ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow #4

[lab.tx]

A few thoughts - if any facts have been established that render the below points incorrect/no longer valid, please let me know!

(1) if the only reason that the two roommates survived was that their doors were locked, IMO this wasn’t as specifically targeted as it was more of a “mass” killing (albeit potentially targeted on the house), and potentially leans to more of a random individual vs someone close to them. In this scenario I’m thinking someone out of their inner circle with more serial killer leanings.

What bothers me is that there is so much rage with how the murders/crime scene are described, that seeing a locked door and that being the reason someone calmed down and left makes me think 1. At least one of the victims was specifically targeted or 2. It was more of a nefarious character.

(2) the dog. It’s not clear if the dog was at home or with someone else. These dogs BARK. *IF* it was home, a few scenarios come to mind that that I don’t think have been answered:

1. The girls took it out when they got back, and when the killer came in it escaped (referencing separate calls to cops about a loose dog)

2. The dog wasn’t there when they got home because the killer had come in and let it out, anticipating a dog barking and then laid in wait on the top floor/bottom floor. This might explain the calls to J, although IMO I think they were just calling as many of us have done/experienced late at night.

(3) I think the calls are a red herring largely (with the exception of the above scenario).

(4) overall, IMO, I’m on the fence as to whether it was someone who they knew/had been in the house vs someone who fixated on them/one of them and just wanted to kill. We don’t have a ton of facts.

Great post - also has me wondering now...J has the same breed of dog or mention of a the same dog on his social media pic. Possibly got them as a couple. I wonder if the girls got back and realized the dog was missing (murderer could have let the dog out). They were looking for the dog and both called J maybe wanting help finding the dog. Maybe KG was outside searching and MM called Jack then to see if he could come help?

 

[EM152]

@annpats do you know where on this sub that you read that the survivors got up Sunday morning and “had gone out and about their business” ? I am fairly caught up but I must have missed that. Thanks so much

That was a post I made as a possible scenario of what happened on Sunday morning with the two roommates that survived the attack. Just a hypothesis on my part that on Sunday morning they left through the ground level door for bunch perhaps, and then came home, either just the two of them or with another friend, entered the house through the ground level door and went up to the second floor and discovered a body on the floor. In shock the friend with them called 911. MOO very much.

 

[Emj]

I am assuming that 1. LE has their phones 2. they already know who called J... we of course do not nor do I think we will prior to an arrest. MOO is killer did not take the time to call J from Both Kaylee and Madison's phone.

From the NYTimes report released a few minutes ago:

There were seven unanswered phone calls made from the phone of one of the victims, Ms. Goncalves, to her longtime boyfriend in the early morning hours on Sunday, according to her older sister, Alivea Goncalves, based on phone logs she was able to download from the phone provider.
<snip>
She also said that the number of calls was not unusual: Kaylee Goncalves would frequently call people until they picked up, even to ask a mundane question like what she should have for breakfast, her sister said.

IMO the sister's insight his illuminating. Some of us have speculated why K called Jack so many times. And while it did seem odd in isolation, according to her sister, that's just how she was. She'd call over and over again until you picked up the call.

 

[annpats]

IMO this report confirms my suspicion that the seven calls to Jack have nothing to do with the murders as K's family members say she was known to call people repeatedly until they answered & the break-up was amicable. JMO.

Oh. That's sounds a bit ...intense.
And it could be annoying too.
I could see how if that was happening many people would put their phones on silent or even block her.

MOO.

 

[Warwick7]

1 hour ago...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1594046462853513216

 

[MassGuy]

That’s a curious update/commentary about today having the most forensic activity at the house since the murders happened. That kind of heavy lifting and intensive work usually occurs right away while everything is fresh. I’m guessing that new developments and/or promising leads have led them back to the house with more specific collection and analysis to be done. Maybe just wishful thinking on my part.

It may be wishful thinking, but at the same time, I think it's a logical inference.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

Anyone else hung up on the ride home? It’s been said it wasn’t an Uber. Why even tell us that?

I see a car pull up in the reflection at 3:50:00 (twitch video time) M and K leave frame at 3:53:30. Car pulls away at 3:53:55.

Can anyone enhance the tail lights?

For the same reason(s) that someone told us, the public, that Bg’s eyes weren’t blue. But you see, they are.

ymmv JMVHAspieO

 

[Ghostwheel]

Some definitive details on the “calls”: they were to the ex.

“There were seven unanswered phone calls made from the phone of one of the victims, Ms. Goncalves, to her longtime boyfriend in the early morning hours on Sunday, according to her older sister, Alivea Goncalves, based on phone logs she was able to download from the phone provider. She said Jack missed them because he was sleeping, and that her sister’s phone account did not show any other calls.”

New Details Emerge in University of Idaho Killings: What We Know

Thank you for this. I note how they say "There were seven unanswered phone calls made from the phone of one of the victims". That tells me it is not assumed that any of the calls were made by the girls. Likely they were, but this is good police work.

 

[layer]

I’m not questioning you, it is clear there is an approved MSM link that states the surviving roommates were on the third floor. I am choosing not to believe it, based on my own personal deductive reasoning. Which could be wrong, and I will be the first to admit it if so.

I am not saying that I am certain the survivors were on the top floor. I'm saying that I've seen it reported several times, most recently by Nancy Grace and Ted Williams this morning on Fox News. What I have never seen is any report that they were on the 1st floor.

 

[MassGuy]

I agree with you but what if the victims were quite drunk and sleeping, and two perps armed with knives attacked them? NOT likely at all, but possible.

If one survivor had anything to do with this crime, then the other is surely aware and likely participatory, so we could conclude that they acted together? The coroner did say likely one knife, but not definitely one knife and please don't ask me for a link, lol. It was in her first interview, I believe.

I doubt that this scenario occurred, but I do think it could have. imo.

I think the coroner said something to the effect of "the same type of knife," but yeah, it's theoretically possible there were two.

That being said, a crime like this does tend to be committed by one person, and this crime absolutely could have been committed by one person.

 

[menolikeyouwhowho]

Two girls out together got a ride home from the potential killer. Potential killer becomes infuriated at them for any number of reasons even as petty as not tipping or mischievous like not paying for the ride. Potential killer gets knife from under his car seat that he uses for self defense or road rage. He then in a fit of rage, goes in and kills the two girls. The third girl is in bed with her bf and she hears noise so goes to investigate. She encounters the killer and he starts to stab her. She retreats to the bedroom where her boyfriend is asleep. The killer having seriously wounded her then stabs the boyfriend and then finishes her off. He goes back into his car and takes off. <modsnip> He is a ghost and is gone. I am very sorry for these kids who were murdered. I hope they get justice. All this is my humble opinion and could be 100% wrong.

 

[annpats]

"Police say...the victims were the only ones in the house when the bodies were found. Two other roommates, though, were home at the time. They were not hurt."

They were home at the time of the attack, but not on Sunday morning when the bodies were found by LE.

@Jscre

 

[KonaHonu]

If the two surviving roommates had been men, do you think that people would be speculating that they may be the perpetrators?

Yes.

 

[CityKid]

Can't read the article because it is behind a pay wall.

I'm redacting his name but "The first call to the man, Jack *******, was at 2:26 a.m., and there were six more over the next 26 minutes, with the final one at 2:52, Ms. Goncalves said. She said Mr. *******, also a student at the university, missed them because he was sleeping, and that her sister’s phone account did not show any other calls. Ms. Goncalves (the sister) said Mr. ******* had been a childhood friend of her sister’s and that they had been dating for years until recently, when they decided to take an amicable break. Ms. Goncalves said she and her family “stand behind Jack 100 percent and know he absolutely had nothing to do with this at all.”"
Is this the Jack who was in Boise with his family last weekend?

 

[sleuth_truths]

I also think (IMO) it is more likely the victims made the calls, but we don't really know, do we? Couldn't a phone be face ID unlocked by pointing at a victim?

EDIT: Sorry, I see KPO posted the same thing before me

This is a good question. I can only speak for my new iPhone. I've tested the Face ID unlock feature and my phone won't unlock if my eyes are closed.

 

[sun16]

Will be interesting to hear if the owner of the house has anything to add.

 

[annpats]

That was a post I made as a possible scenario of what happened on Sunday morning with the two roommates that survived the attack. Just a hypothesis on my part that on Sunday morning they left through the ground level door for bunch perhaps, and then came home, either just the two of them or with another friend, entered the house through the ground level door and went up to the second floor and discovered a body on the floor. In shock the friend with them called 911. MOO very much.

The news report mentions they were not home when the bodies were found, but we're home when the killings took place.

"Police say...the victims were the only ones in the house when the bodies were found. Two other roommates, though, were home at the time. They were not hurt."

 

[BigTex]

Quick thought on the stalker angle - why would her stalker attack on the night when the house was full? No way. If he/she is stalking her then the stalker KNOWS what she is up to (via social media or by actually following her around). It is possible something triggered the attack forcing the stalker to act? Possibly but I just doubt it I guess.

 

[Ghostwheel]

If the two surviving roommates had been men, do you think that people would be speculating that they may be the perpetrators?

I am purely speculating, but I have to think there was a lot of blood. If there was a trail leading out of the house, and nowhere near the way to get to the other roommates space, that would lead LE to mostly rule the other roommates out. So maybe male or female wouldn't matter?

 

[LeBlack]

In my head, I always imagine he left though the woody area at the back of the house, walked down into another suburban street where he had parked his car earlier, and I then think he drove out of Moscow.

Or left by the woody area to one of the dozens of apartments /homes and was out of sight within minutes.
MOO