IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #15

[jjenny]

As I pointed out, it is easy for someone to say, I'm here with Jim Bob to get some food. He is my cousin. He's 21.

There is no way to disprove Jim Bob is not her cousin, nor does the law require proof.

Boom -- Legal entry -- from the bar's perspective.

And we don't know if this happened or not.

The bar would still have to ask her for ID, I presume.
Even if she said CR was her cousin Jim Bob.

 

[Btown]

Regardless, since the ID is checked,

The bar would still have to ask her for ID, I presume.
Even if she said CR was her cousin Jim Bob.

Actually, if you read the Indiana Code 7.1-5-7-5.1 Subsection (b), you will see a statement that an individual can sign to gain entry into a bar if they don't have the proper I.D.

Again, legal entry from the bars perspective, or at least a legal defense to allowing a minor in the bar without I.D.

Not saying this happened either. Just saying we don't know. It could have.


{edit} I take that back, and appologize for misinforming. The form does require 2 forms of I.D. So, if they checked I.D. she would have had to have it to gain entry.

The purpose of the first post was to show that you can legally gain entry to a tavern while not being 21. It didn't have anything to do with her having her purse with her or not.

 

[GoodAim]

Just speculation....

Had a feeling when Lauren left CR's and MB's townhouse, she intended to go to JR's. I would guess that was a half hour or less after arriving at 5 North. After she leaves their townhouse, having to go outside to enter JR's place, she was either unsure of where she really wanted to go (JR's home? JW's), or confused, or some kind of drug had really kicked in. It might've been 3:58 AM (instead of 3:38) or whatever, but I do believe she was seen in the street, pretty much passed out, or on a step of a breezeway.

I think the guy who offered her help took her back to JR's and left. That seems to be before 4:15 AM when JR's phone made the call to DR (had to be an emergency call, unless it was to try to get downers for JR to get some sleep IF he'd been doing coke or other stimulants all night). I guess there's a slight chance Lauren called him, but if the (supposedly 3:38) witness report was correct, Lauren was not in any shape to make a call. So JR was left with the nightmare of a dangerously ill girl being delivered back to him, and then.... well, it probably just got worse...

 

[jjenny]

We have been discussing this for a very long time, but police have already said they don't think the witness saw LS at 3:38 am. <modsnip>?

 

[northsider]

Just to let everyone know...

Kilroy's does ID everyone going in. No exceptions (at least none that I've experienced in 10+ years of going there).

The IDs are often fake, particularly for little blonde girls, but they always have at least two people at the door checking IDs.

 

[jjenny]

Just to let everyone know...

Kilroy's does ID everyone going in. No exceptions (at least none that I've experienced in 10+ years of going there).

The IDs are often fake, particularly for little blonde girls, but they always have at least two people at the door checking IDs.

Well that proves my point-LS had to have her purse with her when she went to the bar. So that means she lost it on her way to CR's after the bar.

 

[akh]

Indiana bars don't typically allow you to enter if you're under 21. Places that serve food go ahead and separate the two areas so there are no questions.

I feel fairly secure in saying that she either had to smile at the bouncer and/or show a fake ID to get in... with a slight possibility maybe there was an opportunity to slip in. But under no circumstances would she be in the bar by saying she was with a parent, family member, etc.. The bar wouldn't allow it IMHO. They'd rather have her in there with a fake ID than to allow what would happen if they utilized that portion of the Indiana codes to allow someone under 21 in the club.

Too much liability for bars to allow someone under 21 thru the doors even via a loophole in the law. Just because a law would allow it, doesn't mean a bar (like Kilroy's Sports Bar) would go anywhere near it.

But I could be wrong...

But it doesn't matter. She'd still likely to have prove she's 18.

 

[akh]

We have been discussing this for a very long time, but police have already said they don't think the witness saw LS at 3:38 am. So what is the point of discussing it as if it happened?

LE rambled on that point and said nothing at all IMHO. LE could not have been any more vague. I don't know whether they didn't want to call the witness a liar or didn't want to let the cat out of the bag they believe her. But whatever the reason IMHO LE did not answer the question or clear that up at all... and I believe that was intentional on their part.

 

[Btown]

Indiana bars don't typically allow you to enter if you're under 21. Places that serve food go ahead and separate the two areas so there are no questions.

Too much liability for bars to allow someone under 21 thru the doors even via a loophole in the law. Just because a law would allow it, doesn't mean a bar (like Kilroy's Sports Bar) would go anywhere near it.

But I could be wrong...

Actually, my son does it twice weekly for over a year. He's 19.
That's how I know the code.

The bars know he's underage, and won't serve him alcohol, but allow him in with a family member as long as he orders food. Its not a loophole, its the law. He also helps the karaoke staff.

Don't worry, I'm not a bad parent. There are reasons we allow this.

 

[Jupiter812]

Do we know if LS had a car at school? And if so, has it been searched?

The MSM has referred to them as car keys. Since she is sophomore living off campus and most of the the East coast kids seem to have cars here, I presume she does too. I don't know if it was searched.

I don't understand why she had the keys with her unless she was planning to drive somewhere. I wonder if she had a key to Jesse's house as well.

 

[jjenny]

The MSM has referred to them as car keys. Since she is sophomore living off campus and most of the the East coast kids seem to have cars here, I presume she does too. I don't know if it was searched.

I don't understand why she had the keys with her unless she was planning to drive somewhere. I wonder if she had a key to Jesse's house as well.

I think the keys might have been attached to the purse.

 

[Btown]

I think the keys might have been attached to the purse.

Does anyone know if her I.D was in that purse found at the handrail?

 

[bx2]

The MSM has referred to them as car keys. Since she is sophomore living off campus and most of the the East coast kids seem to have cars here, I presume she does too. I don't know if it was searched.

I don't understand why she had the keys with her unless she was planning to drive somewhere. I wonder if she had a key to Jesse's house as well.

At the 6/7 news conference (@11:45), Lt. Parker states: "she did not have a vehicle and some of her buddies didn't have vehicles either"

http://www.theindychannel.com/video/28157482/index.html

 

[Btown]

Well that proves my point-LS had to have her purse with her when she went to the bar. So that means she lost it on her way to CR's after the bar.

So her I.D. was in the purse that was found at the handrail?

 

[Jupiter812]

At the 6/7 news conference (@11:45), Lt. Parker states: "she did not have a vehicle and some of her buddies didn't have vehicles either"

http://www.theindychannel.com/video/28157482/index.html

I think he's referring to the fact that she and they did not have vehicles that evening--they were on foot; therefore, there is no reason for the search to go outside the county at that time.

 

[Search4U]

I'm stuck on the jacket today, the one Lauren was carrying in the photo leaving Smallwood. Why haven't we heard anything about it? Where did she leave it? Was it ever found? It might be irrelevant. But maybe not. My guess is that she left it at JR's when she and CR went to Kilroy's. The night wasn't as chilly as she thought it might be, and she didn't want to carry it around.

Good thought! I wish I would have had the smarts to ask the detective about the jacket when he was telling us what to look for while searching. :loser:

 

[Btown]

I think the keys might have been attached to the purse.

You are probably right.

I found one article that says the keys were in a small coin purse.

 

[bx2]

I think he's referring to the fact that she and they did not have vehicles that evening--they were on foot; therefore, there is no reason for the search to go outside the county at that time.

Its a bit confusing due to the 2-parted aspect of the question, but I believe he is clear in that she did not have a vehicle.

 

[TonyGatto]

Has the story from last year about the sex tape made, allegedly in the bathroom at SPORTS, been discussed?

 

[bx2]

Good thought! I wish I would have had the smarts to ask the detective about the jacket when he was telling us what to look for while searching. :loser:

I'm still confused at to how it took until day 10 for them to clarify the top she was wearing. They have her in several videos, Smallwood entry/exit, Kilroys entry/exit, alley - how could what she was wearing be given out as a white tank top until June 14th?