CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #11

[Cafemalyn]

I wish her songs would not have been taken down. She was happy about them being heard by people outside the family.
I think her voice should be heard too, like Jor´s.
People have received her music so well, I am sure the same would be the case for Jen.

Luckily, J-1 (Jen) can now post the songs herself when she is ready. And, after November, so can J-8 (Jor). She turns 18 in Nov, I believe. One positive thing is the older ones at least are getting guitar lessons and they will have more opportunities to improve their abilities and maybe begin to perform for others.

Incidentally, the cousin (Miranda the blogger) appears to be living on the west coast now. Maybe she can reconnect (maybe she has reconnected?) with J-1 and the others and eventually they can get together again.

 

[ilovepierre]

Luckily, J-1 (Jen) can now post the songs herself when she is ready. And, after November, so can J-8 (Jor). She turns 18 in Nov, I believe. One positive thing is the older ones at least are getting guitar lessons and they will have more opportunities to improve their abilities and maybe begin to perform for others.

Incidentally, the cousin (Miranda the blogger) appears to be living on the west coast now. Maybe she can reconnect (maybe she has reconnected?) with J-1 and the others and eventually they can get together again.

That would be wonderful!

 

[FelicityLemon]

I'll probably get jumped on for saying this, but there is another possibility that happens in real life. I'm going to speak only to a hypothetical relationship and since we only know a tiny bit of the extent (for now) it's all any of us can do.

Husband was (or still is) attracted to and acts on inappropriately young females. Couple has several female children.

There are women who are jealous of the attention the husband gives their children. It might be just insecurity or narcissism that has nothing to do with sexual attraction or incest, just the attention and time that the wife thinks should be going to her alone.

It might be sexual jealousy whether it's warranted or not. Wife punishes children.
It might be sexual jealousy because there's specific knowledge. Wife punishes/victimizes children.

Wife punishes the "rivals for her husband's affections" (again) by withholding not only her affection, but basics of life like food, water, hygiene and body functions and access to outside world including relatives.

Bottom line: could be that yes, DT sexually abuses the children and LT is jealous and punishes the children because of it. She'd rather continue to provide him with his "needs" by allowing the abuse and continuing to provide more victims by having more children than lose him or the illusion of Happy Families. It's beyond sick and twisted, but it occurs it real life. LT knows what husband does and DT knows what wife does. Each has their role and is fully aware of and complicit in their spouses behavior and it's a mutually beneficial relationship as long as each gets what they wants. One may want access to sex with children and the other needs the facade of a perfect family, repeated wedding ceremonies to prove to the world how in much in love they still are...

I may not word this clearly, but I'm pretty sure it's understood. Understood intellectually, but not acceptable and yes, jeezopeez it's horrendous like a horror movie in real life.

I think of the paul bernardo / carla homolka relationship. SICK freaks.
Also, joel steinberg / hedda nussbaum - similar, but different, but fits into the sick couples group.

Just a note: I know firsthand (NOT MY RELATIONSHIP - yikes!!!) that there are husbands who are jealous of the attention their wives pay to their children, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case here.

Again, it's just an idea, I'm not saying it's so.

 

[kkdj]

I'll probably get jumped on for saying this, but there is another possibility that happens in real life. I'm going to speak only to a hypothetical relationship and since we only know a tiny bit of the extent (for now) it's all any of us can do.

Husband was (or still is) attracted to and acts on inappropriately young females. Couple has several female children.

There are women who are jealous of the attention the husband gives their children. It might be just insecurity or narcissism that has nothing to do with sexual attraction or incest, just the attention and time that the wife thinks should be going to her alone.

It might be sexual jealousy whether it's warranted or not. Wife punishes children.
It might be sexual jealousy because there's specific knowledge. Wife punishes/victimizes children.

Wife punishes the "rivals for her husband's affections" (again) by withholding not only her affection, but basics of life like food, water, hygiene and body functions and access to outside world including relatives.

Bottom line: could be that yes, DT sexually abuses the children and LT is jealous and punishes the children because of it. She'd rather continue to provide him with his "needs" by allowing the abuse and continuing to provide more victims by having more children than lose him or the illusion of Happy Families. It's beyond sick and twisted, but it occurs it real life. LT knows what husband does and DT knows what wife does. Each has their role and is fully aware of and complicit in their spouses behavior and it's a mutually beneficial relationship as long as each gets what they wants. One may want access to sex with children and the other needs the facade of a perfect family, repeated wedding ceremonies to prove to the world how in much in love they still are...

I may not word this clearly, but I'm pretty sure it's understood. Understood intellectually, but not acceptable and yes, jeezopeez it's horrendous like a horror movie in real life.

I think of the paul bernardo / carla homolka relationship. SICK freaks.
Also, joel steinberg / hedda nussbaum - similar, but different, but fits into the sick couples group.

Just a note: I know firsthand (NOT MY RELATIONSHIP - yikes!!!) that there are husbands who are jealous of the attention their wives pay to their children, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case here.

Again, it's just an idea, I'm not saying it's so.

I'll bet this is spot on!

 

[Doghairrules]

BBM. They sound like little kids in school.

Agreed. And I don’t think they should be allowed any contact with each other.

 

[ClockworkSecret]

Agreed. And I don’t think they should be allowed any contact with each other.

Legally, is there no way to prevent this kind of note-passing contact? The defense certainly has grounds for objection to this behavior since it could allow the couple to "get their story straight" and undermine any facts that might come to light through separate interviewing.

 

[BooBooTheFool]

I don't think that's the case so much here on WS. Most of us place the blame on them equally - they were in this together, agreeing on their bizarre "parenting" style. Right now, though, it's a matter of their attitude that is being reported - DT seems remorseful but LT seems to be in denial.

There is definitely a slant towards LT on these forums- even with some suggestion that she controlled DT (and that he was a nerd or crypto-gay (wtf?) )which is insane because he's the one that preyed upon her when she was still a child. The much harsher criticism of LT was so obvious to me that I made my first post about it.

 

[BooBooTheFool]

I think maybe it's because mothers are supposed to be the nurturers and caregivers of a family, especially since they carry them within their bodies for nine months. Also, she supposedly wanted as many children as possible, but why, if she treated them as objects rather than vulnerable beings in need and deserving of love, compassion and nurturing.

Absolutely BOTH are responsible for their inhuman treatment of their children! It just always feels worse when the abuse is from mothers

I think a lot of it, especially the stuff about LT being "the one in control" out of the two, is related to how people see dominant women as a pathology and think an overbearing woman is definitely the ones to blame for unthinkable stuff like this. She's definitely taking a lot more blame in the court of public opinion.

 

[BooBooTheFool]

It doesn´t to me, so I don´t quite understand this tendency.
Abuse is abuse, no matter from whom it comes.

Basically what you say is that abuse from men is more EXPECTED and somewhat ACCEPTED.
Very depressing!

It's just another way that misogyny hurts people. The view that "it's worse when women do it" comes from the idea that women are born to be nurturers/mothers while men have no such identity politics placed on their very being. If you think about it, reaaaaallly think about it, it's disturbing to believe that women are inherently more nurturing than men because of the implications. It's just another effect of internalized misogyny especially when women spout it.

 

[Meryl12]

I think maybe it's because mothers are supposed to be the nurturers and caregivers of a family, especially since they carry them within their bodies for nine months. Also, she supposedly wanted as many children as possible, but why, if she treated them as objects rather than vulnerable beings in need and deserving of love, compassion and nurturing.

Absolutely BOTH are responsible for their inhuman treatment of their children! It just always feels worse when the abuse is from mothers

I understand completely what you are saying. Women/the mother carries the baby within their bodies for 9 months, then the newborn bonds with the mother holding holding them in her arms, even recognizing their mothers voice....the mother & baby bond.
Men were newborn babies once themselves, and although they think they cannot remember this time in their lives....deep in their subconscious mind that comforting, cuddling, nurturing and reassurance is still there. Men (who are not disfunctional) understand that comforting, reassuring loving bond. People who are dysfunctional react with jealousy.
Many people (including myself) believe that people who react with jealousy are the children of parents who felt jealousy, and that this is a generational thing. Obviously there are varying degrees of jealousy. But I agree there is a lot of jealousy of the motherly love and maternal bond, and this is what children hope to see in a woman....safety and maternal protection. I understand what you are trying to say Felicity.

 

[Meryl12]

I'll probably get jumped on for saying this, but there is another possibility that happens in real life. I'm going to speak only to a hypothetical relationship and since we only know a tiny bit of the extent (for now) it's all any of us can do.

Husband was (or still is) attracted to and acts on inappropriately young females. Couple has several female children.

There are women who are jealous of the attention the husband gives their children. It might be just insecurity or narcissism that has nothing to do with sexual attraction or incest, just the attention and time that the wife thinks should be going to her alone.

It might be sexual jealousy whether it's warranted or not. Wife punishes children.
It might be sexual jealousy because there's specific knowledge. Wife punishes/victimizes children.

Wife punishes the "rivals for her husband's affections" (again) by withholding not only her affection, but basics of life like food, water, hygiene and body functions and access to outside world including relatives.

Bottom line: could be that yes, DT sexually abuses the children and LT is jealous and punishes the children because of it. She'd rather continue to provide him with his "needs" by allowing the abuse and continuing to provide more victims by having more children than lose him or the illusion of Happy Families. It's beyond sick and twisted, but it occurs it real life. LT knows what husband does and DT knows what wife does. Each has their role and is fully aware of and complicit in their spouses behavior and it's a mutually beneficial relationship as long as each gets what they wants. One may want access to sex with children and the other needs the facade of a perfect family, repeated wedding ceremonies to prove to the world how in much in love they still are...

I may not word this clearly, but I'm pretty sure it's understood. Understood intellectually, but not acceptable and yes, jeezopeez it's horrendous like a horror movie in real life.

I think of the paul bernardo / carla homolka relationship. SICK freaks.
Also, joel steinberg / hedda nussbaum - similar, but different, but fits into the sick couples group.

Just a note: I know firsthand (NOT MY RELATIONSHIP - yikes!!!) that there are husbands who are jealous of the attention their wives pay to their children, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case here.

Again, it's just an idea, I'm not saying it's so.

This is what the outcome can be from both parents being the result of generational jealousy and broken maternal bonds. When two such people get together and produce off-spring the result can be horrendous.

I had aquaintances who were in the above category, I had my suspicions, but people always put on their best behaviour in company. I didn't like them and avoided them, I only found out the worst years later, she provided children for his sick fantasies. They were both as dysfunctional as each other, he was the father of his own grandchildren. She was complicit in it all. Yes, it goes on everywhere, when two such people get together.

 

[Satch]

I agree that both David and Louise are equally responsible for their children's many horrors,

With the issue of extreme control as the culprit for punishment and exclusion from any social contact that questioned the parents' sick and satanic value system, do you think that Louise was always the dominant one and broke David down over the years to get what she wanted? Or do you think that both David and Louise were always the way they were and equally punished the kids with neglect, abuse, and torture that intensified over time?

Was David really this little "wuss" that Louise could manipulate? People have said David was big and looked intimidating, but was also very quiet. Do you think that Louise could have abused him? And David could have abused her? You wonder if maybe they accepted physical abuse to each other and the kids, because one of their sick cult-like religious obsessions that they followed, could have, (not necessarily did) permit evil behavior?

I feel that they are both equally to blame. It seems that David through breaking down in jail at least has stronger emotional faculties. However, he could have stopped the abuse and chose not to do that. Louise is a complete psychotic nut-job who has no sense of reality, emotions, or care for anybody other than herself. You wonder who manipulated whom?

There is so much anger toward Louise, certainly justified. People want to beat her because of what she did to those poor kids. But there is much less reports on David and there should be more information, much more. Louise is the ultimate horror devil. But David is the top runner up, that's for sure. It's too late for you to cry now David in your cell. Where were your tears for thirty plus years, when you married a despicable wife that allowed to bring kids into both of your horrific worlds? I wish California had the Death Penalty, because that's what they both deserve!

Satch

 

[enelram]

DT and LT are obviously narcissists and both had to be equally responsible for this treatment to continue for as long as it did. If this goes to trial, there will be a lot of sick details come out and the public will be surprised just how sick.

They continued this house of horrors because each sick parent got their jollies, however they could, and there were
no outsiders to stop them.

The marriage of DT and LT started with 2 very dysfunctional, damaged individuals who gradually grew symbiotically
into a more dysfunctional family unit. The sick family unit of both parents became the norm until they were exposed.
Both are totally complicit in allowing and perpetrating these atrocities.

 

[SATA]

I agree that both David and Louise are equally responsible for their children's many horrors,

With the issue of extreme control as the culprit for punishment and exclusion from any social contact that questioned the parents' sick and satanic value system, do you think that Louise was always the dominant one and broke David down over the years to get what she wanted? Or do you think that both David and Louise were always the way they were and equally punished the kids with neglect, abuse, and torture that intensified over time?

Was David really this little "wuss" that Louise could manipulate? People have said David was big and looked intimidating, but was also very quiet. Do you think that Louise could have abused him? And David could have abused her? You wonder if maybe they accepted physical abuse to each other and the kids, because one of their sick cult-like religious obsessions that they followed, could have, (not necessarily did) permit evil behavior?

I feel that they are both equally to blame. It seems that David through breaking down in jail at least has stronger emotional faculties. However, he could have stopped the abuse and chose not to do that. Louise is a complete psychotic nut-job who has no sense of reality, emotions, or care for anybody other than herself. You wonder who manipulated whom?

There is so much anger toward Louise, certainly justified. People want to beat her because of what she did to those poor kids. But there is much less reports on David and there should be more information, much more. Louise is the ultimate horror devil. But David is the top runner up, that's for sure. It's too late for you to cry now David in your cell. Where were your tears for thirty plus years, when you married a despicable wife that allowed to bring kids into both of your horrific worlds? I wish California had the Death Penalty, because that's what they both deserve!

Satch

So it was Louise alone who decided to have children?
Am I understanding you right?

I have been studying a number of these mega families. In very many cases, it is actually the men who want MANY kids.

How do you know it was Louise?

 

[Satch]

So it was Louise alone who decided to have children?
Am I understanding you right?

I have been studying a number of these mega families. In very many cases, it is actually the men who want MANY kids.

How do you know it was Louise?

We don't know for sure it was Louise. But when married one of their crazy religions, that they BOTH seemingly followed out of about four different faiths was "God says, your supposed to have a big family." They both believed that. Both wanted kids, but Louise wanted no responsibility associated with them once they were no longer cute to her. David followed that same belief so went along with that. The older and more repulsive the kids became, the harder they were to control in the minds of both parents. That's why the abuse intensified over time. It is also why the oldest of the children likely suffered the most, and why the baby was not abused at all. To David and Louise, ugly things need harsh discipline to be able to be controlled. As they aged, the children became more and more like objects and less and less seen as emotional people with feelings and hearts.

I think the oldest adult male taking classes was likely at the demands of his parents and likely not be free choice. Male JT #1 was being groomed to be the next David Turpin as another poster discussed, but not without the strictest of demands for what he would do or not do during classes. Louise being outside the hall in every one of his classes shows her domination.

Satch

 

[enelram]

I want to bring up another way to look at these parents' thinking since my own abusive parents have many similarities
w/ them and also came from a backward area not too far, geographically, from where the Turpins are from.

In some families boys are favored and treated differently than girls. These families place a higher value on male children, and see girl children as being built in workers, caretakers, cooks, cleaners, grundge workers. Boys are
admired and valued for being stronger, money earners, and just overall more valued.

I'm wondering if this attitude wasn't also prevalent here. Boys equal worthy of further education etc. girls just lowly
cleaner/caretakers. ???

 

[SATA]

We don't know for sure it was Louise. But when married one of their crazy religions, that they BOTH seemingly followed out of about four different faiths was "God says, your supposed to have a big family." They both believed that. Both wanted kids, but Louise wanted no responsibility associated with them once they were no longer cute to her. David followed that same belief so went along with that. The older and more repulsive the kids became, the harder they were to control in the minds of both parents. That's why the abuse intensified over time. It is also why the oldest of the children likely suffered the most, and why the baby was not abused at all. To David and Louise, ugly things need harsh discipline to be able to be controlled. As they aged, the children became more and more like objects and less and less seen as emotional people with feelings and hearts.

I think the oldest adult male taking classes was likely at the demands of his parents and likely not be free choice. Male JT #1 was being groomed to be the next David Turpin as another poster discussed, but not without the strictest of demands for what he would do or not do during classes. Louise being outside the hall in every one of his classes shows her domination.

Satch

Again, David "went along" - lessening his responsibility.
I can´t believe it! His interest in Louise started when she was 10! 10!!!!!
He is a paedophile, yet everything is on Louise!

I am close to wanting to stop following this case, I get more and more upset and find myself in the position of defending Louise, which I don´t really want to do.

I need a break, for sure!

 

[Satch]

Again, David "went along" - lessening his responsibility.
I can´t believe it! His interest in Louise started when she was 10! 10!!!!!
He is a paedophile, yet everything is on Louise!

I am close to wanting to stop following this case, I get more and more upset and find myself in the position of defending Louise, which I don´t really want to do.

I need a break, for sure!

I think we can all understand that. This is a very emotional and painful case! I believe that we know probably only ten percent of the horror that went on in that house.

Satch

 

[ClockworkSecret]

I wish California had the Death Penalty, because that's what they both deserve!

California does have the death penalty. However, it would not be applied unless there were evidence of an actual death, which, considering the frailty of the children and the prolonged abuse combined with the filth found in the Turpins' former homes, is a possibility.

You can imagine that a child who receives poor nutrition and undergoes the physical stresses of beatings is more likely to be immunosuppressed. When that child is exposed to human feces and prevented from maintaining good hygiene, as well as deprived of Vitamin D due to lack of sunlight, you have a perfect storm that greatly increases the chances that such a child would develop infections and die from sepsis or organ failure. Investigators should conduct a search of all the Turpins' former premises in order to explore this possibility. To my knowledge, this has not occurred. Were human remains to be found, the couple might be charged with crimes to which the death penalty could be applied.

 

[msphilosopher]

Again, David "went along" - lessening his responsibility.
I can´t believe it! His interest in Louise started when she was 10! 10!!!!!
He is a paedophile, yet everything is on Louise!

I am close to wanting to stop following this case, I get more and more upset and find myself in the position of defending Louise, which I don´t really want to do.

I need a break, for sure!

I had to stop following this case for a while when I found myself having to defend Louise. Not that I want to defend her either.

Don't stop following this case. I need to catch up on some of the posts and then I will start piping in.