Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #114

[155etta]

Forgive me. I thought i included it.

Starts around 53 min mark. Have to listen to a crazy lady that called in chiming in (sorry if ur a sleuther).

Wow. I just watched this at about that mark (53 min), BG on loop walking those few steps. His feet definitely start to turn to his left just before the loop starts again. There's no mistaking it. Watch it and just look at his feet, especially that split second before it starts again. He's headed towards them. This is why they don't show more of the video. But yeah, crazy lady caller is hard to listen to. MOO.

 

[Charlot123]

It is possible to do a tower dump and obtain all the phone IMEI numbers and LE should have done that early in the case, for each of the towers in the area that day. They obviously have a good estimate of TOD. (Tbey have said they died within minutes of the recording and they have the autopsy) So they should have a small period of time to look thru phone logs. AJMO

Thank you. TOD and the numbers that pinged around the Monon Trails. Or, if he left his car further, next to the highway, what number stayed "stationary" from 12-4 or so, if it can be seen. I still hope he did take his cellphone number with him, and left it in the vehicle, or maybe swapped his phone with his kid's/ parent's/girlfriend's. It is very difficult to create a solid alibi without a cellphone.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Thank you. TOD and the numbers that pinged around the Monon Trails. Or, if he left his car further, next to the highway, what number stayed "stationary" from 12-4 or so, if it can be seen. I still hope he did take his cellphone number with him, and left it in the vehicle, or maybe swapped his phone with his kid's/ parent's/girlfriend's. It is very difficult to create a solid alibi without a cellphone.

I hope he had a phone too and I hope he had it powered on at least until he parked. If he had a smart phone even if he didn’t make or receive a call or text there are so many apps that capture location data. The only catches would be which one should LE reach out to and did he have location turned on or off.

Unfortunately I suspect he either didn’t have a phone, turned it off, or had a burner. JMO

 

[Fizzle]

I don't think he had a phone with him -- I think he planned this. He knew LE would check the data from the cell towers. As for Libby's phone, my guess is that he either threw it in the creek or otherwise attempted to destroy it.

 

[Cutiekitty]

I don’t think the video was in selfie mode anymore. An experiment involving my coffee table and a can of dry shampoo convinced me. The resulting shadow angles made the selfie mode theory hard for me to support. I’m back where I started.

I still don’t get why people think LG was filming with the camera lowered by her side. I’m not saying she wasn’t. Just curious.

 

[Boxer]

Replying to my own post to add that this line of thinking actually coincidences with the last GH live chat the other night. Some very interesting comments were made by Gray’s last caller. Around 2:00
Gray Hughes Investigates
Go to the one titled “Delphi Call In, share your thoughts

Thanks for that suggestion.
Super interesting.

 

[Boxer]

I don’t think the video was in selfie mode anymore. An experiment involving my coffee table and a can of dry shampoo convinced me. The resulting shadow angles made the selfie mode theory hard for me to support. I’m back where I started.

I still don’t get why people think LG was filming with the camera lowered by her side. I’m not saying she wasn’t. Just curious.

Early on the police said the video was a mess and that the extracted imagery was the best they could get. They described the BG clips as amazing that they could get it that clean. MOO I think that's because Libby swept it low trying to get a picture of him but also starting to react to the fact that he was approaching them in the manner he was.
She may have thought about dialing 911 but she or Abby was already under his gun and so hid the phone. She had no pockets so maybe hiding it in sports bra, sock or waistband.

 

[Falling Down]

I don’t think the video was in selfie mode anymore. An experiment involving my coffee table and a can of dry shampoo convinced me. The resulting shadow angles made the selfie mode theory hard for me to support. I’m back where I started.

I still don’t get why people think LG was filming with the camera lowered by her side. I’m not saying she wasn’t. Just curious.

People have mentioned that the video was taken from a spot just off of the bridge, with Abby being close to but between Libby and BG. I agree with this, and the idea that Libby's phone was down by her right side. thus the camera on the phone was pointed slightly upwards at this short just over one second length of video. GH did a good analysis earlier this year after the video was released. He added the phone movements to the cropped video released by LE.

So we have a cropped section of video to work with, zoomed in on BG, and the phone was moving as the video was being taken. If we had the uncropped, full screen version, what I'm describing would be easily seen.

 

[BNA]

People have mentioned that the video was taken from a spot just off of the bridge, with Abby being close to but between Libby and BG. I agree with this, and the idea that Libby's phone was down by her right side. thus the camera on the phone was pointed slightly upwards at this short just over one second length of video. GH did a good analysis earlier this year after the video was released. He added the phone movements to the cropped video released by LE.

So we have a cropped section of video to work with, zoomed in on BG, and the phone was moving as the video was being taken. If we had the uncropped, full screen version, what I'm describing would be easily seen.

Thanks for giving us another opportunity to watch that. Seriously.

I know we have gone back and forth on what this reveals to us and, most importantly, what it reveals about his gait...since that is what LE asked us to look at.

Now, most of us concluded, after earlier viewing of it, that it demonstrated that BG was walking the bridge with confidence. I know I did. But, does it?

As I view it tonight, it seems to me that he does not appear to be confident/comfortable at all.

Goes back to confirmation bias, I guess. But, I'd like to know what others think when viewing it with that bias.

 

[155etta]

Thanks for giving us another opportunity to watch that. Seriously.

I know we have gone back and forth on what this reveals to us and, most importantly, what it reveals about his gait...since that is what LE asked us to look at.

Now, most of us concluded, after earlier viewing of it, that it demonstrated that BG was walking the bridge with confidence. I know I did. But, does it?

As I view it tonight, it seems to me that he does not appear to be confident/comfortable at all.

Goes back to confirmation bias, I guess. But, I'd like to know what others think when viewing it with that bias.

I think LE asked us (actually, I think they were asking a few specific people only) to look at his gait because they know that a few specific people have seen him cross this bridge before and have even crossed it with him before. He knows that bridge. And I believe they now know who he is. MOO.

 

[Falling Down]

I think LE asked us (actually, I think they were asking a few specific people only) to look at his gait because they know that a few specific people have seen him cross this bridge before and have even crossed it with him before. He knows that bridge. And I believe they now know who he is. MOO.

My hope is that someone or some people know the identity of BG, and will contact LE in the near future, if they haven't already.

Let this be the thread.

-FD

 

[scadagirl28]

Thanks for giving us another opportunity to watch that. Seriously.

I know we have gone back and forth on what this reveals to us and, most importantly, what it reveals about his gait...since that is what LE asked us to look at.

Now, most of us concluded, after earlier viewing of it, that it demonstrated that BG was walking the bridge with confidence. I know I did. But, does it?

As I view it tonight, it seems to me that he does not appear to be confident/comfortable at all.

Goes back to confirmation bias, I guess. But, I'd like to know what others think when viewing it with that bias.

His voice sounds confident. He is walking on a old bridge, possibly trying to keep his lower face obscured , while keeping the girls in his line of sight. I also think he is trying to keep whatever is in is jacket from falling out while he gets his weapon.

 

[MJPeony]

I think LE asked us (actually, I think they were asking a few specific people only) to look at his gait because they know that a few specific people have seen him cross this bridge before and have even crossed it with him before. He knows that bridge. And I believe they now know who he is. MOO.

BBM

Very interesting. It’s a nuance, but that specific thought had not occurred to me before. It gives me chills actually when it’s put that way. That someone would watch the video clip and immediately recognize the person because they’ve seen him cross that very bridge before. Can you imagine? That may very well be the type of recognition that LE is hoping for.


MOO.

 

[Charlot123]

They will get their man when they (LE) can prove he was there. I remain positive in LE and think they know who. Albeit I wobble occasionally on that thought.

MingyMoo

I am wobbling on that thought, too. For years the LE suspected someone else to be GSK, although D'Angelo was also on their list.

I just re-read the info about April Tinsley's case. They, too, initially suspected someone very different.

It seems that in most cases, the perp is on the list, but not on top.

So, I am not holding my breath that "the LE know".

 

[moonlessnight]

I don't think they did but now they do, IMO.

I am wobbling on that thought, too. For years the LE suspected someone else to be GSK, although D'Angelo was also on their list.

I just re-read the info about April Tinsley's case. They, too, initially suspected someone very different.

It seems that in most cases, the perp is on the list, but not on top.

So, I am not holding my breath that "the LE know".

 

[Charlot123]

I don't think they did but now they do, IMO.

Hoping and keeping fingers crossed. Justice for Abby and Libby.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

• ABIGAIL WILLIAMS
• Feb 21st 2017Murder Victims Delphi, Carroll County, Indiana February 13, 2017
• LIBERTY GERMAN Feb 21st 2017Murder Victims Delphi, Carroll County, Indiana February 13, 2017
• Seeking Information in Indiana Double-Murder Investigation
• Apr 24th 2019Investigators have released an updated voice recording and video of the suspect not previously released that was extracted from slain 14-year-old Liberty German’s cell phone.[Download]
• Information Sought in Investigation into Deaths of Liberty German and Abigail Williams
• Feb 22nd 2017Members of our community may have information to assist in the investigation into the deaths of Liberty German and Abigail Williams.
• UNKNOWN SUSPECT
• 
  
• Voice of Unknown Subject in Indiana Double-Murder Investigation: Feb 22nd 2017Recording of unknown subject in Indiana homicide investigation saying "Down the hill."[Download]

 

[rosesfromangels]

Wow. I just watched this at about that mark (53 min), BG on loop walking those few steps. His feet definitely start to turn to his left just before the loop starts again. There's no mistaking it. Watch it and just look at his feet, especially that split second before it starts again. He's headed towards them. This is why they don't show more of the video. But yeah, crazy lady caller is hard to listen to. MOO.

I always listen to the “crazy lady” people very carefully. Very. Few people do, and quickly dismiss them as crackpots. What I have learned is they often have something important to contribute, to tell; they just have a very hard time verbalizing it because of chaotic or disordered thinking. But I always listen very carefully to see if I can mine that nugget of gold from the tangle of thoughts. And there almost always is a nugget of gold in there.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Justice101]

It is possible to do a tower dump and obtain all the phone IMEI numbers and LE should have done that early in the case, for each of the towers in the area that day. They obviously have a good estimate of TOD. (Tbey have said they died within minutes of the recording and they have the autopsy) So they should have a small period of time to look thru phone logs. AJMO

My understanding is you cannot get a search warrant for random data from a cell tower. My understanding is this is not legal. Instead, if you have a specific cell number you want to trace, the cell phone company has 30 days to provide you data on all the cell towers it pinged on the date(s) searched.

Sometimes I wish it were different, but my understanding is this protects privacy of others.

 

[Justice101]

People have mentioned that the video was taken from a spot just off of the bridge, with Abby being close to but between Libby and BG. I agree with this, and the idea that Libby's phone was down by her right side. thus the camera on the phone was pointed slightly upwards at this short just over one second length of video. GH did a good analysis earlier this year after the video was released. He added the phone movements to the cropped video released by LE.

So we have a cropped section of video to work with, zoomed in on BG, and the phone was moving as the video was being taken. If we had the uncropped, full screen version, what I'm describing would be easily seen.

I have never seen that multiple-frame video. All I saw before was the 2 photo video gif.

This should have been broadcast everywhere.