Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #47

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Serena Angelique said:
I was fascinated by the people willing to “wait for more facts” myself, when it seemed to me there were plenty of facts to go with. However, SEVERAL people entertained the possibility that he was telling the truth and I’ve pondered over why that is myself and will offer my opinion (which may be flawed)....

....The videos also presented a story of contentment and happiness-but how could that REALLY be true if her husband killed all of them? And when he showed up in them, he looked benign and not like we envision killer dads or spouses to look.

On the other hand, there wasn’t much info on Chris Watts to look through. We only had her take on Chris’ personality which was glaringly unreliable in wake of the things he had done. So perhaps her own gushing reverence of him called her credibility into question....

People don’t like to believe that a seemingly normal, family man can snap so abruptly and with such little forewarning. If Chris Watts was capable of that, who isn’t?...

JMO
Click to expand...

SBM for brevity

Serena, I really appreciate your well-thought out and respectful post here. Very insightful and I thought worth bringing forward again. Some of what you said doesn't apply to me, but what I've highlighted above is really spot for me on in many ways.

I was one who, while in absolutely no way a CW supporter, came to the point of wanting to at least try to hold my full judgement until we knew more. This was primarily in the interest of innocent until proven guilty- which I'm a real fanatic about just in general in life. This left me wanting to ponder the Defense strategy and to try to "keep an open mind" to a certain extent. (To be clear, I was never a SW basher and those following my posts would know this).

But what Serena said above, I think speaks to my deeper feelings and why I stayed awake some nights so disturbed by this case. It went beyond my interest in preserving the American justice system of innocent until proven guilty. I just couldn't (and still can't) wrap my head around a person doing this to his family. He seemed so normal. He just seemed so normal. In ways that other FA's have not to me. And being able to see all of SW's social media gave us an insight into their family life. SO. NORMAL. I'd not had an up-close view like this before. And their life not only seemed so normal, but amazingly positive. The question left like an elephant in my brain was: if CW could do this, what is up and what is down? Who else is capable of something like this?

So what Serena says- the effusive reverence of CW and the family life in SW's posts and videos- did call into question for me SW's credibility. The reality was that this family was murdered. All was NOT well. So my brain was not able to compute. It's not that I ever just "believed CW", it's that my brain did not compute the situation. I was searching for answers and therefore was open to nearly anything- anything at all that would help shed even a little light onto why the family dynamics ended up being literally the opposite of what we saw. (mental illnesses? personality disorders? financially irresponsible behaviors? affairs? anything...anything...was searching for anything to grasp onto.) Certainly nothing would ever fully explain it or in any way justify the deaths of those 4 souls, but what in the name of God went wrong? What was it? All was not well and nothing added up. It left me in a state of very uncomfortable confusion.

In any case, Serena's post resonated with me. I'm not looking to create further debate. I'm just wanting to second Serena's deeper thoughts that I highlighted above. I think it's a great explanation of the way some of us could/could not process these atrocities and what motivated some of us on a deeper level. In the end, I'm impressed by so many posters' insights and knowledge of past cases, patterns they recognized, etc. I remain completely baffled as to how CW could do what he did. But he did. It will be a profoundly disturbing case for me for years to come.
 
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MollyDDD said:
Would the proceeds from the sale of their home possibly go towards restitution? And if SW had a life insurance policy, if he’s the beneficiary, perhaps that too?
Click to expand...

The first is a legal question that I'm not qualified to answer. I feel comfortable in stating that with respect to any life insurance proceeds on any of his victims, CW can't collect because he is their slayer.

JMO, restitution for the funeral and burial expenses of his victims, and future expenses of his living victims that might be incurred are shown as a requirement only for CW. The ability to collect any restitution from him is a different matter, IMO.

All JMO.
 
Soon the darkness and dangers will begin for CW as he enters the Colorado Department of Corrections. The journey will begin with processing through Denver Reception and Diagnostic Center, which generally takes around 28 days. In DRDC his needs will be assessed and his custody level and his long term facility assignment will be determined. While there he will submit his phone list for approval (persons he may call). After that he will be going to a very contained, very controlled, very masculine environment. Upon arrival he will be a celebrity, not in a good way, but as a target, like Jared Fogel, Charlie Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer and others, who were attacked in prison. Fogel was beaten, Manson was set on fire, and Dahmer was beaten to death. CW has been in the media spotlight and he carries that with him into prison where there will be prisoners who will believe that harming or killing CW will gain them the media spotlight and/or give them gravitas with other prisoners. There will also be prisoners who will want to harm CW because he killed little children. In prison there will be a real threat of bodily harm, rape, even murder. Prison will be different from his time in jail and very much different from his past life. He will have to share a cell. CW will be LWOP, and from what I've read, there will be no interest or need to rehabilitate him, he's there until he dies. He will be allowed some visitors, sometimes. Visitations do get cancelled. If he does any work he can look forward to earning $.13 to $.38 per hour (that's cents!) He will have an account his earned money goes into and into which his family, etc., can deposit money. The money can be used at the commissary. His friendships and romances will be limited and defined by his surroundings.

CW will no longer have any privacy, not even going to the bathroom. He will no longer have a drivers license. He will never own or drive a vehicle again. No more trips or vacations. No going out to dinner, shopping, movies, concerts, etc. In fact, no going out. No meal choices. No clothing choices (bye-bye spiffy shirts). No credit cards. No more cell phone (if caught with a contraband phone it will be confiscated and he will be punished!). All of the ordinary things available to us, that we take for granted, will be denied to CW, for the rest of his life. He will be very, very limited as to any goals he may set or plans he makes. He will be what he is, for the rest of his life; a prisoner, an inmate. A bad memory.


Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) | Department of Corrections

https://www.sos.state.co.us/CCR/GenerateRulePdf.do?ruleVersionId=414

http://www2.cde.state.co.us/artemis/crserials/cr110014internet/cr110014200209internet.pdf

I just don't understand. He had a woman who loved him and seemed devoted to him and to his well being. He had a wife and family who loved him. They gave to him in so many ways. He had a bright future full of possibilities. Now they are gone, the future is gone, and only pain, sorrow, and confusion remain. What did he want and need that led to this horrible nightmare? I just don't understand.
 
MJPeony said:
SBM for brevity

Serena, I really appreciate your well-thought out and respectful post here. Very insightful and I thought worth bringing forward again. Some of what you said doesn't apply to me, but what I've highlighted above is really spot for me on in many ways.

I was one who, while in absolutely no way a CW supporter, came to the point of wanting to at least try to hold my full judgement until we knew more. This was primarily in the interest of innocent until proven guilty- which I'm a real fanatic about just in general in life. This left me wanting to ponder the Defense strategy and to try to "keep an open mind" to a certain extent. (To be clear, I was never a SW basher and those following my posts would know this).

But what Serena said above, I think speaks to my deeper feelings and why I stayed awake some nights so disturbed by this case. It went beyond my interest in preserving the American justice system of innocent until proven guilty. I just couldn't (and still can't) wrap my head around a person doing this to his family. He seemed so normal. He just seemed so normal. In ways that other FA's have not to me. And being able to see all of SW's social media gave us an insight into their family life. SO. NORMAL. I'd not had an up-close view like this before. And their life not only seemed so normal, but amazingly positive. The question left like an elephant in my brain was: if CW could do this, what is up and what is down? Who else is capable of something like this?

So what Serena says- the effusive reverence of CW and the family life in SW's posts and videos- did call into question for me SW's credibility. The reality was that this family was murdered. All was NOT well. So my brain was not able to compute. It's not that I ever just "believed CW", it's that my brain did not compute the situation. I was searching for answers and therefore was open to nearly anything- anything at all that would help shed even a little light onto why the family dynamics ended up being literally the opposite of what we saw. (mental illnesses? personality disorders? financially irresponsible behaviors? affairs? anything...anything...was searching for anything to grasp onto.) Certainly nothing would ever fully explain it or in any way justify the deaths of those 4 souls, but what in the name of God went wrong? What was it? All was not well and nothing added up. It left me in a state of very uncomfortable confusion.

In any case, Serena's post resonated with me. I'm not inviting criticism of my post here, or interested in trying to defend anything. I'm just wanting to second Serena's deeper thoughts that I highlighted above. I think it's a great explanation of the way some of us could/could not process these atrocities and what motivated some of us on a deeper level. In the end, I'm impressed by so many posters' insights and knowledge of past cases, patterns they recognized, etc. I remain completely baffled as to how CW could do what he did. But he did. It will be a profoundly disturbing case for me for years to come.
Click to expand...

Agreed!!!! Great post :D
 
ZsaZsa said:
Yes, I felt immediately that he really hated the younger child, his contempt was visible, and when we found out where he dumped them, that confirmed it to me. I would bet a month's salary that Celeste was the first to die.
Click to expand...



In the video where CW is opening his birthday present that turns out to be a concert ticket there is a little voice saying adamantly something like I wanna, I wanna, to me indicating a little one [CeCe?] wanted to help open the present.

How in the world could he have kept himself from including her in the present opening or picking her up so she could get a better look?

He was just so… weird…he totally blocked her out.

To me that is not normal loving behavior for a parent not to include their young child in such if the child so desires.

all imo
 
MJPeony said:
SBM for brevity

Serena, I really appreciate your well-thought out and respectful post here. Very insightful and I thought worth bringing forward again. Some of what you said doesn't apply to me, but what I've highlighted above is really spot for me on in many ways.

I was one who, while in absolutely no way a CW supporter, came to the point of wanting to at least try to hold my full judgement until we knew more. This was primarily in the interest of innocent until proven guilty- which I'm a real fanatic about just in general in life. This left me wanting to ponder the Defense strategy and to try to "keep an open mind" to a certain extent. (To be clear, I was never a SW basher and those following my posts would know this).

But what Serena said above, I think speaks to my deeper feelings and why I stayed awake some nights so disturbed by this case. It went beyond my interest in preserving the American justice system of innocent until proven guilty. I just couldn't (and still can't) wrap my head around a person doing this to his family. He seemed so normal. He just seemed so normal. In ways that other FA's have not to me. And being able to see all of SW's social media gave us an insight into their family life. SO. NORMAL. I'd not had an up-close view like this before. And their life not only seemed so normal, but amazingly positive. The question left like an elephant in my brain was: if CW could do this, what is up and what is down? Who else is capable of something like this?

So what Serena says- the effusive reverence of CW and the family life in SW's posts and videos- did call into question for me SW's credibility. The reality was that this family was murdered. All was NOT well. So my brain was not able to compute. It's not that I ever just "believed CW", it's that my brain did not compute the situation. I was searching for answers and therefore was open to nearly anything- anything at all that would help shed even a little light onto why the family dynamics ended up being literally the opposite of what we saw. (mental illnesses? personality disorders? financially irresponsible behaviors? affairs? anything...anything...was searching for anything to grasp onto.) Certainly nothing would ever fully explain it or in any way justify the deaths of those 4 souls, but what in the name of God went wrong? What was it? All was not well and nothing added up. It left me in a state of very uncomfortable confusion.

In any case, Serena's post resonated with me. I'm not inviting criticism of my post here, or interested in trying to defend anything. I'm just wanting to second Serena's deeper thoughts that I highlighted above. I think it's a great explanation of the way some of us could/could not process these atrocities and what motivated some of us on a deeper level. In the end, I'm impressed by so many posters' insights and knowledge of past cases, patterns they recognized, etc. I remain completely baffled as to how CW could do what he did. But he did. It will be a profoundly disturbing case for me for years to come.
Click to expand...

Thank you. It really has been disturbing for so many different people from so many walks of life and impossibly difficult to fathom. I fell in love with the little girls, and as a parent of a little girl myself, this case made me want to be a better parent.
 
What do I know, but I simply think that he thought he wanted a relationship, marriage and kids. Got them. Then realized, with all the good and bad that it brings, that he just absolutely couldn't handle it. Of course all the details surrounding that are numerous and complicated, but he was just done.And his way to fix that was horrid. We’ve all said it already, many different ways.
 
liltexans said:
We just don't know. They haven't spoken publicly since the murders, as far as I know. That's certainly their choice and they may have good reasons for it. I will say, though, that denial can be a very powerful thing. I can't get Jackie Peterson out of my mind completely. She died believing Scott had nothing to do with Laci's murder. But she never liked Laci. Laci wasn't good enough for Scott in her eyes. It's hard to know what CW's family thinks unless they make a statement publicly. Maybe one day in the future they will. They are likely still reeling in shock as additional victims of CW.
Click to expand...

Yes, I completely agree, I keep thinking of Jackie Peterson too. Denial truly is so incredibly strong. I am not sure that I would say anything if I were them, they have to know how much their son is hated. Not that it's their fault, but I really think they'll keep as much as possible out of the public light. Now that there will be no trial, they'll have a much easier time doing so. But my curiosity still really wants to know what they truly think and believe.
 
MJPeony said:
SBM for brevity

Serena, I really appreciate your well-thought out and respectful post here. Very insightful and I thought worth bringing forward again. Some of what you said doesn't apply to me, but what I've highlighted above is really spot for me on in many ways.

I was one who, while in absolutely no way a CW supporter, came to the point of wanting to at least try to hold my full judgement until we knew more. This was primarily in the interest of innocent until proven guilty- which I'm a real fanatic about just in general in life. This left me wanting to ponder the Defense strategy and to try to "keep an open mind" to a certain extent. (To be clear, I was never a SW basher and those following my posts would know this).

But what Serena said above, I think speaks to my deeper feelings and why I stayed awake some nights so disturbed by this case. It went beyond my interest in preserving the American justice system of innocent until proven guilty. I just couldn't (and still can't) wrap my head around a person doing this to his family. He seemed so normal. He just seemed so normal. In ways that other FA's have not to me. And being able to see all of SW's social media gave us an insight into their family life. SO. NORMAL. I'd not had an up-close view like this before. And their life not only seemed so normal, but amazingly positive. The question left like an elephant in my brain was: if CW could do this, what is up and what is down? Who else is capable of something like this?

So what Serena says- the effusive reverence of CW and the family life in SW's posts and videos- did call into question for me SW's credibility. The reality was that this family was murdered. All was NOT well. So my brain was not able to compute. It's not that I ever just "believed CW", it's that my brain did not compute the situation. I was searching for answers and therefore was open to nearly anything- anything at all that would help shed even a little light onto why the family dynamics ended up being literally the opposite of what we saw. (mental illnesses? personality disorders? financially irresponsible behaviors? affairs? anything...anything...was searching for anything to grasp onto.) Certainly nothing would ever fully explain it or in any way justify the deaths of those 4 souls, but what in the name of God went wrong? What was it? All was not well and nothing added up. It left me in a state of very uncomfortable confusion.

In any case, Serena's post resonated with me. I'm not inviting criticism of my post here, or interested in trying to defend anything. I'm just wanting to second Serena's deeper thoughts that I highlighted above. I think it's a great explanation of the way some of us could/could not process these atrocities and what motivated some of us on a deeper level. In the end, I'm impressed by so many posters' insights and knowledge of past cases, patterns they recognized, etc. I remain completely baffled as to how CW could do what he did. But he did. It will be a profoundly disturbing case for me for years to come.
Click to expand...

To me. and I think to most others, CW's words, behavior, and actions painted a very vivid picture. From his interactions with NUA when she was trying to find out if SW and the girls were okay, to the interviews, to his admissions of where and how he hid the bodies. his confession to adultery and even to his accusation against SW; all painted a picture of a liar and FA. We were not and are not a jury, so it was never a "rush to judgement", it was a logical assessment based on available facts and evidence. I, and many others, saw a progression of facts and evidence that pointed to one person being the murderer of all; CW! I, and many others, remained open minded, but asked for alternative facts and evidence that supported an alternative explanation. I never saw alternative facts and evidence. Now the truth has been revealed and there is no presumption of guilt, CW has admitted guilt. to everything! He was and is guilty. I have no apologies for my assessments, opinions, or position, because I wasn't judging a possibly innocent man guilty. I was
assessing, opining, and taking a position based on evidence and facts. I truly hope nothing like this ever happens again, because, like you, I find it profoundly disturbing and tragic.
 
sun16 said:
What do I know, but I simply think that he thought he wanted a relationship, marriage and kids. Got them. Then realized, with all the good and bad that it brings, that he just absolutely couldn't handle it. Of course all the details surrounding that are numerous and complicated, but he was just done.And his way to fix that was horrid. We’ve all said it already, many different ways.
Click to expand...

What just baffles me beyond belief is what makes a person 'fix' things the way he did? Now i know what I speak of here....... Just like him, I had a relationship, marriage and kids. Nice home, job, loving parents and good friends. And I just walked out on it all. Yep, left behind a shocked husband, devastated young children, mortified parents and angry friends. Just snapped. Walked out that door and didn't look back for years. Not my finest moments, however...I guess I can be thankful every day that while my coping skills left nothing to be desired, I could never ever hurt another human being physically, especially not my children. I hear about cases like this and can only wish that he had the sense to just walk away. For anyone that says you can't always just do that, I am here to say you can.
I just cannot wrap my head around the fact that he chose such an option that he did. The thought never ever would have occurred to me to do what he did.
ps....just to add a footnote, in the past 10 years my now adult children and I have been rebuilding our relationship. They are gift and I am forever grateful that they found a way to let me back into their lives.
 
Seattle1 said:
Had this been a DP case, I'm sure that it would be procedural. However, his defense was probably already working on an assessment. MOO
Click to expand...
BBM Well, that's sort of why I wondered, because if, I say if, that was the sealed filing, and they try to mitigate his crimes at sentencing, based upon their psych assessment, maybe the State would need to have their own assessment ready for the Judge.

ETA - I have no idea if he would have pled guilty in that case.
 
Question for the lawyers or anyone who might know.

I am assuming the judge will review any evidence before sentencing, is this correct? I would think he/she would want to know if any other heinous acts were committed in regards to their murder or trying to hide their bodies, if there is defenitive proof this was premeditated, which explains the murder 1 charge for all of the deaths.
 
Yesiamapirate said:
What just baffles me beyond belief is what makes a person 'fix' things the way he did? Now i know what I speak of here....... Just like him, I had a relationship, marriage and kids. Nice home, job, loving parents and good friends. And I just walked out on it all. Yep, left behind a shocked husband, devastated young children, mortified parents and angry friends. Just snapped. Walked out that door and didn't look back for years. Not my finest moments, however...I guess I can be thankful every day that while my coping skills left nothing to be desired, I could never ever hurt another human being physically, especially not my children. I hear about cases like this and can only wish that he had the sense to just walk away. For anyone that says you can't always just do that, I am here to say you can.
I just cannot wrap my head around the fact that he chose such an option that he did. The thought never ever would have occurred to me to do what he did.
ps....just to add a footnote, in the past 10 years my now adult children and I have been rebuilding our relationship. They are gift and I am forever grateful that they found a way to let me back into their lives.
Click to expand...
I think it’s really brave of you to admit that to everyone here, I’m sure at that time you did what you thought was best for tour children, there’s no text book to tell you how to be a parent and it is hard sometimes. I’m a single parent to four children and there’s definitely been times I’ve felt like packing my bags and leaving! But no matter how hard it gets, you don’t hurt your children.
 
Tortoise said:
BBM Well, that's sort of why I wondered, because if, I say if, that was the sealed filing, and they try to mitigate his crimes at sentencing, based upon their psych assessment, maybe the State would need to have their own assessment ready for the Judge.

ETA - I have no idea if he would have pled guilty in that case.
Click to expand...
There will be no mitigating at the sentencing hearing. CW could not voluntarily enter the plea agreement if not of sound mind. At the hearing, CW was asked several questions by the Judge affirming this, and will continue to question him at sentencing. His punishment LWOP x 3 served consecutively is firm. MOO
 
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