beccalecca1
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IIRC, wasn't Susan Smith suffering from Post Partum Depression too? If so, a man wasn't all that it takes, it also takes a hormonal imbalance.
The Verdict - Do you agree or disagree?
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IIRC, wasn't Susan Smith suffering from Post Partum Depression too? If so, a man wasn't all that it takes, it also takes a hormonal imbalance.
Just a few points...
First of all I think those who say that Casey was a good mother, must be much more accepting of bizarre human behavior than I am, since Casey's seems psychopathic to me.
Casey herself said that Zanny was punishing her for being a bad mother and since Zanny doesn't exist one might take this to being an admission by her of her bad mother status. And it is not very good mothering to have fake nannies, fake jobs and fake friends and to drag this very young child to God knows where and at what hours and to be exposed to who knows what. Excessive drinking at the very least. Not to mention that IF she did care about her child's future, she would have had a real job not a pretend one. She was only a "good mother" when it was easy and fun to play and there were witnesses. Since, I am a mother I can imagine myself in her shoes (well I could if I believed the crock of story that Caylee drowned in the pool and instead of doing what everyone else would have done, she and her pervert father decided to make an accident appear to be a murder and throw the beloved, cherished, child away like trash and the dad who then later decides to frame...)...but I digress...
I can imagine being in her shoes and, all logic aside, have to pretend that my dear child has been kidnapped. I would imagine that I would be in a state of devastation, shock and complete and utter sadness. I would have to be alone for awhile to collect myself and then I would want to hide away and not speak with anyone. How could I? The mere mention of my beloved would send me over the edge emotionally. Plus I am driving around in a car that is stinking like my dead child..or maybe that was a squirrel. Don't even mention having to confront and hoodwink my mother and the police...it would be too much. Is this what Casey experienced? Ummm NOOOOOOOO! In fact, Casey did not react like I would have, or anyone who has ever lived would react. Well, anyone innocent that is. And IF she were a good mother to start with, it would just not be possible to (beginning just hours, if not minutes, after the death) go out partying, drinking, f-ing, laughing, cooking, cleaning, dancing, hotshotting, tattooing, texting, lying, and stealing. (Oh and remember this was the same dear who people "thought" was a good friend and daughter who in reality stole from not only her friends, but her aged grandfather and her parents) And she looked seasoned Cops right in the eye and Lied lied lied. Lied to everyone with so much ease and grace, why it was if she had ice water in her veins. So IF I somehow chalked it up to "bad coping" or some sort of selective mental breakdown (although most of which was going on BEFORE child was dead) HOW do you explain the absolute mental and emotional TORTURE that this girl inflicted on her mother by leading her to believe FOR MONTHS that there was a chance that she would see her beloved granddaughter again? I don't care what anyone says this FACT proves that there is something VERY dangerous about Casey. Someone who has it in them the desire, and ability, to use her own baby, who she knows is dead, as a pawn to keep her mother guessing, hoping and in agony and to keep the cops on the runaround is not a person who could be a caring individual. In fact you might want to call her a sadist. Now if you think that the person I just described sounds like a GOOD MOTHER then...yikes!
First of all I think those who say that Casey was a good mother, must be much more accepting of bizarre human behavior than I am, since Casey's seems psychopathic to me.
Casey herself said that Zanny was punishing her for being a bad mother and since Zanny doesn't exist one might take this to being an admission by her of her bad mother status. And it is not very good mothering to have fake nannies, fake jobs and fake friends and to drag this very young child to God knows where and at what hours and to be exposed to who knows what. Excessive drinking at the very least. Not to mention that IF she did care about her child's future, she would have had a real job not a pretend one. She was only a "good mother" when it was easy and fun to play and there were witnesses. Since, I am a mother I can imagine myself in her shoes (well I could if I believed the crock of story that Caylee drowned in the pool and instead of doing what everyone else would have done, she and her pervert father decided to make an accident appear to be a murder and throw the beloved, cherished, child away like trash and the dad who then later decides to frame...)...but I digress...
I can imagine being in her shoes and, all logic aside, have to pretend that my dear child has been kidnapped. I would imagine that I would be in a state of devastation, shock and complete and utter sadness. I would have to be alone for awhile to collect myself and then I would want to hide away and not speak with anyone. How could I? The mere mention of my beloved would send me over the edge emotionally. Plus I am driving around in a car that is stinking like my dead child..or maybe that was a squirrel. Don't even mention having to confront and hoodwink my mother and the police...it would be too much. Is this what Casey experienced? Ummm NOOOOOOOO! In fact, Casey did not react like I would have, or anyone who has ever lived would react. Well, anyone innocent that is. And IF she were a good mother to start with, it would just not be possible to (beginning just hours, if not minutes, after the death) go out partying, drinking, f-ing, laughing, cooking, cleaning, dancing, hotshotting, tattooing, texting, lying, and stealing. (Oh and remember this was the same dear who people "thought" was a good friend and daughter who in reality stole from not only her friends, but her aged grandfather and her parents) And she looked seasoned Cops right in the eye and Lied lied lied. Lied to everyone with so much ease and grace, why it was if she had ice water in her veins. So IF I somehow chalked it up to "bad coping" or some sort of selective mental breakdown (although most of which was going on BEFORE child was dead) HOW do you explain the absolute mental and emotional TORTURE that this girl inflicted on her mother by leading her to believe FOR MONTHS that there was a chance that she would see her beloved granddaughter again? I don't care what anyone says this FACT proves that there is something VERY dangerous about Casey. Someone who has it in them the desire, and ability, to use her own baby, who she knows is dead, as a pawn to keep her mother guessing, hoping and in agony and to keep the cops on the runaround is not a person who could be a caring individual. In fact you might want to call her a sadist. Now if you think that the person I just described sounds like a GOOD MOTHER then...yikes!
Thinker Belle
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^^ITA RueMoira.. I posted this on another thread and want to add it here..
When a mother tells people that she spoke to her DEAD child a month after she died....circumstantial evidence doesn't get much stronger than that. A mother could never claim she spoke to her dead child if she was not covering up her own contribution to her death. It goes against the laws of motherhood and loving a child. Most mothers had rather stay in prison for the rest of their lives rather than utter those words.
When a mother tells people that she spoke to her DEAD child a month after she died....circumstantial evidence doesn't get much stronger than that. A mother could never claim she spoke to her dead child if she was not covering up her own contribution to her death. It goes against the laws of motherhood and loving a child. Most mothers had rather stay in prison for the rest of their lives rather than utter those words.
Thinker Belle
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31 Days!!
ITA. FCA appeared to study those people she was directly lying to and savoring their reactions. She enjoyed the shock and pain exhibited by her parents, and the disbelief when she calmly and deliberately lied to LE. It was all a game to her. Caylee Marie was the meal ticket, and once she no longer had any value FCA was never going to let her parents have this child. They might have wanted to take Caylee Marie away from FCA but they waited too long. Those friends who testified that FCA was a "good mother" ~ these were carefully worded questions, asked of them by JB, to elicit the response he wanted. He was allowed to do that again and again. So much injustice, it leaves me feeling angry at the whole blankety-blank system.
Baznme
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imagirlgeek
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I don't think she had Postpartum Depression. Her youngest was 14 months old. I could be wrong, but I don't remember anything about PPD with Smith. Maybe you are thinking of Yates?
Nikki 01
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Well I, for one, don't believe she was a loving mother, that's why.
She was a good mother in the mind's of her friends because she appeared to be a normal mom in front of them. The thing is, they didn't know the whole story because she lied to them. Casey was not abusive to anyone's knowledge, but the lack of abuse doesn't automatically make someone a good mother. The reality is Casey wasn't a good mother.
Part of being a good parent is taking responsibility for the life you brought into this world. It's about providing and sacrificing so your child could be given the best life possible. Casey had no interest in doing that. She left the actual parenting of her daughter to her parents.
Casey only cared about herself. She wanted the beautiful life without having to earn it. More importantly, she wanted no responsibility. So she never actually bothered to care for and provide for her daughter. She left that up to her parents as she stole off of them. She invented a job and a nanny so she could do as she pleased instead of putting her daughter first.
I don't believe Casey loved her daughter the way most parents love their children. So for me it is easy to believe she would kill her.
Cindy and George, however? No way, no how. They loved that little girl. They are the ones that took care of and provided for that little girl. They gave her everything and then some. They were truly heartbroken when she was missing while Casey couldn't have cared any less. They were her parents.
I'm not the biggest A's fan in the world as I don't agree with their lying to save their daughter, but the difference between them and Casey is night and day. No one who knows the details of this case can say with a straight face that Casey was a good parent and loved her daughter.
The CA/FCA battle 6/15: That big fight with CA on June 15 probably was worse than anyone realized. If CA threatened to go for custody of Caylee Marie, FCA was going to fix that. As she stated to LA, she was a spiteful biotch. I feel sure that if FCA, in a rage, left after CA and GA were asleep, she would have had to "do something" to silence Caylee Marie. I simply don't see how else she could have stealthily left that house with Caylee Marie, who certainly would have been terrified and screaming for her grandparents. The neighbors would have been alerted by the sounds of Caylee Marie screaming and CA and GA would have awakened and attempted to prevent FCA from fleeing with Caylee Marie. I believe that FCA left before dawn, without arousing her parents, let alone the neighborhood.
GA stated he saw them leave on 6/16: I do not believe that GA saw FCA leave with Caylee Marie on June 16th. It has always been an iffy timeline to me, one constructed to hide the fact that FCA was furious and left in a rage. This was another lie that GA had to provide as an alibi for FCA, and clearly it became harder to summon those “memories”. One thing to bear in mind is that GA wasn’t lying for himself but for his daughter. The very same daughter who allowed JB to shock the court, the nation, with accusations that GA was a pervert who had sexually molested FCA. Try looking at the cameras, at the jury, as that dirt is piled on you like you are nothing but depraved evil.
The Gas Can Confrontation on 6/24: Once I realized that GA and CA would boldly lie again and again to protect FCA, I believed that this entire confrontation with FCA on 6/24 was fabricated. It doesn’t make sense and I think it simply did not happen. It gave FCA another alibi. It was created to lead others to believe that there was no smell of decomp coming from FCA's trunk, because GA, ex-cop would have recognized that smell. There was no surprise encounter, no effing words uttered by FCA in her usual foul choice of words. Describing the language FCA used was most likely impressive to the jury anyway. Because GA had testified that it did happen, he had to stick with the story, and that is how JB managed to unnerve him about those damn gas cans. JB well aware that this was untrue, kept bringing up the gas cans to make GA look "evasive".
Those gas cans led to the famed duct tape. That unusual duct tape that GA brought with him from Ohio, from the car dealership, and was no longer sold anywhere. GA did not want any part of it, once he heard that this was the same rare brand found with Caylee Marie’s skull in December. That sealed the deal, he knew that FCA had access to that tape. GA has to live forever with the thought of that Henkel duct tape covering the nose and mouth of Caylee Marie. That it may have been what killed her. Finding it difficult to answer questions when this subject came up is completely understandable. Trouble breathing, imagining how Caylee Marie may have struggled, I have no problem grasping that thought. Finding it difficult is watching how this tape was used to free FCA, and how the DT used this tape to wrap up GA for the jury. For more proof on how GA was not truthful, was evasive was the self-declared “grief expert” brought in at the last minute by the DT. In this, a murder trial, it was deemed important to dig up the pet burial ceremonies that JB dragged out for the pet lovers in the jury. There’s that damn tape again, let GA get mucked up with these trash bagged and duct taped disposal stories of dead pets.
What is really so wrong with this jury verdict is how FCA got free, and GA has to live the rest of his life having some people regard him as a sexual predator. Even if he was forced to knowingly allow JB to drag him in the dirt as it was the only way to save FCA from the DP, she wasn’t worth that amount of shameful degradation.
GA stated he saw them leave on 6/16: I do not believe that GA saw FCA leave with Caylee Marie on June 16th. It has always been an iffy timeline to me, one constructed to hide the fact that FCA was furious and left in a rage. This was another lie that GA had to provide as an alibi for FCA, and clearly it became harder to summon those “memories”. One thing to bear in mind is that GA wasn’t lying for himself but for his daughter. The very same daughter who allowed JB to shock the court, the nation, with accusations that GA was a pervert who had sexually molested FCA. Try looking at the cameras, at the jury, as that dirt is piled on you like you are nothing but depraved evil.
The Gas Can Confrontation on 6/24: Once I realized that GA and CA would boldly lie again and again to protect FCA, I believed that this entire confrontation with FCA on 6/24 was fabricated. It doesn’t make sense and I think it simply did not happen. It gave FCA another alibi. It was created to lead others to believe that there was no smell of decomp coming from FCA's trunk, because GA, ex-cop would have recognized that smell. There was no surprise encounter, no effing words uttered by FCA in her usual foul choice of words. Describing the language FCA used was most likely impressive to the jury anyway. Because GA had testified that it did happen, he had to stick with the story, and that is how JB managed to unnerve him about those damn gas cans. JB well aware that this was untrue, kept bringing up the gas cans to make GA look "evasive".
Those gas cans led to the famed duct tape. That unusual duct tape that GA brought with him from Ohio, from the car dealership, and was no longer sold anywhere. GA did not want any part of it, once he heard that this was the same rare brand found with Caylee Marie’s skull in December. That sealed the deal, he knew that FCA had access to that tape. GA has to live forever with the thought of that Henkel duct tape covering the nose and mouth of Caylee Marie. That it may have been what killed her. Finding it difficult to answer questions when this subject came up is completely understandable. Trouble breathing, imagining how Caylee Marie may have struggled, I have no problem grasping that thought. Finding it difficult is watching how this tape was used to free FCA, and how the DT used this tape to wrap up GA for the jury. For more proof on how GA was not truthful, was evasive was the self-declared “grief expert” brought in at the last minute by the DT. In this, a murder trial, it was deemed important to dig up the pet burial ceremonies that JB dragged out for the pet lovers in the jury. There’s that damn tape again, let GA get mucked up with these trash bagged and duct taped disposal stories of dead pets.
What is really so wrong with this jury verdict is how FCA got free, and GA has to live the rest of his life having some people regard him as a sexual predator. Even if he was forced to knowingly allow JB to drag him in the dirt as it was the only way to save FCA from the DP, she wasn’t worth that amount of shameful degradation.
It is not hard to imagine FCA pulling off something like this. CA would have blamed herself, and FCA knew that. GA seemed to have no authority in that household. I think it went without saying that FCA knew she had the upper hand, as usual. The denial of this brawl on June 15 was important to CA and GA, as they truly wanted to believe that FCA surely wouldn’t have harmed Caylee Marie. They were used to FCA dangling Caylee Marie as bait, and it always got FCA what she wanted. Both CA and GA became caught in the trap of loving and fearing losing Caylee Marie but also loving FCA unconditionally. It became too late to impose any consequences on FCA, and she had just unleashed all of her evil power over a helpless little babe.
This trap, this being stuck with FCA and her dirty deeds, will punish CA and GA forever. They lied for too long, and wouldn’t tell the truth to get justice for Caylee Marie. She will just be the beautiful innocent little babe who never lived to see her third birthday, who was gone too soon, just another throwaway child. The truth will never come from anyone who was part of that Anthony family.
I am still stunned that this flimsy contrived pile of crap was used by JB to paint FCA as the victim and GA as the evil one …. And this convinced the jury??
This trap, this being stuck with FCA and her dirty deeds, will punish CA and GA forever. They lied for too long, and wouldn’t tell the truth to get justice for Caylee Marie. She will just be the beautiful innocent little babe who never lived to see her third birthday, who was gone too soon, just another throwaway child. The truth will never come from anyone who was part of that Anthony family.
I am still stunned that this flimsy contrived pile of crap was used by JB to paint FCA as the victim and GA as the evil one …. And this convinced the jury??
gngr~snap
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Susan was molested by her step dad and still having sex with him after her 2nd baby! IIRC Her mind was messed up. Not because of the step dad but it didn't help
imagirlgeek
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OMG!! I never heard about that. Wow.
Kat
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Loving mothers do not murder their children and toss away that child's body like trash. JMHO
Loving mothers do not dispose of a child that has died by accident-- even JMHO.
There has to be either an egregious disconnect between the mother and child, meaning IMHO the mother capable of doing either of the above has to be disconnected from the child emotionally or that there never was the bond we think of when we think of our own children there between that Mother and child.
In Yates case it was an egregious disconnect caused by profound mental illness. In Smith's case it was a disconnect because the Mother wanted something unobtainable to her while she had those children with her. JMHO
IMHO when we see cases where the Mother helps hide the body of a child, or participates in the abuse/murder of a child or turns her back while a partner is doing so---has diconnected much in the way that Smith did. To me when you look at a woman like smith or the other's I described directly above you're getting an up close and personal look at the personality disordered. JMHO
I do not think that KC was profoundly mentally ill. JMHO. I think she might have one or more psychological issues but I don't think that would have severed any previous relationship she had with Caylee. I don't think that bond was there to begin with. JMHO
I agree with Mason that we will never know exactly what happened to Caylee and when because her Mother is who her Mother is. JMHO
Loving mothers do not dispose of a child that has died by accident-- even JMHO.
There has to be either an egregious disconnect between the mother and child, meaning IMHO the mother capable of doing either of the above has to be disconnected from the child emotionally or that there never was the bond we think of when we think of our own children there between that Mother and child.
In Yates case it was an egregious disconnect caused by profound mental illness. In Smith's case it was a disconnect because the Mother wanted something unobtainable to her while she had those children with her. JMHO
IMHO when we see cases where the Mother helps hide the body of a child, or participates in the abuse/murder of a child or turns her back while a partner is doing so---has diconnected much in the way that Smith did. To me when you look at a woman like smith or the other's I described directly above you're getting an up close and personal look at the personality disordered. JMHO
I do not think that KC was profoundly mentally ill. JMHO. I think she might have one or more psychological issues but I don't think that would have severed any previous relationship she had with Caylee. I don't think that bond was there to begin with. JMHO
I agree with Mason that we will never know exactly what happened to Caylee and when because her Mother is who her Mother is. JMHO
suzyq211
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Incredible post.
suzyq211
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Out of all the evidence, this bothered me the most. Hearing her retell the supposed conversation to the detective makes me ill.
Velouria
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I agree. Her mind was/is "messed up".
And yet, she still had the capacity to premeditate and methodically carry out the death of her two boys and spin an elaborate yarn about a kidnapping to cover her tracks. Susan Smith was impaired, yes - but still culpable just as the jury said.
beccalecca1
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It's possible, but I was pretty sure it was Susan Smith.... looking it up
I do know with Postpartum, if it's not treated as soon as possible, it just keeps getting worse. So, a 14 month old child would only mean that she suffered with it untreated for approximately 14 months.... it was pretty bad I'm sure.
MissJames
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There's a difference in Postpartum depression and postpartum psychosis.
I don't recall Susan Smith having either and I live in SC. I do recall the sexual abuse ,but I don't recall anything about her having sex with her stepfather after her children were born.
I see FICA and Susan Smith as very similar,but they had very different jurors.:banghead:
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