built in GPS which may show where he was and what time he was there.

 

[Jennifer17]

No. She doesn't have a SM history of ridicule. It is your opinion that those videos evidence ridicule. Many of us disagree. I don't think she was ridiculing Bella in the water gun video. I think she was rough housing with her. And the kid enjoyed it for the most part.

I don't see her ridiculing anyone in any of the videos except possibly in the checkers videos, IF it wasn't usual for her and her husband to banter and tease each other in a competitive manner (which MANY spouses do), and/or her husband wasn't playing along with it and felt uncomfortable.

All of these cherry-picked videos to me are simply examples of differences in how people parent or how people's marriages work. Some people don't act the same way and/or they wouldn't publicly post videos containing such moments. Some people feel there are examples or rudeness or taking it too far. Some don't think any of it is a big deal.

None of it indicates she's mentally ill or abusive.

Perhaps some of it may be an indication of some tension between them. Or maybe CW did feel belittled and that caused a simmering anger.

But IMO that's about the only thing these videos may indicate.

Yes, all that, but who made him stay on camera if he felt belittled?
He could have walked away from the camera if she was belittling him.

 

[gitana1]

Forensic Spotlight: A New Investigative Biometric Service - The National Palm Print System
Seems common practice for years

No. It's not. Common booking processes in most states typically only still include finger prints.

 

[gitana1]

Yes, all that, but who made him stay on camera if he felt belittled?
He could have walked away from the camera if she was belittling him.

True. Looks like he was trying hard to win at some stupid game of giant checkers because these two were competitive with one another in a silly way like that. Many spouses are.

Except maybe he was feeling a secret, simmering anger. That his wife was more outgoing. Had more friends. More attention. Won more often. Was better than him.

I think it's worthy of debate going off those videos. Do they indicate possible underlying tensions or even tensions we aren't and se wasn't aware of? Sure?

What all of this has been twisted into, however, supposed evidence that she's some monster, is ludicrous to me.

 

[nwmouse]

This just reminded me - I have a photo of my son's first poop on the potty. Is that bad?
MOO

As long as you don't show his girlfriend!!

 

[PommyMommy]

As long as you don't show his girlfriend!!

Thank you, duly noted!
MOO

 

[Gardener1850]

My question is, if only exercised, or they also took some appetite suppressants. Both of them.

I was reading through her Instagram posts and recall seeing one about the "burn" patches that mentioned you had to also do low carb/low sugar for them to work. So I'm thinking that the diet change is what really helped them lose weight. I wonder how CW is going to do with his diet in prison? He does not get the patches anymore and probably can't eat very low carb while in there. I bet he will put the weight back on. JMO.

 

[MyBelle]

OK, I have lots of professional knowledge & experience in this regard. This is my opinion, take it for what it’s worth (or not worth in your opinion).

These pictures are from Thanksgiving Day 2016. So Bella was 2 years old & CeCe was 1. They both appear to be receiving a punishment of standing with their noses in a corner. I will give the benefit of the doubt & assume a 1 year old is not being punished in this manner, although IMO the post does allude to that.

Even if it is just 2 year-old Bella, a pediatrician, child psychologist, or any other professional with deep knowledge of child development would tell you this is not age-appropriate.

Toddlerhood is a particularly vexing time for parents, because this is the age at which children start to become more independent and discover themselves as individuals. Yet they still have a limited ability to communicate and reason.

I’m not stating this to cast judgement on posters who have done this to their own children. I’m looking at this & other things I know & have observed of SW’s parenting style & addressing how this may fit in with the bigger picture.

According to the American Board of Child & Adolescent Psychology, “Time-outs may not be the best approach for the toddler stage. The negative implication of being sent away can teach kids that they're bad rather than promote good behavior. At the toddler stage, we recommend parents instead try redirection, as it is far more effective than discipline tactics at this age.” For example, a cozy corner for the child to look at a book & take a break, usually a minute per each year if age (2 min for a 2 year old, so to speak).

Add to this the fact that the children were publicly shamed by these pictures being posted on SM.

I’m not diagnosing SW by pictures & videos alone, but there are many things (this, the Xmas video with her becoming angry with Bella for not enjoying the experience & repeatedly calling her names, the video where she allowed CeCe to put herself in danger climbing to “learn her lesson,” etc) that raise red flags for me knowing what ultimately happened to these children.

Well said. It is so easy to redirect a toddler. The "control via humiliation" route usually does result in a disastrous outcome. Which we certainly have in this case. JMO

 

[human]

I'd be happy with no trial assuming he admits to murdering the children. But if it's some plea deal that leaves ambiguity about their murders, no way.

Why would he go for a deal if he had to admit to killing them all? Would the deal be no death then?

Or would he not want the sordid details out in public?

I think going over all of the stuff that will be dragged up in a trial is not worth it . Think of the Jodi Arias trial or Casey Anthony. Who wants that!

Ted Bumdy had women and so did Richard Ramirez. CW will have drama with women.

Just get it over with and he can fade into oblivion.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I was reading through her Instagram posts and recall seeing one about the "burn" patches that mentioned you had to also do low carb/low sugar for them to work. So I'm thinking that the diet change is what really helped them lose weight. I wonder how CW is going to do with his diet in prison? He does not get the patches anymore and probably can't eat very low carb while in there. I bet he will put the weight back on. JMO.

We can hope, lol.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Yes. Probable cause is required. Three people were killed. This is a murder case. CW says they were strangled.

There's your probable cause.

They're doing their job but it's just gatekeeping. They know they're not going to win the motion.

Nothing more needs to be shown to establish probable cause.

What intrigues me is how much we are learning from the court (defense mostly) motions.

Thanks to the original poster for giving us that link where we can check it at any time and look at all the motions and read them at our leisure. I have it saved and check it everyday. That way, I can interpret it before it hits Ashley Banfield 2 Days Later as a bombshell.

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

OK, I have lots of professional knowledge & experience in this regard. This is my opinion, take it for what it’s worth (or not worth in your opinion).

These pictures area from Thanksgiving Day 2016. So Bella was 2 years old & CeCe was 1. They both appear to be receiving a punishment of standing with their noses in a corner. I will give the benefit of the doubt & assume a 1 year old is not being punished in this manner, although IMO the post does allude to that.

Even if it is just 2 year-old Bella, a pediatrician, child psychologist, or any other professional with deep knowledge of child development would tell you this is not age-appropriate.

Toddlerhood is a particularly vexing time for parents, because this is the age at which children start to become more independent and discover themselves as individuals. Yet they still have a limited ability to communicate and reason.

I’m not stating this to cast judgement on posters who have done this to their own children. I’m looking at this & other things I know & have observed of SW’s parenting style & addressing how this may fit in with the bigger picture.

According to the American Board if Child & Adolescent Psychology, “Time-outs may not be the best approach for the toddler stage. The negative implication of being sent away can teach kids that they're bad rather than promote good behavior. At the toddler stage, we recommend parents instead try redirection, as it is far more effective than discipline tactics at this age.”
For example, a cozy corner for the child to look at a book & take a break, usually a minute per each year if age (2 min for a 2 year old, so to speak).

Add to this the fact that the children were publicly shamed by these pictures being posted on SM.

I’m not diagnosing SW by pictures & videos alone, but there are many things (this, the Xmas video with her becoming angry with Bella for not enjoying the experience & repeatedly calling her names, the video where she allowed CeCe to put herself in danger climbing to “learn her lesson,” etc) that raise red flags for me knowing what ultimately happened to these children.

It's really interesting to have people like you onboard!
But what I would like to add: your own parenting style might be sometimes stamped and influenced by the way other people around you raised their own children. I remember when my son was still a little baby. My mother in law would often visit us and tell me that I had to put him away in his own crib (while I was carrying him all the time) otherwise he would never be able to develop some kind of idependence! She rolled her eyes when I just would not let him cry. Just as a few examples. Because this was the way babies were treated when she was younger and she had her's.

I felt so unsecure but had the luck to meet a midwife who told me that it was totally okay to have the baby the entire time at my side. If she hadn't be there for me I would have followed my mil's advices and would have taken a lot of love and comfort from my own son. My mother in law always badmouthed her after that.

So maybe she got somehow influenced by her own parents and thought she would do her kids a favor? But this is just a guess on my own experience.