ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 58

[r3d-ros3]

So we really don’t know if he targeted the house for one of the victims or the house itself (easy to get into from sliding door, lots of coming/goings, parties). I go back and forth depending on what I read.

But, if he just wanted to kill and/or rape someone, why would he go into a house with 6 occupants? Wouldn’t it be easier to find a young woman who lived by herself or with a roommate in an apartment? Going into a house with 6 roommates is just insane.

It's interesting -- we don't know if Ethan regularly spent the night there (I think that his presence was unexpected, whether he spent the night frequently or not) and Kaylee had moved out and was just visiting that weekend to show Maddie her new car.

There was also the roommate who was on the lease but had moved out. I remember that causing somewhat of a stir when that info came out. Anyway, the house may have had only 4 residents sleeping there many nights, or maybe even just the nights BK seemingly surveilled the house? Regardless, he had to have known that the house was known for parties / having people over frequently, so not sure if these details are all that relevant at the end of the day.

 

[x_files]

Hello all. Long time reader buy made an account because this case hits close to home for a handful
or reasons. I did want to share a story about an incident that happened to me a few years ago just to illustrate that you honestly have NO idea how you would react in this situation and the people criticizing DM are killing me. On what planet does a 19 year old female, living in an extremely safe college town (per LE) think noise at 4am in her shared party house and seeing a man she doesn’t recognize = 4 of my closest friends have just been murdered?

I’m a professional woman in my 40’s (mom, husband, kids) and live in what you would consider an affluent suburb (leaning toward rural with 1+ acre lots) town. A few years ago I went for a run around 10am on a regular Tuesday. I was running down a main road at the edge of town where houses lined one side and forest lined the other. This was not a desolate road, there is traffic and borders a much more populated town.

As i was running a truck pulled up beside me and a somewhat friendly guy asked where the closest gas station. I stood back and told him to follow the road to one or he could turn around and follow another route. He thank me and continued down the road.

I changed direction and headed back on the same road (my planned route) and maybe 5 min later he had done the same and stopped me again. Said he was confused with my directions and asks again to the closest station. I repeated what i said and he thanked me and took off. I thought it was unusual but figured he was flirting or confused and I was on mine 8 and tired - it was late winter and I was getting cold so I was just focused on getting home and warm.

Until half a mile up the road, i saw he had pulled over to the side and was standing standing leaning on the hood of the truck. My initial
thought was sort of ‘huh? wonder why he stopped again?’ I wasn’t exactly scared, but it made me nervous. I crossed to the other side of the road and there happened to be a street into a neighborhood that I took instead of staying straight and running by him. I looked at him as I turned and he looked at me, waved and said ‘hey, good to see you again’. The neighborhood houses didn’t start for a bit so the road in was just woods. I looked back once i was in the sidestreet and he was back in his truck slowly following me.

At this point I knew this was not normal but I was confused and my mind sort of went blank because I couldn’t understand why someone would follow me. It didn’t make any sense to me. I was running like I always do. I sort of froze there in the middle of the street looking at him and trying to understand what was going on. He stopped the truck, got out, and started to jog towards me and by that point I was terrified and my mind just told me to RUN.
He followed me down the street and though one yard, maybe two, then stopped. I ran through a few more and then stopped and hid in a child’s playhouse in someone’s back yard. At that point I called my husbands cell which went to voicemail so I left him a sobbing message that I was chased and scared and didn’t know what to do. I waited in that little house freezing my *advertiser censored* off and scared out of mind for about an hour and then I ran home and locked myself inside. I look back at that day and can’t understand why I didn’t take a picture of the truck and license plate or call 911 or scream or bang on someone’s door. Even when I was hiding in the playhouse terrified my mind kept questioning if I made up with happened or it wasn’t as scary as I had thought. Maybe the guy just needed directions? The idea that someone may have been trying to take me or hurt me is just so hard for me to wrap my head around. It doesn’t ‘fit’ into my life. I ended up reporting the incident to the police but was beyond humiliated that I couldn’t think more clearly or strategically in the moment.

So, please be gentle to DM. We know a tiny portion of what happened that night and we should all hope to god we never experience a fraction of what she has had - and will have to process.

fear and adrenaline cause people to make strange decisions.
I was recently followed and tried taking a photo/video of the car my hand was shaking so bad I almost dropped the phone and he noticed and stopped the car to approach me and I had to run. It was terrifying!
I am glad you HID and are SAFE!

 

[Brunette]

An irrelative question. I jump back into websleuth again after taking a break for 4 years. I read the news LE broke windows and doors to arrest BK. But do they really just that dramatic? I though the dramatic scene we see in movies are for visual effects only. Can they just knock the door and ask him to step out (with guns pointing at the doors). Who will pay the fees to fix the damages?

Yes they did. I think they must have thought it necessary to ensure no one else inside gets hurt/the suspect doesn’t have time to hold them hostage or hurt them or kill himself. Better to be safe than sorry when you’re arresting someone accused of killing 4 people and basically having little to lose. Idk who pays for it. My guess is if law enforcement contributes anything it wouldn’t cover the full amount.

 

[kittythehare]

she also said it would take months to solve this. No faith in her

We know her of old here..

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Don't know how I missed this link first time around.
It's very Bryan K


As a teenager
'Bryan Kohberger allegedly attempted to punch through an "unbreakable" glass window a salesman was showing his neighbor..........

She tells us Kohberger wasn't able to break the glass'

link is 31st December

Woman Claims Idaho Murder Suspect Tried to Break Window As a Teen

A Pennsylvania woman says she knew Bryan Kohberger as a teen, and claims she once saw him try to punch through a glass window ... just one of several troubling signs she alleges he displayed as he came of age in high school.

www.tmz.com

I saw this too, and thought, geez, : { , what a little terror/misfit/bad boy/"boundaries don't apply to me" childish little cuss he has been all along ... JMOO

 

[cottonweaver]

It's interesting -- we don't know if Ethan regularly spent the night there (I think that his presence was unexpected, whether he spent the night frequently or not) and Kaylee had moved out and was just visiting that weekend to show Maddie her new car.

There was also the roommate who was on the lease but had moved out. I remember that causing somewhat of a stir when that info came out. Anyway, the house may have had only 4 residents sleeping there many nights, or maybe even just the nights BK seemingly surveilled the house? Regardless, he had to have known that the house was known for parties / having people over frequently, so not sure if these details are all that relevant at the end of the day.

Agree that he probably assumed single occupied rooms and may not have realised Ethan was there that night but on the issue of his intent - to kill one or more ....

he's just driven past the house multiple times and seen that there are 4 cars parked outside the front of the house, on the murder night

And if he's done 12 visits in the weeks prior wouldn't he also have noticed that there are always plenty of cars and occupied rooms?

 

[Charlot123]

When they are up drinking until 2, yup. I'm guessing they came home, hung out and when E was asleep wanted something to eat. Totally normal.

ETA - normal for anyone to do at anytime. Not just related to drinking. Studying. Working. Partying. Not able to sleep. Working on a project. People order food 24 hours a day when they are hungry.

There are six circadian rhythm types identified. The study was done on college students.

There Are 6 Human Chronotypes, Not Just Morning Larks And Night Owls, Study Says

Some people are morning larks.

www.sciencealert.com

 

[x_files]

ok, here's a THEORY. What if BK was stalking EC?
Do you know his preferences? Straight? Bi?
Possibly was stalking Ethan? or all four of them?
If a thrill-kill for infamy and to beat another mass murder first-kill record he may have KNOWN he'd be there and killing a COUPLE was part of the plan?
I guess we wait to find out what his computer searches and more pings on his phone show/

 

[Nila Aella]

Good point. I also wondered if BK sent food there to distract X while he snuck into the sliding glass door in the back. But I'm sure X's app to DoorDash would show if she placed it or not.
Sorry if my response came across harshly directed at you that wasn't my intent. I'm angry at BK for taking away these people's lives.

Because of a previous poster (sorry, cant recall who) I am just trying to invision a scenario of an earlier time of death. Not sure how door dash app works, could someone else use her phone to order it?
No worries, I understand the anger.

 

[isabella88]

Poor sources, but here is the NY POST article, and her name is on the court order appointing a public defender. I am still learning of "good sources" but this Independent UK article includes helpful background. I did not google around to learn but there are confirmed photos of her at the crime scene too.

Thanks! Seems my suspicion was correct. This is BK's ID attorney. His first attorney was in PA. The nightly news was once again way behind.

 

[justme11]

Hello all. Long time reader buy made an account because this case hits close to home for a handful
or reasons. I did want to share a story about an incident that happened to me a few years ago just to illustrate that you honestly have NO idea how you would react in this situation and the people criticizing DM are killing me. On what planet does a 19 year old female, living in an extremely safe college town (per LE) think noise at 4am in her shared party house and seeing a man she doesn’t recognize = 4 of my closest friends have just been murdered?

I’m a professional woman in my 40’s (mom, husband, kids) and live in what you would consider an affluent suburb (leaning toward rural with 1+ acre lots) town. A few years ago I went for a run around 10am on a regular Tuesday. I was running down a main road at the edge of town where houses lined one side and forest lined the other. This was not a desolate road, there is traffic and borders a much more populated town.

As i was running a truck pulled up beside me and a somewhat friendly guy asked where the closest gas station. I stood back and told him to follow the road to one or he could turn around and follow another route. He thank me and continued down the road.

I changed direction and headed back on the same road (my planned route) and maybe 5 min later he had done the same and stopped me again. Said he was confused with my directions and asks again to the closest station. I repeated what i said and he thanked me and took off. I thought it was unusual but figured he was flirting or confused and I was on mine 8 and tired - it was late winter and I was getting cold so I was just focused on getting home and warm.

Until half a mile up the road, i saw he had pulled over to the side and was standing standing leaning on the hood of the truck. My initial
thought was sort of ‘huh? wonder why he stopped again?’ I wasn’t exactly scared, but it made me nervous. I crossed to the other side of the road and there happened to be a street into a neighborhood that I took instead of staying straight and running by him. I looked at him as I turned and he looked at me, waved and said ‘hey, good to see you again’. The neighborhood houses didn’t start for a bit so the road in was just woods. I looked back once i was in the sidestreet and he was back in his truck slowly following me.

At this point I knew this was not normal but I was confused and my mind sort of went blank because I couldn’t understand why someone would follow me. It didn’t make any sense to me. I was running like I always do. I sort of froze there in the middle of the street looking at him and trying to understand what was going on. He stopped the truck, got out, and started to jog towards me and by that point I was terrified and my mind just told me to RUN.
He followed me down the street and though one yard, maybe two, then stopped. I ran through a few more and then stopped and hid in a child’s playhouse in someone’s back yard. At that point I called my husbands cell which went to voicemail so I left him a sobbing message that I was chased and scared and didn’t know what to do. I waited in that little house freezing my *advertiser censored* off and scared out of mind for about an hour and then I ran home and locked myself inside. I look back at that day and can’t understand why I didn’t take a picture of the truck and license plate or call 911 or scream or bang on someone’s door. Even when I was hiding in the playhouse terrified my mind kept questioning if I made up with happened or it wasn’t as scary as I had thought. Maybe the guy just needed directions? The idea that someone may have been trying to take me or hurt me is just so hard for me to wrap my head around. It doesn’t ‘fit’ into my life. I ended up reporting the incident to the police but was beyond humiliated that I couldn’t think more clearly or strategically in the moment.

So, please be gentle to DM. We know a tiny portion of what happened that night and we should all hope to god we never experience a fraction of what she has had - and will have to process.

Oh my goodness, I'm glad you're alright. I'm glad your mind was clear enough to tell you to run run run. I can't even imagine the pure terror you felt. Stay safe!

 

[BrownRice]

The PCA says BKs phone was tracked at the 1122 King Rd address 12 times prior to the murders. Can they determine if he was inside the house (party guest, friend of a resident) or sitting outside in car?

One of the dates August 21, he was there from 10:24pm to 11:35pm and then was detained by LE at 11:37. Was this the citation for no seat belt? Where was he when he received the citation?

 

[cottonweaver]

Because the description given by DM - height, build, eyebrows- is a key part of the affidavit and because the LEO offers the detail about his face being partially covered by a mask, can we infer from the omission in the affidavit that BK was wearing some kind of hat to cover his hair that night?
Black beanie?

 

[Boodles]

I was thinking today, it’s so unfortunate that they didn’t get him while he was still in WA with the knock-on-the-door, “we see you have a white Elantra, would you mind answering some questions for us?” tactic. He probably wouldn't have cooperated, but he might have, and if so, they could have locked down his story.

Now the prosecution will likely never have the benefit of any interrogation, and BK gets the advantage of all the discovery to come up with his defense.

Some of you may have followed the Jason Young trial(s) for the murder of his wife, Michelle Young, in NC (2006). JY never, ever spoke to LE in any respect about his wife’s death, not even a “oh no, what happened?!?” Then he shockingly (to the prosecution) testified in his defense. He was eventually convicted, but there was at least one mistrial, appeals, etc. It was torture for her family. The defense tried to imply that the victim’s sister had something to do with it (which was the cruelest, dirtiest thing) and he still has zealous supporters.

Anyway, the point is, wouldn't it have been wonderful to have the benefit of his answers to a “routine questioning” back in WA with which to help nail him if he’s the guilty party (which I don’t doubt)? But at least they’ve got him now, and hopefully we’re only aware of the tip of the iceberg of evidence against him, upon which they will still gather more.

 

[r3d-ros3]

The PCA says BKs phone was tracked at the 1122 King Rd address 12 times prior to the murders. Can they determine if he was inside the house (party guest, friend of a resident) or sitting outside in car?

One of the dates August 21, he was there from 10:24pm to 11:35pm and then was detained by LE at 11:37. Was this the citation for no seat belt? Where was he when he received the citation?

Based on my (basic, so experts please correct me if I'm wrong) understanding of cell phone data / pings, they would not be able to confirm whether or not he was in the house or not. Cell phone data is pretty precise, but you can ping the same tower if you're sitting in a car across the street from a house or in the house itself. If the defense tries to use this, they will definitely need at least one witness (I think multiple witnesses) corroborating his presence at a party at 1122 King or the house next door, for example.

EDIT TO SAY -- this is why, IMO, they included BK's visit to Albertson's on the PCA (I think the last page). Surveillance footage/CCTV caught him exiting the white Elantra and his cell phone pinged the tower nearby, thereby placing BK, the white Elantra, and his cell phone data at the same place. You need witnesses to fully substantiate cell phone data, otherwise there is enough reasonable doubt - in many cases - that the suspect's phone was not in the exact location LE is placing them at for the commission of a crime. This is not to suggest BK is innocent, but I think it's a useful framework for understanding how cell phone data can be used and its limits.

 

[Wishbone]

The threads have been flying for days. I haven't seen this discussed. I certainly could have missed it. If true, the final nail IMO.

According to Nancy Grace, in Pennsylvania trash “they found
discarded items that match back to the Sheath that was left beside one of the dead…..”

Important evidence...Wonder where Nancy got her info and how reliable it is

 

[TheNile]

Hello all. Long time reader buy made an account because this case hits close to home for a handful
or reasons. I did want to share a story about an incident that happened to me a few years ago just to illustrate that you honestly have NO idea how you would react in this situation and the people criticizing DM are killing me. On what planet does a 19 year old female, living in an extremely safe college town (per LE) think noise at 4am in her shared party house and seeing a man she doesn’t recognize = 4 of my closest friends have just been murdered?

I’m a professional woman in my 40’s (mom, husband, kids) and live in what you would consider an affluent suburb (leaning toward rural with 1+ acre lots) town. A few years ago I went for a run around 10am on a regular Tuesday. I was running down a main road at the edge of town where houses lined one side and forest lined the other. This was not a desolate road, there is traffic and borders a much more populated town.

As i was running a truck pulled up beside me and a somewhat friendly guy asked where the closest gas station. I stood back and told him to follow the road to one or he could turn around and follow another route. He thank me and continued down the road.

I changed direction and headed back on the same road (my planned route) and maybe 5 min later he had done the same and stopped me again. Said he was confused with my directions and asks again to the closest station. I repeated what i said and he thanked me and took off. I thought it was unusual but figured he was flirting or confused and I was on mine 8 and tired - it was late winter and I was getting cold so I was just focused on getting home and warm.

Until half a mile up the road, i saw he had pulled over to the side and was standing standing leaning on the hood of the truck. My initial
thought was sort of ‘huh? wonder why he stopped again?’ I wasn’t exactly scared, but it made me nervous. I crossed to the other side of the road and there happened to be a street into a neighborhood that I took instead of staying straight and running by him. I looked at him as I turned and he looked at me, waved and said ‘hey, good to see you again’. The neighborhood houses didn’t start for a bit so the road in was just woods. I looked back once i was in the sidestreet and he was back in his truck slowly following me.

At this point I knew this was not normal but I was confused and my mind sort of went blank because I couldn’t understand why someone would follow me. It didn’t make any sense to me. I was running like I always do. I sort of froze there in the middle of the street looking at him and trying to understand what was going on. He stopped the truck, got out, and started to jog towards me and by that point I was terrified and my mind just told me to RUN.
He followed me down the street and though one yard, maybe two, then stopped. I ran through a few more and then stopped and hid in a child’s playhouse in someone’s back yard. At that point I called my husbands cell which went to voicemail so I left him a sobbing message that I was chased and scared and didn’t know what to do. I waited in that little house freezing my *advertiser censored* off and scared out of mind for about an hour and then I ran home and locked myself inside. I look back at that day and can’t understand why I didn’t take a picture of the truck and license plate or call 911 or scream or bang on someone’s door. Even when I was hiding in the playhouse terrified my mind kept questioning if I made up with happened or it wasn’t as scary as I had thought. Maybe the guy just needed directions? The idea that someone may have been trying to take me or hurt me is just so hard for me to wrap my head around. It doesn’t ‘fit’ into my life. I ended up reporting the incident to the police but was beyond humiliated that I couldn’t think more clearly or strategically in the moment.

So, please be gentle to DM. We know a tiny portion of what happened that night and we should all hope to god we never experience a fraction of what she has had - and will have to process.

That is horrifying and I am so sorry you went through that! Wow. I agree wholeheartedly that people should ease up on DM. People react in different ways when faced with trauma and like others have mentioned, who knows if she even understood what was happening? After all, it was a party house, she could have been intoxicated, didn't want to put her nose in someone else's business, (Kaylee had an ex iirc?) etc.

 

[Stephen2022]

Based on my (basic, so experts please correct me if I'm wrong) understanding of cell phone data / pings, they would not be able to confirm whether or not he was in the house or not. Cell phone data is pretty precise, but you can ping the same tower if you're sitting in a car across the street from a house or in the house itself. If the defense tries to use this, they will definitely need at least one witness (I think multiple witnesses) corroborating his presence at a party at 1122 King or the house next door, for example.

If victim dna found in BK car which is being processed he would have hard time explaining that. Other evidence is trumped

 

[gizmobtj]

On the last thread, we were talking about BK potentially being on true crime boards on different forms of social media, as referred to in this MSM article in the DM:

Bryan Kohberger believed to have joined online discussion groups

Former FBI investigator Jennifer Coffindaffer suggested that suspect Bryan Kohberger joined social media discussion groups about the Idaho murders.

www.google.com

One of the two accounts mentioned (FB) was blocked by mods the night before the arrest and second one was deleted by the user after the arrest (RDT).

In the Rhoden Murders in Pike County, OH, one of the defendants, Angela Wagner, speculated to her son that the Ohio Bureau of Criminal Investigation, was stirring things up on a social media site. And she was right.

A user people speculated knew too much ended up being the lead BCI investigator, Ryan Schneider.

Pike County murder trial wiretaps heard: 'We get electrocuted...it's your fault"

Several wiretapped recordings were played for the jury Wednesday, revealing the Wagner family dynamic in 2018, two years after the murders and just months before they were arrested.

www.google.com

I am wondering whether LE thought or knew BK was on true crime social media threads and whether they were dropping details to try to get him to act.

 

[Charlot123]

So we really don’t know if he targeted the house for one of the victims or the house itself (easy to get into from sliding door, lots of coming/goings, parties). I go back and forth depending on what I read.

But, if he just wanted to kill and/or rape someone, why would he go into a house with 6 occupants? Wouldn’t it be easier to find a young woman who lived by herself or with a roommate in an apartment? Going into a house with 6 roommates is just insane.

Even easier for a trail killer. Why break into a house in a densely populated area?