Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #161

[mrjitty]

We don't know if defense has listened to the example interview or not. I couldn't imagine not wanting to see the following, especially since McL has hinted at other person/s being involved.

1.) a statement attesting to exculpatory evidence favorable to Allen
2.) a summary of the state’s opinions on statements made by Allen or witnesses

I think the prosecution is arguing those things are not discoverable/deliverable to the defence.

 

[Bergmann]

There's a lot of nothing-burger in relation to the prosecutions handover of evidence and the defence's requests in relation to discovery.

Nothing in the hearing indicated that the prosecution were not meeting their obligations under Indiana state law.

The defence wanted summaries and narratives which the prosecutor reminded them that they were not obligated to provide.

That's it.

Either the defence were trying it on and seeing what they could get away with in their requests (there is only 2 of them and without access to greater resources), or they are naïve and then got schooled by the other side for asking for things which they are not entitled to.

 

[mrjitty]

There's a lot of nothing-burger in relation to the prosecutions handover of evidence and the defence's requests in relation to discovery.

Nothing in the hearing indicated that the prosecution were not meeting their obligations under Indiana state law.

The defence wanted summaries and narratives which the prosecutor reminded them that they were not obligated to provide.

That's it.

Either the defence were trying it on and seeing what they could get away with in their requests (there is only 2 of them and without access to greater resources), or they are naïve and then got schooled by the other side for asking for things which they are not entitled to.

Likely they just threw the kitchen sink at it in the hope of building some procedural angles later. We can guess the defence has significant problems given the damaging admissions of the accused. Therefore they will want to play up the idea that the real killer is out there and its all a conspiracy

 

[steeltowngirl]

Plus he had to know saying that would make him more likely to get caught instead of just saying quiet while the girls allegedly saw him they wouldn’t be able to say it was him for sure as a lot of men look like bridge guy.

Except.. it didn’t make him more likely to get caught. It took 5.5 years for LE to make the connection.

Do you feel they have the wrong guy with RA?

 

[FrostedGlass]

Likely they just threw the kitchen sink at it in the hope of building some procedural angles later. We can guess the defence has significant problems given the damaging admissions of the accused. Therefore they will want to play up the idea that the real killer is out there and its all a conspiracy

Thank you; I appreciate you and the others answering my questions.

Sadly for some innocents who are convicted, your comment that I put in red turns out to be the case. If you follow the exoneration cases coming out of Elkhart County, Indiana, it's appalling what lengths the prosecution/le/judge will go through to get a conviction of an innocent person.

No matter how much we hate RA or the crime he's accused of committing or just crime in general, he is still entitled to a fair trial. I'm not accusing prosecution of wrong doings. IMO we need to be watchdogs and make sure it isn't a case of "someone" has to pay for this heinous crime.

I'm very glad RA's attorneys are mounting a vigorous defense; if they are following Elkhart Co., they may realize they will need to cover every single base, specifics on record.

 

[FromGermany1]

I wonder, if RA is not responsible for the murder, why he didn't/doesn't protest and claimed/claims his innocence loud and unmistakable.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I wonder, if RA is not responsible for the murder, why he didn't/doesn't protest and claimed/claims his innocence loud and unmistakable.

His atty spoke for him:

“Rick is a 50-year-old man who has never been arrested nor accused of any crime in his entire life,” Allen’s lawyers said. “He is innocent and completely confused as to why he has been charged with these crimes.”

Richard Allen’s attorneys speak out, call into question evidence: ‘Rick has nothing to hide’

DELPHI, Ind. — The attorneys for Richard Allen, the man accused of murdering Abby Williams and Libby German in Delphi in February 2017, have fired back against the evidence presented by investigato…

fox59.com

 

[vinayd]

The image of bridge guy is so blurry and grainy that it look like a lot makes in the Midwest so you can’t use that alone to say it’s Richard Allen.

yes understood and agree, literally talking about the shoulders only.

 

[Justice101]

His atty spoke for him:

“Rick is a 50-year-old man who has never been arrested nor accused of any crime in his entire life,” Allen’s lawyers said. “He is innocent and completely confused as to why he has been charged with these crimes.”

Richard Allen’s attorneys speak out, call into question evidence: ‘Rick has nothing to hide’

DELPHI, Ind. — The attorneys for Richard Allen, the man accused of murdering Abby Williams and Libby German in Delphi in February 2017, have fired back against the evidence presented by investigato…

fox59.com

His lawyer is getting the denial too.

Watch the lawyer do a 180 degree turn once the prosecution gives them the discovery document.

Rarely does the defendant tell the whole truth to his attorney.. and the attorney never askes point blank if he did it or not.

 

[Chelly]

yes understood and agree, literally talking about the shoulders only.
View attachment 395680 View attachment 395681 View attachment 395682

I don't know how common a slopped shoulder condition is, but these images are telling.
in my opinion.

 

[layer]

I wonder, if RA is not responsible for the murder, why he didn't/doesn't protest and claimed/claims his innocence loud and unmistakable.

Because the prosecution demanded a gag order, perhaps?

 

[minazoe]

I don't know how common a slopped shoulder condition is, but these images are telling.
in my opinion.

things start stacking up..plus I am dead set on there being an extra small man's footprint that will match RA.
couple the admission regarding the times /whereabouts and clothing that day... well ..

 

[EllaMinnowP]

I wonder, if RA is not responsible for the murder, why he didn't/doesn't protest and claimed/claims his innocence loud and unmistakable.

I’ve wondered this about the wife, daughter, and any other of RA’s loved ones.
Sure, the gag order’s in place now, but it wasn’t since his arrest back in October.
If I was accused of murder or any heinous act that my folks know is completely
far fetched for my character, I hope they would be making noise!

The fact that RA has been incarcerated for about 2 and a half months with no proof evident/ presumption strong hearing and therefore no bail hearing, either, AND not even expected to have such a hearing until next month makes me think someone should be making noise if they believe in RA’s innocence. Gag order be damned. Imo

 

[JosieMae]

things start stacking up..plus I am dead set on there being an extra small man's footprint that will match RA.
couple the admission regarding the times /whereabouts and clothing that day... well ..

Great point. Muddy and bloody will leave footprints. Perhaps the same boots/shoes were kept along with the same jacket.

 

[sandy_80]

At this time, this is only if the current suspect is the killer of Abigail Williams and Liberty German.

I am the biggest critic of this le .. but i think there is not even 1% presence of doubt as to the identity of BG ..I knew that IF the real BG ever caught.. he will be someone no one heard of or suspected and will be caught because of his own doing

yes understood and agree, literally talking about the shoulders only.
View attachment 395680 View attachment 395681 View attachment 395682

he is very short ..that alone is unusual
the teen girl witness said he was around her height ..signalling a short guy but they were bringing giants like kak and co ..simply not trusting the video or the witness ..now you have to reverse on that

 

[Justice101]

During an interview giving by former prosecutor Ives, he said that there was so much evidence in this case that a detective from the 1960''s or 70's could solve this case, and that was not including the new forensic investigative techniques that investigators have available to them today.

That is why this case is strange. I thought the probable cause affidavit would at least have some sort of strong physical evidence in it. Once investigators had a name they would have all the evidence they needed once they matched it to the evidence at the crime scene.

The discovery evidence was described as voluminous. I suppose that is where all the evidence is regarding the current suspect. It was not in the probable cause affidavit. Maybe he is the killer and there is DNA evidence or some other solid evidence, but at this time it is hard to conclude he is the killer with any certainty. And in my opinion, the video is too grainy to come to any solid conclusion about the person pictured in it. There are certain aspects of the video, like the thin material of the blue jacket, that make me think it is a blue windbreaker and not a blue jacket. But I agree there is no way for sure to come to that conclusion about the jacket.

So far, we did not see anything from the RA search warrant at the house except the gun.

They brought documents out, clothing as well as dug something small out of the yard. They might even have the same shell lot number that he originally bought and used 5 years ago. Bet he was afraid of shooting the gun since then. And there has got to be touch DNA left somewhere on the bodies...which now they will be able to match to him.

I suspect there will be a confluence of rivers of evidence come the trial (if there ever actually is one).

 

[Chelly]

I am the biggest critic of this le .. but i think there is not even 1% presence of doubt as to the identity of BG ..I knew that IF the real BG ever caught.. he will be someone no one heard of or suspected and will be caught because of his own doing


he is very short ..that alone is unusual
the teen girl witness said he was around her height ..signalling a short guy but they were bringing giants like kak and co ..simply not trusting the video or the witness ..now you have to reverse on that

Slopped shoulder syndrome plus short man syndrome. Both are real.
my opinion

 

[layer]

The fact that RA has been incarcerated for about 2 and a half months with no proof evident/ presumption strong hearing and therefore no bail hearing, either, AND not even expected to have such a hearing until next month makes me think someone should be making noise if they believe in RA’s innocence. Gag order be damned. Imo

I'm sure they have a cell next to RA for them if they do. It's difficult to protest innocence while you are breaking the law.

 

[EllaMinnowP]

I have tried unsuccessfully to find Indiana law on how long a murder suspect can be jailed without a Proof Evident hearing, which would precede a bail hearing.
If anyone knows the law on that or can find it, I’d appreciate the share.
From the perspective of an American citizen, it seems like those hearings should happen reasonably soon after arrest, IMO.
To me, well over 90 days is too long, IMO.

I’m inclined to think Judge Gull must’ve already seen/ determined that presumption is great for bail to be pushed to February. I’m not too keen on secret decisions by a lone judge, but I accept our justice system does rely on us trusting our elected officials to do right by what’s expected of them. MOO

 

[layer]

I suspect there will be a confluence of rivers of evidence come the trial

Let's hope so. But what if there's not?