ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 56

[jumpingjackflash]

I've known vegans who would not allow anyone to come into their home wearing any kind of leather (shoes, belt, etc)

BK's brand of veganism may be more about control than principle. It sounds like he enjoys deploying it to create complications for other people and coerce them to make accommodations for him (e.g., when he insisted to his relatives that he would not eat food from cookware that had ever been used to cook meat). I think he also prides himself on being in control and sees his veganism as one expression of that quality. So it wouldn't shock me to learn that he does not abide by all vegan principles. On the other hand, I continue to believe the sheath may have left behind purposely, although I do not think BK knew his DNA was on it.

 

[Boodles]

Perhaps e put up a fight. The this was the bodies slamming into the wall (bk and e) as they were fighting.

Maybe the “thud” was something as simple as BK slamming his car door shut before hightailing it out of there. It’s hard to conceive of a neighbor‘s cam hearing a thud taking place inside 1122.

Or if it was dark, he could have run into a trash bin as he ran to his car. I just think it must have been something that happened outside. I have cams and I’ve never heard thuds, cries or moans from inside a neighbor’s house, and they’re close, especially one of them. But I hear car door thuds often.

 

[Boxer]

IMO, I am going to throw a curveball. What if BK wasn’t stalking per se, but surveilling. Maybe after he started at WSU he got wind of some “rumor” or some plot-gossip pertaining to a possible murder occurring at the house on 1122-some weird email or anonymous letter and instead of notifying the police, he followed up on it on his own time. Should he go to the police, he would look like a fool. Obviously, the letter or notification was a set up or joke, but BK kept following up on it not knowing it was a set up. I recall Moscow PD, in the early stages of the investigation, were seeking a 2011-2013 white Hyundai Elantra because they thought that the occupants of that vehicle had “critical” info regarding the murders.

The police knew the Elantra was there at time of murders so either the occupant/s involved or were possible witnesses.
When the driver of the Elantra did not come forward, it was suspicious.

 

[diabeticrockstar]

During the Penn. press conference I was struck by the (county?) Asst. DA from Penn saying that he thought kuhberger waived contesting extradition was the "need to know" what was in the arrainment documents:

(time 20:25 - 20:45)

I think that is a directly reference to Kohberger having to, every day, add to the circumstantial case against him by being observed continually and obviously attempting to hide DNA sourcing at his Pennsylvania residence, eg placing his garbage at neighbors, using gloves etc.

He needed to know if they had his DNA at the scene or not. If not, he would not have wanted to be observed doing what he was doing with the garbage and would be able to stop.

By the way, those PA cops and that shlubby/disheveled but cool coded language dropping DA fit every positive stereotype I hold of PA staties and DA's I have known.

He was already arrested....so why would he want to know the details of probable cause arrest warrant in order to stop doing things like wearing gloves, using different trash cans, etc? I don't understand the point your making.

IMO the reason he was agreeing to extradition was because, as a Criminology major, it was probably Driving him crazy to be locked up and replaying the events in his head....trying to figure out where he F'ed up

 

[lucidium]

The affidavit is so convoluted!

Might not seem that way to the expected audience - a judge. Or maybe it would, what do I know?

 

[jcamh]

er I think Gavin DeBecker describes this phenomena through several examples in his book The Gift of Fear. He gives examples of how people's instinct tells them something is wrong or dangerous but they have been socialized not to trust their instincts. For example, you're a woman, and at the end of the day in a building that's mostly empty, the elevator arrives at your floor and the door opens. It's a large man you don't know and you feel uneasy. Do you get into that elevator--a steel, soundproof box, or do you wait for another elevator or someone to go with you? Most people get into the elevator because we are socialized to be polite.

I was in a similar situation just a few nights ago. I took my dog out in the courtyard of my condo building at 11 PM and turned to notice a man inside the outer lobby who opened the door and was looking out at me. I asked if he was coming out with a dog because my dog becomes rambunctious around other dogs. He said no and went back inside and I noticed he didn't have a dog. (The only people you ever see in my building's courtyard at night with 3 feet of snow on the ground and 5 degrees are people taking their dogs out). I had to go through three doors from outside to the outer lobby, then across the stairwell, then to the inner lobby to the elevator and there he stood. I was very uncomfortable. I asked him if he was going up. He said, No, and just stood there. I had made the decision that when the elevator came, I WOULD NOT GET ON IT WITH HIM. Or, if I got on it and then he did too, I would get off. I got on the elevator, but he did not. Although I felt very uncomfortable, what did I do? Did I go to my apt. and call the police? No, I went to bed.

 

[BelleIsle]

She didn't. She was in her bedroom, she locked her door after she saw him walk past her. My mistake.

He thought that turning off his phone during the murders meant that his phone would never be connected to the murder address. He didn't realize that:

1. the car would connect to the murders,
2. the PA plates car would connect to him (he changed plates after murders),
3. he was connected to his phone number (pulled over near house on Aug 21); and,
4. his phone number history would connect him to the address 12 times prior to the murders.

He studied Criminology, but the program does not teach anyone how to think like a criminal. Knowing how to catch a criminal does not mean knowing how to evade criminal justice.

This is true. I usually think of the "what if"s, so this type of negligence is frustrating & confusing to me. It's a real bonus to all of us that he didn't think in this same way.

Do you think that this was his first murder? Are we allowed to speculate on that?

 

[Boxer]

I think you may be right. He really didn't think they would connect him to the crime. Arrogant. He did not think ahead at all to the "what if"s.

He was safe on the cell phones until they got his cell number which they got from finding the Elantra, from that his registration and a ticket he got with his cell number.

 

[BelleIsle]

Daily mails interpretations of the affidavit and timeline of events is interesting. I initially thought after reading it it was opposite order (M and K first victims, then X and E).

Idaho police begin clearing rental home where students were murdered

Idaho State Police began clearing the Moscow home where four University of Idaho students were stabbed to death - a day after their alleged killer was formally charged.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Idk how this can be correct. If X was active on Tik Tok at 4:12 (is that right?) and then he killed her and everyone else and was back driving by 4:20?

Does anyone know if "active" on Tik Tok means interacting or if it can just be open and running? Maybe Daily Mail messed up.

 

[jepop]

I like your idea. So, we also need to hear when the last drive by was before the one at 4:04, because it could have happened in that space of time as well.
What do you say to X being active on Tik Tok and with Door Dash at 4-4:12ish, the sounds that D heard? Do you think that BK killed X and E while in the house searching for the sheath?

Yes, according to this scenaio, BK killed X and E when one or both of them saw/heard him entering through the slider with intention of collecting sheath. IMOO I think X saw/heard him and she was waking E when BK struck and Killed E in the bed. Then he killed X. MOO. As for Door dash and tik tok, I have envisaged various possibilities, and what makes sense to me is that X had already eaten and was on tiktok when B entered kitchen at 4.10-4.12am.

 

[morty4185]

IMO, I thought you could only lift fingerprints from solid, hard porous material

Fingerprints are most readily lifted from smooth surfaces

 

[bondchanel]

While reading your post, it occurred to me, DM was able to see enough to state the person she saw walking towards her had bush eyebrows...... I wonder if she saw a knife in his hand too. I'd think he'd surely have it in his hand, ready, just in case he was confronted or surprised by another resident living there - JMO. And surely LE would have asked her that, yet there was no mention of it in the affidavit. So, I assume that is one detail they intentionally left out but will bring up at trial. All my opinion and speculation.

I believe the murderer walked towards her coming from X's room. Then the murderer proceeded to walk past her towards the kitchen and out.

Okay. So, if male was coming from X's room then it could be speculated that maybe light emanated from X's room or bathroom and that's how DM was able to "see" that the male had bushy eyebrows. If the house was dark, how could DM see?

 

[insearchoflight]

Idk how this can be correct. If X was active on Tik Tok at 4:12 (is that right?) and then he killed her and everyone else and was back driving by 4:20?

Does anyone know if "active" on Tik Tok means interacting or if it can just be open and running? Maybe Daily Mail messed up.

On second thought, perhaps it makes sense that X and E were first victims because X was awake. The killer “didn’t need to go upstairs” after but he did. Making one of the upstairs victims the primary target? Lots of questions

 

[Cedars]

Maybe the “thud” was something as simple as BK slamming his car door shut before hightailing it out of there. It’s hard to conceive of a neighbor‘s cam hearing a thud taking place inside 1122.

Or if it was dark, he could have run into a trash bin as he ran to his car. I just think it must have been something that happened outside. I have cams and I’ve never heard thuds, cries or moans from inside a neighbor’s house, and they’re close, especially one of them. But I hear car door thuds often.

Have you ever had a multiple murder happen next door? Maybe your camera would pick up on the noise if you did.

 

[XtremeScorpio]

Driving your car around with your phone where bad things happen before, during or after isn’t a crime. The have to prove he did this. IMO with his background in criminology forensics can be disposed of creating reasonable doubt.

His background was in criminal justice, not criminal Forensics or science. They're 2 totally different things.

Criminal Justice vs. Forensic Science

Understand how criminal justice and forensic science are similar and different, and where they overlap. View a side-by-side comparison of the two fields.

www.forensicscolleges.com

 

[jepop]

Yes, according to this scenaio, BK killed X and E when one or both of them saw/heard him entering through the slider with intention of collecting sheath. IMOO I think X saw/heard him and she was waking E when BK struck and Killed E in the bed. Then he killed X. MOO. As for Door dash and tik tok, I have envisaged various possibilities, and what makes sense to me is that X had already eaten and was on tiktok when B entered kitchen at 4.10-4.12am.

To add: In this scenario, after killing X and E, he just got out so never found the sheath. He may have looked for it for a short time in kitchen/living room, even missed it K and M room, but after the second murders he just left in panic and shock. MOO, speculation only

 

[BelleIsle]

Yes, according to this scenaio, BK killed X and E when one or both of them saw/heard him entering through the slider with intention of collecting sheath. IMOO I think X saw/heard him and she was waking E when BK struck and Killed E in the bed. Then he killed X. MOO. As for Door dash and tik tok, I have envisaged various possibilities, and what makes sense to me is that X had already eaten and was on tiktok when B entered kitchen at 4.10-4.12am.

But why then leave without the sheath? If he thought everyone was dead, why not at least go upstairs and rummage around for it? It seems that it was visible on the bed long after M had stopped moving. It was in plain sight.

 

[diabeticrockstar]

The affidavit is so convoluted!

It is not supposed to be a Case Summary, Evidence Summary, Crime Scene Report or anything else. It's entire purpose is to put relevant facts of the Charges on paper, with enough specific evidence that has been collected (and how it was collected) to convince a judge/magistrate that the individual(s) being charged may be guilty.

Then at trial...the prosecutors must prove the dependent is guilty. So much more evidence will naturally be brought forth, with significantly more detail, including witnesses.

People are SO STARVED for info about this case that they are doing some deep dives into sentence structure and such lol. It's a police officer's report--not an English majors. There is a lot of info not in this affidavit--because it doesn't need to be.

And remember....LEOs/Prosecutors know this affidavit is public record. They also were extremely protective of their evidence and knowledge of the crime scene from Day 1 -- which of course is what drove people to be desperate for info. They aren't gonna start spewing it all now. They are being very selective and strategic, and thank God they are, because thus far they've gotten their main suspect, no additional people were harmed in the following days, the witnesses were protected as was other witnesses like Uber and Door Dash drivers.

There's enough info on that affidavit to get BK in cuffs. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[diabeticrockstar]

Yes, but there was a long wall between Xana's room and the kitchen. It meant walking into the LR, turning right as though to go up the stairs, and turning right again, opposite DMs room. This link seems accurate: Virtual Tour of 1122 King Road, Moscow, Idaho

Edited to clarify: talking about route from Xana's room to kitchen.

 

[IQuestion]

Just trying to find more on his prior life. This is from the Pocono Record 4 years ago. He had an assisting role during a health crisis when he worked parttime as school security worker.
""The (athletic director), Jake Percey, and one of my fellow co-workers, Bryan Kohberger, they came, so I started running to get the asthma pump," Fuentes said."
and
"Percey called 911 while Fuentes told Kohberger to retrieve the school’s AED unit, and Fuentes went to work performing CPR."

Life in his hands

It was late in the morning on Saturday, Dec. 1 when Pleasant Valley School District monitor Kathleen Piccolo felt that something was wrong. While patrolling the hallways of the high school, she was…

www.poconorecord.com

****edit to say I apologize in advance for just jumping in with info/pics/links, but the threads are moving so fast, and I move so slowly.****