4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, 2022 #77

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Sundog said:
Most everything is done by email these days, students are advised that they are responsible to keep up with reading emails from the administration (including registrar, Graduate School/division, department, etc.). And they would follow it up with a certified letter requiring signature.

If he showed up in January and paid his tuition on his own, they would have to have another reason to expel him, losing his teaching assistantship is all we know so far, not that he was expelled at that time.
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Do we really know that?
 
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IMO, BK's alleged behavior while attending and TAing at WSU could fall within the definition of bullying per WSU Policy, which specifically states it is inclusive of all employees, staff, and students at all levels (BBM):

"Policy​

The University is committed to maintaining an environment that is free from all acts of bullying by or against employees, students, or members of the public. The University is committed to ensuring trust and respect for all persons in an environment that cultivates individual and institutional integrity in all that we do.

Definition of Bullying​

Bullying, or nondiscriminatory harassment, refers to repeated, unreasonable actions of individuals (or a group) directed towards an employee or student (or a group of employees or students), which intimidate, degrade, humiliate, or undermine; or which create a risk to the health or safety of the employee or student. Workplace bullying often involves an abuse or misuse of power, but not all bullying behavior involves a power differential. Examples of possible workplace bullying include, but are not limited to:
  • Spreading false and malicious rumors, gossip, or innuendo.
  • Systematically excluding or isolating a person or group (socially singling out).
  • Undermining or impeding another person’s work.
  • Repeatedly stealing or taking credit for work done by others.
  • Belittling a person’s opinion.
  • Yelling, insulting, humiliating, or using profanity to harm, undermine, or intimidate others.
The above examples include using electronic technology such as email, social media sites, text messages, and websites for bullying. The following is a noninclusive list of behaviors that are not defined as bullying or harassing:
  • Expressing differences of opinion.
  • Offering constructive feedback, guidance, or advice about work-related behavior.
  • Reasonable action taken by a supervisor relating to the management of an office.
  • Reasonable action taken to manage an employee’s performance, initiating corrective action and/or disciplinary action.
Behavior that constitutes bullying may also violate, and be subject to action under, other University policies and/or state or federal laws.

...​

Applicability​

Except where otherwise indicated, this policy applies to:
  • All levels and areas of University operations and programs.
  • Students, faculty, and staff.
  • Visitors, vendors, volunteers, and all other personnel.
50.31 Workplace Bullying Prevention and Reporting | Office of Policies, Records, and Forms | Washington State University
 
Twistinginthewind said:
IMO, BK's alleged behavior while attending and TAing at WSU could fall within the definition of bullying per WSU Policy, which specifically states it is inclusive of all employees, staff, and students at all levels (BBM):

"Policy​

The University is committed to maintaining an environment that is free from all acts of bullying by or against employees, students, or members of the public. The University is committed to ensuring trust and respect for all persons in an environment that cultivates individual and institutional integrity in all that we do.

Definition of Bullying​

Bullying, or nondiscriminatory harassment, refers to repeated, unreasonable actions of individuals (or a group) directed towards an employee or student (or a group of employees or students), which intimidate, degrade, humiliate, or undermine; or which create a risk to the health or safety of the employee or student. Workplace bullying often involves an abuse or misuse of power, but not all bullying behavior involves a power differential. Examples of possible workplace bullying include, but are not limited to:
  • Spreading false and malicious rumors, gossip, or innuendo.
  • Systematically excluding or isolating a person or group (socially singling out).
  • Undermining or impeding another person’s work.
  • Repeatedly stealing or taking credit for work done by others.
  • Belittling a person’s opinion.
  • Yelling, insulting, humiliating, or using profanity to harm, undermine, or intimidate others.
The above examples include using electronic technology such as email, social media sites, text messages, and websites for bullying. The following is a noninclusive list of behaviors that are not defined as bullying or harassing:
  • Expressing differences of opinion.
  • Offering constructive feedback, guidance, or advice about work-related behavior.
  • Reasonable action taken by a supervisor relating to the management of an office.
  • Reasonable action taken to manage an employee’s performance, initiating corrective action and/or disciplinary action.
Behavior that constitutes bullying may also violate, and be subject to action under, other University policies and/or state or federal laws.

...​

Applicability​

Except where otherwise indicated, this policy applies to:
  • All levels and areas of University operations and programs.
  • Students, faculty, and staff.
  • Visitors, vendors, volunteers, and all other personnel.
50.31 Workplace Bullying Prevention and Reporting | Office of Policies, Records, and Forms | Washington State University
Click to expand...

I wonder where the "go at him" professor would fall in this policy.
 
maconrich said:
I did a duck duck go search using "bryan kohberger termination letter" - I'd think google would pull up the same results. Note the common source named is Banfield and / or NewsNation - even in the Inside Edition story. Perhaps the exclusive termination letter is legit; perhaps someone did violate WCU's "privacy laws that prohibit them from speaking publicly about students and alumni." At some point I guess we'll find out. I'm willing to believe it might be true, but I wouldn't put money down on it. I also agree that every media outlet isn't Fox News, but some "media sources" still have the story that Kohberger exposed himself and taunted a female prisoner in PA (which was debunked). With this case, media and about everyone else, is throwing out bits of information without confirming sources or debunking things that aren't true. All IMHO.

(found doing a search)

Updated: Feb 11, 2023 / 07:49 AM CST
"NewsNation’s “Banfield” exclusively obtained the WSU termination letter sent to Kohberger"
www.newsnationnow.com

Bryan Kohberger’s termination letter from WSU

NewsNation’s “Banfield” exclusively obtained the WSU termination letter sent to Kohberger.
www.newsnationnow.com www.newsnationnow.com

First Published: 10:29 AM PST, February 14, 2023
"allegedly got into a verbal altercation with a professor he worked for in the school’s criminology program, NewsNation and The New York Times reported."
"But following that counseling, Kohberger allegedly had a second incident with the same professor in early December and he lost his job as a teaching assistant."
www.insideedition.com

WSU Investigated Bryan Kohberger's Behavior While He Was a TA: Report

Faculty members were counseling Bryan Kohberger after a verbal altercation between the teacher’s assistant and the professor he worked for in the school’s criminology program while also probing his conduct with female students.
www.insideedition.com www.insideedition.com

Story by Liz Jassin • Feb 11
"The termination letter, obtained exclusively by NewsNation’s “Banfield,” was dated Dec. 19"
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There has been much discussion on the reliability of NewsNation and their anchors' anonymous sources. Though I've been skeptical of their reporting, I hate to dismiss their reports out of hand. Yet, while reading your post, it hit me that all of our unnamed sources have leaked their information to someone at NN. A few other outlets have reported leaks, but those too seem to originate with NN reports.

Considering the information leaked, a single source is not possible. The person with access to a WSU termination letter is not the same person who would have access to what's happening at the Latah County jail. Nor would a person with access to the jail have access to witness statements, to information about what BK was doing when he was arrested, etc.

Are we really buying that all of these unconnected people chose to leak things to Ashley B, Brian E. or Chris C.-- all of whom happen to work at the same fledgling news network?
 
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maconrich said:
So, are we to believe the NYT or WCU (Phil Weiler)? What does WCU have to gain by breaking federal student privacy laws? Wouldn't they be smarter to do whatever they can to make WCU look good (such as following federal laws) especially given the fact a potential murderer was one of their grad students?
Click to expand...

Phil Weiler did not give out any information on BK, he followed the privacy laws. The most he could say was that BK wasn't currently enrolled. I agree with you that Weiler - as Vice President /WSU spokesperson - would want to make WSU look good.

Thus, if this termination letter is bogus fake, then it was Weiler's responsibility to "set the record straight"
and correct this.

He had the right to say that the University never sent BK that letter or never took the actions mentioned in the letter. Especially in light of the fact that a professor's real name is used.

By not denying the letter Weiler is letting everyone think it's real.

How it looks to me anyway.
 
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Cool Cats said:
Phil Weiler did not give out any information on BK, he followed the privacy laws. The most he could say was that BK wasn't currently enrolled. I agree with you that Weiler - as Vice President /WSU spokesperson - would want to make WSU look good.

Thus, if this termination letter is bogus fake, then it was Weiler's responsibility to "set the record straight"
and correct this.

He had the right to say that the University never sent BK that letter or never took the actions mentioned in the letter. Especially in light of the fact that a professor's real name is used.

Is it possible that Weiler knows the letter is fake but has decided to let everyone think it's real? He is letting everyone think it's real.

Yes.

Because we don't know how the letter "got out" there is always room for the possibility of it being a fake letter.
Click to expand...
We know part of the published letter isn't true. This part:

"We met on December 19th when I informed you of your termination as a TA for spring semester."

Unless the writer means we met electronically we know BK was long gone from WSU for break by Dec 19.
 
Cool Cats said:
Phil Weiler did not give out any information on BK, he followed the privacy laws. The most he could say was that BK wasn't currently enrolled. I agree with you that Weiler - as Vice President /WSU spokesperson - would want to make WSU look good.

Thus, if this termination letter is bogus fake, then it was Weiler's responsibility to "set the record straight"
and correct this.

He had the right to say that the University never sent BK that letter or never took the actions mentioned in the letter. Especially in light of the fact that a professor's real name is used.

Is it possible that Weiler knows the letter is fake but has decided to let everyone think it's real?

Yes.

Because we don't know how the letter "got out" there is always room for the possibility of it being a fake letter.
Click to expand...
I too believe Mr Weiler (that he didn't give out information or break federal privacy laws). Would him making any comment confirming or denying the termination letter constitute breaking those laws? I don't know. It seems like it would be though? Perhaps someone else here knows the answer. I do remember that the attorney / professor's name was mentioned in an early report about the grading issue (without using quotes by him or saying he said anything). MOO. So I'm not sure if it was Weiler's responsibility to set the record straight or to maintain FERPA laws?
 
AFAIK, it has not been confirmed that BK's professor told students to "go at" BK or set up an open forum class discussion in which students were able to voice constructive criticism or concerns or complaints out loud to him if they wanted to, and that this was done without good intentions and for good reasons.

And if they did, it could have been taken out of context and/or misconstrued in MSM for "clickbait", IMO, the old "2 sides of the same coin" shtick -- e.g., if you think he treated people harshly, look how harshly people treated him.

I will give the professor the benefit of the doubt in this situation -- he is the current professional faculty member, and BK is a former TA who was fired for being unprofessional.

For all we know:

BK's behavior could have been so egregious towards so many students he was TAing (3 different classes for his professor) and his professor had tried and tried but failed to help him improve regarding expectations on professionalism and respectful treatment of his students.

So the professor asked for advice from other WSU employees and/or came up with an approach that was vetted and approved by other employees, and what they came up with in order to "handle" so many complaints at once, around the same time BK was having altercations with his professor, and it was a pretty dire situation, was to have a group discussion like what was alleged to have happened, with students who wanted to giving him verbal feedback.

Maybe BK was humiliated or embarrassed or angry about what some students said, and maybe it "got away" from the professor in some ways.

Maybe some of what was said to him was constructive criticism that his professor earnestly thought would be helpful to come "straight from the horses's mouth(s)" -- especially IF his professor had already told him what student complaints were about and he balked at that and that is why they had an "altercation" and not just a discussion.

Alas, we just don't know, and probably never will.

JMO
 
Twistinginthewind said:
AFAIK, it has not been confirmed that BK's professor told students to "go at" BK or set up an open forum class discussion in which students were able to voice constructive criticism or concerns or complaints out loud to him if they wanted to, and that this was done without good intentions and for good reasons.
Click to expand...

I mean, the exact same thing could be said for the students who claim he was sexist or even a bully. It hasn't been confirmed, AFAIK, but it's believed.

That's my frustration with this case. Seems that everything negative about BK is automatically believed, even if it's from anonymous sources. But anything that suggests maybe someone else behaved inappropriately, seems to be dismissed or defended. News Nation covers these stories because they know people will click. They want to encourage this kind of black-and-white thinking.

Twistinginthewind said:
And if they did, it could have been taken out of context and/or misconstrued in MSM for "clickbait", IMO, the old "2 sides of the same coin" shtick -- e.g., if you think he treated people harshly, look how harshly people treated him.
Click to expand...

Same could be said in the reverse. There's no question he was unprofessional in some regard. That's documented. But everything else is rumors, IMO.

I guess my point is that even if BK is a killer, it doesn't mean that every negative rumor about him is true and every person around him is an angel.

MOO.
 
gliving said:
Anyone have info about this website?

State Of Idaho Vs Bryan C. Kohberger (D8)​

CASE LAST REFRESHED: 12 HOURS AGO​


trellis.law

Case CV23-00566 State Of Idaho Vs Bryan C. Kohberger (D8) - Trellis: Legal Intelligence + Judicial Analytics

On April 03, 2023, The State Of Idaho, filed a General Criminal - (Criminal) case against Kohberger, Bryan C. in the jurisdiction of Washoe County, NV. This case was filed in Washoe County Superior Courts, with Barry L. Breslow presiding.
trellis.law trellis.law
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm trying Trellis bc someone I admire turned me onto it. It's a mini-law research library started by a couple smart cookies, a lawyer and a tech guy, to make state trial court records and legal data more accessible. I signed up for alerts/emails when new documents land for the Funke in NV case. It's free for now. The only thing is they don't have all the states, like absolutely nothing for Idaho. Time will tell.
JMO

edit: I'm not a lawyer and it's pretty easy. also a typo
 
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Boxer said:
Source.
Click to expand...

abc7chicago.com

Bryan Kohberger's former student describes abrupt behavior change after Idaho college murders

The criminology student said Kohberger's grading style took an abrupt turn after the murders took place.
abc7chicago.com abc7chicago.com

nypost.com

Bryan Kohberger ‘seemed preoccupied’ after Idaho murders: former student

A former student of accused Idaho killer Bryan Kohberger said the teaching assistant seemed “preoccupied” and started grading leniently following the murders of the four University of I…
nypost.com nypost.com
 
U.N. Known said:
There has been much discussion on the reliability of NewsNation and their anchors' anonymous sources. Though I've been skeptical of their reporting, I hate to dismiss their reports out of hand. Yet, while reading your post, it hit me that all of our unnamed sources have leaked their information to someone at NN. A few other outlets have reported leaks, but those too seem to originate with NN reports.

Considering the information leaked, a single source is not possible. The person with access to a WSU termination letter is not the same person who would have access to what's happening at the Latah County jail. Nor would a person with access to the jail have access to witness statements, to information about what BK was doing when he was arrested, etc.

Are we really buying that all of these unconnected people chose to leak things to Ashley B, Brian E. or Chris C.-- all of whom happen to work at the same fledgling news network?
Click to expand...
Nope!
 
maconrich said:
Thank you! It seemed like he would, but I wasn't sure.
Click to expand...

As an employee, though, he has the rights of an employee. It's in federal law and state law. Students are protected by FERPA, but once a person takes a paying position at an educational institution, there is either 1) no protection or 2) scant protection (Federal Work Study students are protected; as are interns).

So, each employee of a college can have their prior employment verified. Otherwise, we wouldn't be able to be employed elsewhere or get a new job. Also, FERPA does not protect basic enrollment information. Colleges still verify whether someone attended, whether they matriculated and whether they received a degree.

That's how colleges and universities can publish their lists of graduates. That information is considered public under FERPA. But not a person's transcript - that's private.

IMO.
 
<modsnip - quoted post was removed>
He could not have met with school officials on 12/16/22- he was driving then...

However, the probable-cause affidavit released after Kohberger was arrested on December 30 stated that the 28-year-old's vehicle was observed arriving at his parents' home in Pennsylvania on December 16, 2022, at approximately 2:26 p.m. local time.Feb 28, 2023

Bryan Kohberger Was Home for 11 Days Before Cops Started ...​

 
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maconrich said:
I too believe Mr Weiler (that he didn't give out information or break federal privacy laws). Would him making any comment confirming or denying the termination letter constitute breaking those laws? I don't know. It seems like it would be though? Perhaps someone else here knows the answer. I do remember that the attorney / professor's name was mentioned in an early report about the grading issue (without using quotes by him or saying he said anything). MOO. So I'm not sure if it was Weiler's responsibility to set the record straight or to maintain FERPA laws?
Click to expand...

Termination letters are not protected under FERPA. Students are students. When they become employees (whether at the same time or afterwards) and get a W-2 or a 1099, they are now employees and do not fall under FERPA>

Apparently students may speak about other students to the press (and I assume the press is responsible for redacting names if necessary). Students may speak about professors (or employers). Professors may not speak about students, but may speak about employment matters (or criminal matters, but as we all know, that takes a subpoena).

IMO
 
10ofRods said:
Termination letters are not protected under FERPA. Students are students. When they become employees (whether at the same time or afterwards) and get a W-2 or a 1099, they are now employees and do not fall under FERPA>

Apparently students may speak about other students to the press (and I assume the press is responsible for redacting names if necessary). Students may speak about professors (or employers). Professors may not speak about students, but may speak about employment matters (or criminal matters, but as we all know, that takes a subpoena).

IMO
Click to expand...
Thank you for the explanation and clarification!
 
BeginnerSleuther said:
IMO, if he was setting fires and killing kittens at age 8, we'd know by now.
Click to expand...
Respectfully, how would we know?

I haven't seen any clinical details about his younger years, just anecdotal "evidence" by friends, coworkers, employers, etc. Maybe I missed something.

I feel the case against him as a person who was outside the social & psychological "norms" does need some actual evidence such as psychological testing, dates of drug treatment & outcome, medical background re: autism spectrum, yadda yadda yadda.

BK has been able to take advantage of technology (distance learning) to hide a lot of behaviors IMO. We really don't know how much in-person instruction & feedback he received in classes after high school. I think this is potentially very instructive as to how some people are able to hide a lack of sociability to a degree that when they need that skill to succeed non-virtually, they simply don't have it.

So many killers have "set fires & killed kittens" at young ages. Why not Bryan?
JMO
 
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