Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - #11

[upstate]

It doesn't matter if were in an uproar, its the way the local le works.silence and ignor. Locals dont have any faith in le, atleast not the ones who needed help in the past. When it comes to wanting contact or information from ccs, I want in one hand and poop in the other , so im not disapionted when there both empty. And im still on my boycott of the evening sun untill they print somthing about Jennifer. I did not know the new editor nows gr.
And we have more than one murderer runing around here.

Is this post referring to who got off in Edward Pastore's murder? Or maybe not the right person wasn't charged in Billy Lee's murder? Or just in general about this case? I totally forgot about the other murders at the beginning of this case

 

[Amanda79]

Well, we'll find out if Gerard Baden Clay is convicted of Allison's murder. Allison was left in the warm Aussie open for 10 days, no apparent COD, and may even have washed down a raging, flooded creek. Gerard was a man of previous 'respectable' reputation.



O/T I am so impressed with the speed in which LE is identifying potential suspects in the Boston bombings. Shows what can be achieved when LE utilise every available resource.

Me too! I can't help but think when I'm watching reports how long waiting is in this case in comparison.... I guess the difference is FBI involved and instead of one its many so urgency exists..... Sad.

 

[Abigail]

Gotta have a cod before you can have a murder correct?

A COD is not necessary for an individual to be tried and convicted of murder.

As long as enough circumstantial and/or forensic evidence combined with clear motive and lack of hard alibi exist.

Example: Scott Peterson - currently on death row for murder of wife Laci and their unborn son. Her body was found in San Francisco bay, too decomposed to determine COD.

 

[Abigail]

Not only was there no COD in the trial of Hans Reiser -- there was no body!

A computer programmer, Reiser was found guilty of first degree murder of his wife. Forensic evidence included blood in the car, and his bizarre behavior following his wife's disappearance was also taken into account.

After his first degree murder conviction, he made a deal to have it dropped to 2nd degree for revealing the location where he buried his wife.

 

[cluciano63]

Not only was there no COD in the trial of Hans Reiser -- there was no body!

A computer programmer, Reiser was found guilty of first degree murder of his wife. Forensic evidence included blood in the car, and his bizarre behavior following his wife's disappearance was also taken into account.

After his first degree murder conviction, he made a deal to have it dropped to 2nd degree for revealing the location where he buried his wife.

I remember he removed the seat from his car, which was pretty weird and incriminating too. Also I think a lot of her friends knew about their very troubled relationship. I wonder if Jennifer shared her secrets about her marriage with people, who may be badly needed for evidence. Not everything gets in, for a trial, due to hearsay issues, but the prosecution can build a case based upon the picture of a relationship in some cases. The more people who talk to LE, the better.

 

[Goldilox]

. Also I think a lot of her friends knew about their very troubled relationship. I wonder if Jennifer shared her secrets about her marriage with people, who may be badly needed for .......

Oh Yeah, with her BFF probably!


Oh cr€p!

 

[upstate]

I remember he removed the seat from his car, which was pretty weird and incriminating too. Also I think a lot of her friends knew about their very troubled relationship. I wonder if Jennifer shared her secrets about her marriage with people, who may be badly needed for evidence. Not everything gets in, for a trial, due to hearsay issues, but the prosecution can build a case based upon the picture of a relationship in some cases. The more people who talk to LE, the better.

LE interviewed everyone Jennifer would have confided in and I am confident that the truth will come out. Most were interviewed early on while Jennifer was still missing, before they would have been tainted by all the weird rumors and still had only Jen's point of view

 

[BearAngel]

Good morning everyone...been thinking back...and for the life of me, I cannot locate Jen's MySpace page...but I once posted the only song, that she had listed on her stream...it has a personal meaning for me...and am willing to bet, it might just have had a personal meaning to her..

I am going to guesstimate the year as being 2009...perhaps someone has a SS of her MySpace...or a better link than I have...why would someone delete it??

Jen has a funny way of seeming to already know her fate...in her poetry from way back...her art, where it screams silent solitude, and even the song...perhaps there was an event that inspired her to list this on her stream, or she liked Daughtry, and yet, if nothing else the song reminds me that it is NOT OVER....:rocker:

http://youtu.be/XgqrqY3LUcQ


I was blown away, what could I say?
It all seemed to make sense.
You're takin' away everything, that I can't do without.

I try to see the good in life,
But good things in life are hard to find.
Blown away, blown away
Can we make this something good?

Well, I'll try to do to it right this time around.
Let's start over,
I'll try to do it right this time around
It's not over,
But a part of me is dead and in the ground.
This love is killin' me, but you're the only one,
It's not over.

I've taken all I can take
And I cannot wait
We're wastin' too much time
Bein' strong, holdin' on
Can't let it bring us down

My life with you means everything,
So I won't give up that easily.
Blown away, blown away.
Can we make this something good?
Cause it's all misunderstood.

Well, I'll try to do to it right this time around.
Let's start over,
I'll try to do it right this time around
It's not over,
But a part of me is dead and in the ground.
This love is killin' me, but you're the only one,
It's not over.

You can't let this get away
Let it out, let it out
Don't get caught up in yourself
Let it out.

Let's start over,
We'll try to do to it right this time around
It's not over,
But a part of me is dead and in the ground.
This love is killin' me, but you're the only one,
It's not over.

Let's start over,

It's not over, whoa, yeah.

This love is killin' me, but you're the only one,
It's not over.

 

[BearAngel]

and while I have been thinking...had quite some time ago watched this documentary...and much to my surprise found that I knew one of the victims towards the end....anyway...it may appear that someone got away with the perfect murder with our beautiful Jennifer Ramsaran...but did they? What mistakes were made? Where did it not go as scripted? How much will our forensics team discover?

Since there are extenuating circumstances, such as the place in which she was discovered, where the elements and predators could get to the body, and where by all accounts, there is little in the way of accessorized clues (ie...clothes...jewelry...shoes etc.)....does that mean that one can get away with the perfect murder? I think not

If it were possible to commit the perfect murder, bet some of us would not be here lol.

So, I have to believe that, even if there is not enough forensic results or they are inconclusive, then there are the behaviors prior to, and after, Jen's untimely demise that can be used for a conviction.

There have to be mistakes....for even if much time passes, in this new day and age...I personally believe that Jens death is NOT a perfect crime...so the question beckons...how can we help?

http://youtu.be/dOrSN5uiKVU

 

[thefox]

A COD is not necessary for an individual to be tried and convicted of murder.

As long as enough circumstantial and/or forensic evidence combined with clear motive and lack of hard alibi exist.

Example: Scott Peterson - currently on death row for murder of wife Laci and their unborn son. Her body was found in San Francisco bay, too decomposed to determine COD.

But in this case there have been no statements on a cod or motive. You have the cart in front of the horse at this point. But that will change.

 

[upstate]

Oh Yeah, with her BFF probably!


Oh cr€p!

I agree with this. We should keep hopeful that the others Jen had in her life, like her classmates and students at the art studio. Jennifer was like me, if someone would listen, she talked. I don't talk as much about my personal stuff, but Jen did. She told everyone who would listen and they all have been interviewed by LE several times.

That still leaves the question as to how much weight that will hold in this case? Is all considered hear say if it backs up the fact she knew about the affair and was heartbroken. IMO it should show Jen was trying everything to keep her marriage intact, but she didn't fit into a certain lifestyle of the new and improved :yuck: "you can do it if you if you want it bad enough" crowd

:furious:

All :moo:

 

[Amanda79]

Still nothing. . Venting my frustration ..... The silence by LE is really ticking me off. Jennifer deserves justice and someone to stand up and fight for her life that was taken from her. I never knew her and it ticks me off how lax things have been.... Based on other crimes its obvious forensics is capable of moving faster than this. If GR is not a POI than clear him with the public..... He has their three children's lives in his hand. If LE doesmt feel he is the guilty party, say something, his childrn im sure have heard the rumours. Why prolong it even more. If he is a POI then get moving. All the waiting cant be good. What if the stress of it all gets to him.... Those kids! I didn't know Jen but am completely frustrated with LE. I cannot imagine how her family and friends must feel!!! Insiders, do you think there is more going on behind the scenes with LE or do you think LE may just be incompetent to some degree or buying time because they screwed up the investigation and are hoping people will forget and the case will go cold? They are elected in.... When is the switch made? Maybe new LE / perspective might get some movement going. So sad that a person - a loving mom- can be killed and there is no urgency to do a darn thing about it. It's disrespectful to her, IMHO. I find it incredibly sad... It's a slap in the face to her life. Kind of like when people wonder if anyone would show up to their funeral.... Again had to vent about this because its so frustrating to me and no one I knows following the case really anymore. . All MOO.

 

[upstate]

Still nothing. . Venting my frustration ..... The silence by LE is really ticking me off. Jennifer deserves justice and someone to stand up and fight for her life that was taken from her. I never knew her and it ticks me off how lax things have been.... Based on other crimes its obvious forensics is capable of moving faster than this. If GR is not a POI than clear him with the public..... He has their three children's lives in his hand. If LE doesmt feel he is the guilty party, say something, his childrn im sure have heard the rumours. Why prolong it even more. If he is a POI then get moving. All the waiting cant be good. What if the stress of it all gets to him.... Those kids! I didn't know Jen but am completely frustrated with LE. I cannot imagine how her family and friends must feel!!! Insiders, do you think there is more going on behind the scenes with LE or do you think LE may just be incompetent to some degree or buying time because they screwed up the investigation and are hoping people will forget and the case will go cold? They are elected in.... When is the switch made? Maybe new LE / perspective might get some movement going. So sad that a person - a loving mom- can be killed and there is no urgency to do a darn thing about it. It's disrespectful to her, IMHO. I find it incredibly sad... It's a slap in the face to her life. Kind of like when people wonder if anyone would show up to their funeral.... Again had to vent about this because its so frustrating to me and no one I knows following the case really anymore. . All MOO.

No idea. It doesn't give me a good or confident feeling at all

 

[LivingJuicy]

I agree with this. We should keep hopeful that the others Jen had in her life, like her classmates and students at the art studio. Jennifer was like me, if someone would listen, she talked. I don't talk as much about my personal stuff, but Jen did. She told everyone who would listen and they all have been interviewed by LE several times.

That still leaves the question as to how much weight that will hold in this case? Is all considered hear say if it backs up the fact she knew about the affair and was heartbroken. IMO it should show Jen was trying everything to keep her marriage intact, but she didn't fit into a certain lifestyle of the new and improved :yuck: "you can do it if you if you want it bad enough" crowd

:furious:

All :moo:

It makes me sad to think that she did know about the affair and IMO, I always believed that she did. I just can't imagine her NOT knowing. How horrific that she had to deal with her husband straying but her best friend, completely betraying her.

IMO, I question how close of friends they really were. :furious:

I wonder if she was more hurt by her friend than her husband and I wonder if she had been unhappy in her marriage for prior years or if she had a good marriage up until the affair. IMO, GR probably had strayed before.

She didn't fit in with that crowd because she was better than them. I'm so sick of not seeing the word arrest. This is getting ridiculous. :banghead:

 

[upstate]

It makes me sad to think that she did know about the affair and IMO, I always believed that she did. I just can't imagine her NOT knowing. How horrific that she had to deal with her husband straying but her best friend, completely betraying her.

IMO, I question how close of friends they really were. :furious:

I wonder if she was more hurt by her friend than her husband and I wonder if she had been unhappy in her marriage for prior years or if she had a good marriage up until the affair. IMO, GR probably had strayed before.

She didn't fit in with that crowd because she was better than them. I'm so sick of not seeing the word arrest. This is getting ridiculous. :banghead:

Jennifer ran circles around that crowd in many ways!

 

[Foxfire]

I believe in cases if a body was buried, or found under a house. Not sure about a body found in the open.

If JR's body was found under the snow from the snow plows. It would be logical to estimate the TOD to be before center rd was snowplowed.

Many cases have been successfully prosecuted without an exact COD or TOD.. Cheryl Dunlap(FL-12/01/2007) is only one example.. There are many examples due to inductive reasoning, circumstantial evidence, and the excellent work of the many body farms across the US.

Noted forensic anthropologist and author, Dr. Bill Bass, takes us on a tour of the world-famous Body Farm in Knoxville, TN
[video=youtube;-qZmLo8qIx4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qZmLo8qIx4[/video]

 

[Wolf Dreamer]

Still here, still thinking of Jen, still waiting and hoping.

 

[Foxfire]

Well, we'll find out if Gerard Baden Clay is convicted of Allison's murder. Allison was left in the warm Aussie open for 10 days, no apparent COD, and may even have washed down a raging, flooded creek. Gerard was a man of previous 'respectable' reputation.



O/T I am so impressed with the speed in which LE is identifying potential suspects in the Boston bombings. Shows what can be achieved when LE utilise every available resource.

South Aussie, Within about 5 hours of the FBI News Conference in Boston, MA & the suspect's photos released. The suspects were identified and located. Once this tragedy comes to a successful conclusion and I am confident that it will.
I would like to challenge the FBI and other Law Enforcement Agencies to utilize the valuable resource of the American public in missing/murdered persons investigations..
The antiquated strategy of Silence utilized in present and past investigations only causes innocent victims lives lost and mounting cold cases..

http://www.fbi.gov/boston/press-rel...t-press-conference-on-bombing-investigation-1
BBM & Snipped
Remarks of FBI Special Agent in Charge Richard DesLauriers at Press Conference on Bombing Investigation

For more than 100 years, the FBI has relied on the public to be its eyes and ears. With the media’s help, in an instant, these images will be delivered directly into the hands of millions around the world. We know the public will play a critical role in identifying and locating them.

Somebody out there knows these individuals as friends, neighbors, co-workers, or family members of the suspects. Though it may be difficult, the nation is counting on those with information to come forward.

No bit of information, no matter how small or seemingly inconsequential, is too small. Each piece moves us forward towards justice.

 

[Foxfire]

But in this case there have been no statements on a cod or motive. You have the cart in front of the horse at this point. But that will change.

GR, cart & CCSO horse?:furious:

 

[Foxfire]

As well as general info, LE sought very specific info from the public .. eg: possible unusual activity between certain times, possibility of car(s) being seen in a particular area at certain times. I think witness testimony may help glue together pieces of the picture for them in the Baden Clay case, as it does in so many cases.

Over 30% of the FBI's Top 10 most wanted were apprehended due to an aware citizen's tip..
John Walsh/AMW has been credited with more FBI Top 10 most wanted apprehensions/with public tips, than any single branch of the FBI...
The numb3rs don't lie...