CONVICTION OVERTURNED MD - Hae Min Lee, 17, Baltimore, 13 Jan 1999

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
MajorHoople said:
Maryland court to hear Lee family's appeal seeking redo of hearing that set Adnan Syed free

WJZ - Feb 2, 2023

Click to expand...
Imo the office of the state's attorney for Baltimore will be able to prove that the Lee's attorney was contacted before the hearing, several times, as had happened in the past with other issues. What the Lee's attorney did with the emails could be asked by the Lees. The State's attorney was forbidden by law to contact the Lees.

I'm afraid this family, in pain, is being used as a pawn for political interests.

"Victims' rights" seems to be a field undergoing need for more definition, although I can't envision the process, with all the variation in cases. Probably the field of "victims' rights" will be left to ambitious attorneys to define thru repeated, imo, exploitations. In the Watts case, the parents of confessed baby killer Watts are said to be looking at whether their own rights were violated nearly 5 years ago by not being invited to certain pressers, etc. They also claim that the DA should have been confiding in them as "victims", at the same time they were in frequent conferences with the defense attys. Apparently they have been lead to believe by internet "detectives" that they might be due "millions" for the way they were carelessly if not criminally treated after their son's horrendous murders. They were considered "victims" because their own son murdered their grandchildren, children of the murderer.

Jmo
 
Last edited:
NuttMegg said:
Imo the office of the state's attorney for Baltimore will be able to prove that the Lee's attorney was contacted before the hearing, several times <snip>
Click to expand...
As was brought out in the oral arguments and questioned further by one of the judges, Young was notified about the Monday hearing on Friday afternoon, less than one business day prior. One of the appellate judges questioned Erica Suter about the apparent rush to file the nolle prosequi when there was an appeal pending. Those judges understood something slimy happened, IMO.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IDK
Frankie Hellis said:
As was brought out in the oral arguments and questioned further by one of the judges, Young was notified about the Monday hearing on Friday afternoon, less than one business day prior. One of the appellate judges questioned Erica Suter about the apparent rush to file the nolle prosequi when there was an appeal pending. Those judges understood something slimy happened, IMO.
Click to expand...
The Lee's then attorney had the legal responsibility to keep his clients updated, instead of ,imo, his preferred MO of hyperbole, drawing attention to himself, etc. I don't believe these victims were well served by their own chosen representation. Mr. Lee had appeared in at least 1 zoom, iirc that was offered to the Lees in the latest instance too.

As I mentioned earlier, if Adnan is not the guilty one, that opens a whole can of worms re the victim's interaction with others who have so far, imo, gone under the radar. People far more unsavory than 17 year old Adnan.

The new law adopted by Maryland and other states mandates a review of inmates convicted of murder while a child, for those who have already served 20 years. It's a good thing.

The Lees are now victims of rivalries within the State's attorney system. They are being used, in their grief, and it's not right.

Imo
 
NuttMegg said:
The Lee's then attorney had the legal responsibility to keep his clients updated, instead of ,imo, his preferred MO of hyperbole, drawing attention to himself, etc. I don't believe these victims were well served by their own chosen representation. Mr. Lee had appeared in at least 1 zoom, iirc that was offered to the Lees in the latest instance too.

As I mentioned earlier, if Adnan is not the guilty one, that opens a whole can of worms re the victim's interaction with others who have so far, imo, gone under the radar. People far more unsavory than 17 year old Adnan.

The new law adopted by Maryland and other states mandates a review of inmates convicted of murder while a child, for those who have already served 20 years. It's a good thing.

The Lees are now victims of rivalries within the State's attorney system. They are being used, in their grief, and it's not right.

Imo
Click to expand...
Mosby’s office was in direct contact with the Lee’s. They did not notify until less than 24 hours prior to the hearing.

If Syed had been released because of a review of inmates convicted of murder whilst being a child, that would be an entirely different ballgame. What happened in this case was back room dealings and allegations of a Brady violation, in addition to allegations of other viable suspects with no proof of such and no ability to challenge any of it via our adversarial system of justice. It was an unprecedented slimy move by Mosby and her minions.
 
NuttMegg said:
IIRC, Adnan turned down a recent (last few years) plea deal, all he had to do was to plead guilty and he would be out after 20. I think it was explained in the podcast "undisclosed". That spoke volumes to me, that he was willing to spend the rest of his life in prison rather than falsely plead guilty. IMO, the Lee family should get another attorney that is not so combative. I feel terrible for her family, but continuing to punish a different family unfairly is not the solution. I don't think their attorney is helping them out with his insistence that they weren't notified, when the State's attorney for Baltimore city claims that she can show emails that they were throughout many steps in this process. The attorney makes it sound like the decision by the Judge came as a surprising, horrifying lightning bolt. A more thoughtful attorney could help them monitor what is to come in the case against others and find justice for Hae Min Lee. Just my opinion.

I don't see anyone mentioning the Maryland "Juvenile Restoration Act (JRA)" which was part of the sentencing review of Adnan Syed's case. In addition to providing the judicial review after 20 years served, the act, law, would now prevent juveniles like Syed of receiving life without parole sentences.


Also, although definitely not an attorney, I've always been intrigued with "Blackstone's Ratio: It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer". That's a simplistic introduction to the concept and its ramifications which I don't have the background to explain. In modern history It ties into beyond a reasonable doubt as the burden of proof. if anyone is interested please look it up on Wiki, they have a great article with a lot of citations and avenues for further research.

JMO.
Click to expand...
I hate to type this all over again. Maryland "Juvenile Restoration Act (JRA)" And, yes Mosby said she was not able to bypass the Lee's atty to speak with them directly.
 
NuttMegg said:
I hate to type this all over again. Maryland "Juvenile Restoration Act (JRA)" And, yes Mosby said she was not able to bypass the Lee's atty to speak with them directly.
Click to expand...
I have no idea what you are attempting to convey. Syed’s release had zero to do with the JRA and please cite where Mosby claimed not to be able to bypass the Lee’s attorney to speak with them, because the official record shows differently.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IDK
'For Syed, things seemed to move quickly from there.

"In light of the JRA, the University of Maryland’s Innocence Project appealed to Baltimore's Sentencing Review Unit (SRU) to re-examine Syed’s case. In March, Baltimore Circuit Court Judge Melissa Phinn ordered that evidence from the original 1999 crime scene be retested using technology that wasn’t available during the original trial. Phinn’s decision came upon the request of both Syed’s defense attorneys and state prosecutors."

www.yahoo.com

Why Murder Conviction For 'Serial' Subject Adnan Syed Was Overturned

For two decades it seemed that Adnan Syed would spend the rest of his life in prison for the 1999 murder of his ex-high school girlfriend Hae Min Lee in Baltimore, but a confluence of events that took shape over years – a stalwart maintenance of his own innocence, the tireless work of advocates...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
Frankie Hellis said:
I have no idea what you are attempting to convey. Syed’s release had zero to do with the JRA and please cite where Mosby claimed not to be able to bypass the Lee’s attorney to speak with them, because the official record shows differently.
Click to expand...
I provided you proof about the JRA, which was already discussed up thread. I don't have time to go thru 48 threads to re-post Mosby's comment about legally being limited to her office dealing solely with the victims' attorney, so may I ask that you post "the official records" that show differently? It sounds like you might have those at hand. Thanks ahead of time, Frankie Hellis.

ETA: Thanks for the help as I can't access the government doc pages from the country I live in.
 
Last edited:
NuttMegg said:
'For Syed, things seemed to move quickly from there.

"In light of the JRA, the University of Maryland’s Innocence Project appealed to Baltimore's Sentencing Review Unit (SRU) to re-examine Syed’s case. In March, Baltimore Circuit Court Judge Melissa Phinn ordered that evidence from the original 1999 crime scene be retested using technology that wasn’t available during the original trial. Phinn’s decision came upon the request of both Syed’s defense attorneys and state prosecutors."

www.yahoo.com

Why Murder Conviction For 'Serial' Subject Adnan Syed Was Overturned

For two decades it seemed that Adnan Syed would spend the rest of his life in prison for the 1999 murder of his ex-high school girlfriend Hae Min Lee in Baltimore, but a confluence of events that took shape over years – a stalwart maintenance of his own innocence, the tireless work of advocates...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com

I provided you proof about the JRA, which was already discussed up thread. I don't have time to go thru 48 threads to re-post Mosby's comment about legally being limited to her office dealing solely with the victims' attorney, so may I ask that you post "the official records" that show differently? It sounds like you might have those at hand. Thanks ahead of time, Frankie Hellis.

ETA: Thanks for the help as I can't access the government doc pages from the country I live in.
Click to expand...
First, the notice issue. Listen to the oral arguments at time stamp 43:25 where Suter admits the family was notified of the date of the hearing only one business day prior to the vacatur hearing by email and then via text. At no time does she state they were limited to dealing only with Lee’s attorney(s), and she was being grilled about the lack of notice, so she certainly would have stated it during that grilling.

If I can find a transcript of the vacatur hearing, I can show you where it was stated that they emailed Lee and I believe even Lee states he received the email. I know this because I listened to it, so I am not sure if it is in writing.
 
With respect to the JRA - I see in that article you linked where it states that was why they looked at this case, however it played no role in the outcome. They tested the dNA on Hae’s shoes - shoes she was not buried in and in fact were found in the trunk of her car - and found none of Syed’s, so they deemed him innocent. Mind you, they didn’t even find Hae’s dNA on Hae’s shoes, but somehow he ended up freed, with his sentence vacated. It was not a case of him having served 23 years and being 18 at the time of sentencing. No, they decided he did not commit the crime. Then they nolle prosequi-ed whilst both a stay and an appeal were pending.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IDK
sds71 said:
Maryland court orders new hearing for Adnan Syed, reinstating conviction Maryland’s second-highest court orders new hearing for Adnan Syed, reinstates conviction

Maryland Court of Appeals issues opinion that Young Lee, Hae Min Lee's brother's rights were violated when the Baltimore City Circuit Court didn't give notice ahead of the State's motion to vacate Adnan Syed's convictions and sentence https://wmar2news.com/local/maryland
Click to expand...
Sounds like Lee's brother has more rights than the person whose convictions were vacated. "We vacate the circuit court’s order vacating Mr. Syed’s convictions" Nah, no double jeopardy here folks.

One giant step for the political ambitions of the Maryland Attorney General. I think the brother just doesn't want to publicly examine any of the victim's relationships after the duo broke up. IMO

Since when does the brother of a victim get to properly review and challenge the state's new evidence".



ETA: see WAPO article below, Lee does not get to challenge any evidence.
 
Last edited:
Looks like Lee doesn't get to challenge anything at all. Just gets to attend and listen. BBM

“where Mr. Lee is given notice of the hearing that is sufficient to allow him to attend in person, evidence supporting the motion to vacate is presented, and the court states its reasons in support of its decision.” They declined, however, to appoint Young Lee or some other entity as a “limited-purpose party-in-interest” who could challenge prosecutors’ evidence. It is possible that after a new hearing, the result could be the same.

 
NuttMegg said:
Looks like Lee doesn't get to challenge anything at all. Just gets to attend and listen. BBM

“where Mr. Lee is given notice of the hearing that is sufficient to allow him to attend in person, evidence supporting the motion to vacate is presented, and the court states its reasons in support of its decision.” They declined, however, to appoint Young Lee or some other entity as a “limited-purpose party-in-interest” who could challenge prosecutors’ evidence. It is possible that after a new hearing, the result could be the same.

Click to expand...

I don't really understand how that is any different from him attending the hearing via Skype as he originally did. Does his attorney get to speak? Is it a question of the attorney having time to prepare or solely whether Mr. Lee was just able to sit in a courtroom in person as opposted to virtually?
 
Elliot_Alderson said:
I don't really understand how that is any different from him attending the hearing via Skype as he originally did. Does his attorney get to speak? Is it a question of the attorney having time to prepare or solely whether Mr. Lee was just able to sit in a courtroom in person as opposted to virtually?
Click to expand...
The makeup of the 3 person appellate court should be disclosed.

The first vacay, vacation, whatever it's called showed the prosecution in a very bad light, which put atty gen's nose out of joint. IMO

But, it could be just a housecleaning exercise to give Lee an in-person appearance to bad mouth Syed. Then close it down for good.

In any case it's a real nose holder.

IMO
 
This is what the appellate court actually said, ie the appellate court is not opining on evidence, etc.

"the circuit court violated Mr. Lee's right to notice of, and his right to attend, the hearing on the State's motion to vacate."

abcnews.go.com

Adnan Syed murder conviction reinstated by Maryland appeals court

He was the subject of the popular "Serial" podcast.
abcnews.go.com abcnews.go.com
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: IDK
“We must allow the appeals process to play itself out, Mr. Syed and his legal team may file for an appeal to the Maryland Supreme Court, and we must respect their rights to do so until those rights are either heard or that request is denied; we are in a holding pattern. Any further comment would be premature at this time.”

thehill.com

Adnan Syed murder conviction reinstated

Maryland’s second-highest court reinstated the conviction and sentence of Adnan Syed, the man whose murder investigation and trial was the center of the hit podcast “Serial,” saying a lower court v…
thehill.com thehill.com
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 159 more.
Total: 4,380 (members: 160, guests: 4,220)

Online statistics

Members online
160
Guests online
4,220
Total visitors
4,380
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
593,065
Messages
17,980,785
Members
229,012
Latest member
OnceAgain
Back
Top