Found Deceased UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #11

[Alethea]

Does anyone know why the police would opt to have the body identified by dental records and not by a family member? Sorry if that sounds crass but would a reason be that the body is in too distressing a sight to see (I don’t want to give example but hopefully you know what I’m getting at) vs totally unrecognisable due to decomposition or burning?

It would mean the person is not recognizable where they could be conclusively identified by sight. It doesn’t have to be complete destruction. If someone’s face is badly injured and they do not have any identifying marks like a tattoo, specific birthmark, etc., LE may not be confident in a visual identification that would rule out all other people. Visual identifications are usually followed up with further checks so it is not too odd.

We don’t know what happened but I don’t think we can or should jump to worst case scenario.

 

[Stella123]

The not handling the guns request could be because he then hoped he would get a desk job in the Met so he then could hear feedback about the investigation or become part of it himself.
Or he visited a doctor for stess/anxiety and they told him he should not be handling guns due to his current illness and either he should inform them or the medical practice would.

What ever it was he had a motive for doing so.

Ooh good point! Trying to evade being caught. IMO

 

[Alethea]

Here’s a paper on forensic odontology if anyone’s interested: Role of forensic odontologist in post mortem person identification

 

[MsBetsy]

I don't think anyone has an agenda, women are angry that we're clearly not safe and that the vast majority of that danger comes from men, and such a lot of sexual harassment is completely ignored by society and the police. I think the vigil for Sarah was a really beautiful idea, and I feel as well as honouring Sarah, it also represented women coming together with this outpouring of emotion her murder has brought to light. She was killed because violence towards women is a horrible issue, and that issue affects all of us - I don't think the two things can really be separated.

I'm not sure why anyone would think it's a political agenda to be angry that a police officer has brutally murdered someone, and to be angry that so many men hurt and harass women. Labelling that as political feels to me like yet another way of minimising the issue and invalidating women's experiences.

It's sad it did get heated, but I think that speaks to how much collective grief and fear and outrage people are feeling, for Sarah and for the very reason why she died.

It was Sarah's friend who said that she would not want her murder to be politicized and that the actions of one man do not reflect all men or all police officers. I think it's more that her family and friends don't want people using her murder to support a cause.

Her friend wrote, "Sarah was a humble, private and sensible person and I feel certain she would not agree with the circumstances of her disappearance being used to promote these kinds of ideas."

Police had already warned the public that the event would be unlawful, that's why organizers called for a national doorstep vigil instead.

There's nothing wrong with being angry and protesting, but doing it in the middle of a pandemic is probably not a good idea.

 

[kittythehare]

How can family and friends know absolutely everything about your life and your friends, acquaintances, one off encounters with a person in the street/office/supermarket/online? etc
It is impossible for your f&f to be entirely certain who you are friends with and whether you know a particular person or not.

Well that is the information that is published.
That is what we get to discuss here.
Until and if contradictory information is printed by MSM we can assume they were not known to each other.

 

[LolaPasha]

Until questioned though, the police wouldn't know if the alibi is false or not?

Penalties for assisting offenders.

(1)Where a person has committed [F1a relevant offence], any other person who, knowing or believing him to be guilty of the offence or of some [F2other relevant offence], does without lawful authority or reasonable excuse any act with intent to impede his apprehension or prosecution shall be guilty of an offence.

Criminal Law Act 1967

EC must have known/been reasonable to have known that WC had offended. Thinking he was at work and covering for him that way would not be an offence on her part

 

[Herat]

It would mean the person is not recognizable where they could be conclusively identified by sight. It doesn’t have to be complete destruction. If someone’s face is badly injured and they do not have any identifying marks like a tattoo, specific birthmark, etc., LE may not be confident in a visual identification that would rule out all other people. Visual identifications are usually followed up with further checks so it is not too odd.

We don’t know what happened but I don’t think we can or should jump to worst case scenario.

Other considerations:

You can't do fingerprint identification if you don't already have a set of fingerprints on record, or if the fingerpads have been damaged.

You can't do DNA analysis if the person was not the child of either of the parents, ie: was adopted and prior DNA testing hadn't been done.

I am not making any claims, just stating some other reasons.

JMHO

 

[SmallNut]

UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #11

I'm wondering if he used a gun - given his email to his boss on 6th March. You'd be much more likely to submit to someone with a gun. If he was emailing to say he no longer wished to be armed does this suggest he was armed - and did he hand his gun in at the end of his shift? From WC's reported actions (IE, sick leave etc) it does appear that he was losing it and the gun email strikes me as an acknowledgement of how dangerous he realises he has become & how having access to a firearm has enabled this.

(Hope it's OK to speculate and query. First post for a while - like many this case has really hit me - I lived for over 5 years in different parts of South London close to where Sarah was abducted in my late 20s and early 30s (and used to walk home on brightly lit thoroughfares at night)).

Edit - sorry meant to quote post 158 but a bit rusty - the link at the top leads to it.

 

[Gibbo214]

I think this makes sense. I was also wondering, while the thread was closed, if maybe WC was setting the stage to leave the country or otherwise disappear himself. Making it seem like he would be extending his leave due to stress, but actually fleeing to somewhere unknown in an effort to hide because he assumed they were on to him, or would soon be on to him. All speculation.

I know that some people have done it, but it is pretty hard to get lost in the world today.

Except it had been cancelled after a court case so was not legal. Under Covid legislation which the Police have to uphold. The original organisers cancelled the event as a result and suggested people lighting a candle at home instead. It was awful seeing demonstrators having to be removed and it is what happens when Police have to deal with large crowds when they feel it is unsafe and it's not legal. There would not have needed to be a Police presence in that way if we were not in the middle of a pandemic. I think it's a difficult emotive situation but neither was it pleasant for Police who have not murdered anyone, to have abuse hurled at them.

There are still people dying of Covid as well which is why crowds are illegal at present. The Police were doing their job to protect life!

"
Organisers of a vigil planned for Sarah Everard in south London are still hopeful it can take place, despite effectively losing a High Court challenge against a ban on the event.

But the Metropolitan Police urged people to find a "lawful and safer way" to express views on women's safety."

Sarah Everard vigil organisers lose court challenge

BBM. This is what women are told when the establishment thinks that they are stepping out of line. 'Behave like ladies and you will be treated like ladies'. Most 'ladies' have enough of men or male establishments telling females how to behave when they are visibly not behaving.
I think that most of the anger comes from men's sexual attacks or just harassment is not taken seriously. I bet that many, many more instances of indecent exposure pop up about him, if they were even recorded when women made complaints.

 

[kittythehare]

UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #11

I'm wondering if he used a gun - given his email to his boss on 6th March. You'd be much more likely to submit to someone with a gun. If he was emailing to say he no longer wished to be armed does this suggest he was armed - and did he hand his gun in at the end of his shift? From WC's reported actions (IE, sick leave etc) it does appear that he was losing it and the gun email strikes me as an acknowledgement of how dangerous he realises he has become & how having access to a firearm has enabled this.

(Hope it's OK to speculate and query. First post for a while - like many this case has really hit me - I lived for over 5 years in different parts of South London close to where Sarah was abducted in my late 20s and early 30s (and used to walk home on brightly lit thoroughfares at night)).

Edit - sorry meant to quote post 158 but a bit rusty - the link at the top leads to it.

A lot of toy guns look remarkably real.
A victim has no way to tell.

 

[sagesun11]

Women are angry. Everybody is angry.
But a vigil for Sarah should , at the very least have taken Sarah, the victim and her wishes into consideration.
This is not what Sarah would have wanted

Anything less is a desecration.
Collective gatherings during covid with so many variants and so many victims disrespects all and sundry.

How do you imagine her family feels? Comforted? Reassured? After the scenes, the scenes that arise during almost every protest during covid times...

With all due respect, women all throughout that vigil were chanting her name before things escalated. Women were calling for her to be remembered and chanting "her name was Sarah" as evidenced by videos there. What's more, unfortunately, we do not know what Sarah would have wanted. And while I appreciate the article her friend wrote, neither does she. She cannot say for certain despite her saying she can. No one is here to gatekeep how anyone grieves and I believe it should stay that way.

It is upsetting of course that things escalated the way they did and that some took the opportunity to be violent and harmful.

 

[Gibbo214]

It was Sarah's friend who said that she would not want her murder to be politicized and that the actions of one man do not reflect all men or all police officers. I think it's more that her family and friends don't want people using her murder to support a cause.

Her friend wrote, "Sarah was a humble, private and sensible person and I feel certain she would not agree with the circumstances of her disappearance being used to promote these kinds of ideas."

Police had already warned the public that the event would be unlawful, that's why organizers called for a national doorstep vigil instead.

There's nothing wrong with being angry and protesting, but doing it in the middle of a pandemic is probably not a good idea.

IMO you are seeing it from an American viewpoint. It is not 'a cause' and IMO it is not political.

 

[Stella123]

I wonder if the CCTV shows if it was threat by a weapon or just brute force to get someone in a car. The unknown bit (that doesn't bear thinking about) is how to keep someone in the car against their will.

 

[Seni]

Hey, I think you might mean my post - here it is again just because you said you'd looked for it.

Rest in peace Sarah, you deserved to live.

"Hello, first time poster!

Snipping one of your point:

1. The police rearrested WC for murder BEFORE they found Sarah's body, didn't they?


NO it was afterwards.

 

[Mollie123]

Apologies for a naive question.
Does anyone know if UK police officers have their fingerprints taken?

 

[Stella123]

With all due respect, women all throughout that vigil were chanting her name before things escalated. Women were calling for her to be remembered and chanting "her name was Sarah" as evidenced by videos there. What's more, unfortunately, we do not know what Sarah would have wanted. And while I appreciate the article her friend wrote, neither does she. She cannot say for certain despite her saying she can. No one is here to gatekeep how anyone grieves and I believe it should stay that way.

It is upsetting of course that things escalated the way they did and that some took the opportunity to be violent and harmful.

It is unfortunate yes, there was another "group" who did politicize it a bit I think and at all such gatherings this does tend to happen.

 

[minneolo]

USA Central time zone picking up the torch / candles for Sarah now.

It just past 9:30pm local time for me.

Apparently i would have to learn how to resize photos to post my candles.

Thinking of Sarah and all women at risk on any street tonight

 

[Herat]

Apologies for a naive question.
Does anyone know if UK police officers have their fingerprints taken?

Undoubtedly

 

[Nancywho]

It was Sarah's friend who said that she would not want her murder to be politicized and that the actions of one man do not reflect all men or all police officers. I think it's more that her family and friends don't want people using her murder to support a cause.

Her friend wrote, "Sarah was a humble, private and sensible person and I feel certain she would not agree with the circumstances of her disappearance being used to promote these kinds of ideas."

Police had already warned the public that the event would be unlawful, that's why organizers called for a national doorstep vigil instead.

There's nothing wrong with being angry and protesting, but doing it in the middle of a pandemic is probably not a good idea.

Difficult when the very cause is women's safety and if more had been done about that, Sarah herself might still be here.

And with the pandemic, absolutely unfortunate timing but as with George Floyd's death sparking the BLM movement, sometimes when horrible things happen, they propel people to act to prevent those things continuing to happen, and that can't wait, even for a pandemic.

 

[SmallNut]

A lot of toy guns look remarkably real.
A victim has no way to tell.

Quite right - but WC emailed his boss on 6th March saying he no longer wanted to be armed. Which suggests access to real guns. I agree that if confronted with what looks like a gun you would likely comply. JMO but it seems possible that he could have actually had a gun. If he didn't hand his in after his last shift then I'm concerned (given that email) that he used it in some way (to gain power or worse) on 3rd March.