GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #2

[NewYork625]

ToutCa, here is the translation.

The body was identified by 19:00. The recovered lifeless body belonged to Sarai Sierra. First findings suggested that she was killed approx. 1 week-10 days ago. She seemed either to have fallen from a high place or her head was smashed with a stone. There were scratches and bruises on her body. Her jacket, her jeans, Ipad and cell phone was missing, yet her earrings and the bracelet, which was wrapped three times around her wrist, was left intact (wasn’t taken). Initial examination showed no sign of rape. Sierra’s interest in historic places (monuments) and railroad tracks suggest she went there intentionally.


Sorry, I was late to reply. It's not easy to translate such graphic stuff. Because you read it in your native tongue. You picture it and than translate it. That's tormenting.

I started thinking we could have saved her. We, one of the locals at WS could have been in Eminönü, she would have asked us about the directions, we would have told her not to go there. Or a car's tire might have gone flat right on that spot, a traffic accident or an MP on his way to the airport with his police escort would make the killer hesitate. Even a child's scream or a train whistle might distract the killer to give SS the opportunity to escape. Or she could fallen on the way and hurt her knee and decided to go back. Or it could have been awfully rainy on that day, or a petty thief's attempt at her wallet might have upset her and she would have decided to head back. But none of this happened. At least not on that day or not at that time.

Considering her numerous injuries including a bruised hip and broken fingers, I wonder if it's possible she was accidently hit by a car and fatally injured, then taken by the driver and tossed over the wall?

 

[Sandstorm]

ToutCa, here is the translation.

snipped for brevity -


I started thinking we could have saved her. We, one of the locals at WS could have been in Eminönü, she would have asked us about the directions, we would have told her not to go there. snipped for brevity .

Yashim,
Thanks for your input on this thread. It is most helpful to read your translations and comments.
I am trying to get the locations correct:
The photo of the area with the wall where SS was found is beside a busy highway. Where is the Eminonu area you refer to above? Is it an unsafe residential area behind the other side of the wall? Thanks.

 

[CMac2]

I was thinking about their financial situation - or rather what we *think* may have been their financial situation. Here's something I haven't seen mentioned: iPads and smartphones are not cheap. Sure, the iPad could have been a gift, but a data plan for a smartphone (even one that was $0 on a 2-yr plan) still is not cheap. I choose to have a flip-phone to avoid the data plan costs. I do have an iPad with a 3G data plan and that is what I choose to pay for rather than also adding what I see as a redundant fee for access on a phone. For someone working part-time (like me - and like Sarai) who doesn't need internet access on their phone, it is an excessive cost that Sarai chose because she wanted it. Text messages and phone calls can be used to reach someone if there is an emergency with a child or someone else.

I have wanted a Samsung Galaxy III for months now. I am not eligible for an upgrade on my contract for a year or so, and if I were to buy one full price without the benefit of the upgrade, I'd spend about $650. Even with the upgrade, I'm still spending $400. After that, factor in the data plan- for a single person, after talk-time, texting and the required data package (unless you get an unlocked phone- which is even more expensive every major cell phone carrier requires a data plan when you purchase a smart phone. Doesn't matter that the device is Wifi capable)- you're looking at a MINIMUM of $100/mo for your phone bill. Add the iPad's data package to that, and you're looking at what, $140-$150 a month? This is if she's only covering herself on the plan, and not her husband and/or anyone else. I have 3 phones on my plan, and my bill is just over $200/mo. Regarding the iPad, she could have had an iPad mini, which doesn't require a long-term contract.

All that said, though, I am AMAZED at how many people have these devices that I never would have thought had the means to purchase them. My DH is a mentor for an organization that pairs successful black men with troubled youth. The 14 year old boy he is currently mentoring has 5 siblings that are all younger than him, his mother is a struggling single mother, but he has a Samsung Galaxy III and a whole lot of other electronic playthings.

If this particular type of photography meant that much to SS, she may have made the sacrifice to purchase the devices she'd need to make it happen. While crazy-expensive for a phone, it is not much different than a nice camera- but unlike a nice camera, she has calling, texting, internet capabilities to boot.

 

[ThinkHard]

First, I'm not at all surprised that a young musician in Amsterdam might have a drug conviction in his past.
Also, I wonder if Sarai didn't take many photos and wanted to edit them first before sharing them. Perhaps she did consider making money from the photos and was saving them for that purpose.

That still doesn't explain why there would be 6 photos in 2wks in Istanbul and 5 photos in only 3 days in Amsterdam

 

[Yashim]

Sorry you keep having to delve into these details. I know it must suck- but know also it's appreciated, and we don't ask you to do it for any reason other than to try and figure what happened.

That said, they're now saying it may not have been murder after all? The one stupid detail we all thought we could agree on may not have been the case? I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around that. They said over and over again in the beginning that this is a murder- definitely. Now maybe not.

No need to worry. I am happy to help. Yet I know the places. I know what those people look like: druggies, homeless, the carpet seller, hostel owner,... I know what and how things can go wrong. How taking one too many step can get you into a dangerous part of the town.

I unconsciously start picturing them as in shows like the Profiler show, etc. That magnifies the impact.

 

[ToutCa]

Considering her numerous injuries including a bruised hip and broken fingers, I wonder if it's possible she was accidently hit by a car and fatally injured, then taken by the driver and tossed over the wall?

There would have been multiple witnesses. He couldn't have just tossed her, he would have had to stop traffic on a 4-lane road, toil to carry her body up an incline and secrete it inside a crypt-like cavern structure. Not possible.

Plus, Turkish LE have stated she was murdered by intentional blows to the head. They have not denied press reports that the murder weapon was a rock and it was found at the scene.

 

[NewYork625]

Also are we suppose to believe that a 24 year old Turkish girl managed to fight off her attacker but sarai couldn't?

Why not? Maybe the Turkish girl's attacker was scared off by others? Maybe Sarai was actually pushed off the wall first and was in no condition to fight back effectively?

 

[ThinkHard]

Different circumstances, different perp -- why not? [Edit: or different circumstances, same perp...though I doubt it was the same dude]

It could just come down to bad luck...SS slipped at the wrong time, perhaps.

Life doesn't always make sense.

Agreed. Just pointing out that while those attacks ay be related to Sarai's murder, it is also quite possible they are only a coincidence, and we should keep that in mind.

 

[ThinkHard]

Considering her numerous injuries including a bruised hip and broken fingers, I wonder if it's possible she was accidently hit by a car and fatally injured, then taken by the driver and tossed over the wall?

Well she wasnt just tossed over a wall, she was found in a cave thing with a fairly small diameter at its opening.

But that's a very interesting theory.

However why take her iPad and phone? And undress her?

 

[NewYork625]

There would have been multiple witnesses. He couldn't have just tossed her, he would have had to stop traffic on a 4-lane road, toil to carry her body up an incline and secrete it inside a crypt-like cavern structure. Not possible.

Plus, Turkish LE have stated she was murdered by intentional blows to the head. They have not denied press reports that the murder weapon was a rock and it was found at the scene.

You're right. Just trying to come up with some new possibilities... Her injuries are quite extensive.

 

[belimom]

(snipped)


If this particular type of photography meant that much to SS, she may have made the sacrifice to purchase the devices she'd need to make it happen. While crazy-expensive for a phone, it is not much different than a nice camera- but unlike a nice camera, she has calling, texting, internet capabilities to boot.

I read on her IG account that she does have a nice digital camera. I think it was in one of her comments? I'll see if I can find it.

 

[NewYork625]

Well she wasnt just tossed over a wall, she was found in a cave thing with a fairly small diameter at its opening.

But that's a very interesting theory.

However why take her iPad and phone? And undress her?

I was imagining her later being moved/robbed by someone frequenting the area where she was found.

 

[CMac2]

Why not? Maybe the Turkish girl's attacker was scared off by others? Maybe Sarai was actually pushed off the wall first and was in no condition to fight back effectively?

The others who were attacked in that area were done so at knife point. Those whose attacks were "successful"(horrible word to use, under circumstances) were also raped.

If the same perp(s) had attacked SS, I would expect she would have been stabbed to death, since that's the weapon of choice in these particular cases. There were early statements that SS may have had stab wounds, but those were debunked by the head of the Turkish police.

I also would expect that she'd been raped, since that seems to be the purpose behind these attacks to begin with.

Don't get me wrong though- this case is just crazy enough that anything is possible.

 

[ThinkHard]

Yashim,
Thanks for your input on this thread. It is most helpful to read your translations and comments.
I am trying to get the locations correct:
The photo of the area with the wall where SS was found is beside a busy highway. Where is the Eminonu area you refer to above? Is it an unsafe residential area behind the other side of the wall? Thanks.

No eminonu is a busy touristy area on one end of the Galata bridge, where the spice market and Yeni Cami are located.

Where she was found was along the walls which run parrellel to Kennedy cadessi (busy 4 lane road, but its not a highway), about a mile from eminonu

 

[Yashim]

Yashim,
Thanks for your input on this thread. It is most helpful to read your translations and comments.
I am trying to get the locations correct:
The photo of the area with the wall where SS was found is beside a busy highway. Where is the Eminonu area you refer to above? Is it an unsafe residential area behind the other side of the wall? Thanks.

The highway is not busy during midday, so cars travel at high speeds and notice nothing. If it was, there would be more traffic, it would be safer.

You cross the Galata bridge from Karaköy to get to Eminönü, where you have the New Mosque and the Spice Bazaar. You take a left and walk along the ferry ports to reach Sirkeci. If you go up you have Sultanahmet Sq. If you continue walking you end up on the spot SS is found. But it is not a short distance. ThinkHard or someone else had some maps. It is not safe to be alone for anyone.

I was listening to radio the other day, the residents said they were afraid to go there. If someone took SS there, he himself might get attacked too. (that's be quite ironic)

 

[ToutCa]

Injuries to SS:

Widely reported in the Turkish press and not denied by Turkish LE:

SS was beaten all over her body and killed by several blows to the head with a rock that was found at the scene.

She sustained broken fingers in at least one hand.

If there was any kind of fall involved, the consistent implication has been that it was not the cause of death, source of primary trauma, or key to understanding the event. The implication has been that the broken fingers were some kind of defensive wound; also note SS is said to have tissue with the attacker's DNA under her fingernails.

FWIW

 

[Munich]

I think one article said she had substantial injury to her hip. I wonder if this in on the same side of her body as the head wound....as in something that could be consistent with falling while trying to escape, or being pushed.

But if this is the case...her electronics would have been damaged in the fall, so why take them?

I read the head wound was the left side and the hip was the right. These seemingly banal details could get misconstrued with the amount of "was it or was it not" type of evidence and leaks in this case.

 

[NewYork625]

I have wanted a Samsung Galaxy III for months now. I am not eligible for an upgrade on my contract for a year or so, and if I were to buy one full price without the benefit of the upgrade, I'd spend about $650. Even with the upgrade, I'm still spending $400. After that, factor in the data plan- for a single person, after talk-time, texting and the required data package (unless you get an unlocked phone- which is even more expensive every major cell phone carrier requires a data plan when you purchase a smart phone. Doesn't matter that the device is Wifi capable)- you're looking at a MINIMUM of $100/mo for your phone bill. Add the iPad's data package to that, and you're looking at what, $140-$150 a month? This is if she's only covering herself on the plan, and not her husband and/or anyone else. I have 3 phones on my plan, and my bill is just over $200/mo. Regarding the iPad, she could have had an iPad mini, which doesn't require a long-term contract.

All that said, though, I am AMAZED at how many people have these devices that I never would have thought had the means to purchase them. My DH is a mentor for an organization that pairs successful black men with troubled youth. The 14 year old boy he is currently mentoring has 5 siblings that are all younger than him, his mother is a struggling single mother, but he has a Samsung Galaxy III and a whole lot of other electronic playthings.

If this particular type of photography meant that much to SS, she may have made the sacrifice to purchase the devices she'd need to make it happen. While crazy-expensive for a phone, it is not much different than a nice camera- but unlike a nice camera, she has calling, texting, internet capabilities to boot.

Perhaps their financial troubles and subsequent bankruptcy were due to her being less than responsible financially? She could have charge all kinds of things on credit cards.

 

[ThinkHard]

I have wanted a Samsung Galaxy III for months now. I am not eligible for an upgrade on my contract for a year or so, and if I were to buy one full price without the benefit of the upgrade, I'd spend about $650. Even with the upgrade, I'm still spending $400. After that, factor in the data plan- for a single person, after talk-time, texting and the required data package (unless you get an unlocked phone- which is even more expensive every major cell phone carrier requires a data plan when you purchase a smart phone. Doesn't matter that the device is Wifi capable)- you're looking at a MINIMUM of $100/mo for your phone bill. Add the iPad's data package to that, and you're looking at what, $140-$150 a month? This is if she's only covering herself on the plan, and not her husband and/or anyone else. I have 3 phones on my plan, and my bill is just over $200/mo. Regarding the iPad, she could have had an iPad mini, which doesn't require a long-term contract.

All that said, though, I am AMAZED at how many people have these devices that I never would have thought had the means to purchase them. My DH is a mentor for an organization that pairs successful black men with troubled youth. The 14 year old boy he is currently mentoring has 5 siblings that are all younger than him, his mother is a struggling single mother, but he has a Samsung Galaxy III and a whole lot of other electronic playthings.

If this particular type of photography meant that much to SS, she may have made the sacrifice to purchase the devices she'd need to make it happen. While crazy-expensive for a phone, it is not much different than a nice camera- but unlike a nice camera, she has calling, texting, internet capabilities to boot.

Just FYI, you are not required to have a data plan on any iPad. You can also add data as needed of your ipad has 3g/4g caability, but this can be a pay as you go rather than a plan, you add it on directly from the ipad. She may have had the wifi only iPad as well.

 

[ToutCa]

I read on her IG account that she does have a nice digital camera. I think it was in one of her comments? I'll see if I can find it.

Someone said she indeed had one but found it too troublesome to carry around on her travels -- so she was using her phone and iPad for all her photos on her international voyage.