Identified! CA - Huntington Beach, WhtFem 40UFCA, 18-30, poss name Andrea, Apr'90 - Andrea Kuiper

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MM thinks that Justine being born in 1961 is too old to be his Andrea. He feels her DOB is more of 1967.

Carl; do you mind if I ask a friend to attempt to add Goth makeup to your recon? I'm not sure if they have ever done it before but I'd love to see her with makeup.

Did MM look at Justine's picture? As she is incredibly young looking in that picture. Supposibly she is 21 in that picture but looks 15 or 16 in the picture. Of course that picture IMO is one of the most useless picture I have seen of a missing person, lol. The whole middle part of her facial features are whited out and for some reason the picture has no definition at all. So in all honestly the resembalance to Andrea from that picture has to be looked at skepticly IMO. Although, the description does work.

mjak
 
some people who are young can be or act very mature. others who are older can be or act very young or immature. ever hear adult women with mousy sounding voices?

I would not be too worked up over ages. MontanaMan's Big Mouth Andrea might not be our "Andrea" in Huntington Beach so I see no reason not to submit anything that is within the realm of reason or within the ballbark.
 
Did MM look at Justine's picture? As she is incredibly young looking in that picture. Supposibly she is 21 in that picture but looks 15 or 16 in the picture. Of course that picture IMO is one of the most useless picture I have seen of a missing person, lol. The whole middle part of her facial features are whited out and for some reason the picture has no definition at all. So in all honestly the resembalance to Andrea from that picture has to be looked at skepticly IMO. Although, the description does work.

mjak

Yes; he looked at her picture. Said she reminds him of another runaway he used to know in Seattle. He's not up to reading & replying right now; I can't imagine what he's going through not knowing if she is his Andrea or not.

I would not be too worked up over ages. MontanaMan's Big Mouth Andrea might not be our "Andrea" in Huntington Beach so I see no reason not to submit anything that is within the realm of reason or within the ballbark.

I think they both should be submitted by whoever has been doing it.
I really wish we could get photos of her clothing; the ring; rock & motel key.
 
Carl; do you mind if I ask a friend to attempt to add Goth makeup to your recon? I'm not sure if they have ever done it before but I'd love to see her with makeup.

Sure, go ahead.
 
As she is incredibly young looking in that picture. Supposibly she is 21 in that picture but looks 15 or 16 in the picture. Of course that picture IMO is one of the most useless picture I have seen of a missing person, lol. The whole middle part of her facial features are whited out and for some reason the picture has no definition at all. So in all honestly the resembalance to Andrea from that picture has to be looked at skepticly IMO. Although, the description does work.

mjak

I actually wonder if the picture is from when she was 15/16 & not when she went missing.

Sure, go ahead.

Thanks Carl. Hopefully they can do it.
 
I want to dump this here to see what else I can find
Susan Caldwell
NamUs MP # 7028

Susan Caldwell
No_photo
King County, Washington
17 year old white female
NCMEC number 1149792
Date last seen November 13, 1987

Very little information; Caldwell may not be true name
 
I want to dump this here to see what else I can find
Susan Caldwell
NamUs MP # 7028

Susan Caldwell
No_photo
King County, Washington
17 year old white female
NCMEC number 1149792
Date last seen November 13, 1987

Very little information; Caldwell may not be true name

I was just checking the HS yearbooks for her yesterday. I couldn't find anything.
 
I actually wonder if the picture is from when she was 15/16 & not when she went missing. .

I wondered the samething. I would hope that whoever took the time to file a missing person report on her would submit as recent a photo as possible. Maybe this was all they had. Her sad eyes have gotten to me.

mjak
 
I wondered the samething. I would hope that whoever took the time to file a missing person report on her would submit as recent a photo as possible. Maybe this was all they had. Her sad eyes have gotten to me.

mjak

Yes, Carl's drawing is incredible. He really expressed emotion in that face, and it's gotten to me too. Does anyone know what she might have told the people she stayed with the night before she died that might explain why she apparently committed suicide? Emphasis on apparently, meaning we aren't sure but it certainly seems that way. Do we know if she appeared despondent the previous evening? They obviously felt sorry enough for her to give her a place to sleep and gave her money for clothes. Maybe the drugs and living on the road just got the better of her, and she couldn't find her way back home. This is a very sad case, and I really hope we find out who this girl is. I want her to have a name and identity, and to be properly remembered.
 
I'll look back through the articles I collected to see if there is anything, but I honestly don't think there is. It seemed to me that none of the journalists actually spoke in person to any of the people who came forward - all the info came through LE. Except for the statements about her parents and location/s, I couldn't find a single thing Andrea said to anyone. She was present in their stories but so elusive, if you know what I mean.

One tiny thing - when she made the hair ring, the man who helped her noticed she saved the unused portion and put it carefully in her pocket. It was found there after her death.
 
I'll look back through the articles I collected to see if there is anything, but I honestly don't think there is. It seemed to me that none of the journalists actually spoke in person to any of the people who came forward - all the info came through LE. Except for the statements about her parents and location/s, I couldn't find a single thing Andrea said to anyone. She was present in their stories but so elusive, if you know what I mean.

One tiny thing - when she made the hair ring, the man who helped her noticed she saved the unused portion and put it carefully in her pocket. It was found there after her death.

So I had never heard of this human hair mourning ring thing until someone explained it earlier in the thread. Apparently it has been quite popular since the Victorian era. Reportedly, even Jackie Kennedy snipped a locket of JFK's hair for remembrance. The interesting twist here is that this ring was made from her OWN hair. This would lead me to believe that her death was premeditated, and that the day before she committed suicide (?) she was "mourning" her own death? The fact that she put the remainder carefully in her pocket is key as well. Something about that makes me think of a ritual, perhaps wiccan or something like that. I'll have to dig in to that a bit more. This would seem consistent with the "goth" culture in my mind, but again I need to research this more.

Here's an interesting link on the whole mourning ring practice. Fascinating!
http://www.hairboutique.com/tips/tip553.htm
 
One other thought and I'm going to break my own rule of staying very pragmatic about the possible scenario. I always say that in the absence of data we tend to get a bit far fetched in our theories, and this may be the case with the following notion.

Aside from the obvious trauma that was the result of being hit by the cars, do we know if this Doe had any evidence of prior abuse (fading bruises, etc.), or if there was evidence to suggest sexual assault or even recent sexual activity? Here's where I'm going with this. It's those expensive porcelain crowns. They just throw a normal scenario way off. Without those, we could just chalk this up to some goth gypsy who was wacked out on drugs and met a sad end. But those crowns....was she the mistress of some wealthy man in Huntington Beach (lots of wealth there) who dismissed her? Did this propel her to this sad and desperate act? I originally thought that she was jilted. It was one of the first impressions I had. Far fetched, but something about this adds up. Was there a sample of the dental material kept I wonder? Something tells me that work was done right there in Huntington Beach, and someone has been keeping quiet about it all these years. Perhaps she had an older rich illicit lover who had an appreciation for a busty young woman? Again, a far reaching theory, but something about this notion rings true for me.
 
One other thought and I'm going to break my own rule of staying very pragmatic about the possible scenario. I always say that in the absence of data we tend to get a bit far fetched in our theories, and this may be the case with the following notion.

Aside from the obvious trauma that was the result of being hit by the cars, do we know if this Doe had any evidence of prior abuse (fading bruises, etc.), or if there was evidence to suggest sexual assault or even recent sexual activity? Here's where I'm going with this. It's those expensive porcelain crowns. They just throw a normal scenario way off. Without those, we could just chalk this up to some goth gypsy who was wacked out on drugs and met a sad end. But those crowns....was she the mistress of some wealthy man in Huntington Beach (lots of wealth there) who dismissed her? Did this propel her to this sad and desperate act? I originally thought that she was jilted. It was one of the first impressions I had. Far fetched, but something about this adds up. Was there a sample of the dental material kept I wonder? Something tells me that work was done right there in Huntington Beach, and someone has been keeping quiet about it all these years. Perhaps she had an older rich illicit lover who had an appreciation for a busty young woman? Again, a far reaching theory, but something about this notion rings true for me.

What doesn't add up to me is there was cocaine in her system. Here is a "homeless girl" who spent the night at someone's house; who gave her money that she used to buy clothes. Where did she get the coke from?

How long does cocaine stay in your system?

Web MD- Cocaine provides its high by quickly achieving high levels in the bloodstream during use. Smoking or injecting cocaine results in peak blood levels and effects on the body within a few minutes. After snorting cocaine, blood levels and effects of the drug reach their peak after about fifteen15 minutes. During this time, cocaine produces an intense high (and an increased risk of damaging effects on the heart and blood vessels, and sometimes other organ systems).

Blood tests can detect cocaine itself for about 12 hours after use. Urine tests check for metabolic byproducts of cocaine, and in infrequent users a urine test is positive for up to two to three days after cocaine use. However, in those who use cocaine regularly, a urine test may be positive for two weeks after the last use. Hair samples can detect cocaine for several months after using.
 
One other thought and I'm going to break my own rule of staying very pragmatic about the possible scenario. I always say that in the absence of data we tend to get a bit far fetched in our theories, and this may be the case with the following notion.

Aside from the obvious trauma that was the result of being hit by the cars, do we know if this Doe had any evidence of prior abuse (fading bruises, etc.), or if there was evidence to suggest sexual assault or even recent sexual activity? Here's where I'm going with this. It's those expensive porcelain crowns. They just throw a normal scenario way off. Without those, we could just chalk this up to some goth gypsy who was wacked out on drugs and met a sad end. But those crowns....was she the mistress of some wealthy man in Huntington Beach (lots of wealth there) who dismissed her? Did this propel her to this sad and desperate act? I originally thought that she was jilted. It was one of the first impressions I had. Far fetched, but something about this adds up. Was there a sample of the dental material kept I wonder? Something tells me that work was done right there in Huntington Beach, and someone has been keeping quiet about it all these years. Perhaps she had an older rich illicit lover who had an appreciation for a busty young woman? Again, a far reaching theory, but something about this notion rings true for me.


Good thoughts, roses! I was under the impression she had hitched into town from the witness who said she was already in the car when he was picked up, but I suppose it is just as likely that she was just getting a ride across town.

She had to have a reason to do this. It doesn't seem like she found her birth parents ( if that story is true), she had to have met or known someone in town in order to get cocaine...I'm assuming you can't just walk up to someone on the street and say hey, do you have any drugs? ( or maybe you can )?? Was she just tired of being on the road?, probably not. I don't know.... My best friend committed suicide and it was over a boy... In the upper teens age, I could totally see this being a result of feeling jilted in some way. :(

Those teeth are the key ...
 
I think the dental work gives more credibilty the story that she was adopted. If she was adopted as a child and came to her new family in need of dental work....then the new parents had her teeth fixed.


I do believe she is MM's Andrea.


Maybe she decided for whatever reason it was time to head to CA like she had talked of doing. If she had a job in WA, then perhaps she left WA with the coke. She could've had some left about the time she ran out of money.


Unless thy were stolen, I'm still not convinced that she didn't have personal effects stashed somewhere.
 
Elisabeth has a lot of information that would be consistant with Andrea. The green eyes do not throw me as green and brown eyes are often subjective. The nose looks good. A long shot with the insinuationg her husband is involved but too much that fit to ignore, imo.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/e/eisel_elizabeth.html

mjak
 
She had to have a reason to do this. It doesn't seem like she found her birth parents ( if that story is true), she had to have met or known someone in town in order to get cocaine...I'm assuming you can't just walk up to someone on the street and say hey, do you have any drugs? ( or maybe you can )?? Was she just tired of being on the road?, probably not. I don't know.... My best friend committed suicide and it was over a boy... In the upper teens age, I could totally see this being a result of feeling jilted in some way. :(

Those teeth are the key ...

Mystery Couple murdered; they thought that "Jock" would be ID'd by his teeth. He had some sort of special root canal done; which not many people did back then. Even after being published in dental mags; still no one came forward.

Dentist provides clues to slain man's identity - The dead man also had a fluted root canal, which Hanna said indicated a "very professional" procedure. dentist who did the work did an extremely good job.

Elisabeth has a lot of information that would be consistant with Andrea. The green eyes do not throw me as green and brown eyes are often subjective. The nose looks good. A long shot with the insinuationg her husband is involved but too much that fit to ignore, imo.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/e/eisel_elizabeth.html

mjak

Elizabeth Eisel NamUs - Eisel was last seen in Washington in 1985. Eisel's adoptive mother died in 1977 and Eisel began to show interest in locating her birth mother afterward.

After attending the University of Minnesota she moved to Orange County, California, and lived with a relative.
 
Sorry guys, I was right. I read through all the articles again but there is nothing there that Andrea said, other than what we know. A couple more bits of info that may come in handy though;

Bruce Lyle, OC Coroner's Office Deputy, said he thought the drawing was a good likeness and they got a good response to it. The two transient men came forward after seeing it April 15th. Including the man who met her hitching on Pacific two weeks before she died. She was already in the car that stopped.

Lyle also said he thought identifying Andrea would be 'a snap' at first and her details were repeatedly checked:

'We'd get a description and go running back to the cooler to see if ours had a small scar on her belly we might have missed'.

'Someone knows her. But for some reason, they just don't want to come forward'.

The mobile home salesman who took pity on her said she had 'few' articles of clothing. I don't know if that means she wasn't actually wearing much, or if she was only carrying a few items with her. If the latter is the case, I wonder what happened to them?

A 2007 article says the Coroner's Office retains jawbones, but I don't know if that applied in the 1990s when I am fairly certain Andrea would have been cremated.

Strange note: Coroner's Office engaged the services of a Chino Hills psychic to help find Andrea's id. She told them to look in Florida.

ETA; In the last article I have, they were staking everything on dental checks working out, but of course we know they didn't now.
 
Mystery Couple murdered;



Elizabeth Eisel NamUs - Eisel was last seen in Washington in 1985. Eisel's adoptive mother died in 1977 and Eisel began to show interest in locating her birth mother afterward.

After attending the University of Minnesota she moved to Orange County, California, and lived with a relative.

The history including Washington, California, adoption, looking for birth mother all seemed consistant with Andrea. Elizabeth's appearance is not spot on but is not wrong either...

mjak
 
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