Skyla Whitaker, 11, & Taylor Placker 13 - Found Murdered - #2

[SuziQ]

NANCY GRACE
Witness Says He Saw Oklahoma Schoolgirls Just Before Murder
Aired June 12, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0806/12/ng.01.html

 

[Garnan]

This thread is so long and I am sure this has been asked but does OK have the DP?

You bet we do, and we use it. Whoever did this will die in McAlester. We've had a lot of rain in the past couple of weeks, I would be very surprised if the creek/river wasn't full of water.

 

[Taximom]

She needs to fix that! I thought she posted them in interview archives.

Oh, maybe she's changed that! Please let me know if that's true. I can't watch her show anymore (no cable) but I'd love to read the transcripts. I know she'll post popular video segments and sometimes that helped in past cases. Please let me know!! Thanks.

UGH, that group who will remain nameless pisses me off. We do have a thread about them here if people want to talk about them more there. Sometimes you just have to vent about things like that.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I wonder, with her love of animals, if Taylor didn't hear something in the woods (or beyond), thought it was an animal in distress and go investigate. Thus the two stumbling upon whatever.

I have a couple of questions that have nothing to do with the timeline that I haven't seen answered (or else I missed them).

The cell phone. Where was it? Dropped by the bodies? If so, why was it not in a pocket, but, it seems, in one of the girl's hand? If it was in her hand and if they were going to answer the grandfather's call to come back, wouldn't that narrow the time down even more? The girls were wearing t-shirts and shorts so the phone was probably in her hand and had dropped, but they haven't verified it. You can't tell why they were unable to answer. They could have already been gone by then so the call won't tell much.

What was said on the 911 call? They haven't released that yet, but I would think the national news media is working on getting it.

Who else did the grandfather call and in what order? No mention of anyone except 911. He flagged down Skyla's mom who was arriving at his house and she drove further up to him. She made a call to the grandparents to bring the father.

Who called who and when did everyone get to the scene? Grandfather first and then Skyla's mother. The order everyone else arrived is unknown right now.

EMTS? They have not released the time of arrival to my knowledge.

Would the police have come with the EMTS? Yes, 911 would have notified them because the grandfather told everyone "They shot the girls" according to what Skyla's grandmother said last night. It would depend on where the closest Deputy or the Sheriff was on when they arrived.

Who placed the cover over the girls and wouldn't it have contaminated any evidence on the bodies? EMTs and they would account for their DNA, fingerprints, etc.

If the EMTS treated the girls (and why, if they were so obviously dead) wouldn't that have also screwed up any evidence? They must have touched the bodies in more than just a check to see if they were dead if there was gauze on one of the wounds. (See above)

If there are shell casings, the grandfather hasn't (to my knowledge) said he saw them. Now, he might have missed them in his distress, but, if not, I wonder what else he might have saw that he hasn't said publicly. I am sure as the shock wears off, he will remember things more clearly. Since it was released they found them, there is no need for him to say anything.

Hope that answered your questions.

 

[XcomSquaddie]

I wonder, with her love of animals, if Taylor didn't hear something in the woods (or beyond), thought it was an animal in distress and go investigate. Thus the two stumbling upon whatever.

I don't see that happening. If, like others have suggested the shooters were executing someone, where's the body? If they took that body, why not the girls? I have to think it was a thrill-killing or the girls were targeted.

The cell phone. Where was it? Dropped by the bodies? If so, why was it not in a pocket, but, it seems, in one of the girl's hand? If it was in her hand and if they were going to answer the grandfather's call to come back, wouldn't that narrow the time down even more?

It was probably on the ground or clipped on her belt. If the girls were involved in a luring or attempted abduction, the phone may have been out to call for help, possibly triggering the murders.

What was said on the 911 call?

I think it would be disturbing, but not helpful. LE does not seem to suspect the family, so

Who else did the grandfather call and in what order? Who called who and when did everyone get to the scene? EMTS? Parents? Police? Would the police have come with the EMTS or later (did the grandfather say they were shot or did the authorities think it might have been an accident (car hitting them)

Not sure where you're going with this one. It sounds like you're questioning the family involvement. Given the intensity of the investigation and the international scrutiny, I would like to think that any family issues would have been brought to light by now.

Remember LE investigates family first, then moves out to friends, acquaintences, then strangers. If the family hasn't been linked by now I'd have to think they were not involved.

Who placed the cover over the girls and wouldn't it have contaminated any evidence on the bodies?

If it were the emt's then it was probably cleaned and/or sterile. Contamination would be minimal.

If the EMTS treated the girls (and why, if they were so obviously dead) wouldn't that have also screwed up any evidence? They must have touched the bodies in more than just a check to see if they were dead if there was gauze on one of the wounds.

Dead doesn't always look dead, if you know what I mean. Especially in this day and age, modern medicine can work miracles. The EMT's probably checked vitals thoroughly.

Not to disturb anyone, but: death is not always instantaneous, even with headwounds and gunshots. Wounds will still bleed, the body might twitch, it may even take a few minutes to stop breathing. It all depends on the time between the attack/injury and the emt's arrival.

If there are shell casings, the grandfather hasn't (to my knowledge) said he saw them. Now, he might have missed them in his distress, but, if not, I wonder what else he might have saw that he hasn't said publicly.

The shell casings should not have been "piled up". Shells that are kicked out of a weapon fly randomly. Some go up and back, some go up and out to the side. If you fire a ten-round magazine, there are going to be shells in ten different places. If the casings were in a pile, someone put them there. They are also difficult to find in weeds/grass.

And as far as the grandfather goes, I doubt he saw anything once he saw the bodies. God help him.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Another interesting note last night on Greta: The the spokesperson for OSBI (Jessica Brown) said that the witness only came forward in the past 24 hours and she can't say why it took that long because it could tip off his identity.

So it makes me wonder if he was a local trucker perhaps and had been on the road so the reason for the delay. Any ideas?

 

[XcomSquaddie]

...grandfather told everyone "They shot the girls"...

That is an interesting choice of words. Has he clarified what he meant by "they"? It could mean plural, meaning maybe he saw something else, or it could just be an ambiguous pronoun.

 

[strach304]

If they haven't checked that creek where the bridge is they should be. After seeing a pic of it I think it's possible they dumped someone there and as they rode down the road saw the girls and assumed they saw them dumping what the girls may have thought was trash. A few pages back someone posted that the bridge was used as an illegal dump site for trash.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

As many times as the girls were shot, I would jump to the conclusion of "they", too.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

If they haven't checked that creek where the bridge is they should be. After seeing a pic of it I think it's possible they dumped someone there and as they rode down the road saw the girls and assumed they saw them dumping what the girls may have thought was trash. A few pages back someone posted that the bridge was used as an illegal dump site for trash.

I have said this a few times already that I think they should drag the creek for not only another body, but the weapons. You could be exactly right. Whatever the girls may have seen had to warrant such a brutal killing and another murder/body being dumped would certainly fit that theory.

Then again, it was mentioned in rumors they might have been killed because they had threatened to turn someone in for doing drugs. I don't see it, but it is possible.

 

[SuziQ]

Jessica Brown from OSBI discusses bullet trajectory with Nancy Grace:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0806/12/ng.01.html

(snip)
GRACE: Back to Jessica Brown. I want to follow up on a theory that Pat Brown has just reiterated. Jessica, the possibility that someone was hiding in the woods, knowing these little girls, or somebody -- not necessarily these two, two little girls, 11 and 13 years old, walking down the street. Were the girls shot from in front or from behind?

JESSICA BROWN: We believe they were shot from the front. Now, that is one theory among many we`re looking at, and that`s why today our crime scene investigators not only went back to the scene, but they took a bird`s eye view so they could see in the thicket of trees there, to see if there was any place where someone could hide.

GRACE: Well, have they determined the angle of the trajectory, the angle of the bullet? Because if that were true, someone shot from above, you could clearly see the angle entry, exit at the lower back.

JESSICA BROWN: We do have a good idea of the trajectory at this point in time, but I can`t get into further details with you. But we`re looking at everything. We`re not taking anything lightly here.

GRACE: Well, obviously, based on what you found at the autopsy, you think that`s a possibility, or else you would have not had someone out there today to determine that. But you`re saying from the front to the back. Here`s another question. From the angle in which they fell, Jessica, could you determine if they were shot right there?

JESSICA BROWN: We believe they were shot there at the scene, not shot elsewhere and taken there. We don`t believe they had time to run away, to move, to get out of the way of these bullets.

GRACE: OK. Next question, to Jessica Brown joining us from the State Bureau of Investigation there in Oklahoma. If you know where they were at the time of the shooting and you know entry/exit, you also know which way the vehicle was traveling if the perpetrator was in a vehicle, yes?

JESSICA BROWN: We have a good idea.

ETA: It sounds like an ambush

 

[less0305]

That is an interesting choice of words. Has he clarified what he meant by "they"? It could mean plural, meaning maybe he saw something else, or it could just be an ambiguous pronoun.

I think he's under the assumption, as is leo, that there were multiple shooters since two guns were used and the girls were shot numerous times. I heard on the news that they suspect more than one person may have been involved.

 

[STEADFAST]

I have said this a few times already that I think they should drag the creek for not only another body, but the weapons. You could be exactly right. Whatever the girls may have seen had to warrant such a brutal killing and another murder/body being dumped would certainly fit that theory.

Then again, it was mentioned in rumors they might have been killed because they had threatened to turn someone in for doing drugs. I don't see it, but it is possible.

I just saw some footage on MSNBC, and they are doing some sort of searching in the creek, which is practically over its banks.

 

[XcomSquaddie]

I think he's under the assumption, as is leo, that there were multiple shooters since two guns were used and the girls were shot numerous times. I heard on the news that they suspect more than one person may have been involved.

Yes, it's been well established that there almost had to be two shooters, from police statements, the ballistics and such.

However I was focusing on the grandfather's words in the initial minutes of the investigation.

I was hoping that maybe he had seen something that made him think multiple shooters, or knew of people that the girls had trouble with. I was hoping that maybe the police were keeping mum about it for investigative purposes. I was hoping that it would mean that the police had strong leads and are closing in on the perpetrators.

But I do understand the the grandfather was probably just talking on autpilot, and that the phrasing is so vague as to be meaningless. I was just hoping.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I just saw some footage on MSNBC, and they are doing some sort of searching in the creek, which is practically over its banks.

Good!! Thanks, Steadfast!

This quote in an article shows how young kids in OK are taught to handle weapons. This boy must have been 8-9 yo when he started...to be good at 10 yo, imo. This is the standard in rural OK. People hunt, fish, and it is a way of life for them. However, I was curious about the father showing off a 9mm when he doesn't know the caliber of guns they are looking for! I wonder if LE caught this?:

A neighbor, Ross Padgett, said drugs and the criminal element are worse than ever.

"Marijuana, meth, coke, you name it," he said. "A number of the meth cookers are right over in this community. They are busting them so hard in the cities, they are going rural." He lifted his shirt to reveal a 9 mm pistol, saying, "I'm not worried."

He said his 10-year-old son, Dakota, arms himself with a knife when he goes out to play on the family's land. The boy has also been trained with a gun.

"I'm good with a shot," Dakota said. "I'm pretty good with almost any gun."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/10/national/main4168258.shtml (Bolded by me)

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Suzi~ I would think they were ambushed, too. They didn't move to run. My guess is that the car pulled up beside them with their guns drawn. It stopped them immediately. If you have two people holding weapons on you while getting out of a vehicle, you are at their mercy.

 

[STEADFAST]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/10/national/main4168258.shtml (Bolded by me)

I thought this quote from your link was very interesting, too:
"It just went downhill out in the country," he (Skyla's grandfather) said. "These roads ain't nothing but drunks and dopeheads on the weekends. Sometimes, you have to drive around them, they're passed out in the middle of the road."

 

[OrdinaryLife]

Good!! Thanks, Steadfast!

This quote in an article shows how young kids in OK are taught to handle weapons. This boy must have been 8-9 yo when he started...to be good at 10 yo, imo. This is the standard in rural OK. People hunt, fish, and it is a way of life for them. However, I was curious about the father showing off a 9mm when he doesn't know the caliber of guns they are looking for! I wonder if LE caught this?:

A neighbor, Ross Padgett, said drugs and the criminal element are worse than ever.

"Marijuana, meth, coke, you name it," he said. "A number of the meth cookers are right over in this community. They are busting them so hard in the cities, they are going rural." He lifted his shirt to reveal a 9 mm pistol, saying, "I'm not worried."

He said his 10-year-old son, Dakota, arms himself with a knife when he goes out to play on the family's land. The boy has also been trained with a gun.

"I'm good with a shot," Dakota said. "I'm pretty good with almost any gun."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/10/national/main4168258.shtml (Bolded by me)

Padgett's statements and showing off his 9mm gun just comes across as a guy who is protecting himself with *his* gun. I do not see any correlation to what mm's were used in this murder at all and/or he having any knowledge of anything more.

What should LE look at concerning this guy?

 

[Garnan]

I just can't wrap my mind around this. I have been reading all the theories about why they were killed, and none of them work for me. I just can't imagine coming up on 2 little girls and killing them for any reason. I think when they make an arrest we are all going to be shocked at the motive. I'll bet it's something really stupid and has nothing to do with something the girls saw. I bet it's teen-agers or an immature young man or both, and the girls at one time laughed at them or something equally stupid.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

He is a "neighbor" and could have been in the area at the time...or maybe he has other kids who are older that have access to his guns. I understand his eagerness to show he can protect his family, but something just struck me as different. Can't put my finger on it, but I saw it yesterday and went back to find the article because of that.