OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #54

[dgfred]

I think good ole mom watched the kids.

 

[IType]

One thing that has puzzled me is, who kept the babies during the crime? We know that JW had S that night as well as GW had his son, so either someone else is involved that watched the babies that night or one of the four actually wasn’t there and was babysitting, or they took the babies with them or they left the babies home alone, a nightmare all the way around. My heart goes out to the Rhoden and Gilley families, May they receive the Justice they deserve, all just my opinion only.

My money is on one of the W4 stayed home with the kids. If that proves to be correct, then my first guess is AW stayed home, second guess would be GW4.

 

[Dudly]

CC
Didn't LE find casings at the Wagners old farm? Also the forensic evidence of the bullet marking coming out of the barrel of a gun matches what was recovered from the bodies, there is no way Judge Deering will throw it out, JMO

You have to have the gun to do ballistic tests to match a gun to a bullet recovered from a crime scene. Casings don't do that, they will show it is likely the same gun fired the bullets but not prove that gun was used to commit a crime like ballistic testing does. They have casings, from two scenes but no gun to match up with the casings or bullets retrieved from what has been released.

 

[IType]

I wonder if what the defense attorneys find out from the recorded conversations, if it will have some type of influence on GW4 finally getting a new pre-trial hearing date.

The last hearing date for him is from January 21st and in just one more week it will be 2 months since GW4 has had a new hearing scheduled.

His attorneys will show him the transcripts and have him listen to the conversations then figure out how to defend him - against his own words - if he unknowingly incriminated himself.

Another thing I want to find out is if Deering will grant Jake's Motion to throw out the shell casing evidence.

According to a news reporter, reporting from the Pike County Courthouse, shell casings from Chris SR's and the Wagner property are in evidence.
Defense says they have no guns to go with the casings.

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if GW4 wants to know what is in those conversations because he's thinking about trying to cut a deal in order to avoid the DP. I could be completely wrong. Him not having a hearing scheduled for the last two months--not even discussing a next hearing date at his last appearance in court (when all 3 of his co-defendants had next hearing dates set at their last appearance)--is rather telling. AC didn't even say anything about a date for the next hearing. She only mentioned the upcoming meeting to provide info on the recorded conversations that the defense wants to see. All just my opinion.

 

[IType]

One thing that has puzzled me is, who kept the babies during the crime? We know that JW had S that night as well as GW had his son, so either someone else is involved that watched the babies that night or one of the four actually wasn’t there and was babysitting, or they took the babies with them or they left the babies home alone, a nightmare all the way around. My heart goes out to the Rhoden and Gilley families, May they receive the Justice they deserve, all just my opinion only.

My money is on one of the W4 stayed with the kids. If that theory proves to be correct, my first guess would be AW.

 

[Dudly]

My money is on one of the W4 stayed home with the kids. If that proves to be correct, then my first guess is AW stayed home, second guess would be GW4.

My thought was JW stayed home with the Ws thinking if the worst happen he would get custody of SW.

 

[IType]

My thought was JW stayed home with the Ws thinking if the worst happen he would get custody of SW.

It's entirely possible. If he was at home with the children, there's no way he could accidentally get killed if things went wrong during the shootings. It would ensure his own safety. Pretty crappy to throw your brother and parents under the bus like that and put them in harms' way to do your dirty work...but then again, if you're so callous as to plan the murder of another individual (let alone eight), what do you care if your parents/sibling get killed in the crossfire? IMO

 

[Cool Cats]

You have to have the gun to do ballistic tests to match a gun to a bullet recovered from a crime scene. Casings don't do that, they will show it is likely the same gun fired the bullets but not prove that gun was used to commit a crime like ballistic testing does. They have casings, from two scenes but no gun to match up with the casings or bullets retrieved from what has been released.

CC
Didn't LE find casings at the Wagners old farm? Also the forensic evidence of the bullet marking coming out of the barrel of a gun matches what was recovered from the bodies, there is no way Judge Deering will throw it out, JMO

Here is what the reporter said:

Mike Schell Fox 19 NOW February 11th, 2020
Outside Pike County Courthouse:

"Just a follow up from Jake Wagner's hearing yesterday his attorneys filed 4 motions they include questioning the opinion of a shoe expert a shoe print expert who saw photos of the crime scenes. Jake Wagner's attorneys claim that the State does not have any of the shoes that belong to the wagners."

Schell looks down at his notes, maybe a copy of the motions, then says:

"Another question that they are considering is the bullet casings that were found outside of Jake Wagner's home and at the crime scenes. His attorneys say the State does not even have a gun to match up the ballistics from those bullet casings."

1.) So they have shoe print evidence from the crime scenes that they can at least match to the sizes of the 4 Wagners' current shoe sizes, and match to their Walmart boot purchases.

2.) Then they have actual bullets, all 32 bullets did not go into the victims and then all of them miraculously disappear. We know at least 2 different caliber bullets were used.

3.) Then they have bullet casings from outside the Wagner's home and from the actual crime scenes. We don't know if any of the Wagner casings match the crime scene casings. Maybe, maybe not.

Yes, you are correct, no way is Judge Deering going to throw all this evidence out and not let the shoeprint/ballistics experts testify about their findings in front of the jury (in my opinion). Of course the defense is trying to get this evidence thrown out --- WHY?

Because that is what the defense does and maybe something in this evidence is making an incriminating connection?

I wouldn't be surprised if the defense files a motion to throw out the recorded conversations.

....2 Cents Only......

 

[StrangeOne]

One thing that has puzzled me is, who kept the babies during the crime? We know that JW had S that night as well as GW had his son, so either someone else is involved that watched the babies that night or one of the four actually wasn’t there and was babysitting, or they took the babies with them or they left the babies home alone, a nightmare all the way around. My heart goes out to the Rhoden and Gilley families, May they receive the Justice they deserve, all just my opinion only.

It has always been my opinion the family members surrounding the case have always known more about it. They had to have a discussion of some kind when they cooked up the forging of the custody papers.

 

[Cool Cats]

It has always been my opinion the family members surrounding the case have always known more about it. They had to have a discussion of some kind when they cooked up the forging of the custody papers.

We thought Rita, Angela's mom, was in on it and even signed the documents. Now, it turns out it is not her signature on the documents and it is possible Angie signed her name without her consent.

When Rita got the Grand Jury Summons Angie may have panicked then told Rita what she did and that she wanted Rita to lie.

Rita admitted she had been lying and now she has had enough of it....2 Cents....

 

[Fight4justice]

My money is on one of the W4 stayed home with the kids. If that proves to be correct, then my first guess is AW stayed home, second guess would be GW4.

Yeah my guess was GW4 as well, explains his rage, he wasn’t there but being charged just the same. My opinion.

 

[Cool Cats]

Yeah my guess was GW4 as well, explains his rage, he wasn’t there but being charged just the same. My opinion.

I don't know, he was talking revenge more than the rest and we know he and Jake are prolific hunters and it seems hunters would go out and do the shooting so I believe those 2 went.

And I think It would be Gw3 who was "best friends" at one time with Chris Sr. who would be the one to confront Chris Sr. in his home.

I can only picture Angie staying at home, and if she did not, then I believe the 3 guys would have wanted to go with her. Angie took full time care of those kids, if anyone stayed with them I would pick her...Or Rita or Fred who maybe they trusted to keep quiet and lie. Rita was lying, in my opinion, because they told her to.

 

[Puzzles8]

My thought was JW stayed home with the Ws thinking if the worst happen he would get custody of SW.

Why would they even consider the thought that they would be caught?
After all they are the W Family - money, influence and corruption has always made sure there were never any consequences of their actions.

Plus, they had a script to follow.. What could go wrong?

IMO, MOO

 

[Puzzles8]

It's entirely possible. If he was at home with the children, there's no way he could accidentally get killed if things went wrong during the shootings. It would ensure his own safety. Pretty crappy to throw your brother and parents under the bus like that and put them in harms' way to do your dirty work...but then again, if you're so callous as to plan the murder of another individual (let alone eight), what do you care if your parents/sibling get killed in the crossfire? IMO

Clearly, the apples did not fall far from the tree.

IMO, MOO

 

[Puzzles8]

We thought Rita, Angela's mom, was in on it and even signed the documents. Now, it turns out it is not her signature on the documents and it is possible Angie signed her name without her consent.

When Rita got the Grand Jury Summons Angie may have panicked then told Rita what she did and that she wanted Rita to lie.

Rita admitted she had been lying and now she has had enough of it....2 Cents....

There is also the possibility that AW had used RN's Notary Stamp on many other documents, without RN's knowledge.

Maybe RN didn't find out about the other documents "she" notarized until after she had appeared before the Grand Jury.

Later, AC presented RN and her attorneys with the additional documents "she" had notarized.

I have no idea what type of legal documents they might have been, but the thought is interesting.

IMO, MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

There is also the possibility that AW had used RN's Notary Stamp on many other documents, without RN's knowledge.

Maybe RN didn't find out about the other documents "she" notarized until after she had appeared before the Grand Jury.

Later, AC presented RN and her attorneys with the additional documents "she" had notarized.

I have no idea what type of legal documents they might have been, but the thought is interesting.

IMO, MOO

Your right, there could be any number of documents with Rita's notary stamp.
Using your documents senario I assume:

Rita gets the GJ subpoena at her door and freaks out calling Angela first thing.
Angela has to think about it and grows anxious. She thinks about all the fake documents that she
stamped after stealing Rita's notary seal.

Angie knows if the prosecutor blind-sides Rita on the stand, about all the fake documents with her personal seal plus her signatures, that Rita will get upset claiming she has no idea what the prosecutor is talking about.

Angie has to come clean with mom and get her to lie because, as she explains to mom, it would be better for Angela if it looks like she had nothing to do with fake custody documents. Canepa said Angie said this to Rita. I can't remember Canepa's exact words.

There are 198 files in the "Daily Files" relating to Jake trying to get custody:

Dropbox - State's Motion Continuance Rita.pdf - Simplify your life

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Your right, there could be any number of documents with Rita's notary stamp.
Using your documents senario I assume:

Rita gets the GJ subpoena at her door and freaks out calling Angela first thing.
Angela has to think about it and grows anxious. She thinks about all the fake documents that she
stamped after stealing Rita's notary seal.

Angie knows if the prosecutor blind-sides Rita on the stand, about all the fake documents with her personal seal plus her signatures, that Rita will get upset claiming she has no idea what the prosecutor is talking about.

Angie has to come clean with mom and get her to lie because, as she explains to mom, it would be better for Angela if it looks like she had nothing to do with fake custody documents. Canepa said Angie said this to Rita. I can't remember Canepa's exact words.

There are 198 files in the "Daily Files" relating to Jake trying to get custody:

Dropbox - State's Motion Continuance Rita.pdf - Simplify your life

CC
I’ve been setting here reading all the good guesses of who watched the 2 little Wagner kids the night of the murders, How About (RW) she is real close to Billy and probably would do anything he ask, not knowing what the 4 Wagners where doing that night, JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

CC
I’ve been setting here reading all the good guesses of who watched the 2 little Wagner kids the night of the murders, How About (RW) she is real close to Billy and probably would do anything he ask, not knowing what the 4 Wagners where doing that night, JMO

I can see Billy asking Fred to lie to cover his arse, and Angela asking Rita to lie to cover her arse,
but I cannot picture Billy doing that to Robin.

Unless there is security camera footage, GPS, witnesses, receipts, etc...vouching for the Wagners being somewhere away from home - very late April 21/22 - then the only alibi they have is that they were all home sleeping.

So if someone babysat late that night, Billy would have to ask that person to lie and not tell LE they were baby sitting for them.
I can't picture Billy doing that to Robin.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

CC
I’ve been setting here reading all the good guesses of who watched the 2 little Wagner kids the night of the murders, How About (RW) she is real close to Billy and probably would do anything he ask, not knowing what the 4 Wagners where doing that night, JMO

IMO, no way... no how. I do have a theory but since it's not fact based, I'll sit on it for now.

 

[Cool Cats]

Why would they even consider the thought that they would be caught?
After all they are the W Family - money, influence and corruption has always made sure there were never any consequences of their actions.

Plus, they had a script to follow.. What could go wrong?

IMO, MOO

Agree. The Wagners went through with it because they didn't think they'd be caught. Period. Getting caught was not an option.
DeWine had said the killers are long gone and there are no witnesses.

The Wagners thought like most amateurs think:

That if there are no witnesses, no surveillance left behind, no DNA, no weapons revovered, no clothing recovered, nothing to tie them to the Rhodens that night, then they can't be caught. How could they?

But like all amateurs they were ignorant over evidence they could leave beforehand. All they
think about are the crime scenes and covering their tracks and getting rid of evidence etc.... But imagine the Wagners surprise when they saw indictments charging them with crimes that happened before the murders.

Custody documents, stalking, sharing the home layouts, custody spread sheet, computer hacking, illegal surveillance, plotting since January 2016, and of course shopping for murder supplies.

Imagine Jake's frustration that there is footprint and ballistic evidence, he thought if they threw out their shoes and guns and caught the spent cartridges then that would be the end of it. I imagine Jake emphasizing this to his attorneys, imploring them to have that evidence tossed out, which they are trying to do with the motions.

Viva Success the Wagner way -- not so much anymore.....2 Cents.....