Found Deceased UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *Arrest* #4

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Been following this case since it happened. I am a local man living in Accrington and was one of the many who helped looked for Lindsay. I have lived in Accrington all my life and live currently 2 minutes away from the forest and cricket club where the defendant will have walked towards the cemetery. I walk my dog along these ways nearly everyday. Just to put you in the picture.

After following this since the start and today without no new evidence i have come to my conclusion of what i think has happened. As being close to the scene i can imagine the routes and ways he has also gone around it.

My judgement is that the defendant is the person who killed Lindsay Birbeck. This person has looked for the opportunity that day to kill a woman. In his own head he has planned, looked and seized that opportunity. On the day of the murder the defendant had a bag ready with all the equipment to try and dismember and hide a body aswell as the blue bin to move the body. The only reason you would have these to hand that day is because it was a planned murder by the boy. The CCTV shows the defendant leaving the coppice and walking back to get his bag. The time states 8 to 9 minutes, with myself knowing the local area that would give him enough time to walk down past the coppice, go behind the cemetery into the woods, collect his bag and walk back up. The only way he could of been that quick is by having that bag to hand , quickly collecting it and walking back up to burnley road and then entering the coppice. Its quite a walk there and back. Just to let you all know that where the defendant has walked, there is a short path that leads up to the caravan park where he was from. He will of walked from his caravan with his bag and maybe the bin also but certainly the bag, left it in the bushes, murdered Lindsay and then walked down to get it. The bag would of stopped him doing what he wanted to do with also the fact he didn't know if it was all going to go as it did. He also didn't know where about on the coppice this murder would occur. Why the coppice also? It could of happened in the woods behind the cemetery or even around the cemetery area.

The witness woman who saw the man on the coppice will of been the defendant. Lucky for her i really do think that she could of been his victim and he was on the look for an opportunity to murder a woman. There is no reason for him to be around there other than for that in my eyes. No walkers had seen him before and i also know a lot of people who walk the coppice daily and they have never seen him before and neither has anyone else. I think her looking at him, her taking a different route and her walking down the path has saved her life. He has then disappeared as she said in her statement and he has gone looking for another victim. Unfortunately the next victim was Lindsay. I also think he has been startled by the witness on the coppice, leading him to exit the coppice near to the crime scene behind whittakers pub and at the most unluckiest of times for Lindsay, she has walked up that way, they have crossed paths and he has murdered her. Could it of been because he was leaving the coppice and going back towards home or was he waiting for someone else to walk that way? We will never know.

Because he has really planned what he was going to do he has wrapped the body very well that night, put the body into the blue bin and hidden this bin around the bushes and overgrown into the coppice behind the whittakers pub. When the time has come for him to move it because searches have gone cold and less people are around and haven't found the bin with the body he has then decided to move this into the cemetery to hide the body. Why the cemetery i thought? Why not bury the body around where he murdered her? I think there could be numerous reasons. Many people walking at night especially a lot more now with the disappearance of Lindsay and he could be caught. Maybe like a lot of killers he had a lot of remorse and a lot of days to think about it and he wanted to bury her in the cemetery. Or it was easy to move the body closer to where he knew and was easy access from where he lived and where he was used to. Maybe he saw the article regarding the police had done a search at the cemetery. Its all a mystery regarding that.

The items that have gone missing , her phone , fitbit etc and clothes he has got rid of on the day. Whether they have been burnt or whether he has just put them in a bin and its just been emptied the next day and its as easy as that. The items found in the skip will of been some of the waste he put in the bin after getting the body in the bin.

What i do find remarkable though is how he moved her. Now with her size and looking at Lindsay i would put her at around 14/15 stone. Now i have a bin outside full of garden waste, im a strong male and i tell you something its extremely difficult to pull in those bins and for someone to pull it along burnley road, where he was seen on cctv has small incline is remarkable.

The boy has serious issues. The motive i think will confuse people for a long time. Myself, i think he has alot of issues, had murder in his mind and wanted to do what he planned to do that day. He packed that bag full of essentials to hide a body that day and he was at the scene of the crime. Another reason i think he may of killed Lindsay, not for someone else but i think personally for him. Maybe he needed to prove a point to someone that he was this dangerous person to friends or to family and wanted a reputation. But my head says that he is just a cold blooded murderer like alot of people that have previously done it and Lindsay was entering the coppice while he was leaving or waiting and he has done what he wanted to do.

Regarding the gory way she was murdered, i think he has strangled her by kneeling on her neck then once she has has passed out he has made sure she is dead by stamping numerous times aggressively on her neck to make sure she was dead. Its like murderers who repeatedly stab a victim or use a hammer etc. Its never once.

I also think the husband and wife who witnessed a coat hung up in the bushes and a noise was the defendant with Lindsay. I think by then Lindsay was dead and he had taken her jacket off, put it to the side and he was planning to do something with the body or he was doing something with the body hence why the coat was taken off.

These are my views and to me i cant see it being anything else. If anyone wants to question or ask me anything about what i have said then i will answer.
Thank you so much for taking the time to set this out, it's really helpful.

My immediate thoughts are that the cemetery makes sense if it's quite easy to access from where he lives. He may have wanted to check his crime was undiscovered on a regular basis. He may have noticed the tree root hole.

I agree totally with your point of view as to how it all unfolded and why.

I'm really sorry that your community has been tainted by this horror and hope you will all be able to walk your dogs again without awful memories.
 
It didn't to me initially but is possible. 11 minutes walk from the burnley Rd cctv to the point on the coppice path of possible red jacket sighting. Time 4.17pm. The voice Mrs Bibby heard wad the defendant telling LB to be quiet or LB softly pleading with him. He used his knee to silence her... Very small window but doable. IMO

I spent some time this evening - without success - trying to find the detailed timeline that was quoted for Judith Bibby in the first trial. I had thought they parked the car at 4.20pm, meaning that they would have reached the spot where she saw the red material/jacket at about 4.26pm

But I am sure the Prosecution would not get his timings wrong in his closing speech, so it must have been confirmed as 4.17pm or close to. Still, sadly, just enough time for the defendant ( or whoever it was ) to attack Lindsay, probably moments before Mrs B arrived there.
 
That's a can of worms that's just been opened!

Sexually motivated assaults have a multitude of underlying motives.

In my experience it is a crime whose primary motivation is to exert power and control over the victim.

There may sometimes be an element of needing sexual gratification but these may from extreme sexual practices.

Just my opinion of course.

Don't worry, I'm not going there. I was focusing more on "there may or may not be overt sexual contact reflected in the crime scene."
 
Just to add what i have put above. Less than 2 years ago there was a sexual assault behind where i live which is the forest leading to the cemetery , where the path is that leads to the caravan site and the industrial site where the defendant was seen on cctv and also where the defendant will have collected the bag and bin he was seen with going to the coppice. Now, after looking at this the last couple of days could this be the defendant? (See link and pictures). The defendant especially on the pictures from the cctv looks older than he actually is and we have also realised through the trial he is alot stronger than he looks. The pictures for me look very similar and he is described as with a parting in his hair what he has and also seems the correct height. The only thing which seems wrong is she described him as blonde. Did she just get the hair colour wrong? However, since his name came out around Accrington , pictures starting circulating and i am sure i saw a picture of him with blonde hair. Did he dye it after being worried about being caught? It just makes me wonder if it was him and this could of been part of his mind and why he may of done what he has done to Lindsay? Could this be him and he could of been sexually motivated?

I really dont know but the picture especially from an evofit looks like him, the location makes sense and other than the hair which i have explained it could be him. Obviously its speculation but it just came to me the other day. The man was never caught.

This is the link for the story... Police issue Evofit after dog walker sexually assaulted in Accrington
 

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Just to add what i have put above. Less than 2 years ago there was a sexual assault behind where i live which is the forest leading to the cemetery , where the path is that leads to the caravan site and the industrial site where the defendant was seen on cctv and also where the defendant will have collected the bag and bin he was seen with going to the coppice with. Now, after looking at this the last couple of days could this be the defendant? (See link and pictures). The defendant especially on the pictures from the cctv looks older than he also as we have realised stronger than he looks. The pictures for me look very similar and he is described as with a parting in his hair what he has and also seems the correct height. The only thing which seems wrong is she described him as blonde. Did she just get the hair colour wrong? However, since his name came out around Accrington , pictures starting circulating and i am sure i saw a picture of him with blonde hair. Did he dye it after being worried about being caught? It just makes me wonder if it was him and this could of been part of his mind and why he may of done what he has done to Lindsay? Could this be him and he could of been sexually motivated?

I really dont know but the picture especially from an evofit looks like him, the location makes sense and other than the hair which i have explained it could be him. Obviously its speculation but it just came to me the other day. The man was never caught.

This is the link for the story... Police issue Evofit after dog walker sexually assaulted in Accrington
They actually do look alike. The sunlight can make your hair look lighter than it is so it's possible it was a mistake. Definitely makes u wonder if it's connected
 
Just to add what i have put above. Less than 2 years ago there was a sexual assault behind where i live which is the forest leading to the cemetery , where the path is that leads to the caravan site and the industrial site where the defendant was seen on cctv and also where the defendant will have collected the bag and bin he was seen with going to the coppice with. Now, after looking at this the last couple of days could this be the defendant? (See link and pictures). The defendant especially on the pictures from the cctv looks older than he also as we have realised stronger than he looks. The pictures for me look very similar and he is described as with a parting in his hair what he has and also seems the correct height. The only thing which seems wrong is she described him as blonde. Did she just get the hair colour wrong? However, since his name came out around Accrington , pictures starting circulating and i am sure i saw a picture of him with blonde hair. Did he dye it after being worried about being caught? It just makes me wonder if it was him and this could of been part of his mind and why he may of done what he has done to Lindsay? Could this be him and he could of been sexually motivated?

I really dont know but the picture especially from an evofit looks like him, the location makes sense and other than the hair which i have explained it could be him. Obviously its speculation but it just came to me the other day. The man was never caught.

This is the link for the story... Police issue Evofit after dog walker sexually assaulted in Accrington

Thanks for this.

Yes, I found this report the other day when trying to find any previous incidents of stranger attacks in the Huncoat area.

It happened in a field very close to Whinney Hill Road in August 2018, if I recall.

I noted the difference in the description of the offenders hair, being blonde as well as the age difference then, our defendant would have been 15?

Witness descriptions can often be wide of the mark but nevertheless the close proximity to the defendants home and the similar clothing style do make him a credible suspect worthy of further investigation.

I could not find any reports of arrest and charge.
 
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After reading the prosecution's summing up and how they've brought all the evidence together, I'm pretty much convinced he did it and most likely alone... I'm less convinced that it's been proven sufficiently to actually get a guilty verdict though. Hopefully what the jury heard was more convincing than the reporting, as if he did do it, letting a clearly very dangerous young man go free would be terrible. I can certainly see the possibilities in the assault Accylocal has linked to above, too, which could mean an escalating pattern building, and so even more likely he'd repeat it if found not guilty.

And yet, it's circumstantial enough, and a clever enough defence which "explains" all forensic evidence found, that the doubt could well be enough. I do hope the judge frames it as a choice between "he did it" and "mystery man did it" and no 3rd explanations allowed, as the mystery man is clearly ridiculous, however, someone known to him is not impossible (although I do believe from the CCTV movements that it's highly unlikely that anyone else was up there for nefarious purposes at that time).
 
After reading the prosecution's summing up and how they've brought all the evidence together, I'm pretty much convinced he did it and most likely alone... I'm less convinced that it's been proven sufficiently to actually get a guilty verdict though. Hopefully what the jury heard was more convincing than the reporting, as if he did do it, letting a clearly very dangerous young man go free would be terrible. I can certainly see the possibilities in the assault Accylocal has linked to above, too, which could mean an escalating pattern building, and so even more likely he'd repeat it if found not guilty.

And yet, it's circumstantial enough, and a clever enough defence which "explains" all forensic evidence found, that the doubt could well be enough. I do hope the judge frames it as a choice between "he did it" and "mystery man did it" and no 3rd explanations allowed, as the mystery man is clearly ridiculous, however, someone known to him is not impossible (although I do believe from the CCTV movements that it's highly unlikely that anyone else was up there for nefarious purposes at that time).

Totally agree, although the options based on the evidence are 'mystery man' killed LB or defendant killed LB.

There was no evidence presented to the jury which enables them to consider a third option of a man known to the defendant.

Hopefully the Judge will make this clear in her instructions to the jury......tomorrow!
 
I spent some time this evening - without success - trying to find the detailed timeline that was quoted for Judith Bibby in the first trial. I had thought they parked the car at 4.20pm, meaning that they would have reached the spot where she saw the red material/jacket at about 4.26pm

But I am sure the Prosecution would not get his timings wrong in his closing speech, so it must have been confirmed as 4.17pm or close to. Still, sadly, just enough time for the defendant ( or whoever it was ) to attack Lindsay, probably moments before Mrs B arrived there.

I’m sure they said in court that their vehicles had been caught on CCTV to verify the times stated. I’ll try and find it in the court updates.


This is from the first trial - again not clear if the 4.20pm is arrival time or viewing time


Dog walker Judith Bibby said she went to the Coppice with her husband Martin at 4.20pm on August 12 and noticed a red anorak hanging on a barb wire fence post.


She also 'heard a voice' but could 'not say if it was male of female'. She said: "It was soft, not shouting, nothing malicious."
 
This is from the first trial - again not clear if the 4.20pm is arrival time or viewing time


Dog walker Judith Bibby said she went to the Coppice with her husband Martin at 4.20pm on August 12 and noticed a red anorak hanging on a barb wire fence post.


She also 'heard a voice' but could 'not say if it was male of female'. She said: "It was soft, not shouting, nothing malicious."
Besides the timings, I'm not sure of the logic. If JB heard a voice I think LB may still have been alive when the Bibbys walked by.
 
Judith Bibby evidence from the first trial - they parked up at 4.20pm






More CCTV is now being shown to the court - it shows the Bibby's entering The Coppice area in their car.

"Judith says in her statement: I was walking in The Coppice on August 12.

"I was with my husband Martin.

"We usually go to The Coppice everyday to walk the dog.

"On Monday August 12 we left Baxenden around 4.10pm and arrived to park at Peel Park Avenue about 4.20pm.

"We set off and I was about 45 yards behind Martin.

"We recahed a blind bend and as we walked past this I glanced to my left, not for any reason, I just did.

"I saw what looked like a red anorak hanging on the fence.

"I could see barbed wire, I don't think it was hanging on the post.

"It was shiny, it was a nice day and I thought it was strange as the area to the left of the path where we were was covered in brambles.

"The only way you would be able to get to the fence where the anorak was was through the field and the path is about four metres away from this and the fiels was fully overgrown.

"I carried on and heard a voice.

"I could not say if it was a male or a female voice. I thought it was kids.

"It was just a voice though, quite soft, not malicious.

"I did not know what was being said.

"I had no idea Lindsay Birbeck was missing at that point."

Lindsay Birbeck murder trial day two - live updates from Preston Crown Court
 
Been following this case since it happened. I am a local man living in Accrington and was one of the many who helped looked for Lindsay. I have lived in Accrington all my life and live currently 2 minutes away from the forest and cricket club where the defendant will have walked towards the cemetery. I walk my dog along these ways nearly everyday. Just to put you in the picture.

After following this since the start and today without no new evidence i have come to my conclusion of what i think has happened. As being close to the scene i can imagine the routes and ways he has also gone around it.

My judgement is that the defendant is the person who killed Lindsay Birbeck. This person has looked for the opportunity that day to kill a woman. In his own head he has planned, looked and seized that opportunity. On the day of the murder the defendant had a bag ready with all the equipment to try and dismember and hide a body aswell as the blue bin to move the body. The only reason you would have these to hand that day is because it was a planned murder by the boy. The CCTV shows the defendant leaving the coppice and walking back to get his bag. The time states 8 to 9 minutes, with myself knowing the local area that would give him enough time to walk down past the coppice, go behind the cemetery into the woods, collect his bag and walk back up. The only way he could of been that quick is by having that bag to hand , quickly collecting it and walking back up to burnley road and then entering the coppice. Its quite a walk there and back. Just to let you all know that where the defendant has walked, there is a short path that leads up to the caravan park where he was from. He will of walked from his travellers site with his bag and maybe the bin also but certainly the bag, left it in the bushes, murdered Lindsay and then walked down to get it. The bag would of stopped him doing what he wanted to do with also the fact he didn't know if it was all going to go as it did. He also didn't know where about on the coppice this murder would occur. Why the coppice also? It could of happened in the woods behind the cemetery or even around the cemetery area.

The witness woman who saw the man on the coppice will of been the defendant. Lucky for her i really do think that she could of been his victim and he was on the look for an opportunity to murder a woman. There is no reason for him to be around there other than for that in my eyes. No walkers had seen him before and i also know a lot of people who walk the coppice daily and they have never seen him before and neither has anyone else. I think her looking at him, her taking a different route and her walking down the path has saved her life. He has then disappeared as she said in her statement and he has gone looking for another victim. Unfortunately the next victim was Lindsay. I also think he has been startled by the witness on the coppice, leading him to exit the coppice near to the crime scene behind whittakers pub and at the most unluckiest of times for Lindsay, she has walked up that way, they have crossed paths and he has murdered her. Could it of been because he was leaving the coppice and going back towards home or was he waiting for someone else to walk that way? We will never know.

Because he has really planned what he was going to do he has wrapped the body very well that night, put the body into the blue bin and hidden this bin around the bushes and overgrown into the coppice behind the whittakers pub. When the time has come for him to move it because searches have gone cold and less people are around and haven't found the bin with the body he has then decided to move this into the cemetery to hide the body. Why the cemetery i thought? Why not bury the body around where he murdered her? I think there could be numerous reasons. Many people walking at night especially a lot more now with the disappearance of Lindsay and he could be caught. Maybe like a lot of killers he had a lot of remorse and a lot of days to think about it and he wanted to bury her in the cemetery. Or it was easy to move the body closer to where he knew and was easy access from where he lived and where he was used to. Maybe he saw the article regarding the police had done a search at the cemetery. Its all a mystery regarding that.

The items that have gone missing , her phone , fitbit etc and clothes he has got rid of on the day. Whether they have been burnt or whether he has just put them in a bin and its just been emptied the next day and its as easy as that. The items found in the skip will of been some of the waste he put in the bin after getting the body in the bin.

What i do find remarkable though is how he moved her. Now with her size and looking at Lindsay i would put her at around 14/15 stone. Now i have a bin outside full of garden waste, im a strong male and i tell you something its extremely difficult to pull in those bins and for someone to pull it along burnley road, where he was seen on cctv has small incline is remarkable.

The boy has serious issues. The motive i think will confuse people for a long time. Myself, i think he has alot of issues, had murder in his mind and wanted to do what he planned to do that day. He packed that bag full of essentials to hide a body that day and he was at the scene of the crime. Another reason i think he may of killed Lindsay, not for someone else but i think personally for him. Maybe he needed to prove a point to someone that he was this dangerous person to friends or to family and wanted a reputation. But my head says that he is just a cold blooded murderer like alot of people that have previously done it and Lindsay was entering the coppice while he was leaving or waiting and he has done what he wanted to do.

Regarding the gory way she was murdered, i think he has strangled her by kneeling on her neck then once she has has passed out he has made sure she is dead by stamping numerous times aggressively on her neck to make sure she was dead. Its like murderers who repeatedly stab a victim or use a hammer etc. Its never once.

I also think the husband and wife who witnessed a coat hung up in the bushes and a noise was the defendant with Lindsay. I think by then Lindsay was dead and he had taken her jacket off, put it to the side and he was planning to do something with the body or he was doing something with the body hence why the coat was taken off.

These are my views and to me i cant see it being anything else. If anyone wants to question or ask me anything about what i have said then i will answer.


Thank you for this. I would agree that he acted alone, I hadn’t however factored in him hiding his rucksack. That’s a very scary thought that he could have planned this in so much detail.

Do you really think she looks 15st tho? She looks quite svelte in the CCTV clip. I would probably put her around 12.

Not that I have stepped on a scale for along time. Especially not during lockdown ;)
 
Thanks for this.

Yes, I found this report the other day when trying to find any previous incidents of stranger attacks in the Huncoat area.

It happened very close to Whinney Hill Road in August 2018, if I recall.

I noted the difference in the description of the offenders hair, being blonde as well as the age difference then, our defendant would have been 15?

Witness descriptions can often be wide of the mark but nevertheless the close proximity to the defendants home and the similar clothing style do make him a credible suspect worthy of further investigation.

I could not find any reports of arrest and charge.

So, as you go up whinney hill road you turn right before you get to the top and you enter the woods. Im not sure what they are called but its a long wooded stretch that lead to the cricket club, highams playing fields and also to the cemetery. What is worrying after this happened is how many family friends (female) have walked along this. Its really isolated and somewhere you could hide something , move something or do something without being noticed. Somewhere you wouldn't walk at night. So where it happened was just as you walk through the entrance ive shown on the picture you can see the dots for the path leading you in the woods behind the houses and this is around where it happened. 5 minutes walk from the cemetery area and not far at all from the traveller site.

I still at 15 being of the family origin he was from and the way he looks in the cctv moving the bin he looks alot older than he is. He is mentioned to have dark shoes and a full tracksuit. Sound fimiliar?

Yes could be a misunderstanding, could be he was wearing a wig, he may have dyed his hair or the hair may of seemed a different colour in the light. It just weirdly matches. Is this where the defendant started his interest in assaulting women? Im not sure if the police have picked up on this and have looked into this.
 

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So, as you go up whinney hill road you turn right before you get to the top and you enter the woods. Im not sure what they are called but its a long wooded stretch that lead to the cricket club, highams playing fields and also to the cemetery. What is worrying after this happened is how many family friends (female) have walked along this. Its really isolated and somewhere you could hide something , move something or do something without being noticed. Somewhere you wouldn't walk at night. So where it happened was just as you walk through the entrance ive shown on the picture you can see the dots for the path leading you in the woods behind the houses and this is around where it happened. 5 minutes walk from the cemetery area and not far at all from the traveller site.

I still at 15 being of the family origin he was from and the way he looks in the cctv moving the bin he looks alot older than he is. He is mentioned to have dark shoes and a full tracksuit. Sound fimiliar?

Yes could be a misunderstanding, could be he was wearing a wig, he may have dyed his hair or the hair may of seemed a different colour in the light. It just weirdly matches. Is this where the defendant started his interest in assaulting women? Im not sure if the police have picked up on this and have looked into this.
I would have thought this must have rung alarm bells with the police, they may have discounted it, or they haven’t discounted it but it would be prejudicial to the current trial.
 
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