IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #13

[hollyblue]

LE hasn't stated anyone a POI or suspect, but I'd have to be clueless to believe that certain ones are not a POI, at least, imo. Person of interest = someone LE may have a good idea of who was involved and they want that info...not necessarily that they committed the act themselves. IMO Hence the pressure on DM and MCM. I still am at a quandary why they were both in the same hotel room for the night.

 

[Thinkzerz]

when I first posted it they did not know it was fabricated, the news channel later updated the article that their claim was false.

Was this the same incident that they girls said a girl was waving them to get away from inside the van?

 

[hollyblue]

Was this the same incident that they girls said a girl was waving them to get away from inside the van?

No this was 2 girls stolling two infants and stated someone again crossed lanes and pulled next to them. Like the girl in front of laundry mat.....or so she said, but was actually someplace else.

 

[Evan's Mom]

Regarding fingerprints on the bikes or the purses...just because there might be prints, does not mean they are viable prints.

We recently had someone break into our truck and steal my fiance's kidney stone pain medication.
There were fingerprints all over the place(windows, doors, homemade jimmy thing on the ground), but because they had greasy or dirty hands, all of the fingerprints were smeared and we were barely able to get a partial the ended up yielding no information.
I kept pushing the point with the officer and he finally had to break it down for me that it's not like CSI. This is the real world and investigations don't usually go like we see on TV. Lol, I almost got my feelings hurt, but decided he was right and that was the only way to explain it to me.

 

[SacreBleu]

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/ev...cle_18411a90-cd32-11e1-a656-0019bb2963f4.html

http://www.kwwl.com/story/19023342/evansdale-police-searching-for-two-missing-girls

These girls have been missing all afternoon and the search was suspended tonight now that it's dark here. We're a small town next to a larger city but a small police force that has likely never dealt with missing kids.. Bikes found on the trail and purse and phone had been thrown over the fence near the bikes but the other side of the fence is a hill leading to the highway. Right now the search is very disorganized and there aren't any flyers .

sbm -bbm

This statement leads off each new thread and seems to indicate the purse was found on the highway side of the fence (south of the trail), not the lake side (north of the trail). Do we have confirmation of exactly where the purse was found? Or, am I reading it wrong?

 

[Thinkzerz]

Is it just me? I remember the Tori Stafford case and TS mother's friends would get on the FB group and defend her that she didn't take her daughter and would stick up for her when other bashed her. So yes many bashed her but she did have people stick up for her that she didn't hurt or take her daughter. Just wondering to myself why hasn't anyone (that i have seen) stick up for MCM and DM? Are they afraid? Maybe this is a question for fb group but i don't post there.

 

[otto]

OMFG I caught up!

Unless they went out on that jetty, and decided to somehow make the walk to the woods from there, which I've discussed above would be treacherous and visible, and would draw attention, IMO, of anyone at the lake that day.

Thanks ... the below image was posted here today and dated July 14. It looks like it was taken with a zoom lens from the parking area on the opposite side of the lake (about 1400 feet away). It looks like there is enough room on the shore to walk without much difficulty. If someone was paying attention to the opposite side of the 27 acre lake, they would see people along the trail or at the drainage pipe, but if they were paying attention to their surrounding area, would they really see two children walking the 100 foot length from the drainage pipe to the forested area around Maiden Lane, or would they really see someone walking quickly towards the gate with two bikes? I'm just wondering ... since people aren't always that observant and even if they do see something, they don't always think about what they're seeing.

 

[mahoolin]

OT...not gonna help us find Elizabeth and Lyric.... But is it necessary to constantly refer to Lyric's size like its a character flaw? ie - larger girls eat more etc... (This isn't directed toward any one person or specific post).

She just a little girl! I don't know her stats as far as height, but next to her cousin (who appears to be petite) she's going to appear even larger. Yes, she weighs more than the average child her age. No one seems to give it a thought that it's more than likely out of her hands. Not all children eat like crazy that happen to be a little bigger. They eat what they're fed and what's provided to them. Yes, some do eat more and some eat due to stress - when things around them are out of their control.

I know several young girls considered chunky, who, when they started to develop grew into lovely young ladies as they matured, all signs of their little girl chunky left far behind.

Lyric is a beautiful little girl, who in my opinion is at least out riding bikes instead of sitting in front of a television. Someone's going to come along and tell me her BMI is obese, but to me, it's much more important to be healthy than the "perfect" size.

Ok, down off my soapbox. Mods, please delete if you feel this is inappropriate.

lease: bring Elizabeth and Lyric home

 

[otto]

One thing that bothers me and I'd like some local input on -

I read a report that says the cctv footage caught the girls going in the OPPOSITE direction, away from the lake, not towards it.

Is this correct?

Could you please link the article ... I'd be interested in better understanding which direction police say the girls were traveling.

 

[GrainneDhu]

http://www.johnnygosch.com/
Could any answers/ideas be found here?

The information on that site is controversial, to say the least.

John Gosch, Johnny Gosch's father, has said that he does not believe Johnny is alive.

 

[lishac23]

In NO WAY do I wish to come off combative/argumentative...

I just wanted to mention after reading several posts regarding Lyric's possible incapabilites due to her "size".... I have a "husky" "chunky" "big" "solid" child (him being the only one out of 4) and I have witnessed him face these same assumptions and stereo types and they can be very hurtful...especially to a child. He is very healthy, very agile, very athletic, strong, and very capable of anything... he's just naturally built that way. I don't say this to attack anyone's opinion...but to hopefully demonstrate that just because she was a "bigger" girl doesn't mean she wasn't capable.

 

[lishac23]

Thanks ... the below image was posted here today and dated July 14. It looks like it was taken with a zoom lens from the parking area on the opposite side of the lake (about 1400 feet away). It looks like there is enough room on the shore to walk without much difficulty. If someone was paying attention to the opposite side of the 27 acre lake, they would see people along the trail or at the drainage pipe, but if they were paying attention to their surrounding area, would they really see two children walking the 100 foot length from the drainage pipe to the forested area around Maiden Lane, or would they really see someone walking quickly towards the gate with two bikes? I'm just wondering ... since people aren't always that observant and even if they do see something, they don't always think about what they're seeing.

I agree. I think its possible that they (lyric, elizabeth, and/or perp(s)) could have walked along fast enough without being seen.

 

[Sunlight]

If you have a link quoting police naming a family member as a suspect, I would be very interested in reading it.

I didn't say anyone was a suspect. That wasn't my question. LE has said otoh that they have interviewed "several persons of interest". My point was really that there is nothing concrete..no one ruled in, no one ruled out. MOO

 

[SapphireSteel]

Could you please link the article ... I'd be interested in better understanding which direction police say the girls were traveling.

I've just asked for confirmation myself as I'm not sure I read it right.

I've just been on Google Earth and I'm still none the wiser.

Brovan Blvd seems to run at a right angle to the lake. The girls were caught either going toward the lake or toward the house....but I'm still not sure.

I've even pm'd someone and searched the threads but no joy.

Anyone? Toward the lake, or toward the house? Locals?

lease:

 

[Copper]

I don't have a link to the video or an article. But I will explain the best I can what the CCTV shows. It is from Cornbelt Auctions, which is a business between Lafayette and Brovan, where the Collins home (IIRC) is. The camera faces south to show Brovan. Brovan is a bit angled so that it does not run truely east-west, but close enough. The video shows the girls riding left to right. The camera is facing south, so that means the girls are riding east to west. ASSUMING, the girls took the trail south to the lake, which is east of that location, they would be riding the wrong way. But since we don't really know how they got to the lake, there is no way to judge if they were going the wrong way or not.

 

[mahoolin]

In NO WAY do I wish to come off combative/argumentative...

I just wanted to mention after reading several posts regarding Lyric's possible incapabilites due to her "size".... I have a "husky" "chunky" "big" "solid" child (him being the only one out of 4) and I have witnessed him face these same assumptions and stereo types and they can be very hurtful...especially to a child. He is very healthy, very agile, very athletic, strong, and very capable of anything... he's just naturally built that way. I don't say this to attack anyone's opinion...but to hopefully demonstrate that just because she was a "bigger" girl doesn't mean she wasn't capable.

BBM
Thanks for carrying on after my post - I didn't even mention genetics.
And I agree, the way those girls were riding those bikes - she's very capable.

 

[SacreBleu]

OT...not gonna help us find Elizabeth and Lyric.... But is it necessary to constantly refer to Lyric's size like its a character flaw? ie - larger girls eat more etc... (This isn't directed toward any one person or specific post).

sbm
Ok, down off my soapbox. Mods, please delete if you feel this is inappropriate.

lease: bring Elizabeth and Lyric home

mahoolin, I don't know that anyone is implying anything - other than being aware there is an 80 pound difference between the two girls. IMHO, it would have been much easier to subdue Elizabeth, and for Lyric to have acquiesced out of fear for and even, perhaps, hoping to protect her younger cousin.

Sometimes such comments tend to come off sounding "snarky" - which I would agree would be uncalled for - but I don't really think that is the way most posters mean it.

 

[otto]

sbm -bbm

This statement leads off each new thread and seems to indicate the purse was found on the highway side of the fence (south of the trail), not the lake side (north of the trail). Do we have confirmation of exactly where the purse was found? Or, am I reading it wrong?

There is confirmation that the purse was found 10 feet east of the bikes and 2 feet away from the fence on the lakeside of the double fences.

ETA: thanks to dotr and jules for posting the video

 

[SapphireSteel]

Regarding fingerprints on the bikes or the purses...just because there might be prints, does not mean they are viable prints.

We recently had someone break into our truck and steal my fiance's kidney stone pain medication.
There were fingerprints all over the place(windows, doors, homemade jimmy thing on the ground), but because they had greasy or dirty hands, all of the fingerprints were smeared and we were barely able to get a partial the ended up yielding no information.
I kept pushing the point with the officer and he finally had to break it down for me that it's not like CSI. This is the real world and investigations don't usually go like we see on TV. Lol, I almost got my feelings hurt, but decided he was right and that was the only way to explain it to me.

You are right and he was wrong, actually.

It depends on what level of forensics they throw at the scene.

If they stop at fingerprinting, yes, there's a chance they won't get a result.

However, I used to work for our local LE and they would throw everything at a crime scene (we don't have guns here, makes a difference to the workload) and they would go in and forensically process a scene for DNA etc, even if it was only a minor crime.

No joke.

They don't have much to do....! Even minor crime scenes are considered "practice" for the big ones and thoroughly processed, swabs taken off the victims for elimination, suspects, etc etc.

It results in a really good clearup rate, as you can imagine...it's a shame our courts don't join in the fun and impose more meaningful sentences but that's another topic.

:moo:

 

[lishac23]

mahoolin, I don't know that anyone is implying anything - other than being aware there is an 80 pound difference between the two girls. IMHO, it would have been much easier to subdue Elizabeth, and for Lyric to have acquiesced out of fear for and even, perhaps, hoping to protect her younger cousin.

Sometimes such comments tend to come off sounding "snarky" - which I would agree would be uncalled for - but I don't really think that is the way most posters mean it.

I can't speak for mahoolin, although I agree with her post. While most of the references to weight were as you describe above, and which I agree with... there have been some comments made to the effect that it was a hot day and with Lyric being a "bigger" girl couldn't/wouldn't have rode her bike that far, or Lyric's BMI would have made it impossible to climb the fence, etc... Those were the comments I was generally refering to.