Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #15

[LollyPop]

thanks lollipop I am A OK x

Are you super sure? Maybe Allison thought the same....not wanting to scare just being alert. Hugs x

 

[Thinking]

Imagine if since his wife became depressed he has had to take on more of the domestic duties than he is happy to do. I really believe he may have become resentful of having to be Mr Mom to the extent that he wished his wife would simply just disappear - dealing with her depression and the kids and work was just too much for him. JMHO of course.

Well he has to be Mr Mum now doesn't he, wonder how that is working for him.

 

[Limaes]

Yes Limaes, me too, and I always think either the cars were still wet from being cleaned, or had water marks on the concrete under the car, but had been chamoised. the other thing I now think is of course the washing machine going..both those things are totally STUCK in my head.. so many questions...want the answers!!!

Well if he was doing some washing, it would be pretty incriminating if the clothes she wore to the hair salon were in there. LOL I have always thought her killer is a dumbarse

 

[frostythesnowman]

Don't know if anyone has seen this link and I am not sure how to post it up but here goes!

http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national-news/salon-link-in-badenclay-case-3338314.html[/URL]

 

[Limaes]

Don't know if anyone has seen this link and I am not sure how to post it up but here goes!

http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national-news/salon-link-in-badenclay-case-3338314.html[/URL]

Thank you, I hadn't seen that. It looks as though they have been reading BrookieLocal's posts

 

[Radster]

Yes back on topic, the Police have been saying an arrest is near or words to that effect but today I read that they are committed to the case and mentioned how long it took to crack that case.I fear that they are finding this to be harder to pin in the culprit than they anticipated because forensics are proving cryptic

I spoke to a journalist friend today who has been reporting on this case, among other things, and she said that the feeling now among the media is that the police just can't get there - they don't enough evidence. They know, but they can't get it over the line. Only a major breakthrough - such as a confession from one of the parties involved - would alter the status quo. I guess that body had been in the water a little too long. And maybe there had been planning involved to ensure this would be the case? Speculation only.

 

[minni]

Respectfully snipped




Yes, the position of the body. Although you can't see clearly, it looks like the knees were in a bent position. Sorry to be graphic but, if this is true, then that is the position she was in when rigor took effect and if she was in the water at any stage then it was only for a maximum of 3 days before she came to rest where she was found. jmo on footage I have observed on the TV.

oooohhhhh I see, after three days the rigor would dissipate and if she was in the water.....her position would have changed! so she must have been on dry land by around three days past her death. (if in fact her knees are pulled up or bent etc) it still means she could have been submerged, or in water for those first three days. and quite possibly 'anchored' to maintain the bent knee position

 

[LollyPop]

Just heard today that a very close friend remembers seeing a white 4wd parked near Kholo creek bridge at around dusk on friday 20th April (after much diary checking etc to check the timeline and is pretty sure that's the right day). Not that it's a BC vehicle but you might think that if the occupants of that car had been near the creek that Allison's body was in under the bridge then she would have been found a lot sooner. If it was ther then and not washed downstream etc. IMO hearsay etc

 

[mouse detective]

Well he has to be Mr Mum now doesn't he, wonder how that is working for him.

Aha - maybe he thinks he has found someone else who would happily take those responsibilities away from him...just a thought!

:therethere:

 

[Petro]

Radster - I have been saying this for a while, if you take wishful thinking and emotion out of it, and just read between the lines using common logic, they just don't have any solid evidence.

Once they did that roadblock at the roundabout thing I felt that forensics was the only hope unless the culprit cracked under pressure and confessed.

 

[minni]

oooohhhhh I see, after three days the rigor would dissipate and if she was in the water.....her position would have changed! so she must have been on dry land by around three days past her death. (if in fact her knees are pulled up or bent etc) it still means she could have been submerged, or in water for those first three days. and quite possibly 'anchored' to maintain the bent knee position

can anyone elaborate on this? rigor is usually total by 3 days (i think) then it goes away. If Allison was found bent kneed, either she was
washed ashore loosely and ended up this way, which means she could have been in the water for the entire time she was missing, or was
thrown over the bridge and landed this way and was never in the water, so on the bank for the 11 days, Or she was
in the water for enough time for rigor to have positioned her body with the bent knee/s which would mean possibly that she was anchored in one position for the first three days. it would also mean that she had to have come loose and washed onto the bank whilst still in rigor to maintain the bent knee/s If this is this case, she would have been on the bank for 7 days.

anyone able to sleuth that one? I suppose we would have to know more about the position of her body and whether it was both knees or just one

 

[stormbird]

Hello everyone. This is my first post, fingers-crossed

I've been trying to guess what the detectives on this case might be doing, so I went looking for a description of police procedures, and found a paper which seems to do a good job of explaining the typical stages in Australian criminal investigations.

Some points it makes:
- investigations need to clear the innocent, not just establish the guilt of the offender;
- investigators draw up a profile of the victim(s), including information about personal history, family, financial interests, and a timeline of activities during their final 24 hours;
- they prioritise suspects according to evidence and potential motives;
- they might try to use the media in a tactical way;
- and good investigators build up a rapport with suspects.

See:
"The criminal investigator" by Terry Goldsworthy, who was a Detective Senior Sergeant with Queensland Police when the paper was published in 2009.
This link goes straight to the PDF, but if you'd prefer to check the abstract before downloading, try this epublications@bond introductory page.

 

[Limaes]

oooohhhhh I see, after three days the rigor would dissipate and if she was in the water.....her position would have changed! so she must have been on dry land by around three days past her death. (if in fact her knees are pulled up or bent etc) it still means she could have been submerged, or in water for those first three days. and quite possibly 'anchored' to maintain the bent knee position

Yes, that is what I mean. That is if her knees were in fact bent. It looked like it on the brief news footage. It also looked like one of her arms was up above her head. I have always felt that rigor had started before her body was taken there. The killer and/or accomplice would not have been able to change her position and probably hadn't thought about that whilst planning what to do with her. Imo, this is where they made a mistake that may come back to haunt them. Just my opinion.

Edited to add: this could also be the reason the police changed the time frame after her body was found. jmo

 

[minni]

Well he has to be Mr Mum now doesn't he, wonder how that is working for him.

haha that would make him such a tosser!!!!!!

 

[bellgirl]

As I said earlier, we will have to agree to disagree. Because for me to mention the cost and resources weighed against the chance of success against these types of software would be off topic. As would examples (including in murder cases) of it's success.

I respect your trust in your "Programmers" knowledge in Networking and Operations; but I am also confident in my own qualifications and experience.

IMO I really don't put much weight in the theory that he wiped his hard drives (which is what was initially suggested and what was being discussed); or that information about what had been found was leaked to locals, especially when it was said on here so quickly after she had gone missing. These things take time.

But rather than argue the point (which btw no one has proven to be of any relevance) any further. I will sign off (before I'm given a time out). Enjoy the forum. I know I used to.

Please don't go mum73! I love your posts - and have learnt so much from you. I totally agree re the wiping of the hard drives ........ I'm sure that "other" things would have been priority that night!

And personally, two of your points have really struck me - I also believe that ABC and GBC had quite a physical and abusive relationship towards the end, and that she (at times) gave back as good as she got. Obviously not as good on that Thursday night - and now, someone will have to pay for going too far ...... accident or not.

The other point that has resonated with me, is when you used the word plethora! My boss is addicted to this word, and he tries to use it as many times as he can, within any meeting - it's a bit of a joke now. All staff think it's hilarious and make fun of him, lovingly. You're the only other person I've ever heard use this word ........ naturally!

I really want to hear more from you.

 

[grannie]

They know, but they can't get it over the line. Only a major breakthrough - such as a confession from one of the parties involved - would alter the status quo.

In some countries the mind-altering drugs used on prisoners subjected to coercive interrogations. Former CIA and FBI director William Webster said that the United States should consider administering "truth drugs" to uncooperative al-Qaeda and Taliban captives to try to obtain more details about terrorist operations. Webster said the use of drugs such as Sodium Pentothal might make the CIA's work more effective...

 

[minni]

Yes, that is what I mean. That is if her knees were in fact bent. It looked like it on the brief news footage. It also looked like one of her arms was up above her head. I have always felt that rigor had started before her body was taken there. The killer and/or accomplice would not have been able to change her position and probably hadn't thought about that whilst planning what to do with her. Imo, this is where they made a mistake that may come back to haunt them. Just my opinion.

wow that really is an interesting thing to mull over (and pretty sad ) but it would indicate she wasn't in the water in your scenario...the fact that you feel it was both knees seems significant to me because if she washed ashore I just cant see her ending up in such a neat position (sorry this sounds heartless discussing this) also, it backs up your theory really well...can you try and pick apart the other possibilities I posted a couple of posts ago? Im going to be going over this all night now!

 

[minni]

In some countries the mind-altering drugs used on prisoners subjected to coercive interrogations. Former CIA and FBI director William Webster said that the United States should consider administering "truth drugs" to uncooperative al-Qaeda and Taliban captives to try to obtain more details about terrorist operations. Webster said the use of drugs such as Sodium Pentothal might make the CIA's work more effective...

you ain't no little ole lady!!!!! fess up grannie, you're only 45!!!

 

[minni]

Are you super sure? Maybe Allison thought the same....not wanting to scare just being alert. Hugs x

right back at you Lollipop xx I inboxed you to set your mind at rest...thank you you rock :rocker:

 

[Toowong(s)]

Hello folks,

I've managed with all my willpower to stay quiet for over a week now - I was hoping the "imminent arrest" would have put all this speculation to rest by now... Sadly we are all still here waiting for answers.

I may have been put in the dog box with old Scraps for my last post (now deleted) - I'm not entirely sure as I have only logged back in just now. Sorry to all (and our extremenly tolerant mods) if I stepped over the line with that last one, since deleted... As most would have realised it was a very "tongue in cheek" summary of the evidence against the main suspect, intended to highlight how difficult it might be for QPS.

I totally understand the acute focus on the main suspect - particularly as we have no one else to focus on. I just think a lot of the evidence some are relying on is so "circumstantial" it is a real worry if that is all the QPS have as well.

I also keep thinking about the following which seems to have been overlooked long ago by all: "Police maintain Mr Baden-Clay, 41, a great-grandson of Scouts founder Lord Baden-Powell, is not a person of interest". http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...lison-baden-clay/story-e6frg6nf-1226342663519

I haven't heard/seen any changes to this since. So perhaps the "suspect" is not the suspect as far as QPS are concerned? And for the record I have no issue with the suspect engaging lawyers - he was always going to be considered a suspect rightly or wrongly and I would do the same (engage lawyers). The press have certainly toned down their innuendo since the suspect appointed an SC.

So to sum up I really worry that we are all on the wrong track and in the interest of the victim and her children we should keep an open mind at the very least. A good sleuth always looks at alternate possibilities and rules them out methodically. Sometimes the correct answer is not always the obvious one.

To that end I have a new (albeit controversial) alternate theory if anyone is interested... I will just have to check the posting rules first on suggesting other suspects.

Toowong(s)