Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #106

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
This statement makes it clear BG was wearing a disguise on his head/face.

“This is the face of the suspect that goes with body of the video captured on Liberty German's cell phone minutes before she and Abigail Williams were murdered.”
MistyWaters said:
The key to the identity of the suspect is Libby’s cellphone video, photo and audio.

BBM

When the audio was initially released -

“This young lady is a hero," Slocum said. "There's no doubt. To have enough presence of mind to activate the video system on her cell phone to record what we believe is criminal behavior that's about to occur, there's no doubt that young lady is a hero."
UPDATE: Delphi teen records audio before murders

Then more recently -

“This is the face of the suspect that goes with body of the video captured on Liberty German's cell phone minutes before she and Abigail Williams were murdered.”
UPDATE: Delphi teen records audio before murders

And the connection between the audio and photo/video -

“The new audio clip is a slightly extended version of the original, which was released days after the girls were murdered and includes the word "Guys" followed by "Down the Hill."
"Please keep in mind that the person talking is one person and is the person on the bridge with the girls" Carter said. "This is not two people speaking. Please listen to it very, very carefully."...”
ISP says new audio, video and sketch shows Delphi killer
Click to expand...
 
x_files said:
crazy, isn't it? So shocked he wasn't caught either. He didn't even really try to hide in any shape or fashion. Women gave his name to SPD for years and I guess they just didn't follow up on it or couldn't gather any evidence against him. Having a car tail him might have worked!
Click to expand...

So darn sad.
Part of the problem was, when a prostitute would disappear, it would take a long while to report her. Too sad. He chose the group that very few genuinely cared about. There was little public outcry because the victims were not beautiful affluent college students, but runaway kids who grew into marginalized adults.
 
I think the reason why they released what they did is that someone knows that tone. maybe an ex-gf, relative, etc. someone knows how he is when the mask comes off and they have heard him speak in this tone. they will recognize his "normal" voice, as in "guys", and they will also recognize the gruffer, humorless, more demanding voice: "down the hill". they will have heard both tones of voice by the person they know.

ilovechili said:
I agree.

I don't comment on this case much because I have as many theories as most others and I mostly just read and do not have a lot to add that has not been said, well maybe a few thoughts, for another time.

The "guys" remark has been discussed in depth. I read along but do not think I commented.

I will say now though as you have said as have others, that I agree that there is condescension and/or authority in the voice and delivery of "guys".

I like others have said would say myself, if a friendly exchange, "Hey guys, how are ya doing?" Or--"Are you guys ready for dinner yet?" Or really casual, possibly, "You guys ready to go yet?" I would never start out with "guys" without a word in front of it, unless angry, or as a teacher, coach, someone who uses that and needs to possibly address that way and maintain control, even a parent who is upset, "Guys, you are so grounded". It eliminates the friendliness of the remark and shows a seriousness.

Every time I listen to it I wonder what comes after and why they cannot release more to truly help those that know the person to recognize the voice.

There must be a reason.

Jmo.
Click to expand...
 
Charlot123 said:
Maybe I am wrong, but to me, many men in Indiana look similar. It is not surprising. First, they are mostly white. The way Indiana was colonized, it seems, several families moved from PA. Maybe there was need in workforce later, but to me, it seems, there was little outside migration. So Hoosiers are probably all 4th cousins. The sketch looks typical to them. (To me as well, btw).

How it might matter? Well, DNA. If you have DNA and it is someone “local”, not necessarily Delphi local, but IN local - there should be matches. If not in IN, then in PA.

So if the DNA yielded no matches to help with the tree, then likely, it was either touch DNA, or something they extracted mito DNA from.
Click to expand...

Yes, being from the Midwest myself, I absolutely know that nothing about BG's clothing is anything unusual. He looks like any other man walking on a trail. We are not know for being fashion forward-so believe me...his outfit looks better than many men I see every day!!
I also must say, that his speech sounds like someone from the midwest-I've pretty much always lived in Michigan, and I detect no other accent in his voice.
 
moonlessnight said:
This statement makes it clear BG was wearing a disguise on his head/face.

“This is the face of the suspect that goes with body of the video captured on Liberty German's cell phone minutes before she and Abigail Williams were murdered.”
Click to expand...

The facial features of the photo are too blurred and grainy to recognize even though the image was clarified as much as possible. I don’t think that proves he was wearing a disguise.
 
mtnlites said:
I'm sorry, but I'm not seeing a difference in what I said vs what you said. Same idea, different order of words. I just didn't walk through the whole legal process.

Unless, as someone else said, they have the guy on 24/7 surveillance then no amount of back and forth is going to convince me that they would continue to put the public in danger by "waiting" for the elusive evidence *might* cinch the case.

There's apparently enough out there already for a judge to issue search warrants, considering that they've been issued and searches already made. They've made multiple references to the evidence they have, including items that have been sent off to be "tested".

Sure things can go awry and screw up an investigation: Evidence obtained without a valid search warrant, improper evidence chain of custody, evidence incorrectly handled/removed from the scene/stored evidence, contaminated crime scene, etc. can all make things inadmissible in a trial. That's not what my post was about at all, however. I was simply stating that due to my professional experience, as well as my experience as a child/adult who grew up around LE, I do not believe that they have a specific person in mind and are biding their time for an arrest. I wish they did, but I don't believe they do. YMMV.
Click to expand...

I must’ve misunderstood where you were going. My response was reference this (wasn’t sure what would happen if I hit quote so I just copied it).

My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!

I was just saying how LE tends to operate regarding high profile murders in my state and how/why they work with the prosecutor and they might hold off on an arrest.

All murders are horrible and brutal. Any person that has killed can kill again - they’ve shown they are capable. There are quite a few people in this world at any given moment that LE has as a suspect for a murder(s). Sometimes they do hold off on arrest to strengthen the case and reach their end goal which is conviction. There is a process and there is a reason for it.

We had a quadruple homicide in my area involving an adult and three young kids. It was a brutal crime so I won’t go into the details. When the case went to trial it was obvious that LE had the murderer on the radar. They had pretty good circumstantial evidence - there was an ongoing dispute with the adult, weak alibi and he was very uncooperative. I think there was also touch DNA recovered too (at the scene), but he was an associate. They didn’t arrest him right away. He was actually arrested over a year after the crime. Even though he committed a really REALLY horrible violent crime (LE knew it and he knew LE knew it) they waited till they had what the prosecution needed to convict and it took a while. If they immediately arrested him the clock starts ticking and speedy trial in my state is 175 days. He got life BTW.

If LE has a POI they’ve got eyes on him/them.
 
moonlessnight said:
I think the reason why they released what they did is that someone knows that tone. maybe an ex-gf, relative, etc. someone knows how he is when the mask comes off and they have heard him speak in this tone. they will recognize his "normal" voice, as in "guys", and they will also recognize the gruffer, humorless, more demanding voice: "down the hill". they will have heard both tones of voice by the person they know.
Click to expand...
Maybe, this person has a certain talent for different voices and for example within seconds can switch to a sonorous tone (like "bedroom voice"), to "officer voice" or to "boss voice" or to "average man on bridge voice". MOO Friends of him should be able, to recognize him. Problem: they would never think, it's him. IMO
 
mtnlites said:
I keep seeing people saying that LE "knows" who did it, but that they're "building an airtight case." We must have vastly different experiences with LE & DAs then. My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!" I have multiple family members in LE including some in the Delphi area, family that works homicide and narcotics, and they have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to public safety. They gather evidence, they interview, they make arrests and keep the public safe-the DA is the one who puts all of that together to ensure that it's an "airtight case." I can see a world in which they have an idea of who it might be, but don't have any hard evidence in which to back it up. I can not, however, after a dozen years of writing true crime and listening to LE discuss things off the record, fathom them holding off on the arrest of a high-profile child murderer who could very well attack again.

They must have some evidence since they've weeded people out.
dbm
Click to expand...
 
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/headlines/bosma-millard-arrested-at-gunpoint-1.3438856
It was the evening of May 10, 2013, when Hamilton police officers boxed in M.'s Yukon SUV at a stop sign on Cawthra Road in Mississauga, Ont.
Sgt. Stuart Oxley walked toward the driver-side window of the SUV with his gun drawn, he testified in Superior Court Monday.
"I approached the car myself with my gun drawn. He looked over at me and put his hands up," Oxley said.
"I said, 'Are you DM?' He said 'yes.' "
M. was then arrested.
-.-.-
Hopefully Abby's and Libby's killer will have an "event" like this soon. :cool:
 
Spy Versus Spy said:
Evening All.

Looking for help/clarification on a couple of points...

I have it in my head that there may be a msm article ,or footage of an interview, in which possibly LEO mentions feeling ,or being, betrayed by someone/something in the investigation period of the first 2yrs,prior to the April PC. Or This may be my own interpretation of the LE feeling at the April PC that Ive turned into 'Fact' ,or a discussion on this topic of betrayal that Ive also adopted as 'Fact'. Is anyone aware of any verified source for this?


Similarly, Im far more convinced that Ive seen interview footage or coverage in which LE or BP/MP/AW or similar persons state that they have heard extra audio from LG's recording and that it records audio of the Perp getting or becoming impatient/frustrated with the girls ( or similar). This in particular is driving me nuts .

Appreciate any pointers to being able to verify or refute the above 2 points.

At this time both may be just MOO
Click to expand...
I would be v interested to know more about these points. Can anyone help?
 
Spy Versus Spy said:
Evening All.

Looking for help/clarification on a couple of points...

I have it in my head that there may be a msm article ,or footage of an interview, in which possibly LEO mentions feeling ,or being, betrayed by someone/something in the investigation period of the first 2yrs,prior to the April PC. Or This may be my own interpretation of the LE feeling at the April PC that Ive turned into 'Fact' ,or a discussion on this topic of betrayal that Ive also adopted as 'Fact'. Is anyone aware of any verified source for this?


Similarly, Im far more convinced that Ive seen interview footage or coverage in which LE or BP/MP/AW or similar persons state that they have heard extra audio from LG's recording and that it records audio of the Perp getting or becoming impatient/frustrated with the girls ( or similar). This in particular is driving me nuts .

Appreciate any pointers to being able to verify or refute the above 2 points.

At this time both may be just MOO
Click to expand...
DELPHI PRESS CONFERENCE TRANSCRIPT (2019) - CrimeLights

The part with "betraying - trust" (similar) disappeared.
No. 2 of your questions: I don't know about this.
 
Charlot123 said:
Maybe I am wrong, but to me, many men in Indiana look similar. It is not s Ft. Ouiaurprising. First, they are mostly white. The way Indiana was colonized, it seems, several families moved from PA. Maybe there was need in workforce later, but to me, it seems, there was little outside migration. So Hoosiers are probably all 4th cousins. The sketch looks typical to them. (To me as well, btw).

How it might matter? Well, DNA. If you have DNA and it is someone “local”, not necessarily Delphi local, but IN local - there should be matches. If not in IN, then in PA.

So if the DNA yielded no matches to help with the tree, then likely, it was either touch DNA, or something they extracted mito DNA from.
Click to expand...

Actually Indiana has a very long and rich history of Native Americans, dating back to at least 8000 B.C. There was a British and French influence in the state for centuries. That French influence is still seen in names of Indiana places like Vincennes or Ouiatenon, to name just two. (For non-Hoosiers, Ouiatenon is pronounced we OT ta non). FWIW, Ft. Ouiatenon Park is a historic area just outside West Lafayette, next to a river. Could BG have been attracted to that and taken a side trip to Delphi to find victims instead? There is also a medium sized cemetery across the street from the park.
Driving past Ouiatenon a few miles and then making a left turn and crossing the river, on one of the side roads is a patch of some of the last remaining prairie grass in Indiana, near a very small pioneer cemetery. (Think Little House on the Prairie opening, where the covered wagon is crossing the tall waving grass and intermittent flowers. It's that type of patch).
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 79 more.
Total: 4,226 (members: 80, guests: 4,146)

Online statistics

Members online
80
Guests online
4,146
Total visitors
4,226
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
593,185
Messages
17,982,144
Members
229,050
Latest member
utahtruecrimepod
Back
Top