AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot to death, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #8

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I went to radar online for the latest info. But the ad pop ups are too overwhelming for me to want to continue. I will simply wait for future copy and pastes by posters here. :(
. Edit: LOL not sure why is starred out! LOL. OK it's an app that blocks ads and I don't know how people can be on the internet without it.
 
I know, logging on and catching up is like a constant deja vu, round and round in circles, I really hope LE has A LOT more to go on that we do (I'm guessing yes), because I can't imagine how frustrating it is for them if they don't!
Agreed! I don’t think I can follow this anymore. It’s a circular cycle: the caretaker, the door, did he answer or not, was she holed up in the bathroom, does the chair have blood, etc. I can’t take it anymore.

But I keep thinking, maybe by now something’s happened.
 
I thought the grandfather said the dad was working that day?
Yes, that's why he missed the party. Although they didn't say what time, I got the feeling it was sometime in the afternoon, I think it was a child's birthday they were celebrating, which makes me think if he was working during the day he would have been home before midnight. Jmo
 
From the last thread:

Post by @Trocroc9
“There is no way in hell I believe Jayme is involved with a situation in which she interacted with an online pedophile . Most parents warn against contact with unknown people to the point that children are fearful of others. I believe she is an innocent victim.”
——

The problem is that predators can disguise themselves as another child the victim’s age. Catfish.

I know that many parents do their best to warn kids about online dangers, but unfortunately if the predator is an adult they may be able to fool the child. If she communicated with a predator unknowingly this doesn’t mean it is her fault because these can be adults who have more experience in life and are able to be quite convincing and deceiving.
 
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I don’t think it’s anything more complex than leaving in a vehicle. Cops probably aren’t focused on finding a car as they approach the house. By the time officers arrived and cleared the scene and realized Jayme was missing, I bet they had a good 15-30 minute head start.

Remember too they lived on a highly trafficked highway. Officers probably drove by many vehicles en route to the house.

sounds like it was three on scene initially would that mean 3 vehicles seems like these day they mostly have their own but i don't know?
 
Investigators are also asking people to observe family members, friends, or people they know in the community for any behavior that seems out of the norm, including:

  • Missing work for no apparent reason
  • Missing scheduled appointments
  • Leaving town without a reasonable explanation
  • Increase in drug and/or alcohol use
  • Altering their appearance
  • Paying “too much or too little” attention to the case, such as quickly shutting the news off when it reports on Jayme and her parents
  • Selling and/or getting rid of a vehicle

They should at least offer a 5k reward if the above was mentioned and bared fruit. Jmo.
 
Many theories on the table still for me.

I want to note that FTR imo the location seems like a perfect house for a home invasion by a random perp(s). But as noted by a local there are more fancy houses elsewhere.

Adding to the list of possible theories: thrill kill? I doubt this but just a thought.

I've just looked at the house for the first time and you're right about it being a good one for a home invasion. Right next to a major road for an easy getaway, house is a reasonable distance from the next nearest property, house is partially hidden by trees in all directions.

I still don't see it as burglary gone wrong though, it would make no sense to take Jayme. In that scenario I could see them killing Jayme but taking her makes no sense.
 
Many theories on the table still for me.

I want to note that FTR imo the location seems like a perfect house for a home invasion by a random perp(s). But as noted by a local there are more fancy houses elsewhere.

Adding to the list of possible theories: thrill kill? I doubt this but just a thought.
But a more fancy house might also have more fancy security? e.g, better locks, motion-sensor lighting? Which would making the Closs home an easier target, even though potentially less lucrative? IDK, that has been my thought whenever this topic comes up. MOO.
 
I think it would be interesting/helpful to have a list of these similar crimes and note who the perps were:

How old were they? How far did they live from the home? Did they have a criminal history? What was their motive(s)? Were they known to the family? Did they have previous contact with the family? Was this single, dual or multiple perps? Did the perp use drugs? Were the victims kept alive and if so for how long? What MO/disposal method did they use? Etc, etc.

I started with Hannah Anderson’s case last night. Perp was 40, known to the family well, had contact with them the day before, lived an hour away. I’m not sure about criminal history as I just begun a cursory study.

I would like to take 10 comparable cases for this data comparison/study. Please feel free to contribute to this any input. Thanks in advance.
<mod fixed broken quote>
Hi Margarita5
Its a great idea you had. And a couple of Websleuthers have provided great links to some of those cases. I don't remember all of them, but you can read the 2 links below for yourself to get you data. (There's more on previous threads; I'll keep looking)

You all remember the case in Tennessee?

The Bain Family was moving from Tennessee to Arizona. A “close family friend”, Adam Mayes, was “helping” them move. He killed the mother and oldest daughter. He spared the two younger daughters. (He claimed they were his bio-daughters, which I believe was determined to be unlikely). On the run, he was eventually was confronted by LE, in a forest, and turned the gun on himself. The girls with him were “unharmed” except for dehydration, poison ivy and bug bites. The Father of the family was the least impacted because he was already in Arizona with the first load of their stuff. AM’s wife and mother were also complicit in this murder/kidnapping and convicted.

2012 Bain murder-kidnappings - Wikipedia


A couple of on-point Websleuthers have brought up the Canadian case.

The Liknes Disappearances:

Disappearance of Nathan O'Brien, Kathryn Liknes and Alvin Liknes - Wikipedia

Here’s one similarity: Both Garland was related to the Liknes family through marriage, AND Adam Mayes was related to the Bain family though marriage.

Garland likely killed the grandson to make sure there were no witnesses.

Mayes was a career criminal and likely involved in a lot domestic abuse towards his wife.

Pure conjecture and my own opinion is below:

I’m getting the some of the same ‘vibe’ with the Closs case in Wisconsin. I believe the perp could have some combo of these qualities

1) Someone who knows the Closs family and may even be related to them through extended ties.

2) Someone who knows the area of Barron really well.

3) Someone who knows their habits

4) Someone who perceives himself/herself to be very very important to Denise, James or Jayme (this view is likely inflated and not reciprocated by the Closses, such as “I paved their driveway for them”, “I works so hard for him. He owes me.” “I tell her everything that is going on in my life.” (Pure Conjecture examples; MOO) ...or..

5) Someone who perceives they have been slighted, betrayed, mistreated, disrespected or severely let down by Denise or James, recently, or even going very far back (such as a friendship/relationship that has been cut off; asked to not communicate with them anymore; business venture which did not work out, reprimanded at a job, covered for them at work, then not compensated, shared a confidence but then it was divulged; etc.) (Pure conjecture; MOO)

6) Someone who feels that they ……cannot “save face”.

7) Someone who is likely controlling, & possible emotionally/physically abusive to those closest to him/her.

8) Someone with a lot rage, and a short temper.

9) Someone with a lot of bitterness/jealousy towards Denise or James (such as, “JC can retire at 56 and I can’t”, “She has such a great relationship with her daughter/friends/mother-in-law/fill-in-the-blank-with-any-name and I don’t.” )

10) Someone who is majorly stressed in other arenas of their life and #5) was the last straw.

__________
I am praying for Jayme’s safe return.

I am praying for her whole family.

I am praying for the entire surrounding community of Barrron.

There are really no words. This is so horrific.
 
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it would only send a message if a bunch of ppl knew the Closs's owed a huge debt and who they owed it to (and therefore) who did it. Considering a 13 year old is missing someone would have talked. For this reason this doesn't make sense to me.

Not only talk because she was missing but talk because it could happen to them. Exactly why this wasn’t over a debt of any kind IMO
 
From the last thread:


Post by @Troccroc9
“There is no way in hell I believe Jayme is involved with a situation in which she interacted with an online pedophile . Most parents warn against contact with unknown people to the point that children are fearful of others. I believe she is an innocent victim. “

——
The problem is that predators can disguise themselves as another child the victim’s age. Catfish.

I know that many parents do their best to warn kids about online dangers, but unfortunately if the predator is an adult they may be able to fool the child. If she communicated with a predator unknowingly this doesn’t mean it is her fault because these can be adults who have more experience in life and are able to be convincing and deceiving.
But so far it doesn't seem like she had much of an on line presence. All we've heard is that she may have had a private Instagram account. It seems like investigators have had time to look into that and my feeling is that they have found nothing. Jmo
 
For sure they know more. We actually have very little that's solid fact which is why all we can do is try to speculate. As more comes out I could certainly change my mind but for now that's all I can come up with. Praying this sweet child makes it through this ordeal.

Not sure they know as much as we’re hoping. Re: she’s alive - that seems to be standard verbiage (even Tibbetts they were saying that up until a day she was found.) I think it keeps case active and focused. I’m certainly hopeful that is the case, but wouldn’t infer anything else from that being said. Prayers she is found safe soon
 
I think it would be interesting/helpful to have a list of these similar crimes and note who the perps were:

How old were they? How far did they live from the home? Did they have a criminal history? What was their motive(s)? Were they known to the family? Did they have previous contact with the family? Was this single, dual or multiple perps? Did the perp use drugs? Were the victims kept alive and if so for how long? What MO/disposal method did they use? Etc, etc.

I would like to take 10 comparable cases for this data comparison/study. Please feel free to contribute to this any input. Thanks in advance.

I can't stop thinking about the Petit family. That was local to me, one of the victims went to my rival high school, my former lacrosse coach knew the family, the mother worked at another high school we interacted with. Perps were about 44 and 27 at the time, the older one had previous convictions. The mother was abducted and taken to her bank, the father was beaten and tied up in the basement. The children and mother were sexually assaulted. Then the perps doused the females and the house in gasoline and burned it down. The father escaped.

According to the perps, it was supposed to be a home invasion/burglary, but it escalated to an absolutely horrific situation. Unheard of for that part of CT.

I'm starting to think that whoever did this was meth-fueled and maybe followed dad come home after work, thought they could handle him, and decided to rob them or do more harm. I lived in a high meth-use state and there is no rational thinking there.
 
Okay, this is another thought:

The objective was to abduct and keep Jayme and also kill the parents because the parents would be able to figure out who abducted their daughter. In other words, the abductor was known to the parents. So, in order to not get caught, the parents had to be killed (as opposed to killed simply because they were home at the time).

justanothertheorytoconsider, jmo, speculation
I think this is it! I've been racking my brain trying to figure out why it all went down like it did and this fits.
 
[
I would like to take 10 comparable cases for this data comparison/study. Please feel free to contribute to this any input. Thanks in advance.

Hi Margarita5
Its a great idea you had. And a couple of Websleuthers have provided great links to some of those cases. I don't remember all of them, but you can read the 2 links below for yourself to get you data. (There's more on previous threads; I'll keep looking)

You all remember the case in Tennessee?

The Bain Family was moving from Tennessee to Arizona. A “close family friend”, Adam Mayes, was “helping” them move. He killed the mother and oldest daughter. He spared the two younger daughters. (He claimed they were his bio-daughters, which I believe was determined to be unlikely). On the run, he was eventually was confronted by LE, in a forest, and turned the gun on himself. The girls with him were “unharmed” except for dehydration, poison ivy and bug bites. The Father of the family was the least impacted because he was already in Arizona with the first load of their stuff. AM’s wife and mother were also complicit in this murder/kidnapping and convicted.

2012 Bain murder-kidnappings - Wikipedia


A couple of on-point Websleuthers have brought up the Canadian case.

The Liknes Disappearances:

Disappearance of Nathan O'Brien, Kathryn Liknes and Alvin Liknes - Wikipedia

Here’s one similarity: Both Garland was related to the Liknes family through marriage, AND Adam Mayes was related to the Bain family though marriage.

Garland likely killed the grandson to make sure there were no witnesses.

Mayes was a career criminal and likely involved in a lot domestic abuse towards his wife.

Pure conjecture and my own opinion is below:

I’m getting the some of the same ‘vibe’ with the Closs case in Wisconsin. I believe the perp could have some combo of these qualities

1) Someone who knows the Closs family and may even be related to them through extended ties.

2) Someone who knows the area of Barron really well.

3) Someone who knows their habits

4) Someone who perceives himself/herself to be very very important to Denise, James or Jayme (this view is likely inflated and not reciprocated by the Closses, such as “I paved their driveway for them”, “I works so hard for him. He owes me.” “I tell her everything that is going on in my life.” (Pure Conjecture examples; MOO) ...or..

5) Someone who perceives they have been slighted, betrayed, mistreated, disrespected or severely let down by Denise or James, recently, or even going very far back (such as a friendship/relationship that has been cut off; asked to not communicate with them anymore; business venture which did not work out, reprimanded at a job, covered for them at work, then not compensated, shared a confidence but then it was divulged; etc.) (Pure conjecture; MOO)

6) Someone who feels that they ……cannot “save face”.

7) Someone who is likely controlling, & possible emotionally/physically abusive to those closest to him/her.

8) Someone with a lot rage, and a short temper.

9) Someone with a lot of bitterness/jealousy towards Denise or James (such as, “JC can retire at 56 and I can’t”, “She has such a great relationship with her daughter/friends/mother-in-law/fill-in-the-blank-with-any-name and I don’t.” )

10) Someone who is majorly stressed in other arenas of their life and #5) was the last straw.

__________
I am praying for Jayme’s safe return.

I am praying for her whole family.

I am praying for the entire surrounding community of Barrron.

There are really no words. This is so horrific.

Excellent summary.
 
Do you realize what a tightly regulated business a casino is? Every employee goes through an extensive background investigation to get a gaming license and any subsequent criminal activity can get that license immediately revoked. If I get pulled over for a DUI tonight I’ll lose my license before I go to work tomorrow - even before a guilty verdict. Not to mention the fact that I’m on camera from the minute I arrive on property until I leave. If I pick my nose it’s on camera.

I'm not real sure what you are referring to??? My thoughts are the casino is so close to the house maybe Mr. Closs was sitting there playing and flashed a few 20's or won a few 20's. That's a lot of money to a lot of people.
Could Never do well's hang around out in the parking lot looking to steal?
Then again I remember reading upthread a hint Mr. Class might have worked a second job. Could it be the Casino.
Then again the police made a beeline to the casino after discovering the bodies.
Lots of unknowns. MOO
 
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