Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #51

[sun16]

Chris is the person who knows all the facts of everything that happened.

The DA and lawyers are next on the list, knowing some things to a certain extent.

Everyone else falls in line after that.

We know Chris isn’t the smartest person ever, especially re: this crime, but he agreed to sign this plea deal, and HE KNOWS WHY.

If he really wanted to give everyone the middle finger, he’d refuse to sign the plea deal, refuse to tell anyone anything, sit thru a trial and just bear it, and then sit on death row and not tell anyone anything ever again. He did not have to sign a deal that he killed the girls. Yes details would come out, but whatever. Some still will come out.

His mom keeps saying “I need to know what happened that night”. Lady, get in frickin’ line. Because Chris is never going to tell anybody what went down that Sunday and Monday, minute by minute, like it’s a movie.

Yes I’m pissed. lol

 

[MsBetsy]

Totally! Didn't he pursue SW like crazy when they first got together... Something Mrs Watts avoided mentioning in her interviews

Yes, and she was sick and vulnerable and at a difficult time in her life. He made himself the hero who cared for her and took her to her colonoscopy before they were even together. It was the perfect time to make his move. Jmo

 

[liltexans]

I find this interesting (there's more in the article, but this is what stood out to me the most):

A narcissistic parent can be defined as someone who lives through, is possessive of, and/or engages in marginalizing competition with the offspring. Typically, the narcissistic parent perceives the independence of a child (including adult children) as a threat, and coerces the offspring to exist in the parent’s shadow, with unreasonable expectations. In a narcissistic parenting relationship, the child is rarely loved just for being herself or himself.

Numerous studies have been conducted on the subject of narcissistic parenting and its impact on offspring. It's important to distinguish certain parent-centric tendencies from chronic narcissistic parenting. Many parents want to show off their children, have high expectations, may be firm at times (such as when a child is behaving destructively), and desire their offspring to make them proud. None of these traits alone constitute pathological narcissism. What distinguishes the narcissistic parent is a pervasive tendency to deny the offspring, even as an adult, a sense of independent self-hood. The offspring exists merely to serve the selfish needs and machinations of the parent(s).

[...]

Jealousy & Possessiveness

Since a narcissistic mother or father often hopes that the child will permanently dwell under the parent’s influence, she or he may become extremely jealous at any signs of the child’s growing maturity and independence. Any perceived act of individuation and separation, from choosing one’s own academic and career path, to making friends not approved by the parent, to spending time on one’s own priorities, are interpreted negatively and personally (“Why are you doing this to ME?”).

In particular, the appearance of a romantic partner in the adult offspring’s life may be viewed as a major threat, and frequently responded to with rejection, criticism, and/or competition. In the eyes of some narcissistic parents, no romantic partner is ever good enough for their offspring, and no interloper can ever challenge them for dominance of their child.

“How dare that woman take my son away from me. Who does she think she is?”

― Anonymous

 

[NuttMegg]

I wonder which group of parents/siblings goes first. I wonder what happens if the Watts go last, and sis/Mom/Dad pour it on heavy about how CW was coerced, stonewalled, etc. And that is left hanging in the air as the actual sentencing happens. They could pour it on just to establish, in the future, how counsel failed CW.

This is such a unique case because it hasn't dragged on year after year, when the victims' statements are usually after so much time dealing with the pain. Not here, it's all raw and the fb podcasters are putting themselves into the center of it all for their own benefit, IMO.

 

[gitana1]

She created him physically & emotionally and we're the people we are today mostly based on how we were raised and what we were taught by our parents instructions / actions. Her reactions to what he did is appalling to me but isn't surprising. MOO

I wasn't talking about his parents!!

 

[MassGuy]

Chris is the person who knows all the facts of everything that happened.

The DA and lawyers are next on the list, knowing some things to a certain extent.

Everyone else falls in line after that.

We know Chris isn’t the smartest person ever, especially re: this crime, but he agreed to sign this plea deal, and HE KNOWS WHY.

If he really wanted to give everyone the middle finger, he’d refuse to sign the plea deal, refuse to tell anyone anything, sit thru a trial and just bear it, and then sit on death row and not tell anyone anything ever again. He did not have to sign a deal that he killed the girls. Yes details would come out, but whatever. Some still will come out.

His mom keeps saying “I need to know what happened that night”. Lady, get in frickin’ line. Because Chris is never going to tell anybody what went down that Sunday and Monday, minute by minute, like it’s a movie.

And even if he did tell everyone what happened, it would only be a self serving lie.

The evidence will get us as close to the truth that we’re ever going to get.

I just hope it’s there.

 

[Colorado303]

I know. I'm just worried for her family and all of you who care for Shanann having to hear those people bash her.

I’m hopeful if Mommy starts bashing the victims the judge will shut her down. I have fantasies of her being removed from the courtroom mid-speech.

 

[Best of What's Around]

I also think the girls were killed way before SW got home. I think she was so tired, took her shoes off, dropped her purse on the kitchen counter and left her suitcase at the bottom of the steps. The only thing she had with her was her phone. I think he was waiting for her in that little room upstairs and that is where he assaulted her and killed her on that couch where her phone was found. Breaks my heart.

The thing I find odd about the AP is saying she "barely knew CW" Yet they had been meeting 4 to 5 times a week. That is a lot of time together. IMO it doesn't go with her statement that she wanted to "take things slowly." I guess its human nature to present yourself in the best light.

And for CW mom to say he was "shocked" that SW was pregnant. I call BS. He didn't act "shocked" in that video. He acted surprised that it happened so quickly but not shocked or unhappy by any means. The ultimate manipulator.

Re the AP saying she barely knew CW, perhaps yes in hindsight everyone presents themselves in the best light, but I would argue that (1) Even when you see someone a lot over a month, it is still just a single month, and (2) I would not be at all surprised, particularly given his need to cover for his lies to her, that he spoke very little about himself during this time - focusing on her, instead...like she noticed him doing when his family was suddenly "gone." Many of those "dates" were likely movies, talking about her, etc. He was also a quiet guy in general. IMO

 

[sunsetbeach]

I also think the girls were killed way before SW got home. I think she was so tired, took her shoes off, dropped her purse on the kitchen counter and left her suitcase at the bottom of the steps. The only thing she had with her was her phone. I think he was waiting for her in that little room upstairs and that is where he assaulted her and killed her on that couch where her phone was found. Breaks my heart.

The thing I find odd about the AP is saying she "barely knew CW" Yet they had been meeting 4 to 5 times a week. That is a lot of time together. IMO it doesn't go with her statement that she wanted to "take things slowly." I guess its human nature to present yourself in the best light.

And for CW mom to say he was "shocked" that SW was pregnant. I call BS. He didn't act "shocked" in that video. He acted surprised that it happened so quickly but not shocked or unhappy by any means. The ultimate manipulator.

I wonder if she hit record on her phone and shoved it in the couch. I really really hope she did.

 

[MyBelle]

Cindy Watts said in her extended interview that the public defenders told her they would defend CW if he wanted to go forward.... but HE didn't want to go forward. That sounds like some intense bullying.

She was referring to bullying of CW's parents not the defendant. She said the PD told them not to write letters to CW and really weren't given an explanation as to why. Cindy said she couldn't understand what harm it would be to write her son and tell him that they love him and will always love him.

Cindy said the PD then summoned them to CO on Nov. 5 but refused to allow them to discuss his plea with him BEFORE the sentencing. I wonder if CW is suicidal and is eager to get to prison for that reason. JMO

 

[tmar]

Yeah, well he was busy with the AP being suspicious on Monday night and he had to try and lie his way out of that.
As she said, he kept trying to change the subject from his missing family.

CW really held it together, acted through it well.
Initially the Murders. Disposing the bodies, and 'off to work'.
Then the AP, texting her, being questioned continually,
then NUA, (his cover up stopped) the Police, Media interviews, the Thayers, picking up Dad, speaking to Dad again. Confession.

He was able to lie through this all, and not appear to fall apart.
Who can do this!
He has had loads of times, in his life, where he has continually lied: well experienced at this, I would think. MOO.
Now all the evidence is available, for the world to see.
As the DA has stated, CW can not be believed, even now.
MOO.

 

[Madison418]

I wonder which group of parents/siblings goes first. I wonder what happens if the Watts go last, and sis/Mom/Dad pour it on heavy about how CW was coerced, stonewalled, etc. And that is left hanging in the air as the actual sentencing happens. They could pour it on just to establish, in the future, how counsel failed CW.

This is such a unique case because it hasn't dragged on year after year, when the victims' statements are usually after so much time dealing with the pain. Not here, it's all raw and the fb podcasters are putting themselves into the center of it all for their own benefit, IMO.

I was wondering the same. I personally hope SW's family goes first so that if CWs family starts really laying it on, they can leave the courtroom. (I know nothing about this practice and what's allowed or not allowed)

 

[MsBetsy]

Chris is the person who knows all the facts of everything that happened.

The DA and lawyers are next on the list, knowing some things to a certain extent.

Everyone else falls in line after that.

We know Chris isn’t the smartest person ever, especially re: this crime, but he agreed to sign this plea deal, and HE KNOWS WHY.

If he really wanted to give everyone the middle finger, he’d refuse to sign the plea deal, refuse to tell anyone anything, sit thru a trial and just bear it, and then sit on death row and not tell anyone anything ever again. He did not have to sign a deal that he killed the girls. Yes details would come out, but whatever. Some still will come out.

His mom keeps saying “I need to know what happened that night”. Lady, get in frickin’ line. Because Chris is never going to tell anybody what went down that Sunday and Monday, minute by minute, like it’s a movie.

Yes I’m pissed. lol

All she needs to know is that he killed her and the kids, which is what he has admitted to. Does she really want him to tell her all the gory details, like how he looked in their eyes as he was strangling them or how they looked blue? How he jammed them in the oil tanks?

 

[gitana1]

I find this interesting (there's more in the article, but this is what stood out to me the most):

A narcissistic parent can be defined as someone who lives through, is possessive of, and/or engages in marginalizing competition with the offspring. Typically, the narcissistic parent perceives the independence of a child (including adult children) as a threat, and coerces the offspring to exist in the parent’s shadow, with unreasonable expectations. In a narcissistic parenting relationship, the child is rarely loved just for being herself or himself.

Numerous studies have been conducted on the subject of narcissistic parenting and its impact on offspring. It's important to distinguish certain parent-centric tendencies from chronic narcissistic parenting. Many parents want to show off their children, have high expectations, may be firm at times (such as when a child is behaving destructively), and desire their offspring to make them proud. None of these traits alone constitute pathological narcissism. What distinguishes the narcissistic parent is a pervasive tendency to deny the offspring, even as an adult, a sense of independent self-hood. The offspring exists merely to serve the selfish needs and machinations of the parent(s).

[...]

Jealousy & Possessiveness

Since a narcissistic mother or father often hopes that the child will permanently dwell under the parent’s influence, she or he may become extremely jealous at any signs of the child’s growing maturity and independence. Any perceived act of individuation and separation, from choosing one’s own academic and career path, to making friends not approved by the parent, to spending time on one’s own priorities, are interpreted negatively and personally (“Why are you doing this to ME?”).

In particular, the appearance of a romantic partner in the adult offspring’s life may be viewed as a major threat, and frequently responded to with rejection, criticism, and/or competition. In the eyes of some narcissistic parents, no romantic partner is ever good enough for their offspring, and no interloper can ever challenge them for dominance of their child.

“How dare that woman take my son away from me. Who does she think she is?”

― Anonymous

I believe all of that matches up with the vague reasons for not attending something as important as her son's wedding:

"She's dangerous."
"We didn't think he wanted us there."
"I didn't get a long with her."

Suuuuuurrrre.

 

[Best of What's Around]

I don’t think they will change their minds unless there is very clear physical evidence he killed the girls.

Agreed. And then it will simply switch to the abused husband / temporary insanity defense of him. We have seen it already. We've seen ZERO evidence of any abuse by SW, verbally or otherwise, IMO. And what CW's mother states as evidence of it - proves to me there never was any. Complaining that she called his looks a skater boy? Oh please. That says it all to me.

 

[MassGuy]

I find this interesting (there's more in the article, but this is what stood out to me the most):

A narcissistic parent can be defined as someone who lives through, is possessive of, and/or engages in marginalizing competition with the offspring. Typically, the narcissistic parent perceives the independence of a child (including adult children) as a threat, and coerces the offspring to exist in the parent’s shadow, with unreasonable expectations. In a narcissistic parenting relationship, the child is rarely loved just for being herself or himself.

Numerous studies have been conducted on the subject of narcissistic parenting and its impact on offspring. It's important to distinguish certain parent-centric tendencies from chronic narcissistic parenting. Many parents want to show off their children, have high expectations, may be firm at times (such as when a child is behaving destructively), and desire their offspring to make them proud. None of these traits alone constitute pathological narcissism. What distinguishes the narcissistic parent is a pervasive tendency to deny the offspring, even as an adult, a sense of independent self-hood. The offspring exists merely to serve the selfish needs and machinations of the parent(s).

[...]

Jealousy & Possessiveness

Since a narcissistic mother or father often hopes that the child will permanently dwell under the parent’s influence, she or he may become extremely jealous at any signs of the child’s growing maturity and independence. Any perceived act of individuation and separation, from choosing one’s own academic and career path, to making friends not approved by the parent, to spending time on one’s own priorities, are interpreted negatively and personally (“Why are you doing this to ME?”).

In particular, the appearance of a romantic partner in the adult offspring’s life may be viewed as a major threat, and frequently responded to with rejection, criticism, and/or competition. In the eyes of some narcissistic parents, no romantic partner is ever good enough for their offspring, and no interloper can ever challenge them for dominance of their child.

“How dare that woman take my son away from me. Who does she think she is?”

― Anonymous

Wow. If this was written specifically about CW’s mother, it couldn’t be more accurate.

 

[gitana1]

I was wondering the same. I personally hope SW's family goes first so that if CWs family starts really laying it on, they can leave the courtroom. (I know nothing about this practice and what's allowed or not allowed)

I want them to go last. They can be told when to leave and when to re-enter the courtroom.

 

[Madison418]

I want them to go last. They can be told when to leave and when to re-enter the courtroom.

Okay so if the Watts' family goes first, SW's family can leave during that if it's too much and return later?

 

[violet101]

I think the call from Chris to Nichol in NC that his divorce was final is significant date. I believe at this point he decided he wanted to kill Shanann, and if he did write a letter it was a premeditated action to take blame away from him. His mom and family already had dislike for Shanann, both them and himself would be happy if she was out of the picture, so he had no guilt killing her. I wouldn’t be surprised if the internet searches the DA mentioned would include him googling how to go about this.

 

[Best of What's Around]

To me this sounds as though it is submitted in advance.

A Victim Impact Statement form accompanies the first letter sent from the District Attorney’s Office to a victim after charges have been filed for prosecution. The District Attorney’s Office will make every effort to insure that a completed Victim Impact Statement is available to the judge prior to the date of sentencing.

The form below was designed to help crime victims provide relevant information, including sentencing recommendations. Please complete all parts of the form which apply to you. If you are requesting restitution for losses sustained as a result of this crime, attach copies of all bills, receipts, invoices and estimates with your completed form.

A COPY OF THIS STATEMENT WILL BE PROVIDED TO THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY, THE COURT, AND THE DEFENDANT OR DEFENSE COUNSEL.

ETA : Here’s a link to the form
http://adamsbroomfieldda.org/wp-content/themes/theme1227/PDFs/VictimImpactStatementApril2013.pdf

I hope you are right, but I was just going off the statute you posted previously which stated (BBM):

Under C.R.S.24-4.1-302.5 (g), a victim has the right to make a written and oral impact statement about the harm that the victim has sustained as a result of the crime. Victims may choose to submit both a written Victim Impact Statement and speak at the sentencing, only speak or only submit a Victim Impact Statement or do neither. The choice is up to a victim. The Victim Impact Statement can be a powerful tool in the recovery process for a victim from the trauma of a crime.