NJ NJ - Dulce Mariá Alavez, 5, abducted @ Bridgeton City Park, Cumberland Co, 16 Sep 2019 #7

[WildOrchid]

Excellent post!

Lots of good info in this article. I found 3 major take-aways.

1) It's interesting that both Hispanic and non-Hispanic locals mention prevalent distrust in the community of LE. I don't know what can be done about this within Bridgeton, but it's a clear illustration of the difficulty in putting toothpaste back in the tube. Once that level of distrust exists toward LE, you can't fix it with a few verbal reassurances and press conferences. It takes a lot of consistently positive engagement, and time for the positive interactions to be recognized as the norm. Especially when multiple agencies are involved. Trust is a fragile thing and once it's broken it's not going to be a quick fix, even if people know they may have to rely on the distrusted party some day.

2) Also of note: the public simply doesn't know what they can do to help. The quote from Abelina Cardoza is telling – she doesn't think posting on social media is necessarily enough, but she doesn't know what else she can do. I think this feeling of not knowing how to take effective action in the wake of an outrageous crime is common, and some guidelines for civilians who want to aid police could be helpful. When police do public outreach it usually on precautions to take against becoming crime victims, which is all well and good. But when a suspected crime with a still-endangered victim has occurred already, ordinary people often want to know how they can assist with rescue or advocacy, without getting in the way of LE investigators and professional efforts. It's not that they want to play at being cops, but some people really do want to be useful to both a stressed police force and a person or family in crisis – without winging it and making more of a mess of things.

Yet we rarely see any official guidance on that, are rarely told (for example) to come in and get vetted in advance of a situation, or educated about procedures and protocols so we can assist effectively from the outset. So we fall back to marches and vigils and social media blasts, but those feel more symbolic than practical IMO, especially in the case of a child who vanished almost four months ago. Perhaps a list of effective tactics for non-LE 'concerned citizens' could be developed, to be posted in public buildings and grounds, schools, etc, so that from a young age children are exposed to this idea of a community partnership with LE.

3) Finally, Jackie Rodriguez seems utterly oblivious to the fact that her comments on Dr. Phil did far more damage than Noema's affect or words. I wish Noema could show a little of Jackie's passion and directness, that she could express herself in a way that draws attention, which seems to be Jackie's main talent. Then the family could break with Jackie, who is less a reliable advocate/spokesperson than a bomb-throwing, foot-shooting loose cannon.

Lots of good info in this article. I found 3 major take-aways.

1) It's interesting that both Hispanic and non-Hispanic locals mention prevalent distrust in the community of LE. I don't know what can be done about this within Bridgeton, but it's a clear illustration of the difficulty in putting toothpaste back in the tube. Once that level of distrust exists toward LE, you can't fix it with a few verbal reassurances and press conferences. It takes a lot of consistently positive engagement, and time for the positive interactions to be recognized as the norm. Especially when multiple agencies are involved. Trust is a fragile thing and once it's broken it's not going to be a quick fix, even if people know they may have to rely on the distrusted party some day.

2) Also of note: the public simply doesn't know what they can do to help. The quote from Abelina Cardoza is telling – she doesn't think posting on social media is necessarily enough, but she doesn't know what else she can do. I think this feeling of not knowing how to take effective action in the wake of an outrageous crime is common, and some guidelines for civilians who want to aid police could be helpful. When police do public outreach it usually on precautions to take against becoming crime victims, which is all well and good. But when a suspected crime with a still-endangered victim has occurred already, ordinary people often want to know how they can assist with rescue or advocacy, without getting in the way of LE investigators and professional efforts. It's not that they want to play at being cops, but some people really do want to be useful to both a stressed police force and a person or family in crisis – without winging it and making more of a mess of things.

Yet we rarely see any official guidance on that, are rarely told (for example) to come in and get vetted in advance of a situation, or educated about procedures and protocols so we can assist effectively from the outset. So we fall back to marches and vigils and social media blasts, but those feel more symbolic than practical IMO, especially in the case of a child who vanished almost four months ago. Perhaps a list of effective tactics for non-LE 'concerned citizens' could be developed, to be posted in public buildings and grounds, schools, etc, so that from a young age children are exposed to this idea of a community partnership with LE.

3) Finally, Jackie Rodriguez seems utterly oblivious to the fact that her comments on Dr. Phil did far more damage than Noema's affect or words. I wish Noema could show a little of Jackie's passion and directness, that she could express herself in a way that draws attention, which seems to be Jackie's main talent. Then the family could break with Jackie, who is less a reliable advocate/spokesperson than a bomb-throwing, foot-shooting loose cannon.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Lots of good info in this article. I found 3 major take-aways.

1) It's interesting that both Hispanic and non-Hispanic locals mention prevalent distrust in the community of LE. I don't know what can be done about this within Bridgeton, but it's a clear illustration of the difficulty in putting toothpaste back in the tube. Once that level of distrust exists toward LE, you can't fix it with a few verbal reassurances and press conferences. It takes a lot of consistently positive engagement, and time for the positive interactions to be recognized as the norm. Especially when multiple agencies are involved. Trust is a fragile thing and once it's broken it's not going to be a quick fix, even if people know they may have to rely on the distrusted party some day.

2) Also of note: the public simply doesn't know what they can do to help. The quote from Abelina Cardoza is telling – she doesn't think posting on social media is necessarily enough, but she doesn't know what else she can do. I think this feeling of not knowing how to take effective action in the wake of an outrageous crime is common, and some guidelines for civilians who want to aid police could be helpful. When police do public outreach it usually on precautions to take against becoming crime victims, which is all well and good. But when a suspected crime with a still-endangered victim has occurred already, ordinary people often want to know how they can assist with rescue or advocacy, without getting in the way of LE investigators and professional efforts. It's not that they want to play at being cops, but some people really do want to be useful to both a stressed police force and a person or family in crisis – without winging it and making more of a mess of things.

Yet we rarely see any official guidance on that, are rarely told (for example) to come in and get vetted in advance of a situation, or educated about procedures and protocols so we can assist effectively from the outset. So we fall back to marches and vigils and social media blasts, but those feel more symbolic than practical IMO, especially in the case of a child who vanished almost four months ago. Perhaps a list of effective tactics for non-LE 'concerned citizens' could be developed, to be posted in public buildings and grounds, schools, etc, so that from a young age children are exposed to this idea of a community partnership with LE.

3) Finally, Jackie Rodriguez seems utterly oblivious to the fact that her comments on Dr. Phil did far more damage than Noema's affect or words. I wish Noema could show a little of Jackie's passion and directness, that she could express herself in a way that draws attention, which seems to be Jackie's main talent. Then the family could break with Jackie, who is less a reliable advocate/spokesperson than a bomb-throwing, foot-shooting loose cannon.

Thank you for this well thought out post. Your analysis of the current situation probably reflects many of their community members feelings.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

It’s really difficult for us because we don’t get answers anymore, not like we did before. They just repeat their survey, but there are literally no answers,” said the mother of Dulce, Noema Alavez.

Now about eight months pregnant, Dulce’s mother walked with supporters from Dulce Park was last seen on the steps of City Hall.

There, awaiting the mayor of Bridgeton, Albert Kelly.

“Dulce will never be forgotten, never forgotten,” said Kelly.

“They are not going to be questioned about their documentation, we are not going to follow up on that. All we want is information about Dulce Maria Alavez,” added Kelly.

“Are you going to put cameras in the park?” asked Alavez.

“Yes, we are looking to see how we can get there,” replied the mayor.

Dulce’s mother doesn’t give up either.

“We miss her very much. We are not going to give up until we find her,” she said.
Dulce Maria Alavez, missing 5-year-old girl visits Bridgeton City Hall, New Jersey - Go Tech Daily

 

[WildOrchid]

Repeat their survey?

It’s really difficult for us because we don’t get answers anymore, not like we did before. They just repeat their survey, but there are literally no answers,” said the mother of Dulce, Noema Alavez.


Dulce Maria Alavez, missing 5-year-old girl visits Bridgeton City Hall, New Jersey - Go Tech Daily

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Rifts could hinder search for missing N.J. girl | Editorial
Editorial: bbm
That Kelly and Bridgeton Police Chief Michael A. Gaimari Jr. felt the need to defend the official search effort suggests a communications deficit with community members whose ongoing aid remains useful, perhaps critical. The police chief indicated that law enforcement organizations continue to meet daily, that they’ve followed some 5,000 leads, and that (contrary to some social media posts) the Alavez family gets updates twice a week. He also indicated that some progress had been made in the past few weeks, although he understandably did not provide specifics.

It’s less clear why Mayor Kelly, who also writes a column for the South Jersey Times, would decline to comment about the security camera request. (According to a report from ABC-owned TV stations, Kelly told protesters earlier that cameras would be installed.) If they’re lacking, one would expect a purchase request would be sent to the express line.

Budget concerns and a limited expectation of privacy in a park might slow the process. Yet, privacy expectations don’t extend to spaces around buildings, parking lots or where motor vehicles are normally driven. Dulce, according to early witness reports, was taken into a van.

If the mayor, council and police acknowledge insufficient video monitoring, they have an implicit obligation to step up park patrols until equipment can be installed. Is the extra police presence that no doubt followed Dulce’s disappearance being maintained?

To date, the number of organized searches involving volunteers has been admirable. Although it’s up to official agencies to communicate how hard they’re working to locate Dulce, unsupported claims that too little is being done can undermine an entire community’s resolve to find this little girl. Don’t lose the will or the means to keep going.

Send a letter to the editor of South Jersey Times at sjletters@njadvancemedia.com

Bookmark NJ.com/Opinion. Follow on Twitter @NJ_Opinion and find NJ.com Opinion on Facebook.

 

[Suglo]

Repeat their survey?

She’s probably translating the word she uses in Spanish literally to English. I don’t know what that word would be in Mexico. Survey does show up as a synonym of investigation in Spanish. Not that it would make much more sense in that sentence. I would love to hear her say this in Spanish so I could translate what she meant by survey.

 

[MimosaMornings]

I would take it one of two ways.

* repeat/review what they have been doing

* repeat/ask same questions to Noema.

 

[MimosaMornings]

JMO
Breaking with JR might be good, but I think there is a need for a professional advocate or liaison to help the family. Both JR and Noema bothered me on the show, frustrating and sad to watch. There is no emotion - whether sad or happy.

 

[WildOrchid]

I agree with you wholeheartedly. There is no mama bear ferocity that I can see in either Norma or Noema here that I would expect to see in a primary caregiver. I think that comes from fear (for any number of reasons) rather than lack of love. The grandfather is rarely seen, the teen brother isn’t an adult as far as I know, the boyfriend is not visible in interviews (not around or standing off camera?) and it has been stated that Noema has no friends. That leaves who to show up with a more commanding and engaging presence? Clergy perhaps or another stranger (as JR was) to volunteer.
I think the need is great. It can only be someone else’s fault for no action for so long and then one must pull themselves up by their bootstraps and get to moving. Otherwise....it looks like this. Just MOO

JMO
Breaking with JR might be good, but I think there is a need for a professional advocate or liaison to help the family. Both JR and Noema bothered me on the show, frustrating and sad to watch. There is no emotion - whether sad or happy.

 

[WildOrchid]

Where specifically could the family go to get an advocate? Are there services in the community? For instance, a family services association in my area can either get help for a family or point in the right direction anywhere in the county.

 

[Suglo]

Where specifically could the family go to get an advocate? Are there services in the community? For instance, a family services association in my area can either get help for a family or point in the right direction anywhere in the county.

The police department should have a victim’s advocate on their payroll. Someone they trust (and who knows the system) to work with victims’ families to bridge any gap.

 

[Suglo]

Many states have Victims Compensation Boards that have advocates and also help victims get compensation for lost wages, funeral expenses, etc. This is the link to New Jersey’s. I hope someone here can pass this info on to Dulce’s family.

State of New Jersey

 

[JDough]

Many states have Victims Compensation Boards that have advocates and also help victims get compensation for lost wages, funeral expenses, etc. This is the link to New Jersey’s. I hope someone here can pass this info on to Dulce’s family.

State of New Jersey

I wonder if an advocate has been offered, but refused by the family? Has the current spokeswoman discouraged using an advocate, and the family lacks trust with the police department?

I thought I had read early on that an advocate had contacted the family, but don't remember hearing anything more? I can't find the article, so MOO!

I am just very concerned that the current spokeswoman is so entangled with the situation (wormed her way in), that the family trusts her implicitly, and they are unable to trust anyone else? Just a personal thought that I can't shake; I don't believe this woman is qualified to be representing the family.

 

[Suglo]

I wonder if an advocate has been offered, but refused by the family? Has the current spokeswoman discouraged using an advocate, and the family lacks trust with the police department?

I thought I had read early on that an advocate had contacted the family, but don't remember hearing anything more? I can't find the article, so MOO!

I am just very concerned that the current spokeswoman is so entangled with the situation (wormed her way in), that the family trusts her implicitly, and they are unable to trust anyone else? Just a personal thought that I can't shake; I don't believe this woman is qualified to be representing the family.

I completely agree with your assessment and feelings. I remember reading something similar. I fear the damage done by that person is irreversible.

 

[casesensitive]

I wonder if an advocate has been offered, but refused by the family? Has the current spokeswoman discouraged using an advocate, and the family lacks trust with the police department?

I thought I had read early on that an advocate had contacted the family, but don't remember hearing anything more? I can't find the article, so MOO!

I am just very concerned that the current spokeswoman is so entangled with the situation (wormed her way in), that the family trusts her implicitly, and they are unable to trust anyone else? Just a personal thought that I can't shake; I don't believe this woman is qualified to be representing the family.

I think we all agree that the current spokeswoman is not qualified to be representing the family. Her main role appeared to be as a translator for Noema for media events. The reality is nobody else was helping the family in the initial aftermath of Dulce's disappearance. Any advocate would have to be bilingual, and maybe that delayed a professional advocate being found immediately, but I'm not sure that any help was offered to the family in this regard until some time later.

I can understand why Noema latched on to the spokeswoman initially. I can't understand why she would continue to trust her as an advocate after the Dr. Phil's show. It is time for Noema to realize that she and her family need a qualified advocate. I hope that someone steps in and offers help.

 

[PunkCake]

Lots of good info in this article. I found 3 major take-aways.

1) It's interesting that both Hispanic and non-Hispanic locals mention prevalent distrust in the community of LE. I don't know what can be done about this within Bridgeton, but it's a clear illustration of the difficulty in putting toothpaste back in the tube. Once that level of distrust exists toward LE, you can't fix it with a few verbal reassurances and press conferences. It takes a lot of consistently positive engagement, and time for the positive interactions to be recognized as the norm. Especially when multiple agencies are involved. Trust is a fragile thing and once it's broken it's not going to be a quick fix, even if people know they may have to rely on the distrusted party some day.

2) Also of note: the public simply doesn't know what they can do to help. The quote from Abelina Cardoza is telling – she doesn't think posting on social media is necessarily enough, but she doesn't know what else she can do. I think this feeling of not knowing how to take effective action in the wake of an outrageous crime is common, and some guidelines for civilians who want to aid police could be helpful. When police do public outreach it usually on precautions to take against becoming crime victims, which is all well and good. But when a suspected crime with a still-endangered victim has occurred already, ordinary people often want to know how they can assist with rescue or advocacy, without getting in the way of LE investigators and professional efforts. It's not that they want to play at being cops, but some people really do want to be useful to both a stressed police force and a person or family in crisis – without winging it and making more of a mess of things.

Yet we rarely see any official guidance on that, are rarely told (for example) to come in and get vetted in advance of a situation, or educated about procedures and protocols so we can assist effectively from the outset. So we fall back to marches and vigils and social media blasts, but those feel more symbolic than practical IMO, especially in the case of a child who vanished almost four months ago. Perhaps a list of effective tactics for non-LE 'concerned citizens' could be developed, to be posted in public buildings and grounds, schools, etc, so that from a young age children are exposed to this idea of a community partnership with LE.

3) Finally, Jackie Rodriguez seems utterly oblivious to the fact that her comments on Dr. Phil did far more damage than Noema's affect or words. I wish Noema could show a little of Jackie's passion and directness, that she could express herself in a way that draws attention, which seems to be Jackie's main talent. Then the family could break with Jackie, who is less a reliable advocate/spokesperson than a bomb-throwing, foot-shooting loose cannon.

I’m a glutton for punishment because I’m somehow back to this thread.

JR is.... not a good look for this family, in this situation. We have more than enough community outreach programs right in bridgeton (I genuinely interned at one).

Donnelly is out of touch.
There’s the normal apprehensiveness towards LE & the Govt that is pretty much standard with the events of the last few decades.
This is a child. Not some random guy getting jumped in front of a bunch of witnesses that then refuse to talk & he refuses to file a police report.
Our LE actually contain a majority of younger officers (awkwardly a lot that I’ve known for a while and weren’t always and still aren’t completely straight laced.)

Like I said. This is a CHILD. Children are EVERYTHING to our community.

Our LE does a lot to keep communication and trust open. I personally love our National Night Out that we have every year with HUGE DIVERSE turn outs. And the kids love the K9 presentations and generally just socializing/taking pictures with LE. They answer questions, let the kids pose in/around the swat vehicles (I have a great series of pictures of me falling off the front of one for the officer to catch me lol).

The article was true that the community is kind of lost as to what to do next.

But I don’t know. I’ve been really trying to retire myself out of this case because there’s theories that I know are so far out simply because I’m here and I know people & trends in crime reported AND unreported. But I can’t rearrange the narrative anonymously and without the concrete evidence needed to post.

I’m just heartbroken all around. For her. For her family. For the community.

 

[Suglo]

I’m a glutton for punishment because I’m somehow back to this thread.

JR is.... not a good look for this family, in this situation. We have more than enough community outreach programs right in bridgeton (I genuinely interned at one).

Donnelly is out of touch.
There’s the normal apprehensiveness towards LE & the Govt that is pretty much standard with the events of the last few decades.
This is a child. Not some random guy getting jumped in front of a bunch of witnesses that then refuse to talk & he refuses to file a police report.
Our LE actually contain a majority of younger officers (awkwardly a lot that I’ve known for a while and weren’t always and still aren’t completely straight laced.)

Like I said. This is a CHILD. Children are EVERYTHING to our community.

Our LE does a lot to keep communication and trust open. I personally love our National Night Out that we have every year with HUGE DIVERSE turn outs. And the kids love the K9 presentations and generally just socializing/taking pictures with LE. They answer questions, let the kids pose in/around the swat vehicles (I have a great series of pictures of me falling off the front of one for the officer to catch me lol).

The article was true that the community is kind of lost as to what to do next.

But I don’t know. I’ve been really trying to retire myself out of this case because there’s theories that I know are so far out simply because I’m here and I know people & trends in crime reported AND unreported. But I can’t rearrange the narrative anonymously and without the concrete evidence needed to post.

I’m just heartbroken all around. For her. For her family. For the community.

I’m genuinely touched by your post. It gives me hope that the community does care and that somehow she will be found. Thank you for coming back!

 

[Stunned]

Yes, thanks for giving us another chance.

 

[283]

I’m not a fan of the spokesperson but she posted this video tour of the park which provides goods perspective - in case anyone is interested ?
She shows perspective from where mom was parked as well as from the opposite side where the storage sheds are located and the roads leading thru.

 

[MJPeony]

I’m not a fan of the spokesperson but she posted this video tour of the park which provides goods perspective - in case anyone is interested ?
She shows perspective from where mom was parked as well as from the opposite side where the storage sheds are located and the roads leading thru.

Thanks for posting that.

Well, watching and listening to that was like walking through wet cement, but it does give me a better idea of the environment and geography than what I’d previously seen. And I’m now (MOO) more convinced than ever that whoever took Dulce knew Noema was in the car out of sight, so therefore must have either followed them there or had been watching them in visits past and saw a pattern. They didn’t risk it- they knew there was no chance of being seen and had cover of the little hill. And since they’d only just been there a few minutes, I think the perp was well prepared. JMO.