Drugging Caylee?Disney Bag/syringe and items found

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As I think about it, the duct tape over the mouth to prevent screams, then the injection with bug spray sounds so... KC... It would have had to be IM and extemely painful before death, as I don't think her skilled enough to hit a vein especially on a child as young as Caylee. I wonder if she put the heart stickie on before she killed her, or after...
 
I had a toddler in the ER once that drank pestacide that grandpa stored in a coke bottle. Organophoshate poisoning causes the lungs to fill with fluid. The child came in all smiley and stable and within 5-10 minutes or so, was gurgling loud enough with fluids and severe respiratory distress you could hear her all over the ER. Took a long time to get an IV because her vascular system shut down and before we could do an intraosseous access (bone marrow needle screwed into bone of lower leg and used like an IV) so we could antedote (atropine), she nearly respiratory arrested!! She gurgles and struggled to breathe and her eyes were wild and desperate!!! (not to be so graphic but this is for real)

Horrific, terrifying experience for child who couldn't breathe and the RN trying to get the medicine into her! One of the most vivid memories of my nearly 30 years in ER.

If pesticides were intentionally given to CA AND duct tape over the mouth, I would be willing to make the trip to FLA and PERSONNALLY give the lethal injection when the time comes!!!!

That sounds absolutely horrid! Was she OK? When my nephew was about 2 he drank Palmolive dishsoap left in a cup..He was fine when SIL called the doc who said bring him to the ER..Within a few minutes of getting there he started to vomit & had a seizure..I'm pretty sure dishsoap doesn't kill but pesticide surely does :(
 
She spent two days on a respirator but did do okay. The atropine dries up the secretions and we couldn't get it into her fast enough. She came back to see me about a week later to tell us thank you and she was adorable.:) Thank you for asking.

Of all the things that KC could have done to CA, this one to me would have been the most horrible method. I picture the little girl I took care of and think of CA being that way and duct taped, jez, makes me livid. If not given by injection (doubt that was the method if it was used), then she would have had to have been alert to swallow it. It acts fairly quickly.
 
I hate even discussing this in this much detail because it makes me just sick to think about it, and I don't know if this has ever been mentioned in another thread, but here goes:

Didn't they say somewhere that there was still flesh under the duct tape? And if so, would the flesh be able to be tested for any chemicals that may have been injected?

The hair would be the key for any drugs or chemicals. Exposure to the elements does not change the drugs in the hair.
 
Why would casey leave the evidence all bagged up nicely with the body ? Its like she left eveidence to convict herself. She had to know the body wasnt going to just disappear ??
I think her behavior is consistent. This is the same girl who maintained she worked at Universal until the last possible second, insisted that Zanny lived at Sawgrass, and so on, ad nauseam. Maybe she begins to believe her own lies. Maybe she's not used to being confronted. She is deluded.
 
I don't recall seeing anything in the released docs concerning any human tissue other than bone. I could very easily have missed it.

If you can dig up a reference that would be great.

I can't recall where it came from..I think it might have been from the ME's PC when she identified Caylee or the report from the ME in the prior doc dump..Also possible is an Orlando (paper/tv) source or NG shortly after the remains were found but I'm leaning more towards coming from the ME..Sorry I can't be more helpful.
 
There was a prescription for gentimicin in Caylee's name which can come in injectable form and it wasn't specified what form it was but I highly doubt a dr would prescribe it as such, even with a nurse for a grandmother. It was likely either gentimicin eye drops or ear drops.

Gentamicin is an aminoglycoside antibiotic for gram negative bacteria. That is a STRANGE antibiotic to give a child. Gentamicin is a bactericidal antibiotic and can cause hearing loss rapidly. It's most common use is in STD's. When was this prescribed does anyone know?
 
Heres a pic of the gatorade bottle with the toilet roll inside.

gatoradewithroll.png


I personally wouldnt think it was possible for a toilet roll not to break down after 6 months in liquid , whatever that liquid may be. So I've just submerged an empty roll in some water to see how long it takes to break down....my mini experiment.
Its interesting that they didnt open the bottle to get a shot of what was inside. I wonder why we didnt get a pic of the possible syringe. I want to know if it was needle-less indicating it was for oral dosage, or if it was left behind by some strung out junky.
Then theres the question of why the heck is there a toilet roll inside this bottle.:waitasec:
The only thing that I can think of is that they were making something similar to a trip (LSD)- allowing the narcotic to soak into the cardboard, then divide it up for sale?
There were alot of pipes found out there so theres obviously alot of drug use/abuse that goes on in those woods.
Do we know if KC drank Gatorade?
JMO
 
She spent two days on a respirator but did do okay. The atropine dries up the secretions and we couldn't get it into her fast enough. She came back to see me about a week later to tell us thank you and she was adorable.:) Thank you for asking.

Of all the things that KC could have done to CA, this one to me would have been the most horrible method. I picture the little girl I took care of and think of CA being that way and duct taped, jez, makes me livid. If not given by injection (doubt that was the method if it was used), then she would have had to have been alert to swallow it. It acts fairly quickly.

Great news about the little girl :)

I'm having a hard time with the pesticide theory..It's overkill & evil KC had so many other ways to get rid of her why go this route? :eek:
 
It seems like Casey panicked and then disposed of her dead child along with everything else she had in the trunk. She had to have had a "better plan" as to how she was going to get rid of everything. The body was only a few feet from the side of the road... even an idiot could figure out it would be discovered eventually. I'm guessing that poor Caylee was in that trunk when George tried to go in to get the gas cans, and Casey freaked and took off and dumped everything. Or maybe when she ran out of gas on the side of the road she realized that she couldn't leave her car with a rotting corpse in the trunk, and quickly tossed everything in the woods before calling Tony for a ride. For someone that put a lot of planning into their child's murder, the way she disposed of the body was too sloppy to have been part of that plan.
Luckily the syringe was protected inside of that bottle, and hopefully they can test it to see what was inside. Had the syringe been dumped elsewhere, chances are it would never have been discovered, or connected to this case. This might be the only evidence they have to show manner of death.

I certainly agree with you that her disposal of the body and all the stuff with it looks panicked and unplanned. But to me, her behavior in the month after the murder does not look like she had any kind of careful plan for what to do afterward - - and that makes me doubt whether there was any real planning involved at all. I'm not sure why you think she put "a lot of planning into [her] child's murder" (unless you are basing that on some of the new evidence I have not seen yet) The internet searches for chloroform, "household weapons", "neck breaking" etc. may indicate she was fantasizing about killing someone (maybe Caylee, or just as likely, her parents, considering her conflicts with them and talking about how she was going to get their house and Amy would move in with her ). But I don't think that indicates she had developed a well-thought-out plan for murdering Caylee.

To me, from what I have seen so far, it still seems likely she just snapped-- out of rage or a sudden evil impulse, or else that she was drugging Caylee and caused an accidental OD. (I am not sure if they have any way of knowing if the duct tape was placed before or after death. but it could have been put there after to prevent further leaking of decomp fluid which is probably what had already stained the trunk)

It looked like Casey was winging it, making up lies as she went along when people asked questions about where Caylee was, but mostly in stuck in avoidance mode. It's not like she was constantly in the presence of others or under surveillance, so her (non)action in keeping poor Caylee's body in her trunk for days so that it started decomposing and causing a terrible odor, very pointedly tying her car to the crime....and then finally just dumping the body AND all the other stuff near the road in the woods/ swamp area nearest to her house --That looks like not much planning went on. And one of the most key features of any murder plan is what to do with the body! (not that I speak from personal experience!)

Also, if she'd carefully planned this in advance with the intention of getting away with murder, she would have reported it much sooner (as opposed to not at all) and would not have told a story with a fantasy nanny with a specific name and address easily disproven. She'd have said Caylee was snatched by some unknown stranger, and it would likely have been from a location without security cameras. At the very least, she would have put on an act of being distraught in those weeks.
Just my opinion. Really it is hard to know what went on in the mind of someone so twisted.
 
This is pure speculation. But it is likely that the A family would have had a syringe around already just in case they needed it to give Caylee oral meds. I always kept one when my kids were young. But.... KC was always going to the hospital to see CA. If you were observant and quick it really wouldn't be that hard to pick one up- needle and all.

It may seem inconsistent for someone to plan a murder and esp an intricate one and yet not plan what to do after the murder. But many times people will do just that. They get so involved in planning the murder that they just forget to plan how to get by with it. Or they have a plan for that, but then things don't work out, something happens or they decide the plan wasn't good enough and try to change it in the middle. Sometimes pure laziness will keep them from carrying out the original plan as far as hiding what they did. After the murder, the urgency seems to be gone.
 
Great news about the little girl :)

I'm having a hard time with the pesticide theory..It's overkill & evil KC had so many other ways to get rid of her why go this route? :eek:


I agree that it is unlikely that she gave the pesticide to CA but wanted to show posters the effects of it if ingested by the example of my patient. I pray she didn't!:eek:

I think the most likely use of the pesticide was she sprayed it on the bags that held CA thinking she would get rid of flies, maggots, etc. while it was in her car.
 
Looks like to me with everything that was found that
Casey's fingerprints would not only be on the duck tape
but a lot of other things the police have found ..Wonder
why she left so many things there ?
 
Gentamicin is an aminoglycoside antibiotic for gram negative bacteria. That is a STRANGE antibiotic to give a child. Gentamicin is a bactericidal antibiotic and can cause hearing loss rapidly. It's most common use is in STD's. When was this prescribed does anyone know?

Casey was a fan of CSI and there was a show some years back where they were using eye drops as a poison for adults.
 
The worst thing that could happen is that the toxicology reports would come back as inconclusive, and there were unidentified fingerprints on the syringe. That would give the defense a boost with the SODDI claim.

Even though the totality of the evidence makes it seem like any reasonable person would convict in a heartbeat (just from what has been made public) I really really want there to be forensics that are slam-dunk, airtight ,untouchable. Hopefully they just haven't released it yet, but it's there.
 
This is pure speculation. But it is likely that the A family would have had a syringe around already just in case they needed it to give Caylee oral meds. I always kept one when my kids were young. But.... KC was always going to the hospital to see CA. If you were observant and quick it really wouldn't be that hard to pick one up- needle and all.

It may seem inconsistent for someone to plan a murder and esp an intricate one and yet not plan what to do after the murder. But many times people will do just that. They get so involved in planning the murder that they just forget to plan how to get by with it. Or they have a plan for that, but then things don't work out, something happens or they decide the plan wasn't good enough and try to change it in the middle. Sometimes pure laziness will keep them from carrying out the original plan as far as hiding what they did. After the murder, the urgency seems to be gone.

I don't believe CA worked at a hospital, did she?
 
It hasn't been officially confirmed that the object inside the Gatorade bottle is a syringe, and if it has been used at all. OCSO described it as a possible syringe in wrapper. Maybe there will be details in the next doc dump.
 
Gentamicin is an aminoglycoside antibiotic for gram negative bacteria. That is a STRANGE antibiotic to give a child. Gentamicin is a bactericidal antibiotic and can cause hearing loss rapidly. It's most common use is in STD's. When was this prescribed does anyone know?

Gentamicin in topical form is used to treat bacterial skin infections. Perhaps it was related to the red rash that appeared on her face.
 
I found this on Urban Dictionary. Thought it was interesting given the presence of dryer sheets in KC's trunk. With the addition of the syringe appears to be drug paraphenalia. Whether or not any of it's related to the case -- we'll have to wait and see.

--------------------------

Blow Tube

Noun. A Smoking Accessory. Often hand-held sized, made of empty toilet paper roll or Gatorade bottle stuffed with dryer sheets. Subsequent to inhaling smoke, exhale into the blow tube such that the smoke is disguised and dispersed into surrounding air. If operated properly, such substances smoke aroma will be incognito.
 
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