ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 20

[OrangeRhyme]

I think in the context of the interview he's referring to a detective or some other LE person. I'm still not certain.

But the theme of the interview was about the police not giving them info and not allowing him to release info.

You can sense his frustration at this.

 

[Joyful Simpleton]

Idaho murders: Kaylee Goncalves' parents say victims' 'means of death don't match'

Steven Goncalves, father of deceased University of Idaho student Kaylee Goncalves, told Fox News on Saturday that Kaylee's and Madison Mogen's 'means of death don't match.'

www.foxnews.com

Apparently, Kaylee's father says Kaylee and Madison's "means of death" don't match.

And also "he didn't have to go upstairs". What does that mean, I wonder.

 

[annpats]

Xana's mom says MPD hasn't been helpful and not telling much at all. Gets info from the news.

Mother of slain Idaho student speaks for the first time

“I believe wholeheartedly that it was those kids who were targeted,” said Cara Northington, mother of Idaho Four victim Xana Kernodle.

www.newsnationnow.com

Oh, that's dreadful she has to do that!
Moscow PD should be ashamed they're treating files of deceased in that manner.

 

[annie1038]

If they were gathering evidence last night, why weren’t they wearing shoe covers and other appropriate gear?

 

[hopewell]

I sort of agree. Coming from an LE standpoint, I thankfully never had to work on something like this, plus, they wouldn’t have given me a lot, if any investigative details as a VA. I generally worked at crime scenes and other VA’s followed up as the investigation progressed and then the court VA’s pick them up from there.

I met people on their worst possible days and gave them the worst possible news.

I always knew and was conscious of the fact that their lives were going to change from the moment I was let in their door, or hospital room, or wherever I was requested to go and I was sad and cognizant of the fact I was going to be the bearer of awful news and change the course of their lives forever.

I was charged with many death notifications and I was given very few details, but after the notification, I was happy to sit as long as they wished me to.

I also was requested on scene at an unattended death, or any death, suspicious or not to talk with family members, friends, roommates, etc…, whomever found the body.

I also spoke to many live victims and survivors and even witnesses to terrible things could request our presence.

I felt like the grim reaper at times, but I also think my job was important because yes, I was meeting people on the worst days of their lives, but I was also there and trained to comfort them and hold space for them for however long they needed… and I was happy to do that. It became too hard and because I did it around where I grew up, I became paranoid I would come on scene to someone I knew and it started to really bother me.

I chose the job because I’d want someone to be there if I needed on my worst day and someone had to do it, so, if not me, then who?

I completely understand as much as I can, Kaylee’s family public grief. What he said about it basically being bad press for the town and college and that “they” (not sure who they are but I have an idea and I don’t think it’s really LE at all) don’t want him hanging up posters because the entirety of the case could scare prospective students away… — As a human, knowing what he said is probably right, I can understand why he thinks maybe some people are trying to suppress the case is not out of the realm of possibilities. It makes a lot of sense logically.

I can’t say I wouldn’t do what he’s doing and start screaming from the rooftops. I mean, what does one do when something like that happens? I’ve been around a lot of victims, but never a crime like this. I cannot imagine there’s a good answer or solution to this, either.

I think the PD needs to offer him some kind of compromise and trauma/grief counseling. He could really say something’s that could hurt the integrity of the investigation. IMO, he needs to be heard more by them and I understand that maybe it’s a sort of nuisance because I also believe that LE 100% cares and are absolutely doing their best… I mean, if they’ve done their due diligence so far and have come up with nothing, then, unfortunately right now, they have nothing… You can’t get blood out of a turnip. You don’t know what you don’t know. That’s just a fact but I’m sure they know a lot more than they did and it’s not for a lack of trying.

It’s a very difficult situation for both sides. I believe her father when he said maybe some people (and I personally don’t think it’s LE, it’s sounds to me more political pressure) don’t want to keep the media spotlight on the town. It tracks it with my sensibilities especially if that’s their economic backbone. I don’t know how to reconcile those two juxtapositions and make both sides better trust the other but I think someone has to try with SG because he’s not going to stop. So someone, somehow needs to come up with a solution.

IMO, this idea about not wanting to have the media spotlight and the previous comments by some like the Mayor stating it was a “Crime of Passion” invariably makes people believe they’re not in danger of it happening to them. And maybe that’s why we have all this back and forth with target or not targeted messaging. IMO, it does seem a little like LE is getting pressure to ease the public tension and fright when maybe the public might have every reason to be at least alarmed.

IMO, this is not a crime of passion. A killer doesn’t bring his own weapon to an unmediated stabbing spree.

I don’t know. This of course are all just thoughts I have after really thinking about what he said and my own work with previously helping victims.

Great post and thanks for doing for others what you did!

I wish that PR 'experts', school officials, and politicians would stop their perception games like minimizing, dismissing, blocking, and/or 'trying to make things to go away' when brutal, potentially serial crimes like this occur (and with no suspects or persons of interest), because to me the repeat risk of the crime is substantial until a suspect is in custody. All of these pencil pushers play the game like it's an episode of Scandal or something, forgetting that there are real people involved with real and grave risks.

Indeed, they calculate that 'panic' in the community is a greater risk of harm than if the killer slaughtered multiple innocent people again. It's borderline psychopathic reasoning, in my view.

My opinion.

 

[laust23]

There are ways to get that info without involving the university or needing a warrant.

Go to the class, if they call roll then listen for the name Josh and watch who answers.
Ask students leaving if there is a Josh in class.
If they point to someone, ask if they can speak to him.

If Josh suddenly runs when he sees a uniformed officer- that speaks volumes.

If LE has a presence on campus it would not be odd. No one would assume this or that if they are talking to a lot oF students every day.
If LE has no presence on campus and one shows up to a class out of the blue, then it looks very bad.

Stalkers on Campus
I taught at the university level for over 20 years
I had a female student tell me a male student was coming to class and sitting in the back waiting for her and following her to her classes. He was not in my class. I asked a male student who was her friend to walk her to the security phone outside the building. He did. Both of us called PD. The guy was not a university student.
JMO

That's a good point. And stalker's on campus don't just have to be students. What about the staff? Or even looking into the cleaning crew members that would have been on site after the football game. Perhaps they'd have access to University showers And cleaned up there after the attack. And parked their car there aswell.

 

[Pennysmom1]

IMO the father needs the info on the intended target so he can continue with his own investigation. His goal is to find the perp in case LE couldn't.

The more the grieving father releases to the public, the perp will may do desperate things instead of laying low and thinking he got away with this (leaving town, getting rid of the knife, bloody clothing, etc)

I think the LE is rightfully keeping evidence and theories close to the vest. I absolutely understand where the father is coming from and I would feel the same way. But since the father keeps doing interviews and releasing information, why would the LE trust him with any more info?

I don't think three weeks is unusual for there not to be an arrest...this isn't TV land where cases get solved in an hour. Give them time to wait for DNA results, process evidence, and watch whoever is in their sights.

 

[everybodhi]

Many people probably only lock their rooms when they're away (if at all).

Even with my house, I never bother to lock the door when I'm at home even though I always lock it when I go out (unless I'm just going for a walk around the block or something like that).

Yeah I can’t imagine punching in a code every time I left my bedroom.
This was just info I have not seen before, a lot of thought was put into making that house nice for roommates.

 

[Honest Abraham]

That's a good point. And stalker's on campus don't just have to be students. What about the staff? Or even looking into the cleaning crew members that would have been on site after the football game. Perhaps they'd have access to University showers And cleaned up there after the attack. And parked their car there aswell.

I have consistently said that institutions and agencies will put self preservation over these types issues. Coaches in particular have a history of covering for athletes.

 

[Stratocaster]

All MOO

Gumshoe detective character profiling here about the killer. As a few sleuthers have said, I believe there's a comfort level with the killer using a fixed-blade knife, ie outdoorsman hunter/fisherman.

Have not seen the knife, or the media's comparable photos, but judging by its description this would be a sought after knife by an outdoorsman, someone who may have researched different models before purchasing it (for their hunting/fishing hobby). IMO generally outdoorsman enthusiasts research the heck out of wanted items before purchasing through online avenues like BassPro, Cabelas Amazon etc.

I believe the knife is a prized posession of the killer, prior to the murders even happening.

Lots of sleuthers commenting about the lack of blood left behind by the killer after all the carnage, im speculating that maybe the killer stabbed victims through their own bedsheets/pillows which would somewhat contain the massive amounts of blood to isolated areas.

Of the comment SG has made publicly about the killer entering through the rear of the house via sliding door, "he chose to go upstairs, he didn't have to" has me wondering all over again about motive.

 

[annpats]

SG is on Fox News this morning. He said the entry point was the second floor. He made clear that he didn’t go downstairs and that he didn’t need to go upstairs but he chose to go upstairs. As in he went upstairs because his target(s) were upstairs.

How do they know he didn't need to go upstairs?
Obviously there was some need - otherwise he'd have just stabbed 2 of them in and not the 4 that he did.

If his target were the 2 on the 3rd floor, why not go straight to the 3rd floor after you've got into the house? Did he go to the wrong bedroom first?

MOO.

 

[Cota332]

“each of the six bedrooms has its own coded lock”

Great find!! This quote from the article really stuck out to me :

“I think they knew them,” Northington said of her daughter’s killer. “I think they may have even been friends with them. I think it had to have been somebody close to them to have been able to get away with it like this.”

 

[NuttMegg]

Just like to point out that it was the FOX reporter who actually broke the news of one person's wounds being so different. He said he had gathered that from his sources, or community, paraphrased. Then he got K's dad to confirm and add a little more. It was not the father who brought that subject up, imo. Reporters know how to feed words to get "news", then the headlines will inevitably say something like "Breaking news!!! K's father says _____". Fill in the blanks.

 

[cottonweaver]

Autopsy reports are held until an investigation is completed.
Death certificates are given to the family, prepared by the funeral home.
Once the investigation is complete, the Coroner will record and certify the death certificate to reflect the cause and manner of death.
Latah County Coroner

bumping this post so people don't miss it

 

[Bliss_Perth]

I've watched Brian Entin's videos on twitter of LE going in and out of the house. Can you point me to where luminol is being used please?.

I remember seeing a screenshot from the Seattle times... Forensics were spraying luminal on the outside of one of the neighbours houses. I will see if i can find it, possibly in the media thread.

 

[Curiousnh]

Me thinks Dad #1 need is knowing who. Not the trial. Not following any rules-now. Not what some lawyer wants. Not what was done before. Who. Who. And he gives no thought to perceived justice, probably knowing justice will come- in some way-once he finds out who. I cannot fathom being him..he must must be heavily medicated and I just say God Bless Him and the families.

Totally agree. Cannot even imagine how he feels.
from the LE side they know what happens when information they need to withhold gets out.
there would be no reason to withhold just to hurt families or make them suffer.

 

[Missyrocks5]

The more the grieving father releases to the public, the perp will may do desperate things instead of laying low and thinking he got away with this (leaving town, getting rid of the knife, bloody clothing, etc)

I think the LE is rightfully keeping evidence and theories close to the vest. I absolutely understand where the father is coming from and I would feel the same way. But since the father keeps doing interviews and releasing information, why would the LE trust him with any more info?

I don't think three weeks is unusual for there not to be an arrest...this isn't TV land where cases get solved in an hour. Give them time to wait for DNA results, process evidence, and watch whoever is in their sights.

And exponentially bump up all of this with the complexity of the crime scene. People coming in and out of the house all the time, waiting for results, putting them tgiether. It’s only 3 weeks, not 3 years. It’s not an episode of csi. If the goal is to get the psycho, giving up all of this information to help the killer‘s defense attorney, or worse, never even getting to an arrest because the investigation is derailed by giving details, is bad. And then there are 3 other families who lost their kids, it’s jeopardizing their justice as well.

 

[T4Tide]

"[Xana's mom] wasn’t sure whether the updated lock was on the Moscow home’s front door or on Kernodle’s bedroom — each of the six bedrooms has its own coded lock — but was certain Kernodle’s father had tinkered with one just before the quadruple murder." Locks on Idaho college house were fixed weekend before killings, victim’s mom says

The thing is, locks are only useful if used/engaged. I have never had a coded lock in my house, only rentals I've used on vacations, and some of them, the door automatically locked once you were inside. For others, there was a "lock" button on them you had to push to lock it. Unless these coded locks meant the doors automatically locked when shut, even with brand new locks, it doesn't mean they were used. I am not saying that to criticize anyone, it's just a fact. To be completely honest, if I was living in a house with a bunch of roommates I was close to and trusted, I don't know that I would lock my interior bedroom door, at least not prior to something like this happening. MOO

I have battery operated coded locks on two properties. One house has 3 separate locks on outer doors. From the outside, you have to press the lock button. From the inside, the knob is exactly the same as a regular “bolt lock” style knob that you physically turn clockwise to lock. Just like bolt locks that are keyed on the outside. Only the outside looks/operates differently. Mine are not set to auto lock, but there are brands with capabilities. There’s Bluetooth and Wi-Fi options, as well, meaning the locks can be operated from remote locations by app. I can set temporary codes for housekeeping or pest control but I have to manually delete them. The more expensive locks can be accessed by app to determine what times the door was accessed, and if multiple codes entered, by whom it was accessed.

I have the more simple, non Bluetooth/wifi capable locks.

 

[MsBetsy]

As the University of Idaho homicide investigation enters a critical stage, police must protect information 'at all costs,' experts say | CNN

The investigation into the murders of four University of Idaho students is entering a critical stage in its third week, as police are starting to receive forensic testing results from the crime scene, law enforcement experts tell CNN.

www.cnn.com

This is an informative article from an evidence stand point

John Miller, CNN chief LE analyst, discusses the multiple agencies involved in this investigation and the three important roles of the FBI in this case.

The first involves the "Behavioural Science Unit," which is important in cases with an "unknown offender" because it "narrows the scope of offender characteristics."

The second is their advanced technology, including it's "Combined DNA Indexing System," which allows LE and crime labs to share and search through thousands of DNA profiles."

Thirdly, the FBI has 56 field offices throughout the country, expanding the reach and capability of the investigation.

They go on to discuss blood and DNA evidence, and say the results could take longer if there is mixed DNA. "When you have several donors with the DNA, then it becomes a problem trying to separate those two or three or four...that could be part of the issue, toxicology reports can sometimes take a couple of weeks to come back," Giacalone added.

They also discuss "victimology" and how investigators learn every detail about the victims, their relationships with each other and various people. "This includes cellphone records, internet records as well as surveillance from every camera surrounding the crime scene."

"When you do an extensive video canvass, you may get a picture of a person, a shadowy figure, and then if you have a sense of direction, you can string your way down all the other cameras in that direction to see if that image reappears," Miller said.

 

[Pharmasgirl]

I took the fathers statement to be his way of saying the killer had more rage for one of the girls over the other. Perhaps more stabs wounds and or deeper wounds?

If you watch that whole interview he did with Jones he kept saying killer singular. Thus I don’t think he meant 2 killers by saying damage don’t match.


Just to clarify I have not ruled out that their could be more than 1 killer.

Isn’t the ‘means’ the knife?