Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #13

[srper2]

@CanadianMade, my intuition is saying the same. I am just not convinced they murdered Lucas & Chynna, and we honestly just have not been given enough information to make a definite decision IMO.

We do not know if BS & KM had access to a weapon, if they did where did it come from?

If they did in fact kill Lucas & Chynna why did they stay in the area for 3 or 4 days, yet after killing Mr. Dyck they immediately got as far away as they could.
If they were looking for another vehicle to escape in after killing Lucas & Chynna, why drive almost 500km to find one? There were likely lots of tourist cars they could have tried to steal around Laird Hot Spring.
We do not know how LD died. If he was not shot, why not, if they had a gun?
Too many questions with no logical answers for me to call them guilty yet.

I will say it again, I really want BS & KM to be the responsible persons but something will not let me jump to that conclusion just yet.
JMO

I also have never believed they killed Lucas and Chynna, and I am still so worried that the real murderer is still free to continue to murder. The police were too quick to ignore other people who should have been considered to be major persons of intrest, and who appear to not have even been followed up as a witness! The police appear to have jumped to conclusions and developed tunnel vision It is awful that they were responsible for the murder of Mr. Dyck, but that doesn't mean that any other recent murders should just be automatically attributed to them. I believe the police have not revealed evidence because they have none. They have also left it far to long to try to now follow up the other suspicious man, last to be seen with Chynna and Lucas, but for some reason completely ignored!

 

[Peace777]

If these 2 died by murder/suicide the coroner will be able to tell. Was a knife used to kill both of them? Was a gun used? If a gun was used a coroner can tell by trajectory of the bullet if it was possible for the 1 to have killed himself. But why wasn't it reported of any gunshot at any point. Wait didn't the 1 guy say he heard a shot or shots early on? Who was that and if he did hear gun fire was it reported to the RCMP? Hmmm

 

[Gina20]

Did we ever learn the height of the mystery man in the middle of the road? If he was 5'9" tall, I hope someone from the murder investigation team has spoken to the flagger on Highway 29 in B.C.

Strangely, the original accounts of that incident said two men were involved, but there is only a description for one.

Also, have there been any reports of stolen vehicles or carjackings?

 

[srper2]

I have a sinking we will continue to get sensational updates from BS's dad, but most other family members, especially on the McLeod side, are just going to stay clammed up. Not that I blame them at all for that decision.

I would say that BS's dad will have a seriously broken heart and doubt we will hear anything more from him, if the press are respectful for the time being. Kam's family would also be devastated and have avoided the press, probably after seeing the awful reporting of interviews at the start of the case. I can only imagine the pain and devastation they would be experiencing right now, their sons charged with murder, accused of murdering three people, and all happening on what was meant to be an adventure to find work and become independent.

 

[copkid]

Having something on pretty good authority without providing a link or any other factual information means it's an opinion - nothing more.

@otto Not really much different than saying "safe to assume" and then presenting it like it is fact. JMO

 

[rollaway]

I have some insight and opinion I’d like to share


The truck and camper.

Port Alberni is a mill town and was formed around the logging industry. This is a town where an old pickup truck would have more value than a new convertible sports car. There is a notable “redneck” culture on northern Vancouver Island that stems from its fishing and logging heritage.


The diesel dodge that KM was driving would be considered to be high value in this area. Its not uncommon to see mid 90’s dodge diesels like KMs sell for $10 000-$14 000CAD depending on condition. Based on the photos I’ve seen it is a 4x4 and in very good shape so this would be a highly coveted vehicle for this area and most of Vancouver Island (with the exception of Victoria area).

The camper is a Bigfoot which means it is a 2 piece fibreglass. This is a much for valuable unit than a more common camper constructed out of wood.

My estimated street value for that vehicle/camper in this area would be around $18-20 000CAD.

For a young male on Vancouver Island, this would be a highly desired vehicle.

I still haven’t found out whether the truck was his or if he borrowed it.

At some point in time, the value of the truck (and computer) to KM and BS was greatly diminished by other circumstances.

If you look at a picture of KM and BS with the butterflies (instagram), you will notice in the background the boom/mast/seat for a self-loading logging truck.

This was a big tip for me in helping to understand where they came from. I was able to pursue this and it brought about some new insight. Some of that I cannot share due to the rules. But that information is helpful and for those who are interested you won’t have to look hard to see where I went.

Based on my research, I’m of the opinion that KM *should* have had an easier time getting local employment (that was better than Walmart) through family connections. I will leave it at that.

2)Bryers Instagram photo of him squatting with the vodka bottle

It’s evident BS was searching for his identity (as we all do) and latched onto slavic culture. He was interested in his own heritage according to AS.

Do you see how BS is squatting, wearing the flat hat? He is only missing Adidas pants, and he would be a “gopnik” which I believe he is emulating.

You can search gopnik and get a better understanding of what it means, but you will discover its embedded in Eastern European pop culture. It is also a big part of gaming.

“Squatting Slavs in Track Suits” is a great facebook page that posts regular fodder relating to the slavic gopnik culture. (Also is Babushka)

Guns are a big part of slavic culture.

I would not consider BS’s interest in slavic culture alarming based on my own local experiences and understanding of generational pop culture. This is fairly mainstream stuff for gamers. Looking at the pieces from my (admittedly) narrow viewpoint, I would opine that BS’s interest in slavic culture was a way of him finding his own identity in a world where that may not have been so easy for him.
Just wanted to touched on those two points.

I keep coming back to the bond the two shared and I think thats an important dynamic for us to dive into.

I have lots more to add to this but I will keep it light today.

So pleased with how well run and respectful this forum is, thanks to all.


Grateful for the coverage of LD and the early photos of him. Hoping for the same from LF and CD, condolences to all.

 

[Gina20]

I certainly don't read the Daily Mail. I only know about their coverage of this case from comments and links other people have posted to these threads. In particular the way AS, Bryer's father, who was the only family member speaking to the media, has stopped speaking since his coverage by the DM. It seemed to me the DM and the freelancer who sold them his story, betrayed his confidences and twisted his words to make a mockery of a grieving father.

Or he has "given" the exclusive to Aus. 60 Minutes for a fee and signed a contract to keep quiet until then.

 

[Peace777]

The Mounties get their man!

Too late tho they were dead already. I don't think that counts as "getting their man/men" JMO

 

[CanadianMade]

Strangely, the original accounts of that incident said two men were involved, but there is only a description for one.

Where did you hear that it was two men?

 

[srper2]

App

Did we ever learn the height of the mystery man in the middle of the road? If he was 5'9" tall, I hope someone from the murder investigation team has spoken to the flagger on Highway 29 in B.C.

Strangely, the original accounts of that incident said two men were involved, but there is only a description for one.

Also, have there been any reports of stolen vehicles or carjackings?

Apparently the mystery man, who was the last reported person seen with Chynna and Lucas, and who was described as acting in a way that appeared to be threatening Chynna and Lucas, was completely ignored and has had plenty of time to hope security footage of him at servos has been deleted, change his look and get rid of his vehicle after all this time. I am amazed that there has been nothing said about him by police at all. I believe he should have been followed up as quickly as they followed up Bryer and Kam, but they appear to have ignored this after the initial report.

 

[aphoto]

Having something on pretty good authority without providing a link or any other factual information means it's an opinion - nothing more.

@otto Not really much different than saying "safe to assume" and then presenting it like it is fact. JMO

You are both entitled to your opinions. I’ll hurry up and verify but even still that won’t enable me to go in to much more detail. Single sourced background information can’t be shared due to the fear of getting the source in trouble.

Up to both of you to believe what you want. I think it’s safe to say I’m the only person in these threads who has been to Gillam during the search for K&B and whom is in contact with multiple people still on the ground. I have spoken off record with lots of people familiar with this investigation. I’m happy to stop sharing the information given to me on background if you want. Your call.

 

[scrappinkat]

Can you direct me to a site that sells airsoft (brand) weapons? Because when I type "airsoft brand" in google, I get dozens and dozens of air gun brands (but not airsoft).

I am not conflating anything. I am blatantly and clearly stating that we don't know it was an "airsoft" in the first place (only the oddball father's words - and I'm claiming that people use the word "airsoft" to cover a wide range of guns - just google it yourself).

In fact, since I was given three "airsoft" guns (all of which shoot BB's and can easily inflict some damage to humans) I just went to check and I can't tell what brand they are (at all) but any markings on them. The person who gave them to me said they were "airsoft." But if you're telling me that Airsoft Brand never makes any guns that fire anything but plastic pellets, then I am telling you that many people use the word "airsoft" for things that are not airsoft.

But I'd like to see something from the brand itself, stating that it does not sell (in the US) airsoft BB guns. Go to amazon and type in "airsoft ammo" and you'll immediately see BB's, which is my point. Retailers and other humans use the term "airsoft" in multiple ways.

In the picture where Bryer is shown holding his gun in the family home, he has the barrel tip hidden under his left arm (as far as I can tell) so you can't see if the tip is orange.

The number of gamers who have realistic looking air rifles is legion. People think they are legal to carry on college campuses and at high schools (they are not, in California, but they are found all the time). Penalties for possessing them are much lighter, in any case, it's often not even charged.

I'll upload a picture later, but you can go to airsoft atlanta and see "airsoft BB" under ammunition.

Canada Legal Airsoft Guns - Airsoft Rifles and Pistols

There are many without the orange tips. The law regarding orange tips is confusing. They are required for import but depending on FPS and kilojoules and class of airsoft they may be required by law. The cheap kind from walmart for example are a different class from the more serious airsoft airguns found on the site and like Bryer had.

Another link about airsoft guns.
https://www.pqbnews.com/news/ladysmith-brothers-playing-airsoft-spurs-heavy-rcmp-response/amp/

 

[SiciC]

I would say that BS's dad will have a seriously broken heart and doubt we will hear anything more from him, if the press are respectful for the time being. Kam's family would also be devastated and have avoided the press, probably after seeing the awful reporting of interviews at the start of the case. I can only imagine the pain and devastation they would be experiencing right now, their sons charged with murder, accused of murdering three people, and all happening on what was meant to be an adventure to find work and become independent.

Alan Schmegelsky, Bryer's dad, is going to be on an episode of "60 Minutes" in Australia this coming Sunday to talk about this case. I think we will hear a lot more from him. He's been the most outspoken family member right from the start. I don't doubt he's heart broken, but I think he somewhat likes the attention or is just a talkative guy. I also think he even mentioned himself that he has substance abuse issues or mental health issues, which makes it even more likely he'll continue his emotional spiels
jmo!

 

[otto]

I don’t know the exact coordinates but it was in the water not far from where the bodies were later found. Again I have lots of only single sourced info I can’t share but that sleeping bag was instrumental in the belief they were no longer alive. At first the polices assumption was they may have drowned so I think it’s fair to expect at some point they were in the water.

That is not true. the sleeping bag was no where near the bodies. It was 110 km away from the bodies. A sleeping bag 110km from the bodies does not suggest that the suspects were no longer alive.

"The sleeping bag was spotted around 11 a.m. floating near Port Nelson, where the Nelson River spills into Hudson Bay."​

How a river guide’s sharp eye, and a sleeping bag, triggered a search that ended the RCMP manhunt

 

[aphoto]

The getaway car was completely burned. The suspects were found. The murder was solved. The only people known to be traipsing through the burned remnants of the vehicle are media and curious locals.

The bumbling, foolish, sloppy, panicked, improper RCMP are doing their jobs according to their training and expertise. They know what is relevant.

The keys are irrelevant, and I highly doubt that the botanist's family wants his keys returned.

If the keys belong to LD they may be irrelevant but we don’t know for sure that every one of those keys belongs to him and the only way to find out would be a side by side comparison with another set of his families keys, something that wouldn’t have been done on the side of a dirt road in Manitoba.

There remains the possibility that the keys, or even just one key, belongs to another thus far unknown victim or to a building or storage locker which may contain more information.

What I am saying is it’s obvious the police hadn’t conclusively confirmed they were LDs keys and they also clearly hadn’t worked to determine who’s keys they may be.

They are most likely entirely irrelevant but the possibility remains that they may literally unlock new information.

 

[Francie Starr]

As it happens, Port Alberni is apparently distinguishing itself as the crime capital of Vancouver Island and rated among the highest in all of Canada. A look at the Crime Stoppers page paints a picture of petty crimes and burglaries - break and enter, theft from cars etc. Kid stuff primarily, from the looks of things, probably indicative of a drug use issue in that rural community. Recent Crimes | Alberni Valley Crime Stoppers

Another RCMP report confirms this POV.

https://www.albernivalleynews.com/news/port-alberni-a-safe-place-to-be-despite-crime-rate-says-rcmp/

According to Hunter’s report, criminal offenses for the quarter were up 17 percent in Port Alberni compared to 2018, and property crime was up 15 percent. Thefts, shoplifting and frauds are seeing the largest increases.

His report also references an increase in assaults but notes that 79 of the 81 cases reported were between people who already knew each other. Of the two remaining assaults, one was between a cab driver and a client and the other between an overdose prevention patient and a volunteer.

So thieving may well be part of the common experience for troubled youth in PA. (Both went to an alternative school where a town's "bad boys" establish a social structure that is not necessarily driven by a need for community acceptance) But physical attacks on strangers is rare to non-existent and the last murder in Port Alberni took place in 1996. I think that may be why a teenaged acquaintance, who has also been following this tragic escapade, tried out his theory on me. He proposed another possibility entirely. His theory is that BS and KM were driving up the highway in the dead of night and saw a van pulled over with the rear doors wide open; a hole in the window and nobody anywhere in sight. Assuming the van was abandoned, at least temporarily, they immediately pulled over and stripped the van of anything they could find of value. In the dark, they never saw the murder victims lying on the ground on the other side of the van. They carried on their way, probably high as kites and camping with their newly acquired gear. But then during the next few days, they learned not only had the van owners been murdered, but that they themselves had been declared missing and so they had no idea what to do, knowing that when they were found there could be questions about the stuff they had stole. They could think of only one thing - they needed a different vehicle in order to stay "disappeared". As for not contacting their families, few teenage time clocks are set to coincide with parental worries. In a month or two they could get in touch, perhaps. And then, stopping at a rest stop, they met an elderly gentleman with a terrific vehicle was parked nearby. He was picking mushrooms or something. Anyway he didn't seem to know anything about their situation. One thing followed another, including a completely accidental vehicle incident took place in which the Professor was run over by their truck, with the unlicensed BS at the wheel. Maybe he was backing up or something. They may or may not have tried to help but then they realized he was dead. What they did do was make another stupendously stupid decision. So they set their "incriminating" truck on fire, stole the Professor's Rav 4 and booted out of there. Is my teenaged sleuth friend's theory reasonable? (I just hope it doesn't get me booted from the forum. Sorry in advance, MODS, if I'm too close to the line.)

 

[srper2]

I highlighted the mistaken assumption. If there was indeed such a bearded man, driving such a Jeep Cherokee with stripes, he would have been found by RCMP.

I was not making a mistaken assumption, I should have said the last person reported seen with Chynna and Lucas, as there was a witness who made a clear report to the police about seeing this. I was not just mistakenly imagining that this person had been seen there. If you have seen other witness reports of people seen with Chynna and Lucas after 11.30pm, I haven't seen them? The next reported sighting of them as when they were deceased the next morning. If the lady who saw this man had a dash cam, that would have backed her report, but just because she didn't have photographic proof doesn't make her a liar, or mean police should just ignore her report.

 

[aphoto]

Actually, the sleeping bag was no where near the bodies. It was 110 km away from the bodies. A sleeping bag 110km from the bodies does not suggest that the suspects were no longer alive.

"The sleeping bag was spotted around 11 a.m. floating near Port Nelson, where the Nelson River spills into Hudson Bay."​

How a river guide’s sharp eye, and a sleeping bag, triggered a search that ended the RCMP manhunt

I’m more than happy to stand corrected. I wasn’t there when they were found but it’s clear the find prompted further searching at a time when the police were considering pulling out.

 

[Kubirai]

... doing their jobs according to their training and expertise. They know what is relevant.

The keys are irrelevant, and I highly doubt that the botanist's family wants his keys returned.

RCMP can and do make mistakes. Those keys are important evidence, no matter who was the owner.

 

[Gina20]

It is not an opinion but an understanding. If you fail to understand that a suspicious death is one that the police will look into as in Who is responsible for this death, then you need to examine your comprehension of the word suspicious.
In the case of an overdose, I doubt the police will be looking for a killer.

And the deaths of BS and KM will be treated as murders.

"Suspicious death" can turn out to be drug overdoses or even natural causes. The opioid crisis makes "suspicious death" a banal, common, overused term, unfortunately, heard every day without a second thought. It has almost become synonymous with fentanyl and carfentanyl ODs. I said I won't go down this rabbit hole again, so I'll leave it at that.