Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #10

[barcode]

If you want to take that angle, then his comments about being a bad girl, he'll be her slave, and other references should be put into the same context, no?

Which I do.

 

[Amee]

Greg Stolz Verified account ‏@GregStolzJourno [video=twitter;788892560169197572]https://twitter.com/GregStolzJourno/status/788892560169197572[/video] Day 9 of Tostee trial, Day 4 of jury deliberations. Guilty, not guilty or hung jury? We could have an answer today #tostee

 

[Tortoise]

Thanks, I was thinking Broar was him as well. My only doubt about Aware is there is a horrible post by him in Feb 22 2015 saying 'he'd massacre everyone if he's put away'.

In feb 2015 the Toaster was supposed to be in jail though? What are your thoughts?

Not being Australian I don't know the perks allowed in prisons there but as he was on remand it may be that his privileges and access to computers/other gadgets might be better than for convicted prisoners. It's definitely him so he found a way!

 

[Tortoise]

That is still your reasonable doubt. It is common ground that Tostee was assaulted with a metal clamp. So, was the force Tostee used to place her on the balcony proportionate to a potentially lethal stirke?

It didn't read like a doubt to me.

 

[Ausgirl]

Thanks, I was thinking Broar was him as well. My only doubt about Aware is there is a horrible post by him in Feb 22 2015 saying 'he'd massacre everyone if he's put away'.

In feb 2015 the Toaster was supposed to be in jail though? What are your thoughts?

Tostee obviously has a few equally pleasant-natured pals that are taking up for him across the net, probably the same one or 2 using VPN's to make multiple accounts, to judge by their uncommonly similar writing/typing habits and posting styles. Maybe paid for their time, because it's pretty much a job, there's a LOT of internet to cover. How effective they've been idk.. I notice they've managed to sway a few against Tostee, just by their assiness.

*dramatic music* WHEN DAMAGE CONTROL GOES WRONG

 

[CleverKnot]

No, yes, no, yes, straw man.

I will happily be proven wrong when you skillfully skewer me with the law that covers all of this. However, you won't present one.

It is this very type of moral dilemma that is at the heart of this case. He is not physically doing anything to her when she goes over the edge. His legal guilt or innocence hinges on where each individual jury member draws that line where his culpability ends, and her responsibility for her own actions begin.

I simply provided examples for pondering. If you read the examples, you'd see there were clear examples of guilt, innocence, and grey area.

Strawman indeed. Mislabelling an argument, in order to deflect from its merit or to avoid a rebuttal, are dishonest debate tactics.

 

[jessicalouise]

I agree with much of this, TBH. The only thing I think is missing from this equation is what drove her to make that foolhardy choice, and it is that missing piece that leads to Tostee's guilt.

What I'm trying to understand is this: the crown argument requires that Rrie's actions could be foreseen by a reasonable person, while the defense states they could not. My question is for those who feel her actions could not be foreseen. What actions would a reasonable person foresee?

People have more faith in their abilities when intoxicated. (Just look at every person who ever drove drunk and wound up in an accident.) Also, the balcony below was not THAT imposible to get onto. Judging by the re-enactment photo she looked like she had a decent chance. Had she not been locked outside she wouldn't have had to make that decision.

 

[ahoy]

Not being Australian I don't know the perks allowed in prisons there but as he was on remand it may be that his privileges and access to computers/other gadgets might be better than for convicted prisoners. It's definitely him so he found a way!

great point. I wonder if they media would be interested in his big footy posts, including the 'I'd massacre everyone if I'm put away' one?

 

[Freya1977]

CleverKnot.

I think this gender stuff is BS. Besides the fact that nobody knows what gender is behind any of our username, I think that the fact that the majority here are rooting for a conviction is more likely due to the fact you are in a victim-friendly space here. People come here as victims themselves. This is not a fair representation of the general population!

Look at twitter. Most of his most vehement supporters are women.

 

[Strangeworld]

Morning all!!:seeya::seeya:

Thoughts with Warriena's loved ones, the jury, the prosecution and the police this morning - what will be will be.
OT (sort of OT :thinking - some words of wisdom from the CWA Handbook....

Trust your gut instinct - sometimes in life you will encounter people that add value to your views, opinions, empathy, the way you see yourself and others. Sometimes in life you will encounter people that detract from that, challenge for entertainment value. What gives them pleasure or satisfaction is seeing the reaction they get from others when they engage in this type of behaviour or communication. I'm sure most if not all of us have met people like this.

All I can say is trust your gut - if something feels like you are being toyed with, step away from the interaction. Don't give those people what they seek.

 

[TheOtherChristina]

@TheOtherChristina I was leaning towards her inebriation as the driving force to make that foolhardy choice.

I see what you're saying. Personally, I think that drunk logic is still a kind of logic and her behavior still needs an antecedent. Take GT's DUI as an example. He was extremely drunk, and he got behind the wheel of his father's car (after removing the license plates) and drove at very high speeds, even when pursued by the police and even after the tire spikes were thrown down. Why? His inebriation enabled these choices, but his motive existed independent of the inebriation.

Why did he get behind the wheel? Not because he was drunk, but because he and his brahs needed to smash some sloots. Why did he remove the plates? To avoid detection and maximize opportunities for smashing.

 

[Freya1977]

And for the record, I am a female, and if I were on the jury my vote would be for not guilty, because I believe there is reasonable doubt.

Sent from my SM-T700 using Tapatalk

 

[CleverKnot]

When the law ties the jury's hands behind their back, pokes a stick in one eye, and tells them to go and find that needle in the haystack ... something is not right with the system or the law. imo

.

But at the same time, how can 12 people in a room far away, long after the fact, accurately read what was in her mind with such certainty, that a person's very freedom or life should be taken away?

Should that be put into a jury's hands?

 

[jessicalouise]

So what do people think he would have done? Kept her out on the balcony in the cold until ... what? For how long? And after stealing her phone would he have eventually just let her out, handed her things back and said "seeya, goodnight!"

Yeah ... I don't think so.

 

[CleverKnot]

I have a question for anyone who defends Tostee's choices. How do you envision the de-escalation playing out in a scenario in which Rrie does not fall from the balcony?

Let's posit for a moment that Tostee's intentions are good, no choking has taken place, his intent is to defuse the situation, and he has no reason to believe that she fears for her life.

He's inside. He's locked the balcony door. She's on the balcony. She is wearing pants, at a minimum. Her shoes are inside the apartment, as is her purse containing her ID, passport, keys and money. Her phone is unaccounted for. What happens next?

It's entirely possible he was about to phone the police to have her escorted out safely.

 

[Freya1977]

It's entirely possible he was about to phone the police to have her escorted out safely.

Oh ffs lol

 

[jessicalouise]

so the jury are expected to disregard what he told her, which includes threatening to throw her over the balcony, in a murder trial where someone "went over the balcony and died???" make perfect sense to me! not!!!!! :banghead::banghead::banghead:

This ^ Exactly. He had already threatened her. But we're meant to give him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't really mean for her to go off the balcony? He just gets a free pass. Why would he say it??

 

[CleverKnot]

BBM: When she has been released from her cage (his balcony) and is allowed to leave his apartment with her belongings.

So she had no hand in the events that led to her being on that balcony?

Did the prosecutor not agree she committed an assault as well?

We live in a cause and effect world.

 

[jessicalouise]

It's entirely possible he was about to phone the police to have her escorted out safely.

Oh yeah, with Tostee's past experience with police and all, he just respects the hell out of them. No. That is the least likely outcome. Nor did he want her calling them because ... he stole her phone so she couldnt!

 

[Oddsocks]

It's entirely possible he was about to phone the police to have her escorted out safely.

That is what a reasonable person would have done. I highly doubt that is what Gable was planning, based on his actions after her death.